Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[WaddleMatt]

Stages back to 103, what? What have I missed?

 

[Iridium]

I'm still convinced that we're going to get at least a few more stages. Perhaps the change doesn't confirm anything so far, in terms of what the base game may have.

 

[Nekoo]

I highly disagree on that last Geno paragraph

There's a difference between your character being in a lot of disprovable text leaks for years now and your character having a high-quality image leak of his model that cannot be disproved

That's really all

If you read again that's literally what I said about the possibility of that picture being actually truth which would bother Square Enix and that Geno was asked by the fan with Ultimate being a fan fullfillement game.

 

[kylexv]

Speaking of Ken.

Does Capcom even remember the existence of Street Fighter 2000?

I would expect them to not remember the thing.

They acknowledged it in the recent Street Fighter collection with Street Fighter 1 and all editions of Street Fighter 2, Street Fighter Alpha, and Street FIghter 3.
There was a timeline for the series in it and it included Street Fighter 2010

 

[Deleted member]

Oh for the love of.. Mods nuke me now before I get so fed up with box theory i end up costing my friend a job.

Maybe your source has false information. What's your Vergeben number? We can use that to identify what sources you have been in contact with.

 

[Luigi The President]

If you read again that's literally what I said about the possibility of that picture being actually truth which would bother Square Enix and that Geno was asked by the fan with Ultimate being a fan fullfillement game.

Oh my b. Hard to read for me, apologies

 

[Deleted member]

They acknowledged it in the recent Street Fighter collection with Street Fighter 1 and all editions of Street Fighter 2, Street Fighter Alpha, and Street FIghter 3.
There was a timeline for the series in it and it included Street Fighter 2010

That's interesting.
But even then, i thought that Ken wasn't in the japanese version.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Let me ask you guys this. What is your favorite move in the Smash series? .

Villager's Timber. Everything about this move is ridiculous. You grow an eight foot, probably 400-600 pound tree from a sapling in less than a minute for the sole purpose of chopping it down (in two hits, mind you) to fall on someone. Meanwhile, Villager never changes its expression while it does something that would take power tools take over a minute to do. Ever cut down a tree by hand? I have, it's exhausting even if the blade is sharp. So here you have this scarecrow child who does it in two hits... On top of this, you have to keep in mind that this was a character who Sakurai originally discredited as not being a fighter but now has one of the most violent moves in all of Smash.

 

[Dee Dude]

So does this hurt the chances of any new series/3rd party character unless Sakurai pulls a F-Zero/Earthbound/Fire Emblem/ROB by making the character homeless?

 

[JustCallMeJon]

Stages back to 103, what? What have I missed?

Coro Coro changed the stage count from 108 to 103 as its total official stage count.

Good for you because possibility of a new franchise in Smash is damaged considerably.

B Waddle Dee still has a chance because he is a Kirby rep meaning that he does not need a new stage to represent the series.

 

[RandomAce]

BREAKING NEWS! NEW CORO CORO INFO!
Coro Coro recently changed the 108 stages to 103!

There was a problem fetching the tweet

So it is a typo!

Oh boy I can see the “OH TO BAD NO NEW FRANCHISES LEFT LOL” arguements.

Why do you guys like this is final? Pessimism is one thing, but acting like it’s the end of the world when a non Nintendo affiliated magazine says a stage count that hasn’t been confirmed to be final yet is on another level.

I just want this speculation cycle to be over. These last months after the August Direct have been rough as is.

 

[Wyoming]

Well ****. Guess that means no Rhythm Heaven, Golden Sun, new 3rd party franchise...

Hope there’s room for a Xenoblade X stage at least

And if 103 is true, the “Minecraft content” Vergeben stated is probably a Creeper AT or something, or even music sans stage

At least this killed a million piggybacking leaks with 5 random extra stages

I wouldn't say first parties are ruled out per say, but unique third parties are pretty much done until DLC comes.

 

[CosmicQuark]

CoroCoro being inconsistent isn't confirmation of anything. Confirmation is Nintendo saying "There are a total of 103 stages in Smash Ultimate." They aren't spoiling anything if that is indeed the final stage count, so no reason to keep it secret (unlike the number of characters). We're still back to where we were--waiting for official confirmation to clear things up.

