Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Dee Dude]

The real problem is why Alph is mute when he clearly has a voice in Pikmin 3.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

16e is the most obviously missing Echo at this point and we all know it.

I kinda do like the idea of Echoes being a somewhat easier accesable version of the main character honestly. This is why I always felt Lucina was a great concept of a character, being it as a full clone or not. She's genious addition in many ways.

This is why I also think a Sheik Echo in the form of Impa would be great. Cause Sheik, as her own character since Smash 4, is the most combo-orientated character on the roster. And having a less polarising version of said character on the roster would be ideal therefore. So yes, Impa would really be a ideal Echo in many ways.

If Impa got in, would you like her to have her Ocarina of Time Design or Her Skyward Sword one?

 

[Deleted member]

The real problem is why Alph is mute when he clearly has a voice in Pikmin 3.

Olimar also has a voice, so I guess they just want the captains to be mute.

 

[monadoboy]

I think the most important thing about the renders is the Yoshi one.
It looks very similar to the normal Yoshi, this might open up possibilities for costumes like spiky eared Pichu that were thought to be too similar to their normal costume.

 

[DarkFalcon]

Olimar's voice is too deep for us mere mortals to comprehend.

 

[Yosher]

By the way.

Anyone else bothered by the fact that they got this art for female Pokémon Trainer now, even if you can't use the standard/default Pokémon's colors with her? Makes me wish you could mix and match their costumes to suit your liking.

 

[Exalt4747]

Is there any particular reason why Ridley's skin looks different when becomes meta Ridley?

Was he just inspired to start taking better care of it...?

 

[Jedisupersonic]

Twice the pride, double the fall.

Reminds me of this I found the other day.

 

[DarkFalcon]

Is there any particular reason why Ridley's skin looks different when becomes meta Ridley?

Was he just inspired to start taking better care of it...?

Ridley visually looks different every game. The color scheme here doesn't remind me of any game in particular. Meta Ridley in Prime 1 had darker looking skin. I guess it's meant to resemble Prime 3 meta Ridley?

 

[BlueMagician]

Why not? He can still do everything while in his boxers in BotW.

Yeah, it doesn't look like there should be anything in the way

 

[Deleted member]

I mean...wanting them added is fine, but realistically thinking we'll get 13 more before launch? I hope you're prepared for immense disappointment.

This vid has never been more relevant.

 

[Exalt4747]

Ridley visually looks different every game. The color scheme here doesn't remind me of any game in particular. Meta Ridley in Prime 1 had darker looking skin. I guess it's meant to resemble Prime 3 meta Ridley?

I'm not an expert admittedly. The last time I saw Ridley designs compared was....a vid arguing he shouldn't be in smash back during the 4 cycle.

 

[Deleted member]

It matters that Dark Pit's Final Smash is a rush job because it was done in little time. So little time there was no time to:
1. Give it unique properties, distinct from Zelda's Light Arrow, something even Sheik's Light Arrow has
2. Polish the animation, so it looks sloppy and stiff compared to the rest of the animation work put into the game that clearly has more flow and polish

Even if they're clones and heavily based on existing characters, echo fighters still take some work to do. Obviously, not as much as a full character, but it still takes development time and resources.

One big problem with Alph having his ship in the Final Smash is that the ship's shape is completely different from that of Olimar's ship, meaning they'd have to create a new model, animate it and program hitboxes on it and ensure the move flows as well.

They had to do the same with Dark Pit's Final Smash sure, but look at how sloppy that animation is, the Dark Pit Staff itself isn't animated, and for the move's data and hitbox, it's a straight up copy-paste from Zelda's Light Arrow, just with a different visual effect for the projectile that probably is made from other special effect assets anyway as it actually doesn't look any similar with the staff's projectiles in KIU.

And you're being obtuse enough to complain about Alph not blinking his eyes.

I don't get why some people act like everything in Smash has a justification. There really isn't any as to why Alph isn't an Echo instead of a costume so stop trying to try to justify it.

