Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[CosmicQuark]

Nah Cloud is the example of how as long as you're a massive gaming icon you've got a fair shot. It's why I don't exactly scoff at the idea of Master Chief

My bet is Banjo & Kazooie are playable, Creeper assist trophy, and Master Chief Mii costume. It would both elate and piss off the entire internet all at once, and is something I could see Sakurai doing. And if you don't think so, recall back when he was showing off Mii Costumes and you went "WHAT? HOW COULD YOU?" That's why.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Cloud was nearly molested before threatening to cut the jewels off of Don Corneo, scum of the slums. Not to mention Barret’s Mouth.

.....Bayonetta.

......... Sanke

 

[Opossum]

People who think Nintendo wouldn't want a Direct on September 11 due to the date seem to forget that Ultimate is releasing on the anniversary of the bombing of Pearl Harbor.

 

[Nethermoosen]

......... Sanke

I always forget about Sanke.

Haha. But yeah, definitely a mature fellow.

 

[Deleted member]

Seribii owner and founder Joe Merrick

If it's Serebii confirmed, then it's real.
real talk Serebii is the only source I trust 100%

I repeat, if you're argument why any third party can get in is ****ing Bayonetta, then its a horrible, horrible argument.

Back in Smash 4, people kept saying Bayonetta would and should never be in because "she was not iconic" or "didn't have a long history with Nintendo". But the thing is, Sakurai doesn't care about that, Bayonetta got in because she was popular
Now the argument shifted over to other 3rd Parties, such as Shovel Knight who isn't in because "he doesn't have a long history with Nintendo". It's the same **** over and over, people will jump through all the hoops possible to justify the inclusion of Smash characters even though they would shut them down before for the same reason they shut down non-playable characters nowadays.

 

[IGuessItsOver]

Inconclusive. Provide incontrovertible evidence or admit assumption based on incomplete evidence.

Nintendo funded Bayonetta 2 and 3 and now they is no way in hell they'd allow Bayonetta to be on other platforms

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Inconclusive. Provide incontrovertible evidence or admit assumption based on incomplete evidence.

How is Bayonetta evidence enough that any third party can get in if the scenario surrounding her very inclusion has basically put her on the levels of Phoenix Wright?

 

[Alchadylan]

There are more likely capcom reps but if we were to get Amaterasu, would her roll and double jump have hit boxes and cause damage? I would imagine they would be like fox's laser or bayonetta's button press guns. I dont believe that actually flinched enemies in game, just caused very minor damage, so maybe like 1% and not interupt anything

 

[Kuon]

Personally I prefer Erdrick (DQ3) or Eight (DQ8)

I think Erdrick would be chosen over the DQ11 Hero because he's probably the only DQ Hero who has a name and because the first three games were collectively called Erdrick Trilogy.

Oooh!!!

Maybe the Dragon Quest stage could be Zenithia from the next three games! They were collectively called Zenithia Trilogy! It is a castle in the sky!

Actually, now that you mention it, that could work really well. Plus, both the male and female Erdrick look a bit different from one another, so they could make both the male and female Erdrick playable similar to Robin and Corrin

 

[blackghost]

There are not many fighting game characters that would excite me... except for the ones I grew up with.

That would be characters from Street Fighter II (any version), Mortal Kombat (original trilogy), Killer Instinct (Nintendo era), and Fatal Fury (at least the ones that were on the SNES).

If I were being very selective, I would choose these characters:

• Ryu + Ken (Echo)
• Chun-Li
• Scorpion + Sub-Zero (Echo with different Special Moves)
• Fulgore
• Terry Bogard

mk aint happening. japanese players basically hate that franchise. chun-li is a good choice but id expect dlc. terry bogard is a who to most people here. and fulgore is a huge 90s character but with Microsoft having him now doubt he has a chance.

 

[Nethermoosen]

If it's Serebii confirmed, then it's real.
real talk Serebii is the only source I trust 100%

Back in Smash 4, people kept saying Bayonetta would and should never be in because "she was not iconic" or "didn't have a long history with Nintendo". But the thing is, Sakurai doesn't care about that, Bayonetta got in because she was popular
Now the argument shifted over to other 3rd Parties, such as Shovel Knight who isn't in because "he doesn't have a long history with Nintendo". It's the same **** over and over, people will jump through all the hoops possible to justify the inclusion of Smash characters even though they would shut them down before for the same reason they shut down non-playable characters nowadays.

My god....she’s right.
Spinal confirmed!!!

(Jokes aside, completely agree)

How is Bayonetta evidence enough that any third party can get in if the scenario surrounding her very inclusion has basically put her on the levels of Phoenix Wright?