 

[Deleted member]

Everyone is getting worked up about these theories and who's right and wrong when no one will care once the game is out anyways.

Kinda puts things into perspective for me, NGL. I honestly regret making a lot of the posts I did arguing about the box, especially because I don't think I worded any of them well and I kinda came off a little hostile in some of them. I mean, who cares what theories are right and wrong? The game comes out in nearly a month now, with whatever's left to show off most likely coming very soon. For me personally, I care more about playing the game, not whose theories are right and wrong in the end.

 

[amazonevan19]

I really hoped the box was fake.

It's so damn uncharacteristic for Sakurai/the smash team to just announce to the ****ing world "HEY THERE'S ONLY TWO CHARACTERS LEFT" via a box concept. Like WHHYYYY after ALL this time, the hype, the buildup, would you just forget and leak there's only two slots, when they know damn well how attentive we are.

But at this point I've surrendered. Occam's razor dictates our doom.

I'll be pleasantly surprised if there's anything else but now I just gotta suck it up, buttercup, look forward to the actual release, and then hope and pray for DLC. The base game is already kickass. But it'd be a lie to say I'm not disappointed over my most wanted aren't going to make it...hell, most of the entire community's remaining wants aren't going to make base now except for the 2 people genuinely happy over Kencineroar.

Let's just all assume the box is true at this point. All signs are pointing to it. It is still so baffling to me how they'd actively kill speculation and hype in such epic fashion that way when they should have KNOWN what that box would do based on those remaining slots you eye zooms RIGHT to.

Let's get hype for the game itself at this point and not let ourselves get wrapped up hoping Kencineroar/the box isn't true. Anyone trying to argue against it is in absolute denial after this double whammy today.

If Sakurai has an ace up the sleeve hype reveal, great, but certainly don't expect it and be grateful for what we've got right now.

 

[PsySmasher]

Hey guys!

What glorious, happy news have we received today...

*Sees CoroCoro tweet"

*Cries internally*

 

[Deleted member]

That's interesting.
But even then, i thought that Ken wasn't in the japanese version.

Correct. The player character from Street Fighter 2010 is Kevin Straker. He's even got SFV-era artwork.

Spoiler

Hopefully he and Blade from Street Fighter: The Movie: The Game get in the actual game at some point.

 

[Luigi The President]

I really hoped the box was fake.

It's so damn uncharacteristic for Sakurai/the smash team to just announce to the ****ing world "HEY THERE'S ONLY TWO CHARACTERS LEFT" via a box concept. Like WHHYYYY after ALL this time, the hype, the buildup, would you just forget and leak there's only two slots, when they know damn well how attentive we are.

But at this point I've surrendered. Occam's razor dictates our doom.

I'll be pleasantly surprised if there's anything else but now I just gotta suck it up, buttercup, look forward to the actual release, and then hope and pray for DLC. The base game is already kickass. But it'd be a lie to say I'm not disappointed over my most wanted aren't going to make it...hell, most of the entire community's remaining wants aren't going to make base now except for the 2 people genuinely happy over Kencineroar.

Let's just all assume the box is true at this point. All signs are pointing to it. It is still so baffling to me how they'd actively kill speculation and hype in such epic fashion that way when they should have KNOWN what that box would do based on those remaining slots you eye zooms RIGHT to.

Let's get hype for the game itself at this point and not let ourselves get wrapped up hoping Kencineroar/the box isn't true. Anyone trying to argue against it is in absolute denial after this double whammy today.

If Sakurai has an ace up the sleeve hype reveal, great, but certainly don't expect it and be grateful for what we've got right now.

If the Box is indeed true imo that slip-up will be the biggest disappointment of Ultimate by far. And there's VERY little disappointments in Ultimate luckily.

But oh my god if he really did spoil the remaining character amount and by implication who they are in September...

At least Incineroar's in; I love him.

 

[Iridium]

Oh boy! More SSBU footage!

Thank you, New Zealand! Also awaiting the Paris event in a week so that I get to see more Otakuni matches (hopefully). Time to get to analyzing.

 

[amazonevan19]

What if Sakurai was going to give us Kencineroar in October but the leaks have convinced him to push it back into a blowout November direct?

