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Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

Almost one month has passed since release. In retrospect....

  • This is by far the best Smash ever. Like, I don't even know how they will top this.

  • Pretty freakin' good; I have a few qualms over things like internet play, balancing issues, etc.

  • It's ok, but [insert Smash game here] is better.

  • I'd rather play Parcheesi.


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MBRedboy31

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if kirby abosrbs goku wouldn't that be like multiplying infinite by infinite?

Or maybe kirby should aborb cell and finally be able to be a Stier character
In actual Kirby games, where he shows the fullest extent of his abilities, he can't usually absorb powers from "significant" characters, only from random mooks and miscellaneous objects, though...

Yes, you can make him eat significant characters if they're allied to you in Return to Dream Land or Star Allies, but they just kind of pop out of him and he doesn't get an ability.

It also makes Kirby seem wimpier when you, say, play through Ultimate Choice in Star Allies and see gods get destroyed singlehandedly by random mooks... (Not characters like BWD, I mean actual random mooks)
 
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blazefan519

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Oof I come back to Goku debates again lol. DBZ always pops up in discussions here one way or another.
 

Shroob

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Yet, we still have a dog and duck being able to go toe to toe with a giant space dragon of death, a goddess of light, and of course, Kirby.
I mean, have you seen that dog?

Takes a shotgun blast and only has a cartoon soot stain on his face to show for it.
 

The Animator

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Considering this direct is exclusively smash, I'm guessing it will be a while before we get any more reveals or important information. Hope we get enough to sustain us, I was starving through July.
 

TMNTSSB4

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I love seeing creators play around with their fans. Makes me happy that Sakurai just did it not too long ago too.
There was a problem fetching the tweet
Sakurai took a second break to be happy over a community telling him happy birthday...and he repays us with too much love (love that we don’t truly deserve)
I didn't say he had a massive chance. I'm saying has does have A chance.
  • Sakurai is a human.
  • Humans can/and often do change their minds.
  • Sakurai can change his mind.

The fact stands that he did consider James Bond. If he was willing to consider it for James Bond why not a highly requested, very popular titan of media like Goku?

Once again, I'm not saying Goku confirmed. I'm just saying, I think its possible.
Sakurai has yet to change his mind on making Smash represent more than gaming history, Bonds was lucky enough to have Rare work on his best game, and would’ve been a lot easier to have gotten in than Goku (who like I stated, has many roadblocks to be considered, Sakurai consideration > Toei consideration and permission > Toriyama conderation, permission, and how he’d want Goku to function)
Yet, we still have a dog and duck being able to go toe to toe with a giant space dragon of death, a goddess of light, and of course, Kirby.
Duck Hunt Dog (Mr.Peepers) has hidden powers that nobody understands yet
Oof I come back to Goku debates again lol. DBZ always pops up in discussions here one way or another.
Goku, Pokémon, Echoes, Newcomers...all that is mostly talked about
 

Cutie Gwen

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In actual Kirby games, where he shows the fullest extent of his abilities, he can't usually absorb powers from "significant" characters, only from random mooks and miscellaneous objects, though...

Yes, you can make him eat significant characters if they're allied to you in Return to Dream Land or Star Allies, but they just kind of pop out of him and he doesn't get an ability.

It also makes Kirby seem wimpier when you, say, play through Ultimate Choice in Star Allies see gods get destroyed singlehandedly by random mooks... (Not characters like BWD, I mean actual random mooks)
Problem with this post. It's forgetting that the random mooks are also wearing hats, which implies Kirby's giving them a boost, especially with Star Allies' surprisingly deep lore and the many questions it opens up. Also the fact that the mooks literally become faster, stronger, take more hits, etc. when Kirby uses friend hearts
 

Pyra

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Even if Kirby doesn't get an ability from something, the whole "infinite hammerspace stomach" thing is still interesting.
 

