Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Geno Boost]

I expect to see custom moves for the DLC characters that are coming back in the switch version

 

[Deleted member]

I don't see why some people are doing that whole "This character will be cut" thing, again. Smash 4 has shown that Sakurai has a pattern of not cutting the characters everyone says will be cut.

So we shouldn't speculate on which characters are going to be cut?
We might as well stop speculating entirely.

 

[Zeallyx]

My take on the mysterious line-up:

 

[Ryu_Ken]

View attachment 138356

From the Smash 4 trailer that revealed Villager and Mega Man

View attachment 138357

From the Palutena trailer

View attachment 138358

From the Pac-Man trailer

Those are character copyrights, not who worked on the game. :V

Wew, I thought I was going insane for a second. Thanks, Golden.

Anyway, in case you want more proof of a new Smash title, listen here at the 0:48 mark. It's HIGHLY likely they're teasing the new theme song since I don't recognize that melody from any of the previous Smash titles or any Nintendo game.

 

[SlickWylde]

What features do you guys hope are added or removed? And which do you hope stay? Here are mine:

Remove From Game:
Custom Moves - I was really excited about this, but this ended up being pretty disappointing. None of my friends enjoyed playing with them or learning them, so we always turned them off anyway. I also think this takes away from development time, where they could have focused more on refining the gameplay. (Just an opinion)

Smash Tour- Because I hate it lol. No real reason.

Add to Game:
Not much, it has most things I want

Keep:
Mapmaker. I always have fun with this!!

 

[SuperSmashStephen]

Yes, let’s just accuse me of being biased rather than actually defend your argument. Classy.

A bogus fan rule will always be a bogus fan rule. Never mind that it’s something that’s only happened once. One time does not a pattern make. Believe it or not Sakurai doesn’t have strict rules or patterns to add characters. He chooses as he damn well pleases.



Corrin really isn’t unique. He has a moveset that exists. It’s like the old Little Mac “A punch B punch Side B punch” meme movesets.

Corrin is an incredibly divisive character in FE, almost certainly because of his inclusion in Smash. For every person that likes them I’ve seen FE fans say they hate them.

Really you get everything about FE with just Marth, Ike, and Robin. Significantly less divisive but still popular characters. Debatably they have more interesting movesets as well.

A new character is virtually guaranteed. (As much as I hate saying those words in regards to any character.) Spring Man is a character with perceived moveset overlap as well. Everything is kinda just stacked against Corrin.



Not really. Clones never really end well in fighting games, especially ones so samey. I’ve seen numerous fans of all three characters want them to just be costumes so they don’t have to pick one over the other for fairly objective gameplay reasons.



And how many times have these bogus fan rules been smashed to pieces?

I see no reason why anybody should think Sakurai would do the same thing twice. Especially when actual fans would appreciate something else.

I mean, look at Dark Pit. That is not a character. That’s a single move that’s better and two other moves that are ****ed.



That’s the thing. You put zero effort in, you get zero out. The character does not work well. It’s not a concept that needs to be pushed further. The effort would be better spent on a different clone, one with some actual thought and effort behind it.

If you people really believe in these stupid “patterns” so much let’s just look at the previous clones. Rather than attempt to bring old ones back they overwhelmingly attempt new ones. You don’t think somebody like Lucas or Wolf could of been made with the effort that went into the new trio? Of course they could of. But Sakurai picked some new characters and a different and arguably less important one. Wether or not it’s just whimsy or a rule I’ll let you decide.

I don’t really get what you’re trying to get at. Nothing is stacked against Corrin other than she was only originally added in for promotion. Marth, Ike, and Robin do not encompass everything Fire Emblem has to offer. Marth is just a swordsman, Ike is a heavy swordsmen, and Robin is a mage. Fire Emblem has lances, axe wielders, wyverns, archers, and so much more. Corrin covers one of those being a transforming character by being able to become a dragon.

Sakurai has said before he puts a lot of emphasis on having unique characters. No one else plays like Corrin. Sakurai is also a fan of Fire Emblem, and Nintendo is pushing it hard. Fire Emblem Heroes has been their best selling mobile game, and the franchise has seen a boom in popularity over the years.

