Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[PsySmasher]

KH's story isn't that bad; this is BlazBlue-level convolution right here.

Nothing is more convoluted than Blazblue's lore...
NOTHING

 

[Flyboy]

At this rate we really could get to page 6969 by the next direct

This is everything I've ever dreamed of. I love Smash.

 

[Iridium]

People bring up Wendy's, but what's Arby's stance on any current happenings? They love to promote stuff.

No, but I found this gem.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[amazonevan19]

That looks like Golden Sun, alright.
would be super funny if Sakurai got Isaac leaked this way lol

Were you even here during ESRB? Everyone but like, 10 people at best were calling it fake. It only became undeniable with the video footage and even then some people denied it.

Believed I stated I wasn't, but w/e. Thank you for the information - I stand partially corrected as my understanding was a bit off then. I thought that ESRB was widely seen as real except by the few in denial, but apparently it started the opposite - most saw it as fake, THEN when more evidence surfaced that turned the tide.

It still backs up my point though that the ESRB leak (eventually) had WAY more going for it, so much more so that almost no reasonable person could deny it when it all came out.

Perhaps our Chadondorf friend will do the same and offer more evidence eventually. Given the deep **** he's probably in though I doubt we're hearing from him again any time soon.

 

[ThatOneAnon]

Guys, characters being moved to other parts of the banner HAS happened before. This actually may support the leak extremely heavily. I may actually blow your minds right now, I'm not sure, so read carefully and follow me. Here's the changes up to K. Rool.

Diddy was moved from the left of Sheik to the right to accommodate space for K. Rool because Dark Pit and Falco were moved over. Duck Hunt was moved from above Falcon, to below Falcon to accommodate Ridley, then back up level with Falcon to accommodate Chrom. Young Link was moved WAY over from the right of Mario and in front of Charizard, all the way over to the left of Mario and near Charizards tail to accommodate Dark Samus and Richter. Mii Gunner moved from under Link to the right of Link to accommodate Simon. Additionally, moving Mii Gunner, Young Link and Duck Hunt revealed more of their art we couldn't see because they were behind other characters. Isabelle and Daisy do not shift anybody significantly and Inkling was there since the beginning.

Sound familiar?
Okay, then here's the leak, which may be the next possible banner update.

Lets go through it again shall we? This time all go through it via the leaked characters to follow along more easily.

- Shadow and Banjo and Kazooie: Mii Brawler and Mii Swordfighter, both displaced by Shadow and Mii Gunner, displaced by Banjo were all moved to a new location where Luigi and R.O.B were on the most recent banner, to the right of Mewtwo. Nice and clean and all 3 are finally together. Everybody else is just slightly shifted to accomodate those 2 characters. As a result, Luigi and Rob were moved to new locations to the right of Dark Pit, Falco and Sheik, further displacing Diddy Kong even more to the right to Pit (like I said before, he was to the LEFT of Sheik at one point, refer to the first banner image) opening up a ton of space up top. This shifting also reveals more of Greninja's tongue

-Ken: All of that opened up space with Diddy allowed for Ken to be placed there with relative ease, along with Luigi and R.O.B like I mentioned before. Shadow, Banjo and Ken all had a hand in shifting the characters like this. It's all very logical and clean.

- Isaac: Completely replaces Olimar's spot. Luckily since Olimar is extremely small, he fits snug right in front of Banjo, Greninja and Snake. Fairly simple.

- Mach Rider and Chorus Kids: Doing this one together because they both shift characters at the bottom. Mach Rider shifts Roy to the right, shifting Megaman as well to be in front of Marth, when he originally was pretty much to the left. Villager does not move much because of Chorus Kids. The addition of Chorus Kids pushes Pokemon Trainer to the right, SQUEEZES together Wario and Dedede and totally displaces Jigglypuff to under Dark Samus. All of this extra shifting and spacing to the right allows both to fit here. This shifting also reveals more of Jigglypuff's body and reveals Roy's foot, which was hidden behind Inkling.

- Geno: Extremely small like Jiggly and Olimar, so he fit snug between Pac-Man and Dark Samus without moving much of anything.



