Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Waluigi is not getting in]

Requested characters that turn into anything other than fighters are practically shunned.

I mean look at the mixed reaction to Shovel Knight.

I would hate for Skull Kid to go through the same fate again.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

A game that set the foundation for great classics like 2 and 3 >>> ****ty physics and nasty collision bugs of SA1 LOL.

Try playing sonic 1 without thinking 3 min in of wanting to play something better. I dont even care if its "t-the foundation!!!!" its not good

And only 1/3rd of SA2 is fun. ALL of CD is fun.

I replayed CD before Mania came out and my god is it the opposite of fun. The level design is horrifying and probably some of the worst in the series.
I could honestly replay Final Rush, the best 3D sonic stage , over and over again and have more fun with it over Sonic CD

 

[Pyra]

Him being a boss is probably the most likely case now, now that I think about it. Considering we already got a rival from Zelda series (Ganondorf) shown in the rivals trailer, I doubt we get a new rival for that franchise anymore. Which it might aling with some of the leaks that said that Zelda wouldn't get a newcomer… Unless having 1 rival per series is not a rule at all, then screw all what I just said, lol. Just brain storming about it atm.

If you can call it a rule, just throw it out of the window tbh
Nobody knows.
A lot of people are low-key imposing rules based on things like leaks, even, now. Haha. Nobody knows what's going on till things are revealed.

That being said, the Majora/Skull Kid boss fight will be incredible if it happens hahaha I'm sure.
Go through story mode > whatever the branch / section is that unlocks young link > boss of that branch is Skull Kid or Majora.
It would be sooo good imo

 

[Nazyrus]

EDIT: Heck, Skull Kid could be a rival to Young Link instead of regular Link.

That just restored my hopes up. SPECIALLY since we haven't seen Young Link's final smash yet, as apparently they haven't shown it to avoid spoilers… I'm expecting it to be Fierce Deity now. In fact, hell, I'm calling it now, that's what' gonna happen in the reveal trailer for Skull Kid, lol.

 

[Honest Slug]

I think there's absolutely nothing wrong with making a game focusing on popular requests.

For one thing we've already had 4 games full of relevant/unorthodox picks, these characters won't make those old ones vanish.

Some people are acting like Sakurai is being "forced" to do this and it's limiting him. Newsflash, if Sakurai thought it would be a hindrance he wouldn't do it. The movesets we're seeing with these characters have just as much thought and love as the ones in Smash 4 and before.

There's barely any major relevant characters to go with. The 2015-2016 window doesn't exactly have a lot of options. Only big one is Inkling which we have. Elma and a Gen 7 Pokemon are the only ones that could get the short end of the stick with this approach, and Elma isn't super popular (I know she has a dedicated following but Xenoblade X isn't exactly the biggest game, and by extension so was the Xenoblade series at the time) and Pokemon certainly isn't starving for newcomers. I'm not saying Elma and a Gen 7 Pokemon would be bad picks, but they aren't necessary at all, at least not any more so than the popular/ballot requests.

I think the fact that people are saying that these characters aren't as important to Nintendo's legacy as the ones chosen in Smash 4 are absolutely crazy. You're a madman if you try to deny the importance of Ridley and King K. Rool. Both major villains in big Nintendo series. Now compare that to Corrin who's some guy from one game that Fire Emblem fans aren't exactly in love with. And by extension Fates isn't exactly an important game unlike Super Mario RPG. It's not like we're getting rid of unorthodox characters either with this approach. Many people are going to scratch their head to Isaac and Geno as much as they did with Ness and Captain Falcon. A lot of these popular requests actually represent even more of Nintendo's history than many of the character choices we've had before.

 

[Will]

Requested characters that turn into anything other than fighters are practically shunned.

I mean look at the mixed reaction to Shovel Knight.

I would hate for Skull Kid to go through the same fate again.

Imagine I posted the "no" video again.

"This character got recognition?! How disrespectful! I'm offended!!!" Does this make sense to you? If you said no, of course it shouldn't because that's wrong.

