Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[perfectchaos83]

Maybe Japan is going through the bargaining stage regarding Ashley like what the Waluigi fans did.

I guess, but I am interested in why they are discussing it, if that is indeed the case.

 

[BlueMagician]

I see no evidence that Japan is talking about that one leak. Are people making stuff up again?

 

[Deleted member]

I've heard that this rumor https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSo5ue1LnhQ&feature=youtu.be has been discussed in Japan recently

Which is odd because it has some massive holes in it. It mentions Ashley, Shovel Knight as what's assumed to be characters and it says the "Belmont" was not chosen because Bomberman was more popular. But it also talks about why Bomberman didn't end up as a character.

By now word would've already spread that this was fake. Though, speaking of Japan, it really is interesting what their wants are this time around.
We usually see characters that the West loves; Ridley, Dark Samus, the usuals. Then there are choices we tend to share with the Japanese, such as King K. Rool and Geno; but at this point, I think now they share quite a lot of the wanted characters we vouch for.

Aside from Rex & Pyra being their #1 most wanted right now, they also got pushes for characters that we also want, like Banjo-Kazooie and even Crash Bandicoot. It's pretty crazy to think about.

 

[Glaciacott]

Everyone losing sleep over shantae and meanwhile Nintendo quietly putting up monster hunter trailers after midnight and having Rathalos be today's update for Smash.

 

[Soulsaint]

Poipole, the best Pokemon.
As a starter
Stop taunting me with things that will never happen!

Wouldn't even mind just a hacked Poipole tbh. I would even reset my file for that.

 

[KMDP]

If you ever do you better drop me a link!

I had actually designed most of the Gym Leaders, and even made front-facing sprites for the first two: Gemma and Eira.

Drawn in Paint like a sucker.
Yes, Gym #2 would have been an Ice-Type gym, because I'm mental.

Maybe one day.

 

[Soulsaint]

I had actually designed most of the Gym Leaders, and even made front-facing sprites for the first two: Gemma and Eira.
View attachment 160130 Drawn in Paint like a sucker.
Yes, Gym #2 would have been an Ice-Type gym, because I'm mental.

Maybe one day.

Better drop me a link aswel then!

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Maybe Japan is going through the bargaining stage regarding Ashley like what the Waluigi fans did.

I think you overestimate Ashley's popularity

 

[KMDP]

Better drop me a link aswel then!

Keep in mind it might not ever happen.

I think you overestimate Ashley's popularity

Never said anything about her popularity.

The bulk of her fans are in Japan, just like the bulk of Waluigi's fans are in America.

 

[Arcanir]

Yeah, though I'd say that Returns isn't doing as well as Awakening or Fates since Nintendo only said firm sales.

Outside of Prime, I don't recall Metroid ever having killer sales, which is a shame since it's one of Nintendo's best.

Oh definitely not, it's certainly below those considering both have long surpassed a million whereas we're still in the dark on Samus Returns. Granted it's a remake unlike them, but that's still a game where Metroid fell short of FE.

Yeah, outside of Prime and the first two games it's always been that one series that despite its high reception usually stuck to the 1 million mark. It would be nice for it to get more recognition in its sales, but at least it's usually consistent.

Everyone losing sleep over shantae and meanwhile Nintendo quietly putting up monster hunter trailers after midnight and having Rathalos be today's update for Smash.

Speaking of which, it's kind of funny how the Rathalos update happened the night before Generation Ultimate came out.

 

[Honest Slug]

I'm kinda curious where the expectations for Black Knight are coming from. I feel like I missed a leak or something.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

If there is ANY kind of Smash related news in the direct, I wonder if they'll have just a small "Indie Segment" where it shows shovel knight and a couple other Indie characters as AT's. Maybe Shantae and Sans and others.

 

[Idon]

I'm kinda curious where the expectations for Black Knight are coming from. I feel like I missed a leak or something.

Because people are shoving everyone that even resembles another character into an echo slot.

neverminding the fact that BK animates nothing like Ike and has completely different body proportions.

