Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[AlphaSSB]

Can we get Sector Z AND Corneria?

Hopefully.

Corneria was essentially the successor to Sector Z, but made much more compact. It's also been given a redesign based off Star Fox Zero.


Sector Z could still work, though. Sector Z would most likely retain its Star Fox 64 design, so it's be visually different. It's also much larger than Corneria, so it's play differently, to some degree.

I think there's a chance we could see them both, but I wouldn't be surprised if we didn't.

 

[Dracyoshi]

What the hell is Flatzone X. And why don’t I know about it.

A combination of Flat Zone and Flat Zone 2 found in Smash 4-U. It features transformations from both stages.

 

[Billybae10K]

Okay, very late to the Pokemon Starter debate but...

Swampert > Sceptile > Greninja > Decidueye > Feraligatr > Typhlosion > Blaziken > Empoleon > Blastoise > Samurott > Incineroar > Serperior > Venusaur > Charizard > Emboar > Meganium >Torterra > Primarina > Infernape > Chesnaught > Delphox

Though admittedly if we're going by their first forms, my list would be fairly different.

Mudkip > Treecko > Bulbasaur > Charmander > Totodile > Turtwig > Oshawott > Froakie > Tepig > Rowlet > Squirtle > Cyndaquil > Snivy > Chespin > Popplio > Piplup > Torchic > Chimchar > Litten > Fennekin > Chikorita


Mudkip and Treecko's evolutionary lines for me, are my personal favourites, miles ahead of the others IMO.

 

[Murlough]

Then you should be glad to hear that Zeraora is most likely out of the running due to the timing of the project plan.

I know. The idea of it tilts me is all. I don't consider him a threat by any means.

 

[Omega Tyrant]

Dixie Kong is in this weird spot where she's too unique to be an echo fighter of Diddy but too similar to be worth developing as a full character. She might happen because of how popular she is, but I expect them to just add K. Rool instead. It's possible she'll be a semi-clone like Dr. Mario, but I don't see them adding another semi-clone for Ultimate when they seem to want to push them aside for echo fighters.

Ideally she would be a semi-clone and I'm sure she the majority would receive her well like that (I know there's some Dixie supporters who are very adamant that she can't be cloned off of Diddy in any way), but after Smash 4's push to have every newcomer be "super unique with a gimmick on top", I don't know if Sakurai will include a conventional semi-clone like Lucas again over a complete unique character, and if Sakurai wanted her in as an easy character, I can just see Sakurai throwing her in as a Diddy Echo to get her in for dirt cheap (normally would be impossible because of the tail, but Diddy's tail jab been replaced and his only other tail move is an easily replaceable edge getup attack).

 

[Wintermelon43]

I really hope Poke Floats and Fountain of Dreams make in it. I never played Melee, but both of them seem like really cool stages.

 

[RandomAce]

A combination of Flat Zone and Flat Zone 2 found in Smash 4-U. It features transformations from both stages.

Ohhh! I remember that. Is it also in the 3DS version?

 

[Dracyoshi]

Ohhh! I remember that. Is it also in the 3DS version?

Nope, just a vanilla Flat Zone 2.

 

[Opossum]

What the hell is Flatzone X. And why don’t I know about it.


RIP Pokefloats and Fountain of Dreams.

It was the Wii U Game and Watch stage that took elements from both previous Flatzones.

 

[L9999]

Such a shame. Yoshi is objectively a better character than what came before but every single mechanic in Smash 4 worked against him...

https://youtu.be/piYLq0ZnKCU

Boi, was not . Every problem he had was on his own. Awful grab, awful throws, and an abysmal lack of kill setups. ripping him to shreds was not a good trait either.

 

[Wyoming]

Sector Z would be the ultimate 8 player Smash stage and it's fun for casual doubles.

Corneria's smaller and the better FFA casual stage. Both are distinct enough to work together.

If I had to guess cuts:

Miiverse - be very surprised if it comes back. It's a Battlefield clone and we now have Battlefield forms. It's gimmick cannot be replicated to make it stand out, nor was it a good idea to start with.
Flat Zone 1/2 - kind of hope it's 2 that goes, but one of them is definitely canned.
Rumble Falls - ok I just hope it is, but since DK could get a new stage and Hijinx is better it makes sense to remove a DK stage.
Rainbow Road - got a Mario Kart 8 stage that is similar in function
Mushroom Kingdom 1/2 - would prefer 64's but I think one being cut is definitely possible.
Mute City/Mute City GBA - same function. Hoping it is the Melee one that stays.
Icicle Mountain - it's a terrible stage that looked like it was shipped in beta stage. Can't see that coming back.

