Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Michael the Spikester]

No screw those darn rabbids. Keep them out of Smash. They're literally the Minions of video games. Annoying as heck and overexposured.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Fox in Smash 4 wasn't just "possibly top 15", he was indisputably top tier in the top 10 and has a strong argument for top 5, it would take some really huge nerfs to knock Fox out of viability, and from what I seen Larry and other Fox players say, the nerfs to Fox have been greatly exaggerated. Though people tend to greatly overreact to nerfs in general (if you thought the initial reaction to Ultimate Fox was bad, see how the bulk of the Sonic players reacted to the Sonic nerfs found), and you won't get an accurate view of how the nerfs actually affect the character until some time down the line (or sometimes not even then, as in the case of Greninja).

Oh I know, fam. I'm squarely in the camp that Fox is somewhere in the top 10, but there are arguments in the wild that slide him down a little further on the totem pole. Even if I agreed with the latter point it's not like opinion of the character would shift our paradigm here; Smash 4 MUs are pretty wildly varying once you start comparing between the mid-tiers and beyond. Hell, most of the spreads are pretty damn even keel (as in, not wildly disparate where characters drop off/plummet in total viability after the top 5).

Smooth Criminal

 

[BluePikmin11]

Third-parties do not get chosen for being retro like Pit/Little Mac/Ice Climbers, they are primarily chosen as guest fighters more than anything else.

Alright lets try again then considering the trend for Pokemon and 1st party retro fighters. Which retro do you guys think is the most likely?

-Ayumi Tachibana
-Balloon Fighter
-Bubbles
-Lip
-Mach Rider
-Sable Prince
-Sheriff
-Other

From most likely to least likely:
1. Lip
2. Balloon Fighter
3. Excitebiker
4. Sable Prince
5. Bubbles
6. Ayumi Tachibana
7. Mike Jones
8. Urban Champion
9. Mach Rider

I think Sakurai will go for the most popular retro in the West and East, regardless of the franchise's obscurity. I am betting on Lip, having a more notable following in the ballot than Balloon Fighter, Prince Sable, and Takamaru to be chosen as this game's retro.

 

[Abha]

We all know who should really be the retro rep
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ku2bO2ZGReA

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

ever since Smash 4 we have been having a few "rules" being broken actually:
Villager completely thrown the "too cute"/"doesn't actually fight" arguments
Cloud just made us rethink which third-parties can enter and "history with Nintendo" means nothing

This time around, it's Ridley with the size stuff, and K. Rool with relevancy. Sure that could point out to popularity being a bigger factor but then again, who knows, we could be getting a Wii Fit Trainer-level of wtf character next

You mean... Something Like this? I remember this being very popular in the Smash 4 DLC days...

 

[Omega Tyrant]

Regarding this retro discussion...

There are a few names that keep coming up because "Sakurai was gonna put them in Melee!" ...like James Bond... and I think people may be reading this wrong.

See SourceGaming's list.

There is undisputably a difference between "This would be cool! Aww, we don't have time to get it to work." and "lol this would be funny. But seriously, someone else." Just because Sakurai mentioned a name does not imply that he gave it more than just a cursory thought.

Also, Sakurai is breaking a lot of our 'rules' so I'm no longer taking "we've always had a retro!" as evidence that we'll be getting one. You know what else we've never gotten? A Metroid character who wasn't named Ms. Aran. A DK character who wasn't a monkey.

Yeah it has become a big pet peeve of mine to see people treating any character that Sakurai ever once mentioned the name of regardless of context as an actual planned character that got cut during development, with Takamaru, Ayumi, and James Bond being the biggest offenders that keep popping up everywhere. An actual planned character is one that Sakurai outright says was going to be in the game but got cut mid-development or has objective evidence that the character at some point was going to be in the game (such as datamined unused data indicating the character).

 

[Icedragonadam]

Breath of Fire is still ongoing. A new one came out in 2016 I believe.

Shh, we don't talk about that "game". And it's for the best.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

We all know who should really be the retro rep
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ku2bO2ZGReA

Considering he has yet to been yet as an assist. He has a pretty good shot.