 

[Shroob]

So today's the Nindies direct, right?


Nothing Smash related is gonna happen, but hopefully they drop the date to the next real direct there.

 

[ArkhaosZero]

I'm kinda curious where the expectations for Black Knight are coming from. I feel like I missed a leak or something.

Castle Sieges' second form has a character in the background that is meant to somewhat resemble Black Knight in past games. It's been replaced with a generic red knight. In addition, a lot of people were expecting Chrom to be an Ike Echo, but he ended up Echoing Roy, leaving Ike open. Black Knight notably fights similar to Ike. Furthermore, there's a seeming Heroes v Villains theme going on, which Black Knight would fulfill.

It's a bit mislead, to be honest, though. The "Black Knight" that was removed was generic, as the entire stage is. It was meant as a mere reference. Them simply feeling like updating the colors would be enough of a reason for the removal (which they've done on other stages). Also, Chrom can be explained by his statline and playstyle matching Roy's more fast, aggressive style better. The expectations rest on weak evidence.

 

[KMDP]

neverminding the fact that BK animates nothing like Ike and has completely different body proportions.

Quiet, you!

 

[Captain Shwampy]

So today's the Nindies direct, right?


Nothing Smash related is gonna happen, but hopefully they drop the date to the next real direct there.

If sakurai retweets anything about it than we will know

 

[Zinith]

Here's a sobering thought. What if the Nindie Direct is a one-for-one carbon copy of the UK one a week ago? Nintendo goes by the assumption that audiences are localized to their region (very archaic viewpoint, but that's Nintendo for ya)

 

[KMDP]

Here's a sobering thought. What if the Nindie Direct is a one-for-one carbon copy of the UK one a week ago? Nintendo goes by the assumption that audiences are localized to their region (very archaic viewpoint, but that's Nintendo for ya)

People being aware of what goes on in other countries in the Age of the Internet?

Don't be silly, Zinith. That's crazy talk.

 

[Shroob]

If sakurai retweets anything about it than we will know

Know what? I just want to know when the next real Direct is.

 

[ZephyrZ]

I don't expect the BK, I just have some hope for him. I do find that knight's armor getting changed very suspicious though even if he never was the real BK. And lets not forget that he had a mii costume (although Ashley did to).

That's actually how I feel about all my most wanted (Silvally, Dillon and BK). I think they're somewhat possible but wouldn't put any of them on a prediction list.

 

[Logo12]

I see no evidence that Japan is talking about that one leak. Are people making stuff up again?

I can (sorta) confirm...

That link leads to a gamefaqs thread which discusses that video.

However, many people simply shoved it off, saying "why are these leaks appearing so frequently", "too much oddity to be believed", etc.

These are some of the response to this topic

704: Look, it's a bait
707: Coooool. /s
723: It surreal how these leaks are so frequent
724: >>703 Yep, too strange to be believable.
725: What even is a leak...
726: Oogiri*
728: I should try making a leak too!
740: Seeing stuff like Crono and whatnot it only feels like you're just adding random guesses**. Definitely bait.
742: Actually to think of it what will happen if we make a long paragraph out of imagination and post in as a "leak" in the overseas boards?
744: Sounds fun
745: Shall we do it? Making our ideal leak?
etc.

*: Oogiri is a type of Japanese comedy involving giving ridiculous responses to a question. Seeing ridiculous leaks like this, it only makes sense they are thinking of leaks like that.
**: The list of leaked characters is quite different from what I see in the thread or the video. Not sure why

... by the looks at it, it seems like they're talking about a completely different leak, however.

Btw The list of leaked characters is:

• Banjo Kazooie
• Geno
• Isabelle
• Ken
• BDee
• Crono
• Hana (Wiggler?)
• Shadow
• Birdo
• King Boo
• Alakazam

I haven't exactly seen the original leak (in gamefaqs/4chan), but the lists seem to be completely unrelated. A lot of the excluded responses are about the ridiculousness of Alakazam. I'm guessing it's just a bait "leak" like those that always happen on Gamefaqs.