There are likely (and definitely) things I'm missing here. But guys....this looks almost too professional to me. You may need direct assets and charact art render's to be able to move people like this. This was done many times to accommodate new characters in previous banners, and its done exactly the same in the leak. Like logically and soundly, DONE THE SAME.


I honestly can't think of a better reason for why I think this leak is real, outside of the how it got leaked in the first place.

Hope people enjoy reading this as much as I had proving it.

Watch the same people who supported the box theory due to the pattern say you’re wrong because patterns don’t mean anything.

 

[Luigi The President]

OK, so for #TeamFake, we have:

• We have proven that the whole thing would be very possible for a single individual to fake. See my post.
• All the insiders outright saying it's fake or missing a character.
• Neither of Eric's companies appearing to do anything Smash related.
• Sakurai saying they were "slowing down reveals"
• None of the Grinch renders being new as we had thought.
• Eric himself being a 50 year old man who likely doesn't care about Smash or SnapChat
• The SnapChat name being so poorly covered up, almost intentionally, as the transparency would have to be upped on the brush tool
• No reason for a promo company to produce a blank Battlefield background.
• The Chad Ganondorf leaker saying that Ray from Custom Robo was cut when Nintendo lost the trademark for him quite a while ago when they could have easily renewed it
• Snake's shadow
• And finally, the inconsistencies between the E3 background and the one shown, as pointed out so skilfully by vaanrose

Did I miss anything?

Team Real y'all better come back with some objective points this instant I believe in you

 

[The DanMan051]

Nothing is more convoluted than Blazblue's lore...
NOTHING

As a BlazBlue fan, I never claim to understand it; just "mostly comprehend it".

 

[ChronoKatie]

Honestly, if it is fake, a huge kudos goes out to the genius who thought of things like having the conductor for Chorus Kids, and Isaac's grass attack.

 

[Schnee117]

No, but I found this gem.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Can't believe they went for Generic Fortnite guy over Thanos and John Wick smh

 

[Luigi The President]

Honestly, if it is fake, a huge kudos goes out to the genius who thought of things like having the conductor for Chorus Kids, and Isaac's grass attack.

If it's fake they're my least favorite person in the world
ESPECIALLY for making Geno so adorably small

 

[KingofKoopas]

Nothing is more convoluted than Blazblue's lore...
NOTHING

Three words for you brother, Metal Gear Solid.

 

[FlappyFalco]

Honestly, if it is fake, a huge kudos goes out to the genius who thought of things like having the conductor for Chorus Kids, and Isaac's grass attack.

Well, they tried to pin all this on some random 50 year-old French man trying to make a living so...

 

[vaanrose]

Didn't we already note that the blank official Battlefield is different from the mural? Now we don't know how much of a difference there would be (and the apparent omission of an entire Castle is extreme) but it isn't a surefire ace.

That "missing" castle behind Zelda isn't missing at all. It's there in every version of the banner. Even the leaked banner has it.

As a comic artist the only riposte I can muster is that maybe some areas of the background were morphed for compositional clarity but that is a rather flimsy argument because it's much less effort to just move characters to achieve better contrast.

My big issue with the changed-for-composition theory is that the biggest differences between images are the areas completely and totally hidden by the crowd across all versions. I.e, elements that may as well not exist at all as far as the composition is considered.

 

[Noipoi]

Hi guys. I've been following this thread for the past 400+ pages or so and I made an account just to offer some thoughts on something a few people have been mentioning.

A few people are claiming the leak to be fake because it has 7 new characters and that goes against Sakurai's words of "slowing down" the announcements. They also mention that in September, we only got one character to be revealed: Isabelle.

This is reaching a bit, but what if that wasn't meant to be it? What if we WERE supposed to get one more character reveal out of that direct?

We know that Nintendo delayed the Direct because of the earthquake. Don't know if any of you are very into Japanese media, but they are very, very conscious about offending people over mass tragedies. Metal Gear Solid 2 famously had some scenes of its ending changed because of the 9/11 tragedy.