Shroob

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Realistically, pretty sure Rosalina is canonically the strongest entity in Smash if Galaxy has anything to say for it. Kirby probably a close 2nd
 

Mc.Rad

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Wow Shrek is super low tier. Little Red Riding Hood is the top character which is so random and I guess Human Fiona is the Zero Suit Samus of the game.
Yeah it's mostly since all of her moves are broken and she easily gets infinites... She's practically the Meta Knight of the game. Human Fiona has an extensive list of combos that are very quick. Shrek is actually the 2nd lowest on the tier list with Cyclops being the worst since he's an even worse shrek
 

MBRedboy31

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Problem with this post. It's forgetting that the random mooks are also wearing hats, which implies Kirby's giving them a boost, especially with Star Allies' surprisingly deep lore and the many questions it opens up. Also the fact that the mooks literally become faster, stronger, take more hits, etc. when Kirby uses friend hearts
If you're playing through Guest Star or Ultimate Choice as a generic enemy helper, they have their normal enemy palette but with the hat added. Whenever Kirby converts an enemy using Friend Hearts, they always use a yellow, blue, or green palette swap based on player port.

Additionally, the Player 1 helpers have the ability to throw Friend Hearts that can convert other enemies, while the Friend Hearts of players in ports 2-4 only cause them to turn into the enemy they hit. The Player 1 helpers can also clone themselves in Guest Star using Quick Join, which players 2-4 can't do.

The intro cinematic for Star Allies depicts many pink hearts being spread around the universe, so it's reasonable that some enemies somewhere powered themselves up with them, without Kirby's help.
 

cmbsfm

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Smash can be stretched to be about 'gaming' in general, since we have characters like Cloud who has only ever been in Nintendo games as cameos, but if you start throwing in random anime or other characters like that, Smash stops being a showcase of gaming history and becomes, well, whatever Smash would be with ****ing Naruto and Sasuke angsting it up on Final Destination.
I get that this is a hyperbole, but I seriously doubt that Goku's inclusion would lead to this.

It's true Goku would lead to more requests for Luffy, Naruto, etc, but that doesn't mean those characters will necessarily get in. I mean it took Ridley four games to get in and plenty of smash games have ignored many highly requested. Plus I think if Goku gets in, it'll be on his merit of having successful video game releases and massive international appeal, something that the other anime characters lack. I mean Goku is huge, and I feel like Naruto doesn't even compare.

I don't think it'll ever happen and I too don't want Naruto,Luffy,Batman in smash, but I don't think they will happen as soon as Goku is in.
 

ZephyrZ

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I think it's important to keep an open mind in these discussions. Ridley was impossible. Snake returning was impossible. Cloud was impossible. Goku isn't impossible, he's just rediculously unlikely.

That said, if by some miracle he makes it in, it'll probably be the funniest thing I've seen in years. I wouldn't even be mad. If I stop making posts after his trailer drops, just assume I died from laughing too hard.
 

TMNTSSB4

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Realistically, pretty sure Rosalina is canonically the strongest entity in Smash if Galaxy has anything to say for it. Kirby probably a close 2nd
:ultbayonetta::ultkirby::ultlink::ultlucas::ultmario::ultness::ultpalutena::ultpit::ultrosalina::ultshulk:...all valid choices for strongest character
 

Cutie Gwen

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If you're playing through Guest Star or Ultimate Choice as a generic enemy helper, they have their normal enemy palette but with the hat added. Whenever Kirby converts an enemy using Friend Hearts, they always use a yellow, blue, or green palette swap based on player port.

Additionally, the Player 1 helpers have the ability to throw Friend Hearts that can convert other enemies, while the Friend Hearts of players in ports 2-4 only cause them to turn into the enemy they hit. The Player 1 helpers can also clone themselves in Guest Star using Quick Join, which players 2-4 can't do.

The intro cinematic for Star Allies depicts many pink hearts being spread around the universe, so it's reasonable that some enemies somewhere powered themselves up with them, without Kirby's help.
Again, the gameplay clearly shows a large difference meaning whatever's happening, they're getting a boost. Hell, Swole Dedede and Meta Knight's clones are things they both can't do without the power of hearts corrupting them, and Kirby is naturally able to produce them for some reason
 

Pyra

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I think it's important to keep an open mind in these discussions. Ridley was impossible. Snake returning was impossible. Cloud was impossible. Goku isn't impossible, he's just rediculously unlikely.