There was another mention of it one thread later, but that time the "leaked characters" became Banjo Kazooie and Rex. I'm not exactly sure if they have read the content, or if I actually missed something in the thread

TLDR: It is sorta "talked about", in form of a gamefaqs post on of video, but the actual content is very much missed and it seemed to be only a tool for introducing more fake leaks.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Not really.

The sprites, engine, and some of the mechanics have been changed. Their not really comparable to eachother at all.

The only thing KOF 94’ has in common is that it’s a fighting game and that it has AOF and FF characters in it, but other than that it’s an entirely different game that spun into a series that surpassed both of them. (Take it from someone who used to be a KOF fanatic. I still like the series and I know a lot about the games).

(Take it from someone who used to be a KOF fanatic. I still like the series and I know a lot about the games).

It's nice to see a fellow man of culture in this thread.


...Also #Kyo4Smash

 

[BlueMagician]

I can (sorta) confirm...

View attachment 160129
That link leads to a gamefaqs thread which discusses that video.

However, many people simply shoved it off, saying "why are these leaks appearing so frequently", "too much oddity to be believed", etc.

These are some of the response to this topic

704: Look, it's a bait
707: Coooool. /s
723: It surreal how these leaks are so frequent
724: >>703 Yep, too strange to be believable.
725: What even is a leak...
726: Oogiri*
728: I should try making a leak too!
740: Seeing stuff like Crono and whatnot it only feels like you're just adding random guesses**. Definitely bait.
742: Actually to think of it what will happen if we make a long paragraph out of imagination and post in as a "leak" in the overseas boards?
744: Sounds fun
745: Shall we do it? Making our ideal leak?
etc.

*: Oogiri is a type of Japanese comedy involving giving ridiculous responses to a question. Seeing ridiculous leaks like this, it only makes sense they are thinking of leaks like that.
**: The list of leaked characters is quite different from what I see in the thread or the video. Not sure why

... by the looks at it, it seems like they're talking about a completely different leak, however.

Btw The list of leaked characters is:

• Banjo Kazooie
• Geno
• Isabelle
• Ken
• BDee
• Crono
• Hana (Wiggler?)
• Shadow
• Birdo
• King Boo
• Alakazam

I haven't exactly seen the original leak (in gamefaqs/4chan), but the lists seem to be completely unrelated. A lot of the excluded responses are about the ridiculousness of Alakazam. I'm guessing it's just a bait "leak" like those that always happen on Gamefaqs.

There was another mention of it one thread later, but that time the "leaked characters" became Banjo Kazooie and Rex. I'm not exactly sure if they have read the content, or if I actually missed something in the thread

TLDR: It is sorta "talked about", in form of a gamefaqs post on of video, but the actual content is very much missed and it seemed to be only a tool for introducing more fake leaks.

I was actually looking through 5ch to see if I could find it and someone made a thread just for this leak since leaks are supposed to be banned in the main threads, but it's pretty just the same kind of unserious responses (elemental punches Alakazam and stuff.) Doesn't seem like it's for any reason that people here were guessing.

 

[Flynn__]

So, something I was thinking about...

Before Smash 4, Sakurai made a point about wanting more female fighters in the franchise. If you stop to think about it, in Brawl we only had Peach, Zelda, Sheik (and she's controversial in that aspect), Samus and Samus 2, and half a fighter in the form of Nana. Only one more female fighter than in Melee, and it was Samus without a suit. Yay representation! So in 4 they added a lot more of female fighters: female!Wii Fit Trainer, female!Villager, Rosalina, Lucina, Palutena, female!Robin, Bayonetta and female!Corrin. Quite a lot of them, in fact more female newcomers in one game than all the female characters we had had so far.