 

[Waluigi is not getting in]

Sakurai is focusing on villains.

The next most popular villain is Skull Kid.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Requested characters that turn into anything other than fighters are practically shunned.

I mean look at the mixed reaction to Shovel Knight.

I would hate for Skull Kid to go through the same fate again.

Honestly though people reacting negatively to Shovel Knight being an Assist Trophy are whack, he's the little Indie that could who started from a kickstarter and is able to fight alongside Mario in some form or another, that's amazing

 

[meowth_thats_wrong]

I can't believe people on 4chan and Reddit are still trashing Vergeben. I'm not the type to idolize leakers, but the guy's first leak was literally confirmed with Simon. No sane person would have bet their reputation on Ridley, let alone Simon Belmont, who was not nearly as popular prior to E3. Leaks in the past always came with bits and pieces of the roster, and this is exactly what we're getting - likewise, people shouldn't be giving full roster leaks the time of day. The rest of his leaks come from different sources, though, so it's really a case of "which sources are legit," not "is Vergeben legit."

One interesting thing is that loz18 is disputing Vergeben's source on Isabelle in favor of Skull Kid, so I guess time will tell who has the more consistent sources.

 

[Pyra]

Requested characters that turn into anything other than fighters are practically shunned.

I mean look at the mixed reaction to Shovel Knight.

I would hate for Skull Kid to go through the same fate again.

Man, for someone who just said

Sakurai truly can't please everyone. Tragic.

You seem to be wavering in your resolve.
Non-playable characters are still interesting, imo.
Especially if they end up being decent boss battles in Single player, the potential is real.

I get feeling remorse if you really wanted to play as someone and then they end up unplayable, but if they're still in the game, I don't understand how anyone can think that's some kind of insult from Sakurai. Lol.

 

[RandomAce]

There's nothing stopping Saki from pulling things from Isa though. Ness and Lucas pull from their party members. Its speculated Shulk pulls one move from Reyn. I mean, Pacman pulls from Galaga of all things.

Saki seems more likely to me because he's the first, he's semi-familiar to Smash players, was acknowledged as a popular requested character in Brawl days, and I like him more and I'm bias.

Well somewhat. Isa recovery would probably utilize his signature jet pack like module on his back to allow for a flight mechanic of sort. Saki sorely lacks that in any capacity.

Although, to be honest there really isn’t anything stoping Saki from becoming an Isa echo. It could be one of those situations where there are two characters that echo each other.

But I’m honestly betting on Isa, since based on my assumption, it’s possible he was considered before and reconsidered again, and decided to have Saki echo him.

 

[Will]

Sakurai is focusing on villains.

The next most popular villain is Skull Kid.

Listen man I think this bias for Skull Kid is really getting into your head(canon).

 

[Fatmanonice]

Something stupid I thought of today: Galacta Knight winds up being an Echo of Metaknight but his build is based off BRAWL Metaknight but actually makes sense because in the canon he was a warrior so destructive that he was sealed away. The crazy thing is that I could totally see this happening, along with Impa being an Echo of Melee Sheik.

 

[Scicky]

It is, because you never know if there's a character that you'd end up liking far more than Geno, Ridley or K.rool in the long run.
It's far, far better if we get a healthy mix of both popular and unexpected. I'm not saying unexpected characters are better than popular picks, I'm saying that there needs to be both. Focusing exclusively on requests is what would make a stale roster. If we hadn't gotten Greninja and Zoroak made it in instead, the roster would've been outdated on arrival.

Also a question for Geno supporters, just curious. If Smash didn't exist, would you still care about him?

