Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[monadoboy]

Got bored so I decided to do a stage-to-character rating thing. Which series has more stages in relation to the characters it has? This includes brand new ones introduced in Ultimate. A series that has twice as many stages as it does characters would get a ranking of 2 and vice versa would be .5

The Mii Fighters and all the Battlefield and Final Destination variants don't count.

has no stages (so far) and Balloon Fight, Nintendo DS, Electroplankton, Find Mii, Miiverse, Nintendogs, Pilotwings, Tomodachi, Wii Sports and Wrecking Crew have no characters (so far).

5
4
3
2.5
2
1.67
1.5
1
.89
.5

This is partly why I think FE representation is just right. Maybe a bit too many characters, but there's barely stages and one assist in all of Smash, plus no items or Smash Run/Subspace enemies.
For comparison, Mother gets a Smash Run enemy, Franklin Badge and one more stage (while all of the Mother stages are unique locations instead of generic scenes.)
Pokemon and Zelda might have comparable amounts of playable characters, but they have 42 Poke Ball Pokemons and Zelda's 7 Smash Run enemies, 4 assists and 8 items. (as of Smash For)
Smash representation is much more balanced than many fans gives it credit for. I know pretty much no one cares about items and such, but it's clear the development team put a lot of work and love into them. Sad to see their work dismissed with petty complaints about "slots" and "representation."

 

[Fenriraga]

I don't understand why people don't make more "image-leaks" of Geno. It would be almost effortless. I'm a Blender newbie and it would take me just a little over an hour to go in there, throw together a close-up of his head, silhouette it, and glue it to a screenshot of some HD Ultimate footage in photoshop.

NOPE.

I'd rather not have to worry about my top pick being real or not.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I was including all of Smash, including the new stages and characters in Ultimate. The Mario series has 20 stages to 8 characters, so 2.5

Makes enough sense to be woke(ish)

 

[Zinith]

This is partly why I think FE representation is just right. Maybe a bit too many characters, but there's barely stages and one assist in all of Smash, plus no items or Smash Run/Subspace enemies.
For comparison, Mother gets a Smash Run enemy, Franklin Badge and one more stage (while all of the Mother stages are unique locations instead of generic scenes.)
Pokemon and Zelda might have comparable amounts of playable characters, but they have 42 Poke Ball Pokemons and Zelda's 7 Smash Run enemies, 4 assists and 8 items. (as of Smash For)
Smash representation is much more balanced than many fans gives it credit for. I know pretty much no one cares about items and such, but it's clear the development team put a lot of work and love into them. Sad to see their work dismissed with petty complaints about "slots" and "representation."

Yeah, it does seem like people only want to talk about "characters" in regards to FE representation not understanding that FE has little else in Smash

 

[Wambo]

If we get both K.Rool and Geno, I don't care who else we get. I'll be happy, and the big three will finally be in Smash before the next game and all it's inevitable cuts.

 

[Slavic]

I was including all of Smash, including the new stages and characters in Ultimate. The Mario series has 20 stages to 8 characters, so 2.5

Technically we know there's a New Donk City stage from Mario's fighter page, just not proper, so it brings them up to an even odd 21. I'm glad you redid this cause when I did it I missed some characters like R.O.B. and Dr. Mario, so it's good to see more accurate numbers!

EDIT lmao I can't count disregard, doing good work!

 

[P.Kat]

Hahahaha... I'm idiot; I tried to write this message without actually trying to understand my idea...

... So... Which characters do you think left to appear in Smash Ultimate that should be in the game?

I just edit this post to include more love for Micaiah... I'm starting to get old.

Red & Pyra/Elma - Cause we can use more Xenoblade in Smash plus Elma high speed agility, and DPS style of playing suits my playstyle, I'm also interested in how Rex & Pyra would play.

Ashley - We have Shulk as a self-buffer, why not a character that debuffs everyone else with hexes, curses, and spells. Plus more Wariorare characters.

