Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[vaanrose]

I'm sure it's been addressed already, but I'm suspicious of why the Japanese version of the game uses the English word "spirits" written in katakana for the secret mode, as opposed to the actual Japanese word for "spirits." I dunno what it means, but it's interesting.

 

[Will]

Wait a minute.

Spirits....
Sakurai never ages....

I never realized that Sakurai's Stand was [Made in Heaven]

But that's not how Made in Heaven works at all. The only Stand that makes you age is Grateful Dead.

I'm sure it's been addressed already, but I'm suspicious of why the Japanese version of the game uses the English word "spirits" written in katakana for the secret mode, as opposed to the actual Japanese word for "spirits." I dunno what it means, but it's interesting.

Honestly nobody has replicated what the twitter guy said. It could be a big bamboozle unless somebody else gives it a shot.

 

[Noipoi]

Dracula Jr., that's the one that wasn't shown and that's all that wasn't shown.
Actually, I do have one.

Will the Final Smash Meter be viable for competitive play?
I'd like to argue that it's dependent on certain characters and certain Final Smashes. If it's allowed, will skyrocket in the competitive scene for how Critical Hit will still OHKO you. And some inescapable (or near inescapable) final smashes like may play a large favor in their endgame as well. I find this pretty interesting since a lot of people are 50/50 on it.

It could be, but it won't be allowed because it's different and different is evil.
So many cool things in this game that could make competitive matches more interesting, but not interfere with the fighting. I hope the competitive overlords allow some minor changes.

 

[WaxPython]

Just a bit confused. Dr. Mario is his own fighter. He's number 18. Lucian is number 21(e) because Marth is number 21 and she's an Echo Fighter of Marth.

That's what I said

 

[Enchess]

I expect a non-smash specific direct around the online services launch. I think smash will reveal some more fighters in this direct.

In October/November, I expect a smash specific direct that has a focus on the new mode (spirits?). I also expect more character reveals.

Sept - Online Service Direct - Isaac and echo Dixie revealed at end
Oct - Spirits mode (cuz Halloween) and Mio and echo Ninten reveal (I have an idea on how this trailer could work)
Nov - Smash Direct with 2 newcomers (let's say Rhythm Heaven rep and Geno) and 3 more echoes (echo Kiddy, echo Ken, and echo..ugh...Shadow)

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Dracula Jr., that's the one that wasn't shown and that's all that wasn't shown.

Spirits is probably related to [monster hunter dragon i always forget the name of] because he said it was boss character, but not what kind of boss character. You obviously have bosses like Metal Face, but it could be related to Spirits (or maybe even Classic mode). I hope current stage hazard bosses like Metal Face and the Find Mii antagonist get expanded upon.


Actually, I do have one.

Will the Final Smash Meter be viable for competitive play?
I'd like to argue that it's dependent on certain characters and certain Final Smashes. If it's allowed, will skyrocket in the competitive scene for how Critical Hit will still OHKO you. And some inescapable (or near inescapable) final smashes like may play a large favor in their endgame as well. I find this pretty interesting since a lot of people are 50/50 on it.

I meant how the bosses there fight and how we never got a proper look at people fighting on the stage


SEE THAT'S A TOPIC I SUGGESTED YESTERDAY BUT EVERYONE IGNORED TOO BECAUSE WE GOTTA TALK ABOUT HOW SHADOW'S A LIKELY ECHO FIGHTER GUYS!
*ahem* Considering how conservative the Smash competitive scene is I doubt it will be legal but it'd be very exciting to see, the main factor imo is how long it takes the meter to charge, it looked like it slowly charges overtime and dealing/receiving damage can boost up the meter. It's really exciting as not only have we never had this in Smash but it also means we have meter management in a way. Only other problem I can guess is neutral B being replaced when the meter is full but I think it'll make an interesting fear factor in high level play

 

[Will]

It could be, but it won't be allowed because it's different and different is evil.
So many cool things in this game that could make competitive matches more interesting, but not interfere with the fighting. I hope the competitive overlords allow some minor changes.

Who even controls what's competitively and not competitively allowed in the first place? Who's the league of Super Smash here, I legitimately I don't know.