What I'm trying to say is that we were maybe meant to get Isaac as a reveal on that direct too. Isaac's powers are related to the earth and tremors. Maybe Nintendo thought it would feel very disrespectful and pushed the reveal back, By that logic, if the leak is real then they'd only need to reveal six more characters.

Just offering some thoughts there.

Howdy! Folks call me Noipoi!

I hope you enjoy your time here. And remember, There's no need to be upset. This is all for a game. So let loose and have fun!

 

[Z25]

GIMP wasn't letting me simply crossing out stuff. So here have my oddly edited meme:

Insiders Vs the Leak in a nutshell.

 

[Hydrualic Hydra]

At this point I remain Team Real on a heaping helping of instinct, but would greatly appreciate more evidence either way for the sake of discussion.

I've come down with a dreadful headache and am going to check out at a more than reasonable hour for once. If any exciting news develops, please @ me.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Here's a clearer image of that green item they found:

https://twitter.com/AlphaOblivion7/status/1055576381416005633

It's clearly the sprout from Wall-E It might be from Golden Sun from a reply in that thread; my guess was the brainwash-sprout from Super Paper Mario when replying to PushDustin, but I was just being silly as I don't really know what it'd do ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Doesn’t that help the leak since Isaac is playable in it

 

[The DanMan051]

Three words for you brother, Metal Gear Solid.

I'd say BB still has the edge, with KH being about on par/ever so slightly below MGS.

 

[Confirmation]

This is what I'm talking about
View attachment 172058

Didn't we refer to this a hundred pages back? There was a theory floated about shadows being on a different layer that wasn't added yet.

 

[ChronoKatie]

Well, they tried to pin all this on some random 50 year-old French man trying to make a living so...

Right. Good point. Clever additions to the characters, but a horrible person overall.

 

[CosmicQuark]

I don't mean to sound rude at all but...we been knew
I don't really see anyone arguing the movement can't happen

I think it's less the movement and more how professional the movement is.

And if we think the graphical designer is not lying and telling the truth, we also can't call who did this definitively a graphic designer (though, still could be). It's not to say it's impossible, nothing's impossible with the level of skills some people have. It just strains credulity for a lot of us that this was hoaxed.

 

[Pyra]

The artist may have posted this on the SmashBros reddit too and even he claims that he believes it's the opposite of "anyone could recreate this";

It's bizarre to me that some people are trying to claim that this "didn't actually take that much effort".
If fake, this pretty evidently took a ridiculous amount of effort, by one person (or more, even).

If they spent that much effort on it, do you think they would actually not consider the shadows?
"Let me just spend several hours on this and make some blatant mistakes for everyone to see"

Could be part of their game for them to miss something so... "obvious".
Or, patterns be damned, it's the first time the shadows were removed.

Also, putting forth so much effort and leaving blatant discrepancies in the background?
Edit: As a disclaimer, I feel like the background is the strongest point against it, in the case that the artist did not know what the clouds looked like otherwise. If they did, they'd just fix it, just like the character's missing parts. If they weren't trying to **** with everyone. End edit.


Either way, like I said earlier, speaking of people's motives is just conjecture. I'm just kinda spitting out random thoughts.
Perhaps they intentionally made those mistakes for people to find, just to watch people argue against it for their own fun.

Or, they aren't mistakes.

We don't know!
Again, just conjecture. Don't mind me

 

[mbvswb]

That looks like Golden Sun, alright.
would be super funny if Sakurai got Isaac leaked this way lol

Were you even here during ESRB? Everyone but like, 10 people at best were calling it fake. It only became undeniable with the video footage and even then some people denied it.

Yeah, most people thought it was fake because they wanted it to be fake. I'm neutral but its obvious most people who think this is real only do bc they want it to be real

 

[ThatOneAnon]

Well, they tried to pin all this on some random 50 year-old French man trying to make a living so...

Real or not, this leaker is a ****ing psychopath. I mean seriously, holy ****

 

[murdokdracul]

I could've told you that. Character 69 will never recover from a label like that.