It’s not.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

If it's Serebii confirmed, then it's real.
real talk Serebii is the only source I trust 100%

Back in Smash 4, people kept saying Bayonetta would and should never be in because "she was not iconic" or "didn't have a long history with Nintendo". But the thing is, Sakurai doesn't care about that, Bayonetta got in because she was popular
Now the argument shifted over to other 3rd Parties, such as Shovel Knight who isn't in because "he doesn't have a long history with Nintendo". It's the same **** over and over, people will jump through all the hoops possible to justify the inclusion of Smash characters even though they would shut them down before for the same reason they shut down non-playable characters nowadays.

I'm not arguing you need a long history with Nintendo! I'm arguing you need to actually be iconic!

And I was there arguing with people about why Bayo could get in, as I was voting for her, and that reason was she had become Nintendo exclusive

 

[Will]

And we've already been in circles about why Bayonetta was an exception to the rule, not the proof of the rule not existing at all. And ANYONE can see that, literally anyone, you're just being contrarian for the sake of it :v

Why can't you understand? I never argued about that **** until you started digging into it with me. I argued that Bayonetta wasn't an icon. You're looking way too deep into this and calling me **** that doesn't apply to what I was presenting and that's really pissing me off now. I said Bayonetta is not an icon of gaming, not Bayonetta is an exception to the rule. Go on. Ctrl + F that. See where I said those specific words. Now Ctrl + F and see where I said she wasn't an icon. Tons of it. Because that's all I'm saying. I don't give two ****s about the rest of that argument, you asked for a not icon, and I gave you one.

Agree to disagree I don't care, just put your head in the right screw and realize what argument is even going on.

 

[Radical Bones]

Pokemon or Xenoblade for me.
Or anything done by ACE. Specially a Zelda remix done by ACE.

ACE are so bloody good. I hope they're involved in a few more remixes from series' outside of Xeno because Gang Plank is sounding fantastic.

If they follow a pattern, then I strongly suspect tonight will be something from the other category rather than the remaining know 14 emblem universes.

I don't really understand what you mean? We haven't had Pokemon or Pikmin music yet.

 

[N3ON]

Bayonetta clearly is in an exceptional situation and shouldn't be used to gauge normality or precedent.

 

[Chrono.]

For those who haven't been keeping track, here's a list of notable people teasing a Direct, so far anyway:

Its_just_f (The first person I saw that claimed a Direct was coming this week.)
Directfeedgames/Resetera mod NateDrake
Vern
Mimique
Resetera mod/Gamexplain's Johnneh
Spawn Wave
Seribii owner and founder Joe Merrick
Resetera admin SweetNicole
Longtime Nintendo expert/insider Rosti
PlayerEssence
Vooks owner Daniel Vuckovic

When there's smoke, there's firecrackers...

I'm not sure if Joe counts.

He doesn't have anything pertaining to a Direct on his twitter. Did he tease it on ResetEra?

 

[IGuessItsOver]

So, objectively speaking, will there actually be DLC after the game's release?

 

[Iridium]

People who think Nintendo wouldn't want a Direct on September 11 due to the date seem to forget that Ultimate is releasing on the anniversary of the bombing of Pearl Harbor.

And it would have meant nothing had those events not happened. People need to not be so sensitive when it comes to releasing products on a day when it has no relation and cannot be twisted to make it so.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I always forget about Sanke.

Haha. But yeah, definitely a mature fellow.

One reason I'd want to have Duke Nukem in Smash, besides the inherent hilarity of him coming back in a general audience game once again and recover from the stigma of Forever, is to prove that just about anyone from M-rated games can be included.

Spoiler

I mean, in one non-canon spinoff game, he went as far as solving the problem of Earth's male population being genocided by proceeding to make love with every surviving woman.

 

[Will]

So, objectively speaking, will there actually be DLC after the game's release?

They have no reason not to.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Why can't you understand? I never argued about that ****. I argued that Bayonetta wasn't an icon. You're looking way too deep into this and calling me **** that doesn't apply to what I was presenting and that's really pissing me off now. I said Bayonetta is not an icon of gaming, not Bayonetta is an exception to the rule. Go on. Ctrl + F that. See where I said those specific words. Now Ctrl + F and see where I said she wasn't an icon. Tons of it. Because that's all I'm saying. I don't give two ****s about the rest of that argument, you asked for a not icon, and I gave you one.

Agree to disagree I don't care, just put your head in the right screw and realize what argument is even going on.

Someone claimed that third party characters didn't need to be iconic to get in

I asked for evidence of that

You supplied Bayonetta, and I think we've well established now Bayonetta is extremely weak evidence, or not evidence at all

 

[Nethermoosen]

So, objectively speaking, will there actually be DLC after the game's release?

Loads of it.

 

[SimonferSmash]

I don't really understand what you mean? We haven't had Pokemon or Pikmin music yet.

Well mainly cause so far miscellaneous music has been uploaded after every four songs with an existing series emblem.