Zoroark isn't exactly a long-time fan favourite though, and didn't even end up being as popular as Greninja in the long run. Not at all comparable to characters like Ridley, K. Rool or Geno. Unexpected picks are nice but I'd much rather have a roster where it feels like everyone has earned their spot, newer characters can always get in the next game if their popularity is significant enough, like what happened with Inklings. Also, Smash's roster doesn't need to be modern and fresh to be good, so what if it's outdated as long as the characters are new to Smash? Melee's most modern characters were Roy and Pichu, with most other characters originating long before the Gamecube. Brawl was a little more modern, with Ike, Lucario, Lucas and (depending on what you consider modern) Olimar and Toon Link. Not once have I ever thought that those games didn't have enough newer characters. I'd actually say that Brawl probably had the best roster in the franchise up until now (aside from lacking Mewtwo lol)

Even old character's feel new in Smash, the idea of playing your favourite character in a cool fighting game doesn't feel any less good because that character is old. And older characters have had a longer time to establish large fanbases, meaning that feeling is spread out to more people. If new and fresh characters was an important factor, Smash 64 would've never gotten off the ground.

I'd like some unexpected characters, but if our roster is being limited to 8 unique newcomers, or maybe less, then I'd prefer full on fanservice 100%

Also, SMRPG gets rereleased all the time, meaning it's getting new fans all the time. Everyone I know who's played that game instantly loves Geno. Him, K. Rool and Ridley are also each enjoying renewed relevancy and exposure thanks to the release of the SNES classic. They're beloved characters not because having them in Smash is a funny meme, but because they genuinely make an impact on the people who've played those games.

 

[Blue7113]

There are three types of people:
1) "Minecraft is the shoe-in if we get a Microsoft rep because it's their most iconic property"
2) "Master Chief is the shoe-in if we get a Microsoft rep because he's essentially their mascot"
3) "Banjo is the shoe-in if we get a Microsoft rep because he's the most popular amongst Smash's demographic"

See I would think Steve or Master Chief would be likely if this was a normal Smash. Literally the most irrelevant characters could be added as long as the fans want them. Dark Samus? K Rool? Simon Belmont?

 

[Pyra]

That just restored my hopes up. SPECIALLY since we haven't seen Young Link's final smash yet, as apparently they haven't shown it to avoid spoilers… I'm expecting it to be Fierce Deity now. In fact, hell, I'm calling it now, that's what' gonna happen in the reveal trailer for Skull Kid, lol.

I've been saying that Young Link's final smash is probably going to end up being more interesting than a triforce slash this time, but people keep going "BUT THE TRIFORCE SLASH IS EASIER", so we'll see what happens and whether or not I can feel justified for a correct prediction.... again. Lol.

 

[Nazyrus]

Sakurai is focusing on villains.

The next most popular villain is Skull Kid.

And after Skull Kid, I bet we could get a Mother villain announced at a later date… a vague idea of its reveal that just came to my mind:
Ness and Lucas are fighting the Claus and Porky (two villains newcomers), Ness gets killed and Ninten (Echo fighter) comes to help. I know it sounds crazy to get 3 newcomers for Mother, but heck… Sakurai is capable of doing it, imo.

 

[Enderwoman]

Hell, I like every veteran and there are still some characters I wouldn't like if they were added (at least four of which are very frequently discussed).

wow that's petty lol

 

[Smashiny]

Other subject: what music tracks would you guys want in the game from games that aren't represented by characters yet (like the galaga medley and the like)?

Mine would be this one: the epitome of great NES music for me :

 

[Deleted member]

In case anyone was wondering, my "Dread Elite Four" are Skull Kid, Geno, Isabelle, and Shadow.
Unfortunately it seems like they're all pretty much inevitable at this point smh.

 

[aarchak]

I think we've had enough villains for this game, I hope to see some other characters, especially interesting ones that aren't just popular ones like Geno (I would still like Geno, it's just that he's seemingly the most popular pick among people).

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Literally googled “Smashboards Tanabe K. Rool” and found it. Bam.

https://smashboards.com/threads/k-rools-kremling-kutthroats-konfirmed.446401/page-78#post-22159425

Amazing what an extra word can add to google results
Anyway, yeah, they did indeed say Kremlings weren't necessary. Though you gotta remember Miyamoto played the biggest part here and that guy tends to push for new things just for the sake of new things. Only time I remember Miyamoto being told no is making Christianity Hyrule's religion (Explains the cross on the Magic Shield in Zelda 1 don't it?). From what I can find Miyamoto's involvement in Metroid Prime was "Make Americans make the game, they love Metroid"

 

[Waluigi is not getting in]

Idk all I am saying is keep watch for Skull Kid. That's it.