I’m not disagreeing that their will be cuts for the franchise in regards to representation on the roster. However, even as you said, the clones don’t offer anything, and they are the most likely to go. Lucina first, Roy second, and Corrin third (if even considered to be cut.)

That being said, I don’t see one of Sakurai’s favorite franchise, and a popular Nintendo franchise taking a hit of 3 cuts in a single iteration of Smash.

Like I said before. Marth, Ike, Robin, Corrin, and A Fire Emblem Switch Character will make the roster. Even Roy is a possibility because the Smash Community loves him. Fire Emblem will have 5-6 reps making either decrease by 1 or stay the same, but on a larger roster, it may not seem as saturated.

 

[N3ON]

While we could start overanalyzing everything and reading real deep into the minimal evidence we have... we could also just wait until they show gameplay and then it'll be pretty simple to tell if we're dealing with a completely new game or not...

 

[Deleted member]

Its totally a new game
Reason: because I want it to be

 

[Cyn]

While we could start overanalyzing everything and reading real deep into the minimal evidence we have... we could also just wait until they show gameplay and then it'll be pretty simple to tell if we're dealing with a completely new game or not...

Where’s the fun in that?

 

[Deathlightning21]

I really hope Smash Tour gets replaced with a boosted version of Smash Run from the 3DS. It reminded me a lot of Subspace Emissary and was actually fun to play.

Speaking of which, An Adventure/Subspace mode would be so great to have again...As long as this one doesn't get leaked again.

 

[N3ON]

Where’s the fun in that?

Sanity seems fleeting and incorporeal around Smash speculation scenes, so I guess I just value what little I have left. :3

 

[Ryu_Ken]

My take on the mysterious line-up:

This is surprisingly what I was thinking as well. Nice job, dude!

Speaking of which, An Adventure/Subspace mode would be so great to have again...As long as this one doesn't get leaked again.

Considering how this teaser trailer came OUT OF NOWEHERE, I doubt Nintendo will be careless this time around.

 

[SlickWylde]

Even if it gets debunked immediately, I like the idea of that song towards the end being a tease for the new theme. That's a fun idea.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Hoping Ganondorf gets a total rework barring like five moves (FTilt, Dair, UAir, Up Smash and Flame Choke). Sakurai can go ham with the rest and I'll be happy so long as at least three of those moves stay, though all five would be preferable tbh.

Edit: added a move.

 

[Schnee117]

Not really. Clones never really end well in fighting games, especially ones so samey. I’ve seen numerous fans of all three characters want them to just be costumes so they don’t have to pick one over the other for fairly objective gameplay reasons.

You don't know what you're on about as usual. Anecdotes are useless. I've seen just as many fans of the character want them to remain separate because they want them to have their individuality.

Sakurai's gone on record as saying that the reason Dr Mario isn't a costume for Mario is because that wouldn't please the fans of Dr Mario.

So yes really. They're their own thing or they're not on the roster at all.

 

[Cyn]

Sanity seems fleeting and incorporeal around Smash speculation scenes, so I guess I just value what little I have left. :3

I agree. Sanity takes a back seat when these things called ‘Smash’ come around. Take a seat back here with sanity and me and enjoy the show.

 

[SlickWylde]

Hoping Ganondorf gets a total rework barring like four moves (FTilt, Dair, UAir and Flame Choke). Sakurai can go ham with the rest and I'll be happy so long as at least two of those moves stay, though all four would be preferable tbh.

I would love that, but seeing as he's been in 3 games now, I don't think that's gonna happen. :'(

 

[Jubileus57]

Speaking of which, An Adventure/Subspace mode would be so great to have again...As long as this one doesn't get leaked again.

Man a new Adventure Mode à la Subspace would be DOPE. I loved how all our favorite characters were put together in one big universe, fighting together... It's absence is by a very long shot my biggest gripe with SSB4.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

Even if it gets debunked immediately, I like the idea of that song towards the end being a tease for the new theme. That's a fun idea.

Mwa ha ha ha... I'm definitely going to remember this post.

 

[SlickWylde]

Mwa ha ha ha... I'm definitely going to remember this post.

I don't get it... I'm not claiming anything, just saying it's a fun idea...

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

I would love that, but seeing as he's been in 3 games now, I don't think that's gonna happen. :'(

Can you like, not do this to me?