And sure, I'm being obtuse for wanting Alph to not look like a soulless sack of meat.

 

[hazza5557]

General question here:
If I were to buy 6 pairs of joy cons (so 12 individual ones) would I be able to connect all 6 to the switch to play Smash 8 players or are only 4 joy cons allowed at once.

 

[Exalt4747]

If thirteen more characters get in the game at launch, Sakurai is God.

 

[T-Hell]

So I've just seen the new renders. Yoshi should have had a yarn yoshi skin imo, the Crafted World one barely makes a difference.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

After seeing the Crafted Yoshi and Meta Ridley, as well as other special alts in Smash

I kind of makes me think in the last direct they are going to showcase all the special alts instead of tons of characters

Like maybe it's only Ken and Incineroar, and tons of alternate costumes

 

[Aurane]

I know this is not a popular opinion, but if Impa gets in as a playable character, then I'd hope for her to be of the same Impa from Hyrule Warriors. Its her most bad ass incarnation by far and she's got that giant sword, fam- That's right up my alley.

But her being a Shiek Echo? I mean, that's also okay. It adds more flavor to the roster, but I personally would just prefer her being a unique character in her HW incarnation.

Again, I know that's not a popular opinion but that's my thoughts about Impa as her own character.

But she won't be playable because Diddy Kong wants her playable.

 

[Astroworld]

I’m surprised they didn’t show off a Duster assist trophy

Kumatora and Boney appear in Lucas’ final smash now so where’s Duster if he’s not an assist?

 

[CroonerMike]

Someone want to help find this shadow render?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=G-QkFxbUlqc

 

[DarkFalcon]

I'm not an expert admittedly. The last time I saw Ridley designs compared was....a vid arguing he shouldn't be in smash back during the 4 cycle.

And in the end none of that mattered because they made a Smash original design for Ridley that made him work.

 

[Deleted member]

After seeing the Crafted Yoshi and Meta Ridley, as well as other special alts in Smash

I kind of makes me think in the last direct they are going to showcase all the special alts instead of tons of characters

Like maybe it's only Ken and Incineroar, and tons of alternate costumes

I'd be completely okay with this, especially if when Ken's revealed, Ryu shows up with his beard.

 

[ChocolatGelgato]

the vast majoirty of the characters that most people want atm would never be DLC however. People need to actually, you know, BUY the characters. I'm sorry to say this, but Ridley and K Rool are both examples of characters would not have the sales power to justify ever being DLC, they were saved to Ultimate baseline for a reason, everyone has to have them, even if you don't care for metroid (like a lot of japanese fans where the series is less popular) or have no clue on earth what a kay rool is (like a lot of younger fans). The DLC characters will be the same as smash 4, either huge icons like cloud, or there to force a new or recent game down our throats like Corrin did. Geno, Isaac, Rhythm Heaven, Ninten/Porky, Mach Rider, Banjo and Skull Kid will never be in smash unless they're in baseline where they dont have to worry about minor things such as milking money from their fans.

If you want to predict DLC and be on the box theory (I don't really believe in the box that much, i'm just playing along because yall are real high and mighty about it) Expect:

Close to Gurantee tier: Rex, Spring Man, Monster Hunter, 3 houses character, Heihachi, whatever Square Enix character (I'm pissed if this ain't Erdrick)
Likely Tier: Dante, Waluigi (Yes really), Star Allies Dream Friend, Gen 8 Pokemon
Eh sure tier: Crash, Dovakiihn, BOTW Champion, Tails

If it's anyone else, and especially some cult hit like isaac or geno, I'll happily take the L, but for now I refuse to believe that "waiting for DLC" is anything but a death sentence for those who love quirky fighters that aren't villager semiclones.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

I’m surprised they didn’t show off a Duster assist trophy

Kumatora and Boney appear in Lucas’ final smash now so where’s Duster if he’s not an assist?

He could still be an assist. I expect a Couple more Pokemon and assists to be shown off during he final smash direct...