Sept - Online Service Direct - Isaac and echo Dixie revealed at end
Oct - Spirits mode (cuz Halloween) and Mio and echo Ninten reveal (I have an idea on how this trailer could work)
Nov - Smash Direct with 2 newcomers (let's say Rhythm Heaven rep and Geno) and 3 more echoes (echo Kiddy, echo Ken, and echo..ugh...Shadow)

>Mio
>Kiddy Kong
hold the **** up buckaroo

 

[vaanrose]

Honestly nobody has replicated what the twitter guy said. It could be a big bamboozle unless somebody else gives it a shot.

I've stepped through the video myself. Right as the camera zooms in, the text is clear as day. Or, at least as clear as those twitter photos.

 

[Nethermoosen]

****ing Dracula's castle, what other bosses we could potentially face, the new songs everyone but Final Fantasy seems to have and if that includes CDs should they return, other guest Assist Trophies, how the new modes could work, the custom balance we see in the menu the FS Meter got shown in, any other single player content like Coin Battle and minigames, if the Trophy store has a chance of coming back, how we supposedly have all stages but the Monster Hunter stage is nowhere to be seen, what that could mean Spirits is, what other information we expect from the next direct assuming it's Smash focused and when we'll get it, etc.

Dracula’s castle is dope and I hope it’s tourney legal with hazards off. Bosses include your mother....3 Porky probably, the rest is guesses. I’m gonna go with Petey Piranha as a safe guess and Kudgel from Donkey Kong Country 2 as an off the wal guess because K. Rool and Klaptrap. Assist trophy guesses are a street fighter rep like Vega or Ken if he isn’t an echo and Vivi from FF9 and then be sad because he isn’t a character. Final Smash meter, if it’s toned down enough, could be fun and maybe could see tournament play. Doubtful, but could be interesting. Stage morph is probably going to be a tourney legal thing in some cases so long as they use legal stages and could help with counter picking and character weaknesses on certain stages. Spirits is gonna be a story mode, you collect character spirits and return them to their bodies to unlock them. Or maybe just collect spirits and choose character husk to unlock whichever you like. That’s how I feel it will go down. Bet. That’s also where I see the
monster hunter scenario occurring since no one else was even on the “stage” but Dedede.

Music and trophy stores aren’t a topic of interest to me. I’m good knowing we have 900 tracks and I know there will be more trophies than I will ever collect.

 

[Enderwoman]

Will the Final Smash Meter be viable for competitive play?

If matches end up deathly slow again then perhaps it could help the pace of the game to have some moves that just kill your enemy faster. But I think the mechanic needs a lot of work to be improved, there needs to be some kind of meter management so it actually has depth beyond just deleting your opponents stock occasionally.

wavedashes as a thing you can do with meter perhaps

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Who even controls what's competitively and not competitively allowed in the first place? Who's the league of Super Smash here, I legitimately I don't know.


>Mio
>Kiddy Kong
hold the **** up buckaroo

Top players get a big say in what goes, I remember some locals refused to allow customs before they were banned just because Zero said they shouldn't be a thing. I've also seen some arguments that it should be banned because it's not a default setting too, which as we all know is why the competitive scene is only 2 minute timed matches with items on

 

[Enchess]

>Mio
>Kiddy Kong
hold the **** up buckaroo

Not that I really think either is likely, but (1) who on Earth could possibly be better paired with an October direct and a mode called "Spirits"? And (2) Donkey echo has been highly speculated. I feel like Funky would look super weird with Donkey's animations (personally) but Kiddy would look perfect and with K Rool and potentially Dixie we could have a full original trilogy reunion. They are both pipe dreams, but both a heck of a lot more likely than Goku and people are willing to entertain that possibility.

 

[Nethermoosen]

That's what I said

Sakurai seems like he won’t change things as a PR move. Like Ganon still isn’t Canon at all with his moveset. They won’t change old clones to be echoes, but I think any new clone will be considered an echo, no matter how big the overall difference is, so long as they draw enough inspiration.

 

[Kaeltor]

I've stepped through the video myself. Right as the camera zooms in, the text is clear as day. Or, at least as clear as those twitter photos.

"Spirits" for all we know could be a placeholder to throw us off or it could be an internal codename.

 

[Shroob]

I actually wonder if our next newcomer reveal will be a lot 'tamer' in comparison.

Ridley and K.Rool were both basically something that people have wanted for years, but I just can't imagine that we'd get banger after banger.