 

[IGuessItsOver]

We all know who should really be the retro rep
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ku2bO2ZGReA

If he gets in over my gal Shantae i will be very pissed, and when i get pissed, things don't go well!

 

[Pakky]

So like if I made Custer would that be going too far?

 

[MSmariosonic]

If he gets in over my gal Shantae i will be very pissed, and when i get pissed, things don't go well!

It's not like he'd steal her spot.

 

[Deleted member]

No screw those darn rabbids. Keep them out of Smash. They're literally the Minions of video games. Annoying as heck and overexposured.

I mean, they're popular with children, and that's a very big part of Nintendo's audience. It would make a lot of sense to put them in.

I personally would enjoy them. I have good memories playing the first 3 Raving Rabbids with my folks as a kid and they were a blast. It'd bring back a lot of really good memories for me to have 'em.

To each their own, though.

 

[Draugen]

Ganondorf takes a 5/10 from me because he wears a carpet instead of a cape.

It's a magnificent persian-gerudo chad carpet, like on his original design:

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net...f_Time).png/revision/latest?cb=20110423215925

So it's literally perfect.

 

[Chrono.]

No screw those darn rabbids. Keep them out of Smash. They're literally the Minions of video games. Annoying as heck and overexposured.

This isn't 2008 anymore.

Rabbids have barely been anywhere recently aside from Kingdom Battle which is almost universally agreed to be a great game where the Rabbids are at their best.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

If he gets in over my gal Shantae i will be very pissed, and when i get pissed, things don't go well!

You really like Shantae Don't You? I've been part of smashboards for only a couple of days... and you seem to bring her up a lot. (I'm not saying that's bad. In fact, I think it's fine to make your most wanted character well known to everyone...)

 

[Pakky]

No screw those darn rabbids. Keep them out of Smash. They're literally the Minions of video games. Annoying as heck and overexposured.

I mean I like them... Why ya'gotta be mean about it man?

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

We all know who should really be the retro rep
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ku2bO2ZGReA

****ing BluePikmin11 would be ****ing ecstatic and so would I. It's strange to think that, yeah, he has a better chance at making it because of all the Assist Trophy Disconfirmations. He could actually be in but I'm not sure about that considering this game is all about the popular fan picks. I dunno how popular The Prince of Sable would be in that context.

 

[Iridium]

Spoiler: Mondu the Fat

Welp this is the last one...

Not really

I wasn't ready for that dark web territory. There could be even worse games though.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

On the subject of Codec Conversations and Palutena's Guidance, the chances of them not returning are there. You do need the proper voice actors if you want to create new conversations after all.

 

[Abha]

Considering he has yet to been yet as an assist. He has a pretty good shot.

My comment was partially a joke, but I enjoyed playing the translation of the game so I would be completely fine with him

It's not like he'd steal her spot.

Sable steals all of the ladies
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSer-WueLjs

 

[MrRoidley]

Rabbids (as in regular Rabbids) in Smash is a no for me.
HOWEVER, specifically Rabbid Mario/Peach/etc? I really want them lol

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

I think if we're not getting a retro rep it's going to be because of a combination of having gone through most of the notable ones as well as Ultimate having more limited newcomer spots.

I don't think it's something Sakurai tries to force in, if there aren't any great options or he doesn't want to make it a huge priority, then it's just not going to happen.

Not to mention most of the retro choices are starting to kind of thin because of "No Obscure/Japan-Only"-clause, if Takamaru becoming an Assist again is any indication. It's why I can't see Lip or other Japan-only retros happening in this one. Balloon Fighter meanwhile is bit difficult one due how we already have Villager don his Up B.

This'd probably leave us with likes of Bubbles, Urban Champion, Mach Rider, or heck, Muddy Mole if we need to really create something unique. I might mainly see Bubbles or Mach Rider happening since Urban Champion seems so bland that he might as well become Sakurai's OC if he was given liberties to cover it all up - even then I'd rather have Kunio of River City-series to serve that kind of thing better.