Isabelle(unique) - cause more AC rep and I want to see what original moveset can be given to her to set her apart from Villager

Fjorm/Micaiah : Lancer with ice abilities/Mage with light/healing abilities would be interesting mechanics.

Shantae - At least one Indie character should join the cast, can't think of a more likely newcomer than Shantae. Also dancing/transformation mechanics.

Amaterasu - Alright, I'm probably cheating at this point, I just want to see a character with some kind of artistic moveset/weapon change in Smash and Amaterasu is the best/favorite choice for this. Adeleine would work too, but I'm uncertain about her chances with Bandana Dee and Marx in the running. So Amaterasu it is.

Sora/Rayman - The wow factor that most people would flip their lids for if they got in.

 

[Zinith]

Technically we know there's a New Donk City stage from Mario's fighter page, just not proper, so it brings them up to an even odd 21. I'm glad you redid this cause when I did it I missed some characters like R.O.B. and Dr. Mario, so it's good to see more accurate numbers!

I'm pretty sure Mario has 20 stages including New Donk City. I even looked through all the games, the series had 19 stages (2 in 64, 4 new in Melee, 5 new in Brawl, 7 new across both versions of Smash 4 and 1 new DLC)

 

[Slavic]

I'm pretty sure Mario has 20 stages including New Donk City. I even looked through all the games, the series had 19 stages (2 in 64, 4 new in Melee, 5 new in Brawl, 7 new across both versions of Smash 4 and 1 new DLC)

yea I threw an edit in oops

i have trouble counting objects on screens my apologies!

 

[Icedragonadam]

I'm pretty sure Mario has 20 stages including New Donk City. I even looked through all the games, the series had 19 stages (2 in 64, 4 new in Melee, 5 new in Brawl, 7 new across both versions of Smash 4 and 1 new DLC)

And yet, none them were Bowser's Castle.

 

[Slavic]

And yet, none them were Bowser's Castle.

"uhhh we can throw it in Paper Mario stage, that'll make them happy right??"

- sakurai probably

 

[DoctorSanity]

Ashley - We have Shulk as a self-buffer, why not a character that debuffs everyone else with hexes, curses, and spells. Plus more Wariorare characters

I honestly really like the idea of this? She can have a move that's kind of like her assist trophy move where it's an area-of-effect where something is just worse on the opponent if they happen to be in it, with different colors depending on the move's effects

 

[Dracyoshi]

If they bring over Paper Mario from the 3DS then they should let you lock the transformation to a specific one with L and R. It'd also affect the battlefield & omega variants.
It's not unprecedented! Dream Land on the 3DS let you change it to a b/w variant if you held L while selecting the stage.

It'd at least throw a bone to all the people who've been clamoring for Bowser's Castle, like me. I'd use that omega variant all the time! And if Pirate Ship is removed then we'd at least have the sweet TTYD Pirate Ship transformation.

 

[Zinith]

Not only was a Bowser's Castle stage only a part of a bigger Mario stage

Not only was it a "Paper Mario" stage

But it was a stage that represented Paper Mario at it's low point...

R.I.P. Bowser's Castle

 

[Omega Tyrant]

Not only was a Bowser's Castle stage only a part of a bigger Mario stage

Not only was it a "Paper Mario" stage

But it was a stage that represented Paper Mario at it's low point...

R.I.P. Bowser's Castle

I think the truly criminal part is that it was a stage that is completely unplayable. I know Sakurai likes crazy stages, but I don't know how anyone could look at that stage and greenlight it as a stage anyone would ever want to play on, no matter how casual they are.

 

[Opossum]

I think the truly criminal part is that it was a stage that is completely unplayable. I know Sakurai likes crazy stages, but I don't know how anyone could look at that stage and greenlight it as a stage anyone would ever want to play on, no matter how casual they are.

Literally the only stage that made me somewhat appreciate Hanenbow.