I'm gonna say that the September Direct will drop the Pokemon newcomer right after they talk about Let's Go.

 

[Nethermoosen]

F

I meant how the bosses there fight and how we never got a proper look at people fighting on the stage


SEE THAT'S A TOPIC I SUGGESTED YESTERDAY BUT EVERYONE IGNORED TOO BECAUSE WE GOTTA TALK ABOUT HOW SHADOW'S A LIKELY ECHO FIGHTER GUYS!
*ahem* Considering how conservative the Smash competitive scene is I doubt it will be legal but it'd be very exciting to see, the main factor imo is how long it takes the meter to charge, it looked like it slowly charges overtime and dealing/receiving damage can boost up the meter. It's really exciting as not only have we never had this in Smash but it also means we have meter management in a way. Only other problem I can guess is neutral B being replaced when the meter is full but I think it'll make an interesting fear factor in high level play

FM Meter will at least be tested. It depends on how well balanced they are. Zelda’s FM is pretty easy to land since it has such a wide effect, but it also autokills at high enough percent. Mario’s probably won’t kill as easily. Marth has an easier time landing his than Ike does. It all boils down to how easy something is to land vs how powerful it is.

 

[Will]

Not that I really think either is likely, but (1) who on Earth could possibly be better paired with an October direct and a mode called "Spirits"?

I said it once, I'll say it again: I don't recall Japan being big on the whole Halloween thing. Since the direct from Wednesday focused on Japanese viewers, they'll likely keep doing that.

also i had to google who mio even was and all i get is a water brand

FM Meter will at least be tested. It depends on how well balanced they are. Zelda’s FM is pretty easy to land since it has such a wide effect, but it also autokills at high enough percent. Mario’s probably won’t kill as easily. Marth has an easier time landing his than Ike does. It all boils down to how easy something is to land vs how powerful it is.

The Final Smashes are specifically less powerful, AKA Zelda likely won't instakill past 100%. Critical Hit users are definitely a problem though.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I actually wonder if our next newcomer reveal will be a lot 'tamer' in comparison.

Ridley and K.Rool were both basically something that people have wanted for years, but I just can't imagine that we'd get banger after banger.

I'm gonna say that the September Direct will drop the Pokemon newcomer right after they talk about Let's Go.

I mean, duh. The only other highly requested characters left are Dixie Kong and Isaac maybe? Simon might have been a popular request in the ballot too methinks as Sakurai says he 'finally' joined the roster

F


FM Meter will at least be tested. It depends on how well balanced they are. Zelda’s FM is pretty easy to land since it has such a wide effect, but it also autokills at high enough percent. Mario’s probably won’t kill as easily. Marth has an easier time landing his than Ike does. It all boils down to how easy something is to land vs how powerful it is.

I mean, other fighters with supers have the same thing really so it's good imo

Also yeah Japan doesn't seem to be crazy for Halloween, I've been watching Super Sentai and Kamen Rider for years and there are NO Halloween episodes. Hell, Ultraman Tiga was the first time I saw anything about Japan even knowing what it is

 

[Noipoi]

I actually wonder if our next newcomer reveal will be a lot 'tamer' in comparison.

Ridley and K.Rool were both basically something that people have wanted for years, but I just can't imagine that we'd get banger after banger.

I'm gonna say that the September Direct will drop the Pokemon newcomer right after they talk about Let's Go.

Hey man, a Pokemon reveal is hype for me. I'm a huge Pokemon guy and any of the likely Alola Pokemon would be great to see.
Except Gumshoos. Gumshoos sucks he ruined Yungoos.

 

[Shroob]

I mean, duh. The only other highly requested characters left are Dixie Kong and Isaac maybe? Simon might have been a popular request in the ballot too methinks as Sakurai says he 'finally' joined the roster

I mean, other fighters with supers have the same thing really so it's good imo

Also yeah Japan doesn't seem to be crazy for Halloween, I've been watching Super Sentai and Kamen Rider for years and there are NO Halloween episodes. Hell, Ultraman Tiga was the first time I saw anything about Japan even knowing what it is

"Only ones left"


I mean, Geno and Banjo exist.