The rest have a 50/50 shot imo. Zebes, Kongo Jungle and Sector Z have a spiritual successor but that's not stopping Yoshi's Island....twice.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I hope that Mushroomy Kingdom isn't the sole SMB1 representation in Stages. The gimmick is cool but I want a pixel version too. I hope that the N64 version gets another shake.

 

[Opossum]

Conspiracy time. What if Pirate Ship doesn't come back and we get Gangplank Galleon? :thinking:


Or we get Novis Seaway because boat maps.

 

[Dracyoshi]

I hope that Mushroomy Kingdom isn't the sole SMB1 representation in Stages. The gimmick is cool but I want a pixel version too. I hope that the N64 version gets another shake.

We're getting Super Mario Maker, which features an 8-bit SMB1 aesthetic. Close enough?

 

[Blargg888]

I hope we get Fountain, Delfino, Pirate Ship, KJ64, Big BF, and Peach's Castle 64 back.
Not only are some of those stages popular, they're all also some of my personal favorites.

 

[Koopaul]

but I don't see them adding another semi-clone for Ultimate when they seem to want to push them aside for echo fighters.

Says who? You're acting like echo fighters are this hot new thing that will be heavily focused on in Ultimate. We don't know that. All we know is that the characters Dark Pit and Lucina are now branded as Echo Fighters and that they made one for Daisy. We don't even know if there's going to be any more echo fighters than that!

 

[Dracyoshi]

Says who? You're acting like echo fighters are this hot new thing that will be heavily focused on in Ultimate. We don't know that. All we know is that the characters Dark Pit and Lucina are now branded as Echo Fighters and that they made one for Daisy. We don't even know if there's going to be any more echo fighters than that!

I'm not saying that with certainty! It's just an assumption, but it seems likely to me that they'll do so. And I'm doubtful there won't be more echo fighters announced.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

If we're not getting every stage in the base game, I at least hope we get the remaining stages as DLC.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Says who? You're acting like echo fighters are this hot new thing that will be heavily focused on in Ultimate. We don't know that. All we know is that the characters Dark Pit and Lucina are now branded as Echo Fighters and that they made one for Daisy. We don't even know if there's going to be any more echo fighters than that!

The wording in the English version seemed to say to me that there'd be at least one more after her but A. Translation has screwed us over before, B. I could be reading into it too much.

 

[Koopaul]

I'm assuming there will be more echo fighters too. But that's no reason to assume that semi-clones are gone.

 

[L9999]

Conspiracy theory! The Echo brand was made as a way to justify Lucina and Dark Pit returning, and Daisy was revealed to legitimize it as a thing, but in reality there are no plans for more echo fighters! It was all a trick to dispell the flood of hate for clones.

 

[CJ Falcon]

I'm assuming there will be more echo fighters too. But that's no reason to assume that semi-clones are gone.

There were no new semi-clones is Smash 4 so I wouldn't count on it.

 

[92MilesPrower]

I've been seeing people debating about the best starter Pokémon, and this will be the only input I have:

 

[SlickWylde]

Interesting, Would be a good time for a reveal but I'm not sure Nintendo would show up themselves unless they're really pushing for this one to be an eSport.

Though if another Street Fighter character is in...

(This isn't calling you out, just reminded me)
This reminds me too much of Sm4sh speculation. Nintendo rarely reveals anything Smash related at any kind of events, except for Directs and E3. We need to temper our expectations this time. Let's not make the same mistakes as last time!

 

[AlphaSSB]

I'm not expecting anymore than two additional Echo fighters.

Although they are last-minute additions, Sakurai knows that aren't very well-liked. Just look at the negative reception towards Dark Pit and Lucina.

 

[KMDP]

Conspiracy theory! The Echo brand was made as a way to justify Lucina and Dark Pit returning, and Daisy was revealed to legitimize it as a thing, but in reality there are no plans for more echo fighters! It was all a trick to dispell the flood of hate for clones.

The only extra Echo Fighter I can see 100% is Ken Masters (and even then he could also be a Semi-Clone). So I agree with you.

 

[RandomAce]

I really want Mute City 3DS to return. I love that stage!

 

[Ivander]

Heihachi would be much better than another SF character.

Despite not being a fan of Tekken, part of me wants Heihachi for a number of reasons:
-Link vs Heihachi, just make up for no Soul Calibur II on Wii U or Switch.
-Ryu vs Heihachi, just to give us a Street Fighter X Tekken that's actually good.
-Heihachi was part of Playstation All-Stars. If he gets in Smash, we can actually have the opportunity of Snake vs Cloud vs Heihachi that was missed. Extra points if Crash Bandicoot gets in for Nintendo Smash Bros vs Playstation All-Stars.