But in Ultimate, so far we only have female!Inkling and Daisy, 2 out of 8 characters. 3 if you want to count Dark Samus, although DS is more an it than a she. And if we take a look at the List of Most Requested Newcomers By Smash Bros. Fans™, there are not a lot of female characters in there: Dixie Kong, Isabelle, Shantae, Medusa, Elma... Kazooie? Versus a myriad of tough guys (Isaac, Geno, Skull Kid, Rayman, Shadow, Sora, Bandana Dee, Rex, Crash Bandicoot, Black Knight, Ken, and a long etc.). And some of the most popular female choices have already been deconfirmed (Krystal, Ashley, Midna, Lyn...).

I don't know if Sakurai's is going to try to add more female characters to the roster or if he feels satisfied with what he did in 4 and thinks that that's enough. But fact is, if he wants to add more women to the cast, his options are more and more limited each time. Which doesn't talk well about female representation in Nintendo games and gaming in general, to be fair.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I can (sorta) confirm...

View attachment 160129
That link leads to a gamefaqs thread which discusses that video.

However, many people simply shoved it off, saying "why are these leaks appearing so frequently", "too much oddity to be believed", etc.

These are some of the response to this topic

704: Look, it's a bait
707: Coooool. /s
723: It surreal how these leaks are so frequent
724: >>703 Yep, too strange to be believable.
725: What even is a leak...
726: Oogiri*
728: I should try making a leak too!
740: Seeing stuff like Crono and whatnot it only feels like you're just adding random guesses**. Definitely bait.
742: Actually to think of it what will happen if we make a long paragraph out of imagination and post in as a "leak" in the overseas boards?
744: Sounds fun
745: Shall we do it? Making our ideal leak?
etc.

*: Oogiri is a type of Japanese comedy involving giving ridiculous responses to a question. Seeing ridiculous leaks like this, it only makes sense they are thinking of leaks like that.
**: The list of leaked characters is quite different from what I see in the thread or the video. Not sure why

... by the looks at it, it seems like they're talking about a completely different leak, however.

Btw The list of leaked characters is:

• Banjo Kazooie
• Geno
• Isabelle
• Ken
• BDee
• Crono
• Hana (Wiggler?)
• Shadow
• Birdo
• King Boo
• Alakazam

I haven't exactly seen the original leak (in gamefaqs/4chan), but the lists seem to be completely unrelated. A lot of the excluded responses are about the ridiculousness of Alakazam. I'm guessing it's just a bait "leak" like those that always happen on Gamefaqs.

There was another mention of it one thread later, but that time the "leaked characters" became Banjo Kazooie and Rex. I'm not exactly sure if they have read the content, or if I actually missed something in the thread

TLDR: It is sorta "talked about", in form of a gamefaqs post on of video, but the actual content is very much missed and it seemed to be only a tool for introducing more fake leaks.

This is exactly the type of response I was hoping to get by bringing that up. That makes sense.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

So, something I was thinking about...

Before Smash 4, Sakurai made a point about wanting more female fighters in the franchise. If you stop to think about it, in Brawl we only had Peach, Zelda, Sheik (and she's controversial in that aspect), Samus and Samus 2, and half a fighter in the form of Nana. Only one more female fighter than in Melee, and it was Samus without a suit. Yay representation! So in 4 they added a lot more of female fighters: female!Wii Fit Trainer, female!Villager, Rosalina, Lucina, Palutena, female!Robin, Bayonetta and female!Corrin. Quite a lot of them, in fact more female newcomers in one game than all the female characters we had had so far.

But in Ultimate, so far we only have female!Inkling and Daisy, 2 out of 8 characters. 3 if you want to count Dark Samus, although DS is more an it than a she. And if we take a look at the List of Most Requested Newcomers By Smash Bros. Fans™, there are not a lot of female characters in there: Dixie Kong, Isabelle, Shantae, Medusa, Elma... Kazooie? Versus a myriad of tough guys (Isaac, Geno, Skull Kid, Rayman, Shadow, Sora, Bandana Dee, Rex, Crash Bandicoot, Black Knight, Ken, and a long etc.). And some of the most popular female choices have already been deconfirmed (Krystal, Ashley, Midna, Lyn...).