 

[Nethermoosen]

I said it once, I'll say it again: I don't recall Japan being big on the whole Halloween thing. Since the direct from Wednesday focused on Japanese viewers, they'll likely keep doing that.

also i had to google who mio even was and all i get is a water brand


The Final Smashes are specifically less powerful, AKA Zelda likely won't instakill past 100%. Critical Hit users are definitely a problem though.

I forgot to add Zelda’s probably won’t do that, but yeah. You understand my point. We just won’t know, but I imagine that even if it’s perfectly viable, the best I would hope for is a division of tournament types. Because people have a set way they play smash tournaments and this requires some additional training to get used to. Highest level players are...like borderline OCD about it.

Rally and let us form a tourney type!

 

[Will]

"Only ones left"


I mean, Geno and Banjo exist.

Geno is a no-brainer, but Banjo? I'm skeptical he raised high stakes.

also steve exists in all his money-making glory

 

[Noipoi]

I mean, duh. The only other highly requested characters left are Dixie Kong and Isaac maybe? Simon might have been a popular request in the ballot too methinks as Sakurai says he 'finally' joined the roster

Geno's the last really big one.

 

[Enchess]

I said it once, I'll say it again: I don't recall Japan being big on the whole Halloween thing. Since the direct from Wednesday focused on Japanese viewers, they'll likely keep doing that.

also i had to google who mio even was and all i get is a water brand

And I've said it once and will say it again: Halloween still is a thing in Japan even if its not as big and even if it wasn't they know it's a thing in the West. There's no reason they have to do a Halloween reveal, but if the mode is really called "Spirits" it would make sense to reveal it then. Simon having a strong connection to spirits would've made sense to pair him with the mode, but he's revealed already. I think a character reveal will go along side Spirits. Why wouldn't they pair it if they could? Mio is one of the only Nintendo characters with a connection to Spirits (other than Luigi obviously). 3rd parties are too much of a crapshoot to guess.

 

[Nethermoosen]

"Only ones left"


I mean, Geno and Banjo exist.

You tell em’ like it is. Geno and Banjo. May Sakurai descend from the heavens to grant us these things.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

"Only ones left"


I mean, Geno and Banjo exist.

Geno's the last really big one.

Oh, right, Geno. Forgot him lol. Honestly I think he's happening as Sakurai DID try to get him in before twice, other than SE being stingy, I can't really imagine any reason Geno couldn't make it in tbh

 

[Will]

And I've said it once and will say it again: Halloween still is a thing in Japan even if its not as big and even if it wasn't they know it's a thing in the West. There's no reason they have to do a Halloween reveal, but if the mode is really called "Spirits" it would make sense to reveal it then. Simon having a strong connection to spirits would've made sense to pair him with the mode, but he's revealed already. I think a character reveal will go along side Spirits. Why wouldn't they pair it if they could? Mio is one of the only Nintendo characters with a connection to Spirits (other than Luigi obviously). 3rd parties are too much of a crapshoot to guess.

no seriously who the hell is mio i get no search results. Also, I don't recall Nintendo ever theming these things after holidays.

I can't really imagine any reason Geno couldn't make it in tbh

They could always say no. Again.

 

[Enchess]

no seriously who the hell is mio i get no search results Also, I don't recall Nintendo ever theming these things after holidays.

The spirit-fighting protagonist of Fatal Frame 2/Project Zero 2/Zero 2 depending on your country. Nintendo co-owns her and put out a Wii exclusive remake in Japan and Europe. Sm4sh acknowledged her, which is actually more than Isaac can say somehow (Isaac is still more likely though)

 

[Cutie Gwen]

no seriously who the hell is mio i get no search results. Also, I don't recall Nintendo ever theming these things after holidays.


They could always say no. Again.

That's what I meant with SE being stingy. Apparently Uematsu's songs are extra expensive so that MIGHT mean something but then I see ALL the love Dracula's Castle got and just think "Jesus either Sakurai REALLY ****ing loves Castlevania or SE is REALLY ****ing stingy for anything"

 

[Idon]

I mean, other fighters with supers have the same thing really so it's good imo

The thing is, Smash isn't a fighting game in that kind of way.

In Smash, FSes are unblockable, completely safe, activate at frame zero, trap the opponent in a wide area, and can even potentially OHKO you depending on the character's final smash.
Traits, that no other fighter has in its super mechanics and traits that fighters have been designed and balanced with from the ground up for decades.

Meter Finals may or may not get in, but justifying them on the basis other fighters have supermoves is a mistake.