That said, if by some miracle he makes it in, it'll probably be the funniest thing I've seen in years. I wouldn't even be mad. If I stop making posts after his trailer drops, just assume I died from laughing too hard.
Best timeline:

Nintendo Goku gets added and it pisses off a bunch of people who dislike obscure dead characters (I guess).

Then, Jump Goku gets added and pisses off... a lot of people who ride on the symbolism of Smash Bros.

It's a double-whammy.

Edit: Before people are extra salty to balance out their bitter, I was joking about the "best timeline" bit.
 
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MBRedboy31

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Again, the gameplay clearly shows a large difference meaning whatever's happening, they're getting a boost. Hell, Swole Dedede and Meta Knight's clones are things they both can't do without the power of hearts corrupting them, and Kirby is naturally able to produce them for some reason
In terms of Dedede and Meta Knight getting a boost, is it really a boost? They get beaten very handily if you mirror match them with their non corrupted selves.

Kirby can only produce Friend Hearts because one of the pink hearts hit him in the intro trailer. He didn't even realize that he had that power initially, shown by the little cutscene in the first level where he encounters a Poppy Bros. Jr. and then realizes that he can throw a Friend Heart at it.

Anyway... it is true that the mooks have become more than mooks due to the power of the hearts, but anyway, the point is that Kirby really isn't unique in power when it's possible for mooks to, with some assistance, be as powerful as he is.
 

MysticKnives

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I'd be fine with Goku if Sakurai says he's the only anime character that will ever appear and that's that.

Goku has a rich video game history at this point and Namco could help facilitate any transition needed into a platform fighter, and he has global appeal and a lot of interesting moves to pull from. Not to mention the stage and music selection would be pretty rad for Smash, even if they went with video game OST.

Though I know it will never happen and the salt storm would be massive.
If he was to somehow ever get in, the music he'd bring could be so lit.
 

SvartWolf

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Until Ashley is introduced as a Captain Falcon clone, anyway.
good grief!
Now i really want a gothic lolita costume for captain falcon....

I think it's important to keep an open mind in these discussions. Ridley was impossible. Snake returning was impossible. Cloud was impossible. Goku isn't impossible, he's just rediculously unlikely.

That said, if by some miracle he makes it in, it'll probably be the funniest thing I've seen in years. I wouldn't even be mad. If I stop making posts after his trailer drops, just assume I died from laughing too hard.

Honestly, if Simon belmont is in, i don't really care who else they add, with simon and ridley in, they could add goku, shrek or friggin margaret tascher for all i care.

Best timeline:

Nintendo Goku gets added and it pisses off a bunch of people who dislike obscure dead characters (I guess).

Then, Jump Goku gets added and pisses off... a lot of people who ride on the symbolism of Smash Bros.

It's a double-whammy.

Edit: Before people are extra salty to balance out their bitter, I was joking about the "best timeline" bit.
I think that Nintendo goku could be added as an AT, and sakurai could use teh oportunity to get a good lod laugh at it... *Goku is in smash*!

Even better, Jump goku gets added... as pokeball pokemon...
 

Darkraid

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I think it's important to keep an open mind in these discussions. Ridley was impossible. Snake returning was impossible. Cloud was impossible. Goku isn't impossible, he's just rediculously unlikely.

That said, if by some miracle he makes it in, it'll probably be the funniest thing I've seen in years. I wouldn't even be mad. If I stop making posts after his trailer drops, just assume I died from laughing too hard.
Goku is literally impossible since he originated from manga and anime.

Stop with this goku crap
 
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Rie Sonomura

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Huh, weird. The Smash Blog hasn’t updated yet

We probably won’t get anything today...
 

Cutie Gwen

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In terms of Dedede and Meta Knight getting a boost, is it really a boost? They get beaten very handily if you mirror match them with their non corrupted selves.