 

[Dracyoshi]

Not only was a Bowser's Castle stage only a part of a bigger Mario stage

Not only was it a "Paper Mario" stage

But it was a stage that represented Paper Mario at it's low point...

R.I.P. Bowser's Castle

Yep... that was such a disappointment. Should've used the Bowser's Castle from 64, but oh well. Not to mention how difficult it is to play on, with the complete lack of any neutral area to stand on.
Also, I've realized that you could potentially lock the S.S. Flavion variant with my idea and enable hazardless to play it without the disruption from the ship swaying. It could potentially become a really fun stage!

 

[Iridium]

Well, we have less than two days until we get to watch you know what from Japan! I can't wait!

 

[CannonStreak]

Well, we have less than two days until we get to watch you know what from Japan! I can't wait!

Less than one day, actually. It plays on the 21st in the US, whereas it plays at the same time on the 22nd in Japan.

 

[CodakTheWarrior]

I'm

Well, we have less than two days until we get to watch you know what from Japan! I can't wait!

I'm a dinkbutt so what is it exactly we're waiting for just for clarification?

 

[Noipoi]

I'm honestly surprised Bowser didn't come with a Bowser's castle stage in melee.
You could have Mario and Bowser fight in Bowser's castle, it makes too much sense.
Get on it, Sakurai!

 

[Will]

I'm honestly surprised Bowser didn't come with a Bowser's castle stage in melee.
You could have Mario and Bowser fight in Bowser's castle, it makes too much sense.
Get on it, Sakurai!

Boi Sakurai ain't here

 

[MainJPW]

I'm I'm a dinkbutt so what is it exactly we're waiting for just for clarification?

This here event.

 

[Deleted member]

How have we not had a Bowser's Castle stage yet?

Better yet: Why have we not had an actually good Mario level since Peach's Castle? The Mario levels past Melee were always kind of underwhelming for me, TBH. :/

 

[Dragoncharystary]

If they bring over Paper Mario from the 3DS then they should let you lock the transformation to a specific one with L and R. It'd also affect the battlefield & omega variants.
It's not unprecedented! Dream Land on the 3DS let you change it to a b/w variant if you held L while selecting the stage.

It'd at least throw a bone to all the people who've been clamoring for Bowser's Castle, like me. I'd use that omega variant all the time! And if Pirate Ship is removed then we'd at least have the sweet TTYD Pirate Ship transformation.

I really want the Paper Mario stage to return just for that section. I could care less about the other two parts of the stage but TTYD is my favorite game of all time so I need the stage back for that. I'm also glad that Sakurai threw a bone to Paper Mario fans and included a throwback to the original two games in the modern Paper Mario era. I hate that stage as much as I love it though because I die a little inside every time the stage switches to the Bowser's Castle section.

 

[DoctorSanity]

Boi Sakurai ain't here

Fool.... he was here all along, you just never suspected...

 

[Slavic]

How have we not had a Bowser's Castle stage yet?

Better yet: Why have we not had an actually good Mario level since Peach's Castle? The Mario levels past Melee were always kind of underwhelming for me, TBH. :/

here's my personal enjoyment of Mario stages in Smash (obviously everyone cares about this):

Top Tier:
Rainbow Cruise, Peach's Castle (Melee), Super Mario Maker, Mario Galaxy, Mario Circuit (Brawl), Mushroom Kingdom II

Middle Tier:
Delfino Plaza, Mushroomy Kingdom, Luigi's Mansion, Mushroom Kingdom (Melee), Mushroom Kingdom (64), Rainbow Road, Mushroom Kingdom U

Bottom Tier:
3D Land, Golden Plains, Mario Circuit (Wii U), Peach's Castle (64), Paper Mario

Bottomest Tier:
Mario Bros.

it's pretty all over the board for me, but definitely favors Melee's stages heavily, I gotta agree with you.