I don't know if Sakurai's is going to try to add more female characters to the roster or if he feels satisfied with what he did in 4 and thinks that that's enough. But fact is, if he wants to add more women to the cast, his options are more and more limited each time. Which doesn't talk well about female representation in Nintendo games and gaming in general, to be fair.

You're forgetting that Sakurai added the female Pokemon Trainer.

Also you might as well count Miis if you're counting avatars.

 

[NintenRob]

You're forgetting that Sakurai added the female Pokemon Trainer.

Also you might as well count Miis if you're counting avatars.

And a Female Pikachu, and brought back Nana, and Ivysaur who is believed by a lot to be female


Also Ridley

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Also Ridley

Let's not start that again.

 

[StormC]

So, something I was thinking about...

Before Smash 4, Sakurai made a point about wanting more female fighters in the franchise. If you stop to think about it, in Brawl we only had Peach, Zelda, Sheik (and she's controversial in that aspect), Samus and Samus 2, and half a fighter in the form of Nana. Only one more female fighter than in Melee, and it was Samus without a suit. Yay representation! So in 4 they added a lot more of female fighters: female!Wii Fit Trainer, female!Villager, Rosalina, Lucina, Palutena, female!Robin, Bayonetta and female!Corrin. Quite a lot of them, in fact more female newcomers in one game than all the female characters we had had so far.

But in Ultimate, so far we only have female!Inkling and Daisy, 2 out of 8 characters. 3 if you want to count Dark Samus, although DS is more an it than a she. And if we take a look at the List of Most Requested Newcomers By Smash Bros. Fans™, there are not a lot of female characters in there: Dixie Kong, Isabelle, Shantae, Medusa, Elma... Kazooie? Versus a myriad of tough guys (Isaac, Geno, Skull Kid, Rayman, Shadow, Sora, Bandana Dee, Rex, Crash Bandicoot, Black Knight, Ken, and a long etc.). And some of the most popular female choices have already been deconfirmed (Krystal, Ashley, Midna, Lyn...).

I don't know if Sakurai's is going to try to add more female characters to the roster or if he feels satisfied with what he did in 4 and thinks that that's enough. But fact is, if he wants to add more women to the cast, his options are more and more limited each time. Which doesn't talk well about female representation in Nintendo games and gaming in general, to be fair.

When it comes to Nintendo characters, the only realistic options left seem to be Dixie, Isabelle, Elma, and Impa. It's anyone's guess how many of these will get in, if any, and who will be an echo or what. I imagine this is why he chose girl Inkling as the default to make the gender disparity a bit less obvious. I don't think Sakurai added any of the female fighters in 4 just because they were girls, and I don't see why he would here either.

I think the onus falls a bit on Nintendo as well to create more iconic, Smash-worthy female characters. Though I wouldn't be surprised if Edelgard becomes DLC; she's become a bit of a fixture in the marketing for Three Houses and I can see Sakurai being drawn to an axe fighter.

Sucks about the deconfirmed fighters, though. Ashley will probably be in the running for the next Smash, but I doubt the other three will make it.

 

[osby]

So, something I was thinking about...

Before Smash 4, Sakurai made a point about wanting more female fighters in the franchise. If you stop to think about it, in Brawl we only had Peach, Zelda, Sheik (and she's controversial in that aspect), Samus and Samus 2, and half a fighter in the form of Nana. Only one more female fighter than in Melee, and it was Samus without a suit. Yay representation! So in 4 they added a lot more of female fighters: female!Wii Fit Trainer, female!Villager, Rosalina, Lucina, Palutena, female!Robin, Bayonetta and female!Corrin. Quite a lot of them, in fact more female newcomers in one game than all the female characters we had had so far.