October would have been a Robin/Lucina Kencineroar reveal, November blowout direct detailing EVERYTHING left in the game and no characters or one character.

Idk but just a thought, Verge might have ruined everything even harder than we all thought.

 

[Deleted member]

Oh boy! More SSBU footage!

Thank you, New Zealand! Also awaiting the Paris event in a week so that I get to see more Otakuni matches (hopefully). Time to get to analyzing.

The Madrid Games Week will also have a Smash tournament.

We may get gameplay from there too online.

 

[Opossum]

What if Sakurai was going to give us Kencineroar in October but the leaks have convinced him to push it back into a blowout November direct?

October would have been a Robin/Lucina Kencineroar reveal, November blowout direct detailing EVERYTHING left in the game and no characters or one character.

Idk but just a thought, Verge might have ruined everything even harder than we all thought.

Ryu and Roy got leaked months in advance last time and it didn't throw off plans whatsoever. They wouldn't change things on the fly like that when they have a schedule, short of an earthquake or other natural disaster, as we've seen.

 

[Mellowy Yellow]

Hey guys what did i mi-

*Sees the last 3 pages*

I'm ********* done.

 

[Deleted member]

What if Sakurai was going to give us Kencineroar in October but the leaks have convinced him to push it back into a blowout November direct?

October would have been a Robin/Lucina Kencineroar reveal, November blowout direct detailing EVERYTHING left in the game and no characters or one character.

Idk but just a thought, Verge might have ruined everything even harder than we all thought.

Only thing the Vergeben collective ruined IMO was Simon, and even then, Intern-kun also spoiled him, and we at least got Richter as a surprise. I ignored him completely before E3, and Isabelle was pretty easy to guess.

 

[CosmicQuark]

I really hoped the box was fake.

It's so damn uncharacteristic for Sakurai/the smash team to just announce to the ****ing world "HEY THERE'S ONLY TWO CHARACTERS LEFT" via a box concept. Like WHHYYYY after ALL this time, the hype, the buildup, would you just forget and leak there's only two slots, when they know damn well how attentive we are.

But at this point I've surrendered. Occam's razor dictates our doom.

I'll be pleasantly surprised if there's anything else but now I just gotta suck it up, buttercup, look forward to the actual release, and then hope and pray for DLC. The base game is already kickass. But it'd be a lie to say I'm not disappointed over my most wanted aren't going to make it...hell, most of the entire community's remaining wants aren't going to make base now except for the 2 people genuinely happy over Kencineroar.

Let's just all assume the box is true at this point. All signs are pointing to it. It is still so baffling to me how they'd actively kill speculation and hype in such epic fashion that way when they should have KNOWN what that box would do based on those remaining slots you eye zooms RIGHT to.

Let's get hype for the game itself at this point and not let ourselves get wrapped up hoping Kencineroar/the box isn't true. Anyone trying to argue against it is in absolute denial after this double whammy today.

If Sakurai has an ace up the sleeve hype reveal, great, but certainly don't expect it and be grateful for what we've got right now.

"Let's just all assume the box is true at this point."

Um, no? Unless I missed something else, not all signs point to box theory. You're free to assume whatever you want, but so am I. Box Theory still has way too many assumptions (it's the finalized design, all base characters are on the sides, Verge is right except oh no SE rep um DLC!) and Occam's Razor is all about assuming the minimal amount of assumptions supported by the evidence. The simplest explanation is it's still a dumb box that doesn't give us any non-trivial information. Is it possible Box Theory is true? Yes. Is it likely? It's still not.

The one thing I worry about, which I have for the past couple weeks, is the stage count could still be 103 and be consistent with Verge, if Geno is the SE rep. But there's no reason to assume he's DLC unless you assume Box Theory is true in the first place.

 

[SAMation]

Incineroar Ken and Geno revealed, no need for an extra stage.

Badabing, Badaboom.

 

[Polar Bair]

I'm kinda lost as to why people thought "108 stages" meant anything after this.
Not that 103 stages was an absolute statement either, but we're right back to where we started.

E: to keep some discussion going, have we talked about this upcoming Ult event? I'm hoping we get some news, but at the very least we could see a lot of changes to confirmed characters that we haven't yet.