Maybe Incineroar is actually character 69 but has been removed from the roster because they don't want anyone to have that number. Next reveal is character #70: Chorus Kids Skip a Beat!

 

[KingofKoopas]

I'd say BB still has the edge, with KH being about on par/ever so slightly below MGS.

People still cant decide if portable ops is canon or what The Boss's motivations were, and then we get to the cloning stuff..


Edit: And then theres The Patriots.

 

[Zinith]

Hi guys. I've been following this thread for the past 400+ pages or so and I made an account just to offer some thoughts on something a few people have been mentioning.

A few people are claiming the leak to be fake because it has 7 new characters and that goes against Sakurai's words of "slowing down" the announcements. They also mention that in September, we only got one character to be revealed: Isabelle.

This is reaching a bit, but what if that wasn't meant to be it? What if we WERE supposed to get one more character reveal out of that direct?

We know that Nintendo delayed the Direct because of the earthquake. Don't know if any of you are very into Japanese media, but they are very, very conscious about offending people over mass tragedies. Metal Gear Solid 2 famously had some scenes of its ending changed because of the 9/11 tragedy.

What I'm trying to say is that we were maybe meant to get Isaac as a reveal on that direct too. Isaac's powers are related to the earth and tremors. Maybe Nintendo thought it would feel very disrespectful and pushed the reveal back, By that logic, if the leak is real then they'd only need to reveal six more characters.

Just offering some thoughts there.

Hi!!! Feel free to make yourself at home

 

[Saelind Genesis]

Hi welcome to the site and thanks for your thoughts. Hope you enjoy it here...though this place is bat**** crazy so be forewarned.

There have been some who've theorized just like you that Isaac was meant for the September direct. I honestly don't buy it because it turns out we got AC for Switch announced with Isabelle. Could it have been cut and pasted? Maybe, but I don't think dropping Isaac outside of any real meaningful context in the September direct makes sense. It doesn't meld with anything else shown off in the direct. If they're planning a Golden Sun revival sure, but as of now I am pretty sure they originally intended Isabelle for the September direct, given AC was announced as well. A general direct usually wouldn't just drop a character and not have another game or project associated with them.

We'll probably never know one way or another if Isaac is eventually announced, but obviously if Isaac doesn't make it, then there's our answer, since they didn't intend for him to be in the game at all, they never had to move the direct because of Isaac.

Thanks for the welcome. I can see it haha

I agree with you on your argument about context. I'm thinking that, since Golden Sun's trademark got renewed, they were planning an announcement related to it as well. But I can see that it's just especulation. I'm not saying it's true, but it's good to keep it in mind moving forward when talking about it, that's all

 

[Rigumaro]

OK, so for #TeamFake, we have:

• No reason for a promo company to produce a blank Battlefield background.

I don't think this one is a valid point. I think there'd be a legit reason. I explained it here.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Where did this Eric being a 50 year old man thing come from? First I'm hearing of it.

Also it's a bit ageist to assume a 50 year old wouldn't play Smash or use Snap Chat anyways.

But that's neither here nor there.

 

[Paperchampion23]

I don't mean to sound rude at all but...we been knew
I don't really see anyone arguing the movement can't happen

I'm arguing the WAY it moved. Not just that it moved. They all moved in similar ways to how characters previously were shifted. Shifting of the characters revealed new art not seen before. Do people really think a fake leaker did all of this?

 

[BluePikmin11]

Back in my day, this thread used to think that getting anyone getting more than 2+ unique newcomers was a ridiculous possibility, hammed down as hard as transformations prior to the veteran trailer.

Now we are being open about the possibility now.

Don't get me wrong, I am liking the openness going on here, but I think you all should not be relying on leaks to form your own speculative thoughts.

 

[Luigi The President]

I'm arguing the WAY it moved. Not just that it moved. They all moved in similar ways to how characters previously were shifted. Shifting of the characters revealed new art not seen before. Do people really think a fake leaker did all of this?

This would be the craziest fake leak I've ever seen but I've gone to the dark side of team fake, so...