But in Ultimate, so far we only have female!Inkling and Daisy, 2 out of 8 characters. 3 if you want to count Dark Samus, although DS is more an it than a she. And if we take a look at the List of Most Requested Newcomers By Smash Bros. Fans™, there are not a lot of female characters in there: Dixie Kong, Isabelle, Shantae, Medusa, Elma... Kazooie? Versus a myriad of tough guys (Isaac, Geno, Skull Kid, Rayman, Shadow, Sora, Bandana Dee, Rex, Crash Bandicoot, Black Knight, Ken, and a long etc.). And some of the most popular female choices have already been deconfirmed (Krystal, Ashley, Midna, Lyn...).

I don't know if Sakurai's is going to try to add more female characters to the roster or if he feels satisfied with what he did in 4 and thinks that that's enough. But fact is, if he wants to add more women to the cast, his options are more and more limited each time. Which doesn't talk well about female representation in Nintendo games and gaming in general, to be fair.

Always female: ()

Can be female:ultwiifittrainer:(other Pokémon, but not explicitly)

I'd say Ultimate is doing fine but I'd expect female character inclusions to increase over time, not decrease. We don't have a unique, solely female fighter yet.

 

[Soulsaint]

Girl Inkling is also a lot more recognisable I think. I mean I haven't played Splatoon, but whenever I think about it, she comes to mind and not the boy Inkling

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Always female: ()

Can be female:ultwiifittrainer:(other Pokémon, but not explicitly)

I'd say Ultimate is doing fine but I'd expect female character inclusions to increase over time, not decrease. We don't have a unique, solely female fighter yet.

Female depending on your interpretation:

 

[DJ3DS]

When it comes to Nintendo characters, the only realistic options left seem to be Dixie, Isabelle, Elma, and Impa. It's anyone's guess how many of these will get in, if any, and who will be an echo or what. I imagine this is why he chose girl Inkling as the default to make the gender disparity a bit less obvious. I don't think Sakurai added any of the female fighters in 4 just because they were girls, and I don't see why he would here either.

I think the onus falls a bit on Nintendo as well to create more iconic, Smash-worthy female characters. Though I wouldn't be surprised if Edelgard becomes DLC; she's become a bit of a fixture in the marketing for Three Houses and I can see Sakurai being drawn to an axe fighter.

Sucks about the deconfirmed fighters, though. Ashley will probably be in the running for the next Smash, but I doubt the other three will make it.

Pretty much this. If there's a problem with representation in Smash Bros it likely isn't surface level. The fact of the matter is that Nintendo has produced comparatively few quality female characters, and that's the problem that needs addressing.

When Samus got in it was nothing to do with representation, it was to do with the fact she is just an excellent character. The same will hopefully be true of Dixie.

 

[osby]

Girl Inkling is also a lot more recognisable I think. I mean I haven't played Splatoon, but whenever I think about it, she comes to mind and not the boy Inkling

That was probably why Wii Fit Trainer is female by default, too.

I like boy Corrin, but it'd be cool if they made girl Corrin default after Heroes (I think) did.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Question, is Lucas being attacked by the Rathalos a reference to anything?

 

[Zinith]

Question, is Lucas being attacked by the Rathalos a reference to anything?

Umm....

They wanted a character for Rathalos to attack so they chose Lucas?

 

[osby]

Question, is Lucas being attacked by the Rathalos a reference to anything?

Yes, if you pretend Rathalos is Reggie and Mother 3 not being localised is caused by him solely.

EDIT: It's also a reference to Lucas' s life sucks.

 

[ZephyrZ]

That was probably why Wii Fit Trainer is female by default, too.

I like boy Corrin, but it'd be cool if they made girl Corrin default after Heroes (I think) did.

In Heroes male and female Corrin are treated as totally separate characters. It's actually Warriors that made female the default.

It still probably would have been the better move for Smash to do this anyway, in part for the reasons discussed and in part because female Corrin is just more popular, but I guess they just wanted to keep Ultimate consistent with Smash 4.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Question, is Lucas being attacked by the Rathalos a reference to anything?

He and Claus play fight with Dragos in the beginning of the game, so maybe it's related to that?