 

[ShadowGuy1]

Incineroar Ken and Geno revealed, no need for an extra stage.

Badabing, Badaboom.

Except one of them is third party (while still in the Mario series) and would likely come with a stage from Mario RPG .

 

[Deleted member]

I really hoped the box was fake.

It's so damn uncharacteristic for Sakurai/the smash team to just announce to the ****ing world "HEY THERE'S ONLY TWO CHARACTERS LEFT" via a box concept. Like WHHYYYY after ALL this time, the hype, the buildup, would you just forget and leak there's only two slots, when they know damn well how attentive we are.

But at this point I've surrendered. Occam's razor dictates our doom.

I'll be pleasantly surprised if there's anything else but now I just gotta suck it up, buttercup, look forward to the actual release, and then hope and pray for DLC. The base game is already kickass. But it'd be a lie to say I'm not disappointed over my most wanted aren't going to make it...hell, most of the entire community's remaining wants aren't going to make base now except for the 2 people genuinely happy over Kencineroar.

Let's just all assume the box is true at this point. All signs are pointing to it. It is still so baffling to me how they'd actively kill speculation and hype in such epic fashion that way when they should have KNOWN what that box would do based on those remaining slots you eye zooms RIGHT to.

Let's get hype for the game itself at this point and not let ourselves get wrapped up hoping Kencineroar/the box isn't true. Anyone trying to argue against it is in absolute denial after this double whammy today.

If Sakurai has an ace up the sleeve hype reveal, great, but certainly don't expect it and be grateful for what we've got right now.

TBH, when the Box Theory first cropped up, I instantly got flashbacks of FE Warriors, which killed all prerelease hype by doing the exact same thing: Putting every character on the special edition box and not keeping in mind that hey, it kinda gives everything away. My base arguments against the box was that there wasn't any hard evidence for it, and that Ken being the final Echo just didn't sit right with how Echos have been handled. Today's news isn't exactly clinching it, but it certainly helps, as 108 stages was pretty much the only major thing arguments against the box had. I'm not putting all my chips on it, but I will say it's certainly possible for Box Theory to be legit.

This game has plenty of fan-favorites in it. Every veteran is back, Ridley, K. Rool, a bunch of old stages, there's a LOT of hardcore Smash fanbase fan-service in this game. Unfortunately though, yes, people are gonna be disappointed. It is legit impossible to please everyone and not have at least someone walk away disappointed or unhappy something they wanted wasn't put in. Also, I'd caution not to take that attitude about Incineroar: I have seen many people excited for the idea, same with Ken. Just because something does not appeal to you does not mean no one will like it.

The only thing I would ask others here is let's please be civil, no matter what happens. Rubbing things in each others faces does nothing but make you look petty and like a sore winner, while ranting you were wrong does nothing but make you look like a sore loser. I myself got way to invested in these kinds of arguments and acted foolishly, so take it from me, it's not really the best way to act.

This is a video game, at the end of the day, it's really not worth getting upset about.

 

[Deleted member]

Some positive stuff to change the mood:

We are finally getting news on the new Medievil title in one or two weeks.

Confirmed by Playstation

 

[Luigi The President]

Except one of them is third party (while still in the Mario series) and would likely come with a stage from Mario RPG .

"while still in the Mario series"
Bingo disproved your own point. Geno does not at all need a stage.

 

[Androobie]

Oh boy, now it’s Team “It’s a typo” VS Team “They accidentally spoiled the actual amount of stages” now.

 

[SAMation]

Except one of them is third party (while still in the Mario series) and would likely come with a stage from Mario RPG .

Geno doesn’t need to have a stage, even if he’s third party he’s still a Mario character and not a new series. New series would require a new stage. But that’s my personal opinion and we can agree to disagree tho, Peace and Love only in this thread.

 

[Luigi The President]

TBH, when the Box Theory first cropped up, I instantly got flashbacks of FE Warriors, which killed all prerelease hype by doing the exact same thing: Putting every character on the special edition box and not keeping in mind that hey, it kinda gives everything away. My base arguments against the box was that there wasn't any hard evidence for it, and that Ken being the final Echo just didn't sit right with how Echos have been handled. Today's news isn't exactly clinching it, but it certainly helps, as 108 stages was pretty much the only major thing arguments against the box had. I'm not putting all my chips on it, but I will say it's certainly possible for Box Theory to be legit.