 

[amazonevan19]

The item picture is such awful quality that I can't say what it is, or whether it comes from Golden Sun, or not.

It would be interesting if they put that in the Wendy's smash build given how attentive Sakurai is and how much he knows the smash fanbase

I'll use this opportunity to plead: if ANYONE is able to go to a smash demo or Wendy's tailgate, PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF SAKURAI GO AND RECORD EVERYTHING YOU CAN. Or at the very least give a full report of anything relevant (how the game plays and feels, what characters you tried and why, a list of items that popped up, etc.)

 

[CosmicQuark]

It's bizarre to me that some people are trying to claim that this "didn't actually take that much effort".
If fake, this pretty evidently took a ridiculous amount of effort, by one person (or more, even).

If they spent that much effort on it, do you think they would actually not consider the shadows?
"Let me just spend several hours on this and make some blatant mistakes for everyone to see"

Could be part of their game for them to miss something so... "obvious".
Or, patterns be damned, it's the first time the shadows were removed.

Also, putting forth so much effort and leaving blatant discrepancies in the background?


Either way, like I said earlier, speaking of people's motives is just conjecture. I'm just kinda spitting out random thoughts.
Perhaps they intentionally made those mistakes for people to find, just to watch people argue against it for their own fun.

Or, they aren't mistakes.

We don't know!
Again, just conjecture. Don't mind me

This is what flabbergasts me the most. I can definitely see reasons why someone would think this is fake--I can not comprehend those saying "anybody could do it" or saying it required no effort. Boggles the mind.

 

[Luigi The President]

The item picture is such awful quality that I can't say what it is, or whether it comes from Golden Sun, or not.

It would be interesting if they put that in the Wendy's smash build given how attentive Sakurai is and how much he knows the smash fanbase

I'll use this opportunity to plead: if ANYONE is able to go to a smash demo or Wendy's tailgate, PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF SAKURAI GO AND RECORD EVERYTHING YOU CAN. Or at the very least give a full report of anything relevant (how the game plays and feels, what characters you tried and why, a list of items that popped up, etc.)

Chunky Kong is an assist trophy the sequel

 

[Gyrom8]

Can't believe I'm saying this, but I'm actually starting to miss the times when we would speculate over whether or not Skull Kid and Medusa would get in as a Halloween rep.

Instead, we're talking about the Grinch in October.

Christmas celebrations getting earlier every year

Comparing this item to Super Paper Mario's
View attachment 172059

View attachment 172060

Thoughts?

I remember in pre-Brawl days wanting Dimentio for Smash. Good times. It'd be cool if it was the item, but as it's used for mind control in SPM I'm not really sure what it would do that the mushroom from Earthbound doesn't already do.

 

[Luigi The President]

It's bizarre to me that some people are trying to claim that this "didn't actually take that much effort".
If fake, this pretty evidently took a ridiculous amount of effort, by one person (or more, even).

If they spent that much effort on it, do you think they would actually not consider the shadows?
"Let me just spend several hours on this and make some blatant mistakes for everyone to see"

Could be part of their game for them to miss something so... "obvious".
Or, patterns be damned, it's the first time the shadows were removed.

Also, putting forth so much effort and leaving blatant discrepancies in the background?


Either way, like I said earlier, speaking of people's motives is just conjecture. I'm just kinda spitting out random thoughts.
Perhaps they intentionally made those mistakes for people to find, just to watch people argue against it for their own fun.

Or, they aren't mistakes.

We don't know!
Again, just conjecture. Don't mind me

Heh, sorry TB, but this image with the characters cleared up slightly and accounting for nothing else is gonna BLOW YOUR MIND

 

[Pazzo.]

It was posted last Tuesday on Reddit as part of a joke about the smash community becoming a group of investigators due to the surge of "leaks" Ultimate has seen.

Nice, do you have a link? Glad one of my GIMP edits made it to reddit.

 

[Iridium]

Stolen base? Wonder what else he could steal… #WorldSeries pic.twitter.com/F6QQPz0d7O

— The Grinch (@grinchmovie) October 24, 2018

I literally don't remember seeing this. Uh, interesting.