Kirby can only produce Friend Hearts because one of the pink hearts hit him in the intro trailer. He didn't even realize that he had that power initially, shown by the little cutscene in the first level where he encounters a Poppy Bros. Jr. and then realizes that he can throw a Friend Heart at it.

Anyway... it is true that the mooks have become more than mooks due to the power of the hearts, but anyway, the point is that Kirby really isn't unique in power when it's possible for mooks to, with some assistance, be as powerful as he is.
Wait I just remembered Robobot's pause screen if you don't have an ability. It literally says Kirby has infinite power. So there we go
 

CodakTheWarrior

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As I promised earlier, here's another Moveset! This time, it's an ACTUAL Eddy Moveset. I know I posted one the other day, but I intended that to be used for Ed and got them mixed up. This one embraces Eddy's con-man attributes to the max.

***Eddy Moveset***

A true con-man knows that sometimes you gotta play dirty in order to make a profit, and that's exactly what Eddy has come to Smash to do. The most sneaky and mischievous of the three titular characters in "Ed, Edd, and Eddy", Eddy uses a plethora of tricks of the trade he's picked up in his years as a con artist to baffle his foes. He also utilizes his skill as a salesman to set up cheap shops and schemes to harm his opponents while also earning massive benefits for himself. Eddy is here to win, no matter the means.

Despite his overall short stature, Eddy is actually somewhat slow as a default. Eddy is also pretty heavy too, which also means his attacks could leave quite a mark on those he comes across. Eddy's jump height is slightly above average, so, combined with his decent recovery move, allow him to bounce back from most nasty situations. Eddy can crawl, but does not have the ability to wall jump.

Eddy's main gameplay style revolves around a central mechanic unique to only him; money. At the beginning of the battle, Eddy will have a total of 50 cents, with 100 cents being the max Eddy can have at once. As Eddy uses his specials and some of his other attacks, his coin supply will be drained. If Eddy is able to successfully land and reap the benefits of these attacks, however, his coin supply will continue to raise. It is not only important to keep Eddy's coin supply high so he can use his attacks, but if is coin supply drops below 10, his stats will take a massive hit. His speed will be even slower, he will be significantly lighter, his jump height will be lower, and his attacks will be generally weaker until he can have more than 10 cents again. This makes constant management and planning of Eddy's money vital to playing the character, and also makes Eddy one of the most risky, yet rewarding, characters to play as in the game.

Specials:

Neutral Special: Pet Boutique- This move takes 10 cents to use and stays on the battlefield for 10 seconds. Every two seconds, a dog will escape from one of the kennels and run in a straight line towards the nearest opponent, tracking them down and dealing some good damage in the process. If Eddy is able to successfully hit foes with a dog, he will earn 4 cents back. A total of 5 dogs will be spawned with the Pet Boutique, meaning Eddy could earn a double profit if he is able to hit opponents with all of the dogs. Once the 10 seconds is up, Eddy will have to wait through a 5 second cooldown before he can use the move again.

Side Special: Bus Service- Using this move will cost 5 cents. This attack will cause a shoddily-drawn cardboard bus to ride straightforward in a line at a very fast speed. Any fighters touched by the bus will not only receive some decent damage, but will also be stuck to the bus for a matter of a few seconds. If Eddy is able to hit opponents with the bus, he will double his profit and earn 10 cents back. However, the bus moves at a very quick speed meaning opponents can avoid it relatively easily. There is no cooldown on the move after Eddy uses it either.

Up Special: Tire Swing- Eddy's recovery move costs 3 cents to use and will cause a tire swing to appear. Eddy will be locked in the tire swing and will be able to rock back and forth on it until he jumps off. The tire swing will be present for 5 seconds before it disappears, when it has another 5 second cooldown before he can use it again. In order to prevent a constant stream of profit, using this move cannot earn Eddy more coins in return.