We'll know if that's just a coincidence after tonight, but that's what my gut is telling me.

 

[Abha]

So, objectively speaking, will there actually be DLC after the game's release?

Yes, but only so we see discussion go from who should be in Ultimate to who should be Ultimate's DLC ignoring the gameplay aspect.

 

[Will]

Someone claimed that third party characters didn't need to be iconic to get in

I asked for evidence of that

You supplied Bayonetta, and I think we've well established now Bayonetta is extremely weak evidence, or not evidence at all

It depends on the third party in question.

If you're arguing Bayonetta's precedent, it shouldn't matter because she got in through the ballot, which isn't saying anything about her status and more just that people supposedly wanted her real bad.

 

[lightdrago]

So, objectively speaking, will there actually be DLC after the game's release?

Unless Nintendo all of a sudden gained a hatred for money, I’d say so.

 

[Chrono.]

So, objectively speaking, will there actually be DLC after the game's release?

Yeah, that's not even a debate.

DLC was a huge success for Smash 4 and Nintendo has been doing content updates to all their first party games on the Switch.

I said it before and I'll continue to say it, Smash is probably getting a season pass announced before the game comes out.

 

[blackghost]

So, objectively speaking, will there actually be DLC after the game's release?

people still question this? its not a question of if rather how much.

 

[Nethermoosen]

Someone claimed that third party characters didn't need to be iconic to get in

I asked for evidence of that

You supplied Bayonetta, and I think we've well established now Bayonetta is extremely weak evidence, or not evidence at all

Okay, I can see how Bayonetta might seem like weak evidence, but evidence is evidence. It is “proof to the contrary.” That’s where Arigarmy comes in. He sees opportunity, he strikes. He’s a pretty straightforward dude.

 

[Zinith]

Can it be DLC handled WELL this time around?

 

[Will]

Can it be DLC handled WELL this time around?

DLC was fine in Smash 4, we just had a lot of returning characters in it. That won't be a thing now, but instead we'll get like an Echo Pack for 4 bucks with 3 echoes each or something.

 

[Icedragonadam]

Loads of it.

Dr. Eggman confirmed.

 

[Abha]

Can it be DLC handled WELL this time around?

No

 

[WallyPalmer]

Alright here’s a game.

Out of these possible newcomers:
-Geno
-Issac
-Isabelle
-Bandana Dee
-Shadow
-Rayman
-Banjo
-Incinaroar

Who do you think you’ll end up maining regardless if you supported them or not?

I’d main Bandana Dee instantly if he was in the game. Screw all of the hot buff dudes or Twinks. I love that funky little orange

I’d have to see how Isabelle played but I don’t think I’d be very good at her, especially if she’s a villager echo. Geno, however, I think would have a really neat move set that might work well for me. (I like spammy characters)

 

[Nethermoosen]

DLC was fine in Smash 4, we just had a lot of returning characters in it.

All DLC regarding characters is guaranteed to be entirely new(echoes I guess aren’t entirely). That realization is pretty euphoric. Thank you.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

So, objectively speaking, will there actually be DLC after the game's release?

Nintendo would be absolutely crazy not to, this game is probably gonna be the best selling fighting game ever made, surpassing brawl, they would make bank on dlc while also giving them an opportunity to promote other upcoming titles.

 

[Hydrualic Hydra]

I can't lie, Smash Ultimate is probably the most hyped I've been for anything ever and any other announcement (games, television, manga, anything) pales in comparison to my thirst for Smash news. Hopefully you guys aren't nearly as depraved as me, but what games/shows/books are you guys into right now?

I'm currently playing through the final Hollow Knight DLC to completion, with Shantae: Half-Genie Hero, a few old Gamecube games, and the Metroid Prime trilogy lined up for replay to keep me busy, and re-watching Jojo to get ready for Part 5.

 

[praline]

Ultimate should so more than 1 season of dlc characters.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Okay, I can see how Bayonetta might seem like weak evidence, but evidence is evidence. It is “proof to the contrary.” That’s where Arigarmy comes in. He sees opportunity, he strikes. He’s a pretty straightforward, dude.

I mean if the character/series is exclusive to Nintendo ala Geno, Phoenix Wright (I... think), or in this case Bayo, then they're obviously considered differently than the likes of Cloud, Snake, or Mega Man.

If what it takes here is that Nintendo exclusives can make it despite being iconic or not, I'll concede to that. But I feel like just saying "you don't need to be an iconic third party to get in" is the kind of attitude one carries who simply doesn't want to step on anyone's toes when debating character speculation.

Im trying to be realistic here not pessimistic.

 

[Kirby Dragons]

The iconic rule wasn't directly stated, but it was based off of something Sakurai said in an interview regarding third-parties. Something like "there aren't that many series that made a worldwide impact."