Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Kaeltor]

So I get that Geno belongs to Square, and that Square has been historically stingy. But they also own Cloud, so why are they ok with Cloud's inclusion in the roster but are hesitant when it comes to Geno?

Genuinely confused as to why this is the case...

 

[Cutie Gwen]

So I get that Geno belongs to Square, and that Square has been historically stingy. But they also own Cloud, so why are they ok with Cloud's inclusion in the roster but are hesitant when it comes to Geno?

Genuinely confused as to why this is the case...

Cloud is one of, if not the most iconic characters from Square Enix from easily their most beloved game

 

[Shroob]

So I get that Geno belongs to Square, and that Square has been historically stingy. But they also own Cloud, so why are they ok with Cloud's inclusion in the roster but are hesitant when it comes to Geno?

Genuinely confused as to why this is the case...

Cloud's the face of Final Fantasy and can basically print money.

Geno's from one Mario spin-off who's only really popular in our community.

 

[Nethermoosen]

So I get that Geno belongs to Square, and that Square has been historically stingy. But they also own Cloud, so why are they ok with Cloud's inclusion in the roster but are hesitant when it comes to Geno?

Genuinely confused as to why this is the case...

It may have been that Sakurai was aiming for Geno, but Square preferred that Sakurai use something that represents their most famous franchise instead. Sakurai probably would have accepted that offer as the best he could get at the time.

If that was the case, now Geno might have the chance since Cloud has already been posted on one of gaming’s biggest advertisements.

 

[Kaeltor]

Cloud is one of, if not the most iconic characters from Square Enix from easily their most beloved game

Cloud's the face of Final Fantasy and can basically print money.

Geno's from one Mario spin-off who's only really popular in our community.

It may have been that Sakurai was aiming for Geno, but Square preferred that Sakurai use something that represents their most famous franchise instead. Sakurai probably would have accepted that offer as the best he could get at the time.

If that was the case, now Geno might have the chance since Cloud has already been posted on one of gaming’s biggest advertisements.

I hope they'll allow it this time around. Licensing characters is such a pain...

 

[Enchess]

After Walking Dead crossing over with Tekken, I'm convinced this has an actual ****ing chance of happening. None of you lie, Goku in Smash would genuinely be cool

Tekken isnt related to Smash at all. Was Jason in Mortal Kombat a sign too...?

 

[Shroob]

Honestly, I sometimes wonder 'who' or 'what' started the Geno hype.

He's a character from a one-off game that never got a true sequel, yet I remember all the way back on Nsider how much hype Geno had as far back as Brawl speculation.


And now he has a Mii Fighter costume in 4, with a legit(Dare I saw really good) chance of being playable.


Just, how the hell did we end up here after all these years?


I would seriously love someone to do a retrospective on the Geno fanbase if possible.

 

[Enchess]

Honestly, I sometimes wonder 'who' or 'what' started the Geno hype.

He's a character from a one-off game that never got a true sequel, yet I remember all the way back on Nsider how much hype Geno had as far back as Brawl speculation.


And now he has a Mii Fighter costume in 4, with a legit(Dare I saw really good) chance of being playable.


Just, how the hell did we end up here after all these years?


I would seriously love someone to do a retrospective on the Geno fanbase if possible.

If he gets in, he'll definitely be the most baffling inclusion in 20 yrs for people who weren't here

 

[Dee Dude]

Agreed, I totally understand wanting niche/RPG/spin-off Mario characters like Fawful, Captain Syrup, etc personally but what exactly made Geno so special?

As someone who didn’t play SMRPG, I didn’t even know who he was until the Brawl days, it’s like if Goombella from TTYD suddenly had a cult following and become of the top ten picks for Smash Bros.

I want a look at this Geno fanbase retrospective as well.

 

[Nethermoosen]

Tekken isnt related to Smash at all. Was Jason in Mortal Kombat a sign too...?

Just to be an ass, Tekken and Smash do have Bandai Namco in common.

 

[YoshiandToad]

Honestly, I sometimes wonder 'who' or 'what' started the Geno hype.