 

[greenluigiman2]

People should probably treat the old veterans returning as newcomers for all intent and purposes. Same thing as Clones/Echoes.

If you're looking for 16-18 newcomers, you need to take Squirtle, Ivysaur, Pichu, Wolf, Ice Climbers, Snake, Young Link, Daisy, Ridley and Inkling into account. That leaves you with 7-9 more characters with some of that number being Echo Fighters. At Best.

Completely disagree. Newcomers are newcomers. There's a reason Sakurai is emphasizing the order that each character joined the series. He's making it very clear that characters like Ice Climbers and Snake are "BACK" and they have the exact same movesets and animations (pretty much) as before, so work on them takes nowhere near as much as work on a newcomer does. He even made the echo fighter distinction this time around which actually somewhat negates Dark Pit and Lucina as Smash 4 newcomers.

That said, I'd be completely content with only getting 7-9 true newcomers (meaning not echo fighters).

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Despite not being a fan of Tekken, part of me wants Heihachi for a number of reasons:
-Link vs Heihachi, just make up for no Soul Calibur II on Wii U or Switch.
-Ryu vs Heihachi, just to give us a Street Fighter X Tekken that's actually good.
-Heihachi was part of Playstation All-Stars. If he gets in Smash, we can actually have the opportunity of Snake vs Cloud vs Heihachi that was missed. Extra points if Crash Bandicoot gets in for Nintendo Smash Bros vs Playstation All-Stars.

Plus Bandai Namco are helping with Ultimate. They'd be remiss not to put him in there, especially after Pac-Man went over so well with the fanbase.

 

[Dracyoshi]

Well, since everyone is doing it:

A: Charizard, Swampert, Sceptile, Greninja, Blastoise
B: Primarina, Decidueye, Feraligatr, Empoleon, Samurott, Meganium, Torterra, Venusaur
C: Emboar, Delphox, Serperior, Typhlosion
D: Blaziken, Incineroar, Infernape
E: Chesnaught
F: None

Here's my rough ranking. I like almost every starter's final form so I don't even have an F tier.
The fire/fighting Pokemon didn't fare well.

 

[CommanderZaktan]

What the hell is Flatzone X. And why don’t I know about it.

Have you played Smash 4? X is a combination of both stages.

 

[RandomAce]

Have you played Smash 4? X is a combination of both stages.

Of course! I have Smash 3DS tho, not the Wii U version.

Oh and since I’m late to the Favorite Starter thing:

S: Sceptile, Decidueye, Charizard, Greninja
A: Blastoise, Swampurt, Primerina, Samurott, Blaziken, Arcadack?
C: Incenroar

I forgot about all the other starters, so they are probably in C after Incenroar, D and below.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I'm thinking that Pac-Maze and Windy Hill may be on the chopping block so each 3rd party has one stage.

Hope I'm wrong...

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I'm thinking that Pac-Maze and Windy Hill may be on the chopping block so each 3rd party has one stage.

Hope I'm wrong...

I hope you're wrong about at least Pac-Maze.

It's the one good Pac-Man stage, dammit

 

[KMDP]

(This isn't calling you out, just reminded me)
This reminds me too much of Sm4sh speculation. Nintendo rarely reveals anything Smash related at any kind of events, except for Directs and E3. We need to temper our expectations this time. Let's not make the same mistakes as last time!

Hmm... while I definitely agree with you, another factor to consider is that Nintendo have definitely changed their business practices somewhat since the last Smash Game's release. So, really, it could go either way.
I'll keep what you said in mind, though...

 

[Starbound]

Starter tiers:

S: Blaziken
A: Meganium, Empoleon
B: Delphox, Venusaur, Seperior, Greninja, Decidueye
C: Incineroar, Blastoise, Infernape, Samurott
D: Primarina, Chesnaught, Torterra, Feraligatr
E: Typhlosion, Charizard, Sceptile, Swampert, Emboar

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Everyone is Here...we need to have Every Stage Here

 

[Jedisupersonic]

Plus Bandai Namco are helping with Ultimate. They'd be remiss not to put him in there, especially after Pac-Man went over so well with the fanbase.

The Tales fanbase wants a character too, Namco honestly has a lot of choices if Sakurai and them decide on a 2nd.

 

[KMDP]

Plus Bandai Namco are helping with Ultimate. They'd be remiss not to put him in there, especially after Pac-Man went over so well with the fanbase.

Potential fighters from Bandai Namco (besides, naturally, Pac-Man):

• Heihachi (because Heihachi is usually their go-to crossover guy)
• Nightmare (because he's Team Soul's mascot, and Link appeared in SCII)
• Agumon (for that Pokémon vs. Digimon nostalgia)

That's how I see it.