This game has plenty of fan-favorites in it. Every veteran is back, Ridley, K. Rool, a bunch of old stages, there's a LOT of hardcore Smash fanbase fan-service in this game. Unfortunately though, yes, people are gonna be disappointed. It is legit impossible to please everyone and not have at least someone walk away disappointed or unhappy something they wanted wasn't put in. Also, I'd caution not to take that attitude about Incineroar: I have seen many people excited for the idea, same with Ken. Just because something does not appeal to you does not mean no one will like it.

The only thing I would ask others here is let's please be civil, no matter what happens. Rubbing things in each others faces does nothing but make you look petty and like a sore winner, while ranting you were wrong does nothing but make you look like a sore loser. I myself got way to invested in these kinds of arguments and acted foolishly, so take it from me, it's not really the best way to act.

This is a video game, at the end of the day, it's really not worth getting upset about.

Wasn't the FE warriors special box released a week before the game??

 

[Deleted member]

"Let's just all assume the box is true at this point."

Um, no? Unless I missed something else, not all signs point to box theory. You're free to assume whatever you want, but so am I. Box Theory still has way too many assumptions (it's the finalized design, all base characters are on the sides, Verge is right except oh no SE rep um DLC!) and Occam's Razor is all about assuming the minimal amount of assumptions supported by the evidence. The simplest explanation is it's still a dumb box that doesn't give us any non-trivial information. Is it possible Box Theory is true? Yes. Is it likely? It's still not.

The one thing I worry about, which I have for the past couple weeks, is the stage count could still be 103 and be consistent with Verge, if Geno is the SE rep. But there's no reason to assume he's DLC unless you assume Box Theory is true in the first place.

You don't have to believe the Collective if you follow Box Theory. Box Theory is just Ken + final character. Only way the hive mind fits in to all of this is if you also think he's right, and then both assumptions fall apart. Even then, Vergebens in the past have had almost correct information with one or two things mentioned being false.

Some positive stuff to change the mood:

We are finally getting news on the new Medievil title in one or two weeks.

Confirmed by Playstation

It'd better be on Halloween.

 

[Deleted member]

Wasn't the FE warriors special box released a week before the game??

I believe the design for it was up earlier, but I could be misremembering.

 

[Mellowy Yellow]

To say i would be absolutely ****ing fine and happy if the last revealed characters are goddamn Incineroar and Ken would be a lie and an absolute understatement.

 

[Amiibo Doctor]

Somebody make sure my understanding is correct. Corocoro said we have 103 stages. This supports box theory... somehow? And if Vergy is right (I think he is) then thats Kencineroar confirmed... somehow.

Help me out here, folks.

 

[Deleted member]

You don't have to believe the Collective if you follow Box Theory. Box Theory is just Ken + final character. Only way the hive mind fits in to all of this is if you also think he's right, and then both assumptions fall apart. Even then, Vergebens in the past have had almost correct information with one or two things mentioned being false.


It'd better be on Halloween.

Some fans that i know on Twitter theorized about the news releasing close to the release day of the original game.

For more information, i suggest to look for SaveMedievil on Twitter.

 

[Heracr055]

Let me ask you guys this. What is your favorite move in the Smash series? For me it's probably Brawl/4 Ganondorf's Side-B. Fits the character well, does good damage, bypasses shield, sets up combos. ROB's Top gets special mention. I love getting to play mind games with throwing it straight-up or tossing it just in front of someone, and it's such a nice spacing/edge-guard tool.

Smash 4 had everyone's recovery improve so I grew to appreciate moves that kill off the top as a result.
My favorite 2 moves now are Sonic up air and Ryu True Shoryuken. The former is because it's such a cute light little tap that just barely throws you into the blast zone, so it feels so insulting to get a kill that way from around 60ish% and up. And the latter because it's the most devastating punish in the game with frame 1 startup, frame 1-6 invincibility and the ability to kill at ridiculous percents (with safe kill confirms into it too).