He's a character from a one-off game that never got a true sequel, yet I remember all the way back on Nsider how much hype Geno had as far back as Brawl speculation.


And now he has a Mii Fighter costume in 4, with a legit(Dare I saw really good) chance of being playable.


Just, how the hell did we end up here after all these years?


I would seriously love someone to do a retrospective on the Geno fanbase if possible.

Wasn't it Sakurai himself mentioning Geno got a few votes in the poll around Brawl and how unexpected that was?

 

[Nonno Umby]

Yeah, I'm in the same boat. Never played Mario RPG and never understood what made Geno so requested or special besides moveset potential (which admittedly every single character can have an amazing moveset). A retrospect would be very appreciated.

 

[MalcolmBelmont]

Do you think we will see a new charcter and echo in September. I assume Nintendo is having a direct next month (with one part focusing on online)

 

[Dee Dude]

Wasn't it Sakurai himself mentioning Geno got a few votes in the poll around Brawl and how unexpected that was?

Is that how the massive Geno craze happened? Just cause Sakurai took notice of some few longtime fans wanting a personal character?

 

[Zinith]

MY hope is that Boshi gets revealed as an Echo just after Geno...

 

[praline]

Do you think we will see a new charcter and echo in September. I assume Nintendo having a direct next month (with one part focusing on online)

No it’d more likely be in October to spread out the reveals more evenly.

 

[Noipoi]

I want Geno because it would complete the holy trio of Ridley, K Rool, and Geno. But I don't know where his hype came from either. It probably started small and then exploded in the Brawl era.

 

[MalcolmBelmont]

If Atlus gets a rep (which they deserve) i think it will be as DLC but still want Jack Frost though for base game :D

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Tekken isnt related to Smash at all. Was Jason in Mortal Kombat a sign too...?

My point is that Negan is a completely ****ing random addition in Tekken who doesn't fit at all. Meaning a fighting game with a non video game character isn't that ridiculous anymore.
Jason's a slasher movie character in a franchise about gore, that at least fits well

 

[Nethermoosen]

Agreed, I totally understand wanting niche/RPG/spin-off Mario characters like Fawful, Captain Syrup, etc personally but what exactly made Geno so special?

As someone who didn’t play SMRPG, I didn’t even know who he was until the Brawl days, it’s like if Goombella from TTYD suddenly had a cult following and become of the top ten picks for Smash Bros.

I want a look at this Geno fanbase retrospective as well.

What exactly made Duck Hunt, R.O.B. Or Mr. Game and Watch special? None of those had any kind of fan base worth mentioning and they are as old as the cosmos. Relevancy and popularity aren’t going to be a main concerns for every character they choose.

Smash is a great advertising tool, but it’s also Sakurai’s baby. Nintendo and Square are collaborating. Geno is the ultimate symbolism of that collaboration, if there is one.

 

[MalcolmBelmont]

No it’d more likely be in October to spread out the reveals more evenly.

Eh, Nintendo's going to have to make some sort of Direct before the September Release of online and we could end up seeing charcter reveals in September,October and November.

 

[praline]

Is that how the massive Geno craze happened? Just cause Sakurai took notice of some few longtime fans wanting a personal character?

Sakurai said he wanted to put Geno in Smash back in the Brawl days.

 

[Takasmash]

Did Emily Rogers said that KI is getting a new character if what she saying is true Hades anyone.

 

[MalcolmBelmont]

Did Emily Rogers said that KI is getting a new character if what she saying is true Hades anyone.

I have a feeling it will be Medusa but Hades would be god tier.

 

[Zinith]

No it’d more likely be in October to spread out the reveals more evenly.

Newcomer reveals get more frequent the closer to release. It was true with both Brawl and Smash 4

 

[Nethermoosen]

Newcomer reveals get more frequent the closer to release. It was true with both Brawl and Smash 4

Ramp me up!

 

[epicgordan]

And yet for some reason, they still won't lend Midgar more music tracks. I mean, we got Bombing Mission in his reveal trailer, and it's not available in Smash Wii U to listen to.

Is it some sort of contract hang-up? Specifically since the songs featured in Final Fantasy VII are owned by Nobuo Uematsu who--if memory serves--is no longer working with Square Enix?