 

[BluePikmin11]

If thirteen more characters get in the game at launch, Sakurai is God.

I will bow down to Sakurai if he manages to do that and get Heihachi working in Smash.

That will be proof of Sakurai's godly skills as a developer.

 

[TeamFlareZakk]

I like your Choice for 74... I'd be happy with just that alone...

Yes 74 plus the echos mentioned!

I believe Rhythm Girl or Ringside Reporter have a really good chance, I have a hunch that maybe Chorus Kids would be scrapped for one of them.. Reasons well first off Reporter's Wrestler is fightng fit and so that would work perfectly.. And Rhythm Girl has Rhythm in her name so that could be ideal in marketing because she would reccognized as that girl from Rythim Heaven.. Tje Rhythm Girl!

I dont think Chorus Kids would have the charisma to represent the series as its fighter.. But they probably will be assist trophies.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

the vast majoirty of the characters that most people want atm would never be DLC however. People need to actually, you know, BUY the characters. I'm sorry to say this, but Ridley and K Rool are both examples of characters would not have the sales power to justify ever being DLC, they were saved to Ultimate baseline for a reason, everyone has to have them, even if you don't care for metroid (like a lot of japanese fans where the series is less popular) or have no clue on earth what a kay rool is (like a lot of younger fans). The DLC characters will be the same as smash 4, either huge icons like cloud, or there to force a new or recent game down our throats like Corrin did. Geno, Isaac, Rhythm Heaven, Ninten/Porky, Mach Rider, Banjo and Skull Kid will never be in smash unless they're in baseline where they dont have to worry about minor things such as milking money from their fans.

If you want to predict DLC and be on the box theory (I don't really believe in the box that much, i'm just playing along because yall are real high and mighty about it) Expect:

Close to Gurantee tier: Rex, Spring Man, Monster Hunter, 3 houses character, Heihachi, whatever Square Enix character (I'm pissed if this ain't Erdrick)
Likely Tier: Dante, Waluigi (Yes really), Star Allies Dream Friend, Gen 8 Pokemon
Eh sure tier: Crash, Dovakiihn, BOTW Champion, Tails

If it's anyone else, and especially some cult hit like isaac or geno, I'll happily take the L, but for now I refuse to believe that "waiting for DLC" is anything but a death sentence for those who love quirky fighters that aren't villager semiclones.

Don't most fighting games have characters as DLC that the developers just made up?

I mean, if Mortal Kombat or Killer Instinct can just make up a character for DLC and show them off, why does SMASH specifically have to go for DLC that's not big corporate names?

 

[Zeox]

I’m surprised they didn’t show off a Duster assist trophy

Kumatora and Boney appear in Lucas’ final smash now so where’s Duster if he’s not an assist?

Well, they announced Klaptrap, the new assist trophy of DK in the same streaming as King K. Rool, to tease him... maybe they are saving Duster's assist trophy for a Ninten reveal as a non echo character but as a semi echo like isabelle?

 

[drag0nscythe]

Someone want to help find this shadow render?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=G-QkFxbUlqc

Just saying, I can make those. I did for a while.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Someone want to help find this shadow render?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=G-QkFxbUlqc

I think I Found it http://sonic.wikia.com/wiki/File:ASR_Shadow.png

 

[Malkior7]

Someone want to help find this shadow render?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=G-QkFxbUlqc

If that person had actually clicked on Shadows page and brought it up I would have been more inclined to believe it

 

[TheCJBrine]

If it's anyone else, and especially some cult hit like isaac or geno, I'll happily take the L, but for now I refuse to believe that "waiting for DLC" is anything but a death sentence for those who love quirky fighters that aren't villager semiclones.

Idk, they're still possible if they sell them in packs.

Didn't Lucas come with Ryu in Smash 4? Maybe you could buy them separate, but I remember DLC bundle stuff.

I’m surprised they didn’t show off a Duster assist trophy

Kumatora and Boney appear in Lucas’ final smash now so where’s Duster if he’s not an assist?