Also, the fact I didn't list Up Smash in that list is a crime, as a Smash 4 Ganondorf main smh.

 

[Schnee117]

Hoping Ganondorf gets a total rework barring like five moves (FTilt, Dair, UAir, Up Smash and Flame Choke). Sakurai can go ham with the rest and I'll be happy so long as at least three of those moves stay, though all five would be preferable tbh.

Edit: added a move.

Keep Wizard's Foot too. We need our Not!Dr Doom.

 

[N3ON]

I do think that music may be a tease for the game's theme. You can quote me if you want.

I agree. Sanity takes a back seat when these things called ‘Smash’ come around. Take a seat back here with sanity and me and enjoy the show.

I'm used to these shows lasting triple, quadruple the time. This one may just be a breeze.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

I don't get it... I'm not claiming anything, just saying it's a fun idea...

I'm not gonna pressure you to choose a side or pose your own thoughts, but it sounded like you were implying it's not likely to happen.
It IS a fun idea, though, considering most haven't pointed it out yet.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Keep Wizard's Foot too. We need our Not!Dr Doom.

I'd list that too, but the fact the move loses momentum when hitting shield and its long startup kind of made me forget about the move tbh

 

[PSIguy89]

how would people feel in general if this next smash game got NO new FE characters? and instead brought everyone from 4 back? plus a largely reworked Lucina? i think that might be the "safest" option when it comes to appeasing the fanbase in general

 

[SlickWylde]

I'm not gonna pressure you to choose a side or pose your own thoughts, but it sounded like you were implying it's not likely to happen.
It IS a fun idea, though, considering most haven't pointed it out yet.

I was trying to say "Whether or not this ends up happening", like as a completely unbiased spectator

I have 0 idea whether or not it will be, or whether or not this will be a port or a new game. And I'm trying not to make any decisions in my own mind, so I won't be disappointed either way!

 

[Ryu_Ken]

I'd list that too, but the fact the move loses momentum when hitting shield and its long startup kind of made me forget about the move tbh

And in consequence, forgetting the many options that comes out of ledge cancelling Wizard's Foot or the adrenaline that comes just from doing that. Hmph.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

Keep Wizard's Foot too. We need our Not!Dr Doom.

I can fully agree with this. Down-B and Dair must remain so that all can bow before FOOT DIVE!

 

[Deleted member]

While we could start overanalyzing everything and reading real deep into the minimal evidence we have... we could also just wait until they show gameplay and then it'll be pretty simple to tell if we're dealing with a completely new game or not...

The Smash fanbase?
Not overanalyzing even the most minimal of things?

You must not know us very well.

 

[dezeray112]

My take on the mysterious line-up:

That's pretty much what I was predicting as well.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Just so I'm getting this right, Nintendo's online service is launching in September, correct?

If that's the case, would that mean it's possible Smash might launch in September to coincide with the launch of the online service? I feel like you'd need a really big game like Smash in order to push the service and show off how well their online infrastructure performs with the sheer amount of people wanting to play a game like Smash online.

 

[LancerStaff]

I wouldn't say Corrin isn't unique.

Their Dragon Fang abilities is something exclusive solely to them (and Kana).

No other character in the entire Fire Emblem series can do what they do.

It’s “unique.” It’s literally just a thing they can do. It makes for one gimmick move in the entire moveset. It doesn’t define the character’s gameplay.

Never mind that that you could have any character with an electric/poison/whatever projectile copy it easily. Spring Man could for example imitate the move. Robin could copy the move with magic and a sword sword.

I stop taking people who use bias in their arguements seriously. I couldn't bother.


He did mention that he doesn't like cuts though, didn't he?
Sakurai at least tries to appeal to the fanbase. Turning clones into alts would be pretty damn counter productive.
Not to mention there's absolutely no reason to do that at all.

Everybody is biased. You might as well swear off arguing at all if you’re just going to hide behind that every time somebody points out a flaw in yours.

They’re still fully playable though. That’s not a cut.

In what way? They can try a new idea that might actually work, and then people don’t have to feel compelled to pick a character over another because they’re the same thing but better. There’s absolutely reason to do it. Claiming there isn’t... It’s pure bias.