You know, similar to how we can't get Steve Burton's voice actor to voice Cloud for legal issues (he's a union voice actor).

 

[Nonno Umby]

Wasn't it Sakurai himself mentioning Geno got a few votes in the poll around Brawl and how unexpected that was?

Which pool? If that is the "Smash 2 Poll", he only got 5 votes, tied with Mallow. Just for reference, Goomba got 7.

Sakurai said he wanted to put Geno in Smash back in the Brawl days.

He also said that he wanted to add Takamaru since Melee, or Ayumi Takibana. Or James Bond. He considers a lot of characters for Smash.

I have a feeling it will be Medusa but Hades would be god tier.

Oh that pun.

And yet for some reason, they still won't lend Midgar more music tracks. I mean, we got Bombing Mission in his reveal trailer, and it's not available in Smash Wii U to listen to.

Is it some sort of contract hang-up? Specifically since the songs featured in Final Fantasy VII are owned by Nobuo Uematsu who--if memory serves--is no longer working with Square Enix?

You know, similar to how we can't get Steve Burton's voice actor to voice Cloud for legal issues (he's a union voice actor).

Honestly at this point they should just add more classic FF music rather than sticking to just VII if that is the case.

 

[MalcolmBelmont]

Ramp me up!

Yeah my bet is:

September: 1 Newcomer and 1 Echo
October: 1 Newcomer and 1 Echo
November: 2 Newcomers and 2 Echos

 

[Nethermoosen]

If they add FF7 music, they should add the Metal version of One Winged Angel and Sephiroth should be on one of Midgar’s Reactors headbanging in the background, lashing his hair too and fro.

 

[Dee Dude]

What exactly made Duck Hunt, R.O.B. Or Mr. Game and Watch special? None of those had any kind of fan base worth mentioning and they are as old as the cosmos. Relevancy and popularity aren’t going to be a main concerns for every character they choose.

Smash is a great advertising tool, but it’s also Sakurai’s baby. Nintendo and Square are collaborating. Geno is the ultimate symbolism of that collaboration, if there is one.

Those three you mentioned are all Retro characters, chosen as oddball choices because they were old and unrecognizable.

That same reason doesn’t apply to a side character from a two decade old Mario game who hasn’t been part of the main cast ever since, yet he’s gets twice as much requested then them.

Yes relevance is not a factor but that’s not what I’m arguing, what I’m asking is what made him so special compared to say Jr, Waluigi etc.

 

[Shroob]

No it’d more likely be in October to spread out the reveals more evenly.

I mean, a Direct next month seems incredibly likely since they're gonna need to talk about online features for the Switch, and I can't imagine that they'll fill an entire 20-25 minutes just talking about that, they'll probably explain how it affects certain titles like Let's Go or Splatoon2.

 

[MalcolmBelmont]

I mean, a Direct next month seems incredibly likely since they're gonna need to talk about online features for the Switch, and I can't imagine that they'll fill an entire 20-25 minutes just talking about that, they'll probably explain how it affects certain titles like Let's Go or Splatoon2.

Plus there's a good chance of a Smash reveal trailer but that will be the only Smash thing there

 

[Aaron1997]

Spoiler: Xenoblade Chronicle 2 Spoiler's

You know what, Malos is actually a dark horse for to be playable as a Shulk Echo. They can Lucina-fy Back Slash and give it Monado Eater's DOT and change Vison into Monado Cyclone. (Make it a counter if you have to) IDK about Air slash. He doesn't have the same problem's that Rex/Pyra have because they can put him in at anytime during Development. He would be another Villan to. The only problem with Malos is having him but not Rex/Prya in the base game seems off.

 

[Nethermoosen]

Those three you mentioned are all Retro characters, chosen as oddball choices because they were old and unrecognizable.

That same reason doesn’t apply to a side character from a decade old Mario game who hasn’t been part of the main cast ever since, yet he’s gets twice as much requested then them.

Yes relevance is not a factor but that’s not what I’m arguing, what I’m asking is what made him so special compared to say Jr, Waluigi etc.