Down Special: Lemonade Stand- By far one of Eddy's most risky moves, this move needs a whopping 20 cents to function. After the payment is made, this move spawns a lemonade stand that will stick around for 10 seconds. The stand will have 8 special Lemonade pitchers that will heal 5% of health, with Eddy being the only one who can use them. This means if Eddy is able to successfully heal up without being kept away from the stand/letting the stand's timer run out, he can heal an astounding 40% of health. However, there is no way to earn any money back on the purchase, meaning the Lemonade stand should only be used if Eddy has some cash to spare. The stand has a 20 second cooldown before it can be used again.

Normals:

Jab: Eddy alternates punches in giving a one-two punch to opponents, dealing some pretty good damage.

F-Tilt: Eddy has his arm outstretched to shake the opponent's hand. The attack itself does minute damage, but it has a special effect. If the opponent attacks Eddy while his arm his outstretched, Eddy will actually counter with a massive punch using his other hand, dealing INCREDIBLE damage. However, this makes using the move at opportune times a huge benefit, and at others a borderline negative.

U-Tilt: Eddy jumps up in the air slightly with his arms outstretched above him, dealing damage.

D-Tilt: Eddy kicks downward at an angle slightly, dealing minor damage and moving him forward slightly.

Dash Attack: This attack has Eddy dive into opponents by sliding along the ground, with coins spilling of his pockets if he has a measly 2 cents to spare. The attack does decent damage normally, but with the added coinage, it deals FAR more damage.

Smashes:

F-Smash: Eddy takes out a Baseball bat to hit opponents, like Ness' F-Smash. The attack is even more fatal than Ness', but it does cost 4 cents to use. If Eddy is able to land the hit on foes, not only will it do unbelievable damage, but he will earn a double profit and receive 8 cents in return. A very good move overall.

U-Smash: This attack has Eddy chuck a literal beehive up in the air, costing 6 cents to use. Although the cost is decently high, the attack has some special effects. If opponents foolishly attack the beehive while it's in midair, it will break and a swarm of bees will pursue foes, like the beehive item from Smash 4. If Eddy hits opponents with the beehive normally, he will earn a double profit and gain 12 cents. If the beehive is broken, he will earn an additional 3 cents as well, meaning Eddy could earn a net profit total of 9 cents through the attack.

D-Smash: Another move that comes at a price, Eddy takes out a golf club and sharply swings it around on the ground, dealing heavy damage but at the cost of 5 cents. If Eddy hits opponents with the golf club, however, he will earn a double profit and receive 10 cents in return.

Aerials:

N-Air: Eddy does a front flip in midair, dealing decent damage.

F-Air: Eddy quickly throws a coin in front of him, costing 1 cent to use. The move is a lightweight projectile that does minor damage but can be spammed, just be careful not to drain Eddy's coin supply in the process. If Eddy uses the move when he's completely broke, the move will do nothing.

U-Air: Eddy quickly head butts the opponent in midair to deal decent damage.

D-Air: This move will have Eddy sharply bash the opponent with a rolled-up newspaper beneath him. It has a strong meteor effect, but costs 3 cents to use. Luckily, if Eddy can successfully hit opponents with the newspaper, he will earn 6 cents back in return.

B-Air: This attack works identically to Eddy's F-Air in every way, except it's done behind him as opposed to in front of him.

Grab/Pummel: For the grab, Eddy merely leans forward to snatch opponents with his hands. Eddy's Pummel is incredibly strong, as Eddy violently shakes opponents to knock the money out of them. This means every attack of the Pummel will have Eddy earn two cents, allowing him to increase his money count in a flash.

Throws: For forward throw, Eddy holds opponents before kicking them in the crotch region, sending them flying. Back throw sees Eddy take and roll over opponent to send them behind him. Up throw has Eddy throw foes above him and then bash them upward with his head. Down throw has Eddy jumps up in the air and do a cannonball onto enemies, dealing major damage.

Final Smash: Debt Collection- After using this attack, a tree will appear in the middle of the screen with a branch hanging down, which Eddy uses to get up in the tree and hide. Once he's concealed, all of the other kids from the cul-de-sac (except for Ed and Double-D) will stampede onto the screen to earn their money back. The kids will search for Eddy for around 10 seconds, dealing massive damage to opponents. Once the 10 seconds is up, the kids will leave and Eddy will hop out of the tree, with the tree leaving soon after.