 

[Iridium]

Less than one day, actually. It plays on the 21st in the US, whereas it plays at the same time on the 22nd in Japan.

Well, 10:00 A.M. here is 12:00 P.M. over there right? Knowing that there is a 14-hour difference, when it is 12:00 A.M. over there and the 16th for example, it would be 10:00 P.M. and the 15th here, so if it starts in the afternoon, then we would waiting until nighttime, when it's very late.

I don't know why I had to explain so much. I think I need to know the schedule, if it is out there.

 

[CannonStreak]

Well, 10:00 A.M. here is 12:00 P.M. over there right? Knowing that there is a 14-hour difference, when it is 12:00 A.M. over there and the 16th for example, it would be 10:00 P.M. and the 15th here, so if it starts in the afternoon, then we would waiting until nighttime, when it's very late.

I don't know why I had to explain so much. I think I need to know the schedule, if it is out there.

The event starts at 8PM on the 15th of this month where I am at, US Mountain time, so that means it would start at 10PM Eastern US and 7PM Pacific US time. What time would it be by then in your area compared to the US times?

 

[Starbound]

Conspiracy theory: We haven't seen Paper Mario stage or heard either music track because the character is coming soon.

 

[Iridium]

The event starts at 8PM on the 15th of this month where I am at, US Mountain time, so that means it would start at 10PM Eastern US and 7PM Pacific US time. What time would it be by then in your area compared to the US times?

Oh, I'm in the Eastern Time Zone, so 10:00 P.M. it is then.

 

[CannonStreak]

Oh, I'm in the Eastern Time Zone, so 10:00 P.M. it is then.

So, you thought I was in another country? (not making a big deal out of that, by the way)

Well, I think it is safe to say that it won't be the 21st in some parts of the world, aside from Japan of course. But I think you did know that already. Just saying.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Don’t know if people are gonna care, but Samus showed signs of her PTSD in the Ridley trailer (which also references the manga quite a bit)

 

[Wyoming]

Conspiracy theory: We haven't seen Paper Mario stage or heard either music track because the character is coming soon.

Certainly has a chance due to that mysterious absence.

If not I hope Sakurai realized the error of his ways and scrapped it for a Theater stage.

Or he cant be arsed to make new or reuse PM songs in Smash so Paper Mario content is scrapped altogether.

 

[SpiralGalaxies]

just make a rogueport stage as TTYD is the best paper mario.

 

[UltimateWario]

Don’t know if people are gonna care, but Samus showed signs of her PTSD in the Ridley trailer (which also references the manga quite a bit)

It's whatever. Other M has come and gone but this game started likely development around or before Samus Returns did, so that's where Sakurai pulled from. I wish Other M could go and stay go but I'm not going to complain since at least Ridley doesn't look like Other M Ridley (and much as I hate Samus's Other M suit, Other M Ridley makes Other M Samus look like a SSS Elder God-tier design).

 

[Dracyoshi]

Well, they couldn't be arsed to make a good Paper Mario game for an entire decade. Wouldn't be surprised if it didn't even make Smash. Paper Mario can't get a break.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

It's whatever. Other M has come and gone but this game started likely development around or before Samus Returns did, so that's where Sakurai pulled from. I wish Other M could go and stay go but I'm not going to complain since at least Ridley doesn't look like Other M Ridley (and much as I hate Samus's Other M suit, Other M Ridley makes Other M Samus look like a SSS Elder God-tier design).

Don’t think he only pulled from Other M since Mario and Mega Man die in a way that’s similar to the manga (which shows her PTSD massively), and that came out around 2004 (other games showed minor hints at it, but only the manga and OM had it play a huge role in their stories)

 

[Darkraid]

Who are your ultimate wish characters that you want to be in smash? For me its Crash and Phoenix Wright

 

[Peridorito]

Who are your ultimate wish characters that you want to be in smash? For me its Crash and Phoenix Wright

Paper Mario and Terra. Bomberman too but he's an assist...