 

[Nethermoosen]

You know what? I always hoped there would be a mode that allowed customization at a level equal to the Halo series.

I mean like you could create your own custom modes to have really unique games.

Example: You could devise a 2 on 1 where the lone player is metal(or just takes less knowckback) and has higher damage while the other 2 are still normal.

 

[Will]

The spirit-fighting protagonist of Fatal Frame 2/Project Zero 2/Zero 2 depending on your country. Nintendo co-owns her and put out a Wii exclusive remake in Japan and Europe. Sm4sh acknowledged her, which is actually more than Isaac can say somehow (Isaac is still more likely though)

>not in america
now i have a reason to not feel like an idiot

The thing is, Smash isn't a fighting game in that kind of way.

In Smash, FSes are unblockable, completely safe, activate at frame zero, trap the opponent in a wide area, and can even potentially OHKO you depending on the character's final smash.
Traits, that no other fighter has in its super mechanics and traits that fighters have been designed and balanced with from the ground up.

Meter Finals may or may not get in, but justifying them on the basis other fighters have supermoves is a mistake.

But in the grand scheme of things it's a bit more on the benefit of spectator I think. When people see someone do the unthinkable and pick Bowser Jr. or the Koopalings the first thing someones gonna think in 2019 (if its legal) is "oh **** shadow mario OP" or something.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

The thing is, Smash isn't a fighting game in that kind of way.

In Smash, FSes are unblockable, completely safe, activate at frame zero, trap the opponent in a wide area, and can even potentially OHKO you depending on the character's final smash.
Traits, that no other fighter has in its super mechanics and traits that fighters have been designed and balanced with from the ground up for decades.

Meter Finals may or may not get in, but justifying them on the basis other fighters have supermoves is a mistake.

I mean, I see Sakurai adjusting more stuff as this means he could balance the meter version before release or with patches

 

[blazefan519]

Dracula Jr., that's the one that wasn't shown and that's all that wasn't shown.

Actually, I do have one.

Will the Final Smash Meter be viable for competitive play?
I'd like to argue that it's dependent on certain characters and certain Final Smashes. If it's allowed, will skyrocket in the competitive scene for how Critical Hit will still OHKO you. And some inescapable (or near inescapable) final smashes like may play a large favor in their endgame as well. I find this pretty interesting since a lot of people are 50/50 on it.

I'd actually like to see it be implemented. Maybe have side tournaments with it first to see how balanced they are and if they seem good, maybe some tournaments can start implementing them.

 

[Shroob]

Like, right now, I'm more confident in Geno than I've ever been......buuuuuuuuuuuut.........

My issue lies solely on Square, and if they'll allow it.


I'm going to guess that when they gave Sakurai the rights to use the Mii costume, what they gave him were the "Rights to use the likeness of the character", so if he could keep that deal for this game, then I feel like Geno'd be almost a lock.

Granted, I have no idea if that's even how the business deal with Square even went down.

 

[Enchess]

>not in america
now i have a reason to not feel like an idiot

The remake wasn't in America, original was but is kinda old now. There was a recent entry in the later half of Wii U's life in America.

 

[Noipoi]

Like, right now, I'm more confident in Geno than I've ever been......buuuuuuuuuuuut.........

My issue lies solely on Square, and if they'll allow it.


I'm going to guess that when they gave Sakurai the rights to use the Mii costume, what they gave him were the "Rights to use the likeness of the character", so if he could keep that deal for this game, then I feel like Geno'd be almost a lock.

Granted, I have no idea if that's even how the business deal with Square even went down.

Sakurai made a deal with them.
Geno gets in, but in return there will be zero Super Mario RPG stages or songs in the game.

 

[Will]

The remake wasn't in America, original was but is kinda old now. There was a recent entry in the later half of Wii U's life in America.

Unless it's popularly picked in the other parts of the globe I can't say much for the character.

 

[Shroob]

Sakurai made a deal with them.
Geno gets in, but in return there will be zero Super Mario RPG stages or songs in the game.

Oof. I want Beware the Forest Mushroom as much as I want Geno.

 

[Will]

Sakurai made a deal with them.
Geno gets in, but in return there will be zero Super Mario RPG stages or songs in the game.

Doesn't Nintendo own the songs, but they just don't own the rights to Geno?