 

[Enderwoman]

In case anyone was wondering, my "Dread Elite Four" are Skull Kid, Geno, Isabelle, and Shadow.

need anyone ask how someone ends up this contrarian

 

[StormC]

Amazing what an extra word can add to google results
Anyway, yeah, they did indeed say Kremlings weren't necessary. Though you gotta remember Miyamoto played the biggest part here and that guy tends to push for new things just for the sake of new things. Only time I remember Miyamoto being told no is making Christianity Hyrule's religion (Explains the cross on the Magic Shield in Zelda 1 don't it?). From what I can find Miyamoto's involvement in Metroid Prime was "Make Americans make the game, they love Metroid"

I personally never found it malicious. I think Nintendo just severely underestimated how much fans love K. Rool and the Kremlings. I’m glad we showed them.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I can't believe people on 4chan and Reddit are still trashing Vergeben. I'm not the type to idolize leakers, but the guy's first leak was literally confirmed with Simon. No sane person would have bet their reputation on Ridley, let alone Simon Belmont, who was not nearly as popular prior to E3. Leaks in the past always came with bits and pieces of the roster, and this is exactly what we're getting - likewise, people shouldn't be giving full roster leaks the time of day. The rest of his leaks come from different sources, though, so it's really a case of "which sources are legit," not "is Vergeben legit."

One interesting thing is that loz18 is disputing Vergeben's source on Isabelle in favor of Skull Kid, so I guess time will tell who has the more consistent sources.

Do we have a link to where loz18 apparently says Skull Kid and not Isabelle? Him having set his profile to private makes it really hard to keep track of what he's saying.

 

[Deleted member]

need anyone ask how someone ends up this contrarian

You can thank leaks for that.
Especially that one leak that's supposedly really credible that said my most wanted character isn't going to get in.

 

[Wyoming]

In case anyone was wondering, my "Dread Elite Four" are Skull Kid, Geno, Isabelle, and Shadow.
Unfortunately it seems like they're all pretty much inevitable at this point smh.

Cultured man regarding Shadow.
The other three I just don't really care about. Cool if they're in, meh if they're not. I see the merit behind Isabelle, and understand Geno's popularity.

 

[Will]

Waluigi is not getting in
damn thats just rude

Other subject: what music tracks would you guys want in the game from games that aren't represented by characters yet (like the galaga medley and the like)?

Mine would be this one: the epitome of great NES music for me :

I know a guy who really likes that game. It's pretty cool, I think.

 

[Knight Dude]

I wish they did more with Dark Samus.
They went through all the trouble of changing every non-attack animation and even some subtle attacking ones, that they easily could've made her more different like Falco or Wolf to Fox.

Hell, they even already had effects and animations from her 4 Assist Trophy.

It just feels like they wanted to make her her own thing, but decided to fill up the echo category.

Kind of sucks, but that's the nature of these clone characters. Guys like Luigi, Ganon and Falco didn't start out as different as they are now. They tend to gradually change as time goes on between titles. Assuming some of these guys return in a follow up game(though one that'll like cut the roster to Vanilla Marvel 3 size or a bit larger) I can see D. Samus being one of the ones that changes over time from the original.

 

[aarchak]

While I don't personally see Skull Kid as a playable fighter, Sakurai's a madman and I wouldn't count anyone out at this point.

 

[Jocario Zero]

Honestly, i hate how people react to assist trophies these days. It's not like Sakurai is sitting in his little room thinking to himself "who am i gonna **** today?". Thats not how it works, people. I know that it can hurt seeing your most wanted in a non-playable role but seriously some people need to calm down.