Bubbles I wonder though, she seems based on being always on the move. IDK if that'd translate well on Smash, unless she's super-slippery in movement or something. Mach Rider I'm wondering might have potential to overlap with Captain Falcon, unless he's given something very cool on his arsenal.

I'd love Muddy Mole to be this game's retro through all of this due how perfect he'd fit for the spot and truly be a surprise to many people out there, while bringing the fun and charming tools + digging mechanics seen in his puzzler that was on Gameboy.

Boy though, do I wish Japan-only characters weren't always considered no-nos because some of them would be so cool to see as playable.

 

[IGuessItsOver]

You really like Shantae Don't You? I've been part of smashboards for only a couple of days... and you seem to bring her up a lot. (I'm not saying that's bad. In fact, I think it's fine to make your most wanted character well known to everyone...)

Yes, she's my 2nd most wanted, only behind Geno.

It's not like he'd steal her spot.

But if he gets in first then there would be no point in adding Shantae since both characters transform into animals.

 

[Pakky]

I wasn't ready for that dark web territory. There could be even worse games though.

Lowkey I want to make Custer....

"But PAKKY what about like ANY BODY ELSE?"

"But, I wanna make dumb stuff"

 

[Iridium]

Shh, we don't talk about that "game". And it's for the best.

Something wrong?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Something wrong?

It’s a *cough* very NSFW game...

 

[Deleted member]

Oh, and Rabbids Go Home was a really fun game. I really regret trading that one in before finishing it. I should see about tracking down a copy eventually...

If Rabbids did get in Smash, I would probably prefer the Kingdom Battle ones. Especially Rabbid Peach, she was amazing.

 

[Iridium]

It’s a *cough* very NSFW game...

Which ones? The later ones?

 

[Michele]

Which ones? The later ones?

Yes, it is a game for mature/adult only.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

And Master Chief was in the Minecraft skin bundle.

Don’t think Minecraft can count as a Halo game

On the subject of Codec Conversations and Palutena's Guidance, the chances of them not returning are there. You do need the proper voice actors if you want to create new conversations after all.

Well Anthony Del Rio already has new dialogue done for Pit, and at the least Viridi’s voice actress (Hynden Walch) will be available thanks to one of her shows just concluding (Adventure Time)...plus Daddy Sakurai...so PG still have a chance in life

Snake’s crew however...I’m definitely worried as hell about

 

[Icedragonadam]

Which ones? The later ones?

The 5th and 6th games have been polarizing, especially the 6th one which was really a cheap mobile game with the BoF title slapped on for sales. The game shut down only after 1 year after it's release.

 

[StormC]

When does Famitsu release, by American time zone standards?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Oops, I confused the BoF mobile game for Custer lmao

But both are things we dare not speak of

 

[Iridium]

The 5th and 6th games have been polarizing, especially the 6th one which was really a cheap mobile game with the BoF title slapped on for sales. The game shut down only after 1 year after it's release.

But the 1-4 is fine, right? I don't remember much about this.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

When does Famitsu release, by American time zone standards?

Probably Wednesday for us...

 

[Mr. Trumo]

I mean, they're popular with children, and that's a very big part of Nintendo's audience. It would make a lot of sense to put them in.

I personally would enjoy them. I have good memories playing the first 3 Raving Rabbids with my folks as a kid and they were a blast. It'd bring back a lot of really good memories for me to have 'em.

To each their own, though.

Raving Rabbids 2 was frickin' awesome.

 

[Untouch]

When does Famitsu release, by American time zone standards?

Releases on Thursday (I believe) but usually leaks on Tuesday or Wednesday.

 

[IGuessItsOver]

When people talk about retro reps, no one brings up this man

 

[Chrono.]

Oops, I confused the BoF mobile game for Custer lmao

But both are things we dare not speak of

I was so confused cause I thought Capcom had gone R-18 for Breath of Fire of all things.

 

[Pakky]

When people talk about retro reps, no one brings up this man

METAL SLUG!

Hmmmmm.

I wonder.