He was too busy getting yelled at by Wess to notice his invitation.

 

[staindgrey]

If thirteen more characters get in the game at launch, Sakurai is God.

The catch is that they're all Fire Emblem lords.

 

[Exalt4747]

And in the end none of that mattered because they made a Smash original design for Ridley that made him work.

I saw one person say he hunches over like that in Super Metroid, but idk if that's true.

 

[Frostwraith]

Yeah, and as you mentioned, the shape of the ship is different which prevents it from being a clean replacement for the Dolphin. This hitbox would be too small or large depending on the ship used.

fwiw, here's the model without the blur effect.
View attachment 165187

I'm no artist, and it's been a while since I've played Pikmin 3, but I feel like you'd definitely want to animate the parts of it that don't exist on the Dolphin, which would create even more work.

And because the hitbox would be different, they'd potentially need to adjust the move's properties to make sure it flows well since Olimar's ship can deal multiple hits to characters depending on where it hits (basically has a tendency to somewhat drag opponents upwards for a bit).

I don't get why some people act like everything in Smash has a justification. There really isn't any as to why Alph isn't an Echo instead of a costume so stop trying to try to justify it.

It's a game with a huge load of content, all of it is planned and every single decision is deliberately taken in consideration for development costs, time and resources.

Balancing characters revolves around making minute decisions, slight adjustments and ensuring there's no underpowered or overpowered move. Even a change like a move dealing 1% more or less than before can make a difference.

In order to follow as closely with the project plan, there's a large amount of planning to ensure they have enough staff working on it. Things can complicate, there are bugs that might take longer to fix, there are development issues that can happen.

There are changes that occur mid-development and that need to be accounted for.

There might be changes in the budget, delays, staff changes mid-development, and many other factors that can't be accounted for during the planning phase.

It's a wild ride. As the director, Sakurai has to manage a large staff, work with different departments in the development, from programmers, designers, animators, sound directors, art directors, music composers, debuggers, legal departments, deal with the demands of the employer, work around potential issues.

It's a lot more complex. They can't simply snap their fingers and make **** happen. Sometimes compromises need to be made in order to have content.

Some characters don't make it into the game. It's easy to say "they should have done this or that" but tell that to the entire development staff behind the behemoth of a game Smash Bros. is, especially Ultimate, but 3DS/Wii U and Brawl were no slouches in that department either.

Is this even difficult to understand? Do you even realize all the work that is put in developing every single feature, every single detail in the game? I don't think you're quite getting it.

 

[CroonerMike]

If that person had actually clicked on Shadows page and brought it up I would have been more inclined to believe it

Never said anything about believing it. I just want the render.

 

[Chrono.]

16e is the most obviously missing Echo at this point and we all know it.

Just like 38e is.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

Is there any particular reason why Ridley's skin looks different when becomes meta Ridley?

Was he just inspired to start taking better care of it...?

NANOMACHINES, SON! DON'T **** WITH THIS SPACE PIRATE!

 

[Deleted member]

Didn't Lucas come with Ryu in Smash 4? Maybe you could buy them separate, but I remember DLC bundle stuff.

Nope, all DLC characters were sold separately.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Yes 74 plus the echos mentioned!

I believe Rhythm Girl or Ringside Reporter have a really good chance, I have a hunch that maybe Chorus Kids would be scrapped for one of them.. Reasons well first off Reporter's Wrestler is fightng fit and so that would work perfectly.. And Rhythm Girl has Rhythm in her name so that could be ideal in marketing because she would reccognized as that girl from Rythim Heaven.. Tje Rhythm Girl!

I dont think Chorus Kids would have the charisma to represent the series as its fighter.. But they probably will be assist trophies.

Rhythm Girl has been one of my Dream Smash Characters ever since I Started playing Rhythm Heaven a couple months ago...
Seriously though... that Franchise needs a rep. I don't want the franchise to be canceled. If it can work with Fire Emblem and Xenobalde, I think it can work with Rhythm Heaven...