What do you mean? Waluigi isn’t special. He has a high fan base for Hades knows what reason. He’s annoying just to look at.

Geno, if I had to give a special reason, is the product of an old alliance between Square and Nintendo. He is the best symbol of their union and collaboration because he once walked side by side with Mario.

I don’t get the special rules everyone makes up. People did that with Ridley. Too big. People did that with Chrom. Too similar, too much Fire Emblem. People didn’t want clones, now they beg.

There is no point in being a naysayer. Why do people come here to ask people why they care about fictional characters in smash? Because that’s what this is even about.

We want to play the characters we want to play. That’s why we’re all here debating. To come in and declare a desire for a smash inclusion is unrealistic is a warped logic where the logic is based on patterns that continually change and break.

People want Geno. People want Waluigi and both will want them because they love those characters. What else is there that you’re looking for? Because it’s not in a spirited way, whatever it is.

 

[MalcolmBelmont]

Spoiler: Xenoblade Chronicle 2 Spoiler's

You know what, Malos is actually a dark horse for to be playable as a Shulk Echo. They can Lucina-fy Back Slash and give it Monado Eater's DOT and change Vison into Monado Cyclone. (Make it a counter if you have to) IDK about Air slash. He doesn't have the same problem's that Rex/Pyra have because they can put him in at anytime during Development. He would be another Villan to. The only problem with Malos is having him but not Rex/Prya in the base game seems off.

Spoiler

You could have Rex/Pyra and Malos as DLC in the same reveal Trailer

 

[ZephyrZ]

I think it's hilarious how much Goku talk there has been lately. First there was the whole Walking Dead x Tekken incident, then there was a crazy reveal at the end of the last the direct that left everyone asking "how could they possibly top this"? People who never thought the idea was even worth considering are now actually scared that Goku might actually happen now.

Honestly though? If he made it in, I think most people would get over it. The idea of Smash being a celebration of gaming is just kind of a title we've slapped onto it. Before it was the "celebration of Nintendo featuring Sonic and Snake", and any character not tied in with Nintendo was immediately shot down for that. But then Cloud happened and most people just learned to accept it. You've got to remember that when Smash Brothers was first conceived, it was as a new take on the fighting genre, not as a massive video game all-star crossover. It just kind of naturally evolved into that.

And honestly? I think Goku would actually be pretty hype, and this is as someone who doesn't really care for Dragonball or its characters. Heck, I barely even like most anime. But he's just so insanely flashy and over the top that it's hard for me not to see the appeal of having someone like him in Smashbrothers.

And just to clarify, I don't think Goku is ever actually going to happen. I give it maybe, I dunno, a 0.2% chance even in a best-case scenario for him where he scored #1 on the ballot. But I really don't think we should be horrified of it if it does happen. He'll still only be just one anime character in a game that still has over sixty Nintendo characters. His presence won't somehow ruin the spirit of Smash Brothers all by itself.

I actually work at Nintendo and Goku is going to be revealed in a Direct in November (with Naruto as an echo fighter). I'm just trying to prevent the inevitable fan riot before it even starts.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Which pool? If that is the "Smash 2 Poll", he only got 5 votes, tied with Mallow. Just for reference, Goomba got 7.


He also said that he wanted to add Takamaru since Melee, or Ayumi Takibana. Or James Bond. He considers a lot of characters for Smash.


Oh that pun.


Honestly at this point they should just add more classic FF music rather than sticking to just VII if that is the case.

More classic FF music is just more Uematsu music. It'd have the same problems as music from VII.

For reference, Uematsu composed the music for FF I-XII, XIV and Tactics Advance.

 

[Dee Dude]

I didn’t say Waluigi was special but sure man, whatever.

I wasn’t questioning why people wanted a character they liked but why this particular character was on an A-rank level of demand compared to more common frequent characters. That’s what I’m “looking for”.

I don’t like the special fan-made rules either and I sure as hell don’t make them, some of them apply to my wanted as well.

Either way, your point is fair enough.

 

[Originality]

What if Goku got a mii costume, opening the door to non gaming representation without taking a spot in the roster? How would y'all feel about that?