Taunts: Up Taunt has a thought bubble slowly appear above Eddy that has a dollar sign on it before disappearing. Side Taunt has Eddy flip a coin up in the air and catch it, has no effect on the coin count. Down Taunt causes Eddy flip on some shades and give a 'cool guy pose' to the foreground.

Alts: Most of Eddy's color swaps are based off of other characters from the show, with swaps like a Red for Double-D, Green for Ed, Brown for Jonny, and others. However, Eddy does have one special alt where he dons an Elvis costume, allowing him to put some rockin' style to the fight.

Stage: The Cul-de-sac- A very large stage that spans the length of a street. Players will fight not only on the street itself, where cars and buses will occasionally drive directly into the fight, but also have two houses on either side as well. Players can jump on top of the rooftops of the houses, as well as enter the houses, in which the houses will become hollow and allow you to see in them. Note however that attacks will not harm the buildings in any way. Overall a very dynamic and fluid stage that really captures the chaos and mishaps of the "Ed, Edd, and Eddy" world.

Poseidome title: "King of Scams"

I'm not sure if this will be used in the fan game or not, likely because it is very complicated, but I hope you guys like it regardless. I worked really hard on it, so let me know what you think!
 

ZephyrZ

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Goku is literally impossible since he originated from manga and anime.

Stop with this goku crap
Ridley was "impossible" because he was too big. Villager was "impossible" because he wasn't a fighter. Cloud was "impossible" since he was bare tied to Nintendo. They all had reasons to be "impossible". What you should be saying is that Goku is almost impossible.

Look, I don't actually think Goku will ever happen. I'm actually willing to make a bet on it. But I hate it when someone treats something as completely impossible. It's close-minded.
 

Cutie Gwen

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"Huh the site is late again"
Huh it's hot in the summer. Huh I feel less hungry when I eat dinner. Huh poking myself with something sharp hurts.
It's been happening at least once a week because whatever the **** is going on behind the scenes for the site, it's not exactly as professional as we're used to
 

Iridium

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Wait I just remembered Robobot's pause screen if you don't have an ability. It literally says Kirby has infinite power. So there we go
Knowing that, Kirby dying in a few hits to enemies definitely weaker than him overall is a bit strange to have to think of.
 

Pyra

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"Huh the site is late again"
Huh it's hot in the summer. Huh I feel less hungry when I eat dinner. Huh poking myself with something sharp hurts.
It's been happening at least once a week because whatever the **** is going on behind the scenes for the site, it's not exactly as professional as we're used to
Stares at Fake Smash Ball update

Knowing that, Kirby dying in a few hits to enemies definitely weaker than him overall is a bit strange to have to think of.
Glass cannon.
 
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MysticKnives

Smash Ace
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But give me Wang Tang, the Power Stone dude loosely based on Goku. Anything Power Stone related I'd love. A Power Stone remake or sequel on the Switch (this would be so awesome), or even a Power Stone styled Smash game.
 

RandomAce

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Huh, weird. The Smash Blog hasn’t updated yet

We probably won’t get anything today...
They’re saving it for the Direct!

————————————————————
The thing with Ultimate is that it’s an improved Smash 4 on steroids and stuff on top of it.

It has all the Smash 4 characters and missing veterans from it.

It has an improved stage list (a majority of them remade for this game).

Improved graphics, looks, and colors.

It has an improved soundtrack (based one what’s on so far, it’s looking good! Hopefully)

It has stuff that caters to the competitive scene like hazard toggles, battlefield forms, universal FD forms, redone rage mechanics, new mechanics, bringing back old mechanics like Dashdancing and directional air dodge.

Faster gameplay, and rewards aggressive gameplay while it punishes campy gameplay.

The items feel better and are more balanced.

AND, we’re getting BRAND NEW content like: characters, stages, (and even more hopefully). With possibly new characters that people have been asking for from the ballot (Isaac).

Smash Ultimate is basically what everyone wanted Smash 4 to be.
 
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