What do you guys think happened at Yacht Club Games when they where asked for Shovel Knight as an assist? I wasn't there when it happened but im sure that they didn't went insane and cried themself to sleep because their character was "just an assist trophy". Here we have a character, a pretty young indie character mind you and now he is in the same game as Mario, Pac-Man, Mega Man, Sonic, Snake, Cloud, Bayonetta, Ryu and Simon Belmont...yeah they really ****** up hard. They should stop making games and do something different because they cleary failed in the Video game Business....

Being an assist trophy is not an insult guys....

 

[Waluigi is not getting in]

Man, for someone who just said

You seem to be wavering in your resolve.
Non-playable characters are still interesting, imo.
Especially if they end up being decent boss battles in Single player, the potential is real.

I get feeling remorse if you really wanted to play as someone and then they end up unplayable, but if they're still in the game, I don't understand how anyone can think that's some kind of insult from Sakurai. Lol.

No? If Skull Kid doesn't make it in I wouldn't start complaining. I'm completely content as it is. Maybe "hate" is too strong of a word.

 

[Deleted member]

Waluigi is not getting in
damn thats just rude

Actually confused me for a second.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Huh, seems like Waluigi is not getting in saw Relaxalax's tweet on the matter, which shows the colours of the cushions matching up with Skull Kid's hair and how Sakurai stressed that he was an AT.
Also dude, don't change your avi just to insult a different user based off of a small spat, I take pride in that I beat 7 Roys who targeted me in the same match due to my sheer hatred of Roy but that's just too petty

 

[Shroob]

need anyone ask how someone ends up this contrarian

Legit I went through a period of not wanting K.Rool.

Not because I hate the character, but because after Ridley's reveal, there were a LOT of EXTRA VOCAL members of the fanbase that were almost insufferable.


Half of me is glad he's in because he deserves it, but the other half legit is glad he's in to shut them up.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Honestly, i hate how people react to assist trophies these days. It's not like Sakurai is sitting in his little room thinking to himself "who am i gonna **** today?". Thats not how it works, people. I know that it can hurt seeing your most wanted in a non-playable role but seriously some people need to calm down.

What do you guys think happened at Yacht Club Games when they where asked for Shovel Knight as an assist? I wasn't there when it happened but im sure that they didn't went insane and cried themself to sleep because their character was "just an assist trophy". Here we have a character, a pretty young indie character mind you and now he is in the same game as Mario, Pac-Man, Mega Man, Sonic, Snake, Cloud, Bayonetta, Ryu and Simon Belmont...yeah they really ****ed up hard. They should stop making games and do something different because they cleary failed in the Video game Business....

Being an assist trophy is not an insult guys....

As a heads up, don’t bypass the site’s auto censor. You can get into trouble for that, but other than that, I agree wholeheartedly

 

[Will]

Actually confused me for a second.

You can make madmen work twice as hard when you do this though. I always got backups just in case.

 

[Nazyrus]

Random thought… I know i will get murdered Negan style by Geno fans for saying this, but hear me out… if we "ignore" the fact that Sora has it hard to make it in because of Disney issues, or heck, if we places ourselves in a timeline where Sakurai manages to get him in the game despite that huge wall of dififculty… Wouldn't Sora be a better/more possible second inclussion of a SE rep for Smash (I know he is Disney's but i consider him to be SE's at the same time) since Sora has had even more appareances in Nintendo than Geno has + it would be very convenient that KH3 is launching a month after Smash Ultimate? Just a thought… just ignore me if you get too triggered about this lol

 

[Shyy_Guy595]

I mean, I'm not ecstatic that Ghirahim wasn't the Zelda newcomer, but I'm at least happy that he's still recognised and actually exists.

Same for Silver with Sonic. At least they exist in SOME form, rather than no acknowledgment at all (although Silver has never even set foot on Green Hill Zone so, that cameo is admittedly a bit odd).

I also rooted for Ashley but hey, at least she's there; same for Mimikyu.

I wonder if Waluigi can serve as a boss in the Spirit Mode just like Rathalos. Sakurai DID say that he was the first character in the series to be both, not the last.

Though that's just me playing devil's advocate and grasping for straws that are almost a planck length.