I don’t really get what you’re trying to get at. Nothing is stacked against Corrin other than she was only originally added in for promotion. Marth, Ike, and Robin do not encompass everything Fire Emblem has to offer. Marth is just a swordsman, Ike is a heavy swordsmen, and Robin is a mage. Fire Emblem has lances, axe wielders, wyverns, archers, and so much more. Corrin covers one of those being a transforming character by being able to become a dragon.

Sakurai has said before he puts a lot of emphasis on having unique characters. No one else plays like Corrin. Sakurai is also a fan of Fire Emblem, and Nintendo is pushing it hard. Fire Emblem Heroes has been their best selling mobile game, and the franchise has seen a boom in popularity over the years.

I’m not disagreeing that their will be cuts for the franchise in regards to representation on the roster. However, even as you said, the clones don’t offer anything, and they are the most likely to go. Lucina first, Roy second, and Corrin third (if even considered to be cut.)

That being said, I don’t see one of Sakurai’s favorite franchise, and a popular Nintendo franchise taking a hit of 3 cuts in a single iteration of Smash.

Like I said before. Marth, Ike, Robin, Corrin, and A Fire Emblem Switch Character will make the roster. Even Roy is a possibility because the Smash Community loves him. Fire Emblem will have 5-6 reps making either decrease by 1 or stay the same, but on a larger roster, it may not seem as saturated.

People hate the idea of advertising, especially with paid DLC.

Transforming into a dragon is a visual. It has zero effect on gameplay.

Corrin is a character that exists. We have slow swordfighters.

I mean you admitted that people are keen on the idea of cutting the character. I’m just explaining why.

You don't know what you're on about as usual. Anecdotes are useless. I've seen just as many fans of the character want them to remain separate because they want them to have their individuality.

Sakurai's gone on record as saying that the reason Dr Mario isn't a costume for Mario is because that wouldn't please the fans of Dr Mario.

So yes really. They're their own thing or they're not on the roster at all.

I can see him easily being swayed by fan demand and usage statistics. Dark Pit is not a character. Lucina is a crappy character. Doc fans do not necessarily like the direction he’s going in. Believe it or not he can change his mind.

Trying to predict Sakurai only leads to tears.

 

[N3ON]

The Smash fanbase?
Not overanalyzing even the most minimal of things?

You must not know us very well.

BUT THE SOLUTION IS SO SIMPLE

IT JUST REQUIRES A LITTLE BIT OF PATIEN-

oh, yeah. Nevermind. Carry on.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

And in consequence, forgetting the many options that comes out of ledge cancelling Wizard's Foot or the adrenaline that comes just from doing that. Hmph.

You're not wrong there.

Maybe if air Wizard's Foot functioned like 's, then I might've listed it first

 

[Arcadenik]

My take on the mysterious line-up:

Hmmm... Sheik but no Zelda.

I hope this doesn't mean Zelda and Sheik are back together as one.

 

[N3ON]

how would people feel in general if this next smash game got NO new FE characters? and instead brought everyone from 4 back? plus a largely reworked Lucina? i think that might be the "safest" option when it comes to appeasing the fanbase in general

Reminds me of when we used to think we'd just get the Brawl Pokemon + Mewtwo in Smash 4.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

The Smash fanbase?
Not overanalyzing even the most minimal of things?

You must not know us very well.

Phoenix Wright approves of this statement.

Plus, as someone who plays a lot of AA games and watches a lot of mystery shows, theorizing and speculating is fun to me. Now what I don't approve of is people bashing each other because "their ideas or theories are wrong" and "this person/theory is right," which is usually what happens in this kind of community.

 

[Schnee117]

I can see him easily being swayed by fan demand and usage statistics. Dark Pit is not a character. Lucina is a crappy character. Doc fans do not necessarily like the direction he’s going in. Believe it or not he can change his mind.

Trying to predict Sakurai only leads to tears.

The fan demand is for the characters to REMAIN seperate lmao.
Dark Pit is a character.
Lucina is actually high tier.
Doc fans don't like his direction but that can easily change with some buffs.

Come back when you're fit for debate and actually know what you're on about.

 

[Bowserlick]

Looks like everyone got Inkling correct on their rosters.

So far, everyone's a rockstar.