Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[92MilesPrower]

*AUX CALL PUSH SELECT*

Snake: Otacon, what's with this guy? He looks, acts, and sounds just like Pit, but... edgier...
Otacon: That, Snake, is Dark Pit, an evil clone of Pit created by the Mirror of Truth. His personality is made entirely of Pit's repressed thoughts and feelings, and is far more aggressive than the original Pit. He also uses similar weapons and abilities as the original, so he basically has the same strengths and weaknesses.
Snake: So he's an evil clone... sounds familiar, right?
Otacon: Snake, you and I both know very well that Les Enfants Terribles is nothing like the Mirror of Truth, and you're also a clone too!
Snake: And yet Liquid is still the evil one, not me. Anything else that I need to know?
Otacon: No, just... do what you normally do.

 

[Graizen]

QUESTION:

If you could choose a Arc System Works Character to enter Super Smash Bros. Ultimate, which character would you choose?

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Street Fighter 5 started out rough.

But it's been on a roll lately. The newcomers they've added to it have been great. The returning faces have been great and seeing how they've changed? Awesome.

Really it's just MvC: Infinite that is now that giant disappointment. And the sad thing is? You could easily do to it what they did to Street Fighter 5 and turn it around.

It's not gonna happen though.

 

[Troykv]

I keep thinking about all those zeroes Young Link got. People were straight up convinced Toon Link totally replaced him, like they were saying it would be impossible for them to coexist.
lol

Well, changing Adult Link that much gave to Young Link a reason to exists at least...

 

[MainJPW]

Oddest thing I haven't seen mentioned anywhere. Assist have air dodges?

As you can see, Knuckles has it at least:

Let me get this straight. From this video and others we can see that:

- Knuckles has a 3-hit neutral attack.
- A Homing Attack
- A Dash identical to Sonic
- Major Eruption (Burrows underground and launches with an uppercut)
- A Directional Air Dodge.

He's just a playable character lmao.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

feeling more like this time being smash ultimate and the fact ridley is playable and there was the smash ballot etc... its gonna be fan favorites and highly requested characters for the most part if not entirely. Sakurais had his fun with past rosters but i think he'll give us pretty close to whats expected, those last few very expected characters this time and call it a day. This one just feels like such a love letter to the fans already and with taking the time to get everyone back it just seems like if he had some wacky character up his sleeve he wouldnt be prioritizing the cut veterans and stuff. he care what we want and not how he can trick and surprise us...beyond the surprise of actually getting what the majority wants.

I agree with this! Although I want to clarify I don't mean random or wacky, just surprising. Something like an unsuspected Alolan Pokemon, a champion, Pauline etc. I wouldn't call these wacky, just not what people expect.

I keep thinking about all those zeroes Young Link got. People were straight up convinced Toon Link totally replaced him, like they were saying it would be impossible for them to coexist.
lol

Perfect example, because I was definitely one of those people XD.

 

[Will]

QUESTION:

If you could choose a Arc System Works Character to enter Super Smash Bros. Ultimate, which character would you choose?

Sol Badguy is the big boy of the series, but Ragna is also something to consider I guess? I don't think Nintendo wants to put its hands on something thats literally named Bloodedge.

 

[zeldasmash]

Capcom COULD be starting their redemption arc though.

Mega Man 11
Monster Hunter World
RE 2 Remake and people like RE7.
DMC5

It's just their fighting game division that's lacking.



Not enough until we get Wonderful 101 I guess.

Okami getting re-released for modern consoles was a good move on their part and Street Fighter V: Arcade Edition is a MASSIVE upgrade from vanilla SFV.

Now if only Marvel vs. Capcom: Infinite got the same treatment...the gameplay is so good in that game.

 

[Will]

As you can see, Knuckles has it at least:

Let me get this straight. From this video and others we can see that:

- Knuckles has a 3-hit neutral attack.
- A Homing Attack
- A Dash identical to Sonic
- Major Eruption (Burrows underground and launches with an uppercut)
- A Directional Air Dodge.

He's just a playable character lmao.

"Mr. Sakurai, Knuckles isn't finished and E3 is getting close! What do we do?"
"lmao make him an assist trophy or something"

 

[CWCPT00]

If they’re doing this whole newcomer a month thing, then this is what I would like to see;

July: Captain Toad (his game comes out that month and would make sense from a promotion stand point).

August: Dixie Kong

September: Elma

October: Simon Belmont

November: Bandana Waddle Dee

December: Chorus Kids

 

[Knight Dude]

Okami getting re-released for modern consoles was a good move on their part and Street Fighter V: Arcade Edition is a MASSIVE upgrade from vanilla SFV.

Now if only Marvel vs. Capcom: Infinite got the same treatment...

Yeah I know. I'd be so happy to get Wolverine, Storm, Magneto and Deadpool back.

Also for them to finally add Green Goblin and Carnage to a Marvel Fighting game too.

QUESTION:

If you could choose a Arc System Works Character to enter Super Smash Bros. Ultimate, which character would you choose?

Sol Badguy I guess. He could be really fun, and probably busted. But I don't think Guilty Gear is really well known enough for people here to be in a crossover like this, especially since most of the GG games are more associated with Sony systems.

 

[staindgrey]

Street Fighter 5 started out rough.

But it's been on a roll lately. The newcomers they've added to it have been great. The returning faces have been great and seeing how they've changed? Awesome.

Really it's just MvC: Infinite that is now that giant disappointment. And the sad thing is? You could easily do to it what they did to Street Fighter 5 and turn it around.

It's not gonna happen though.

The mechanics in MvCI made for a really fun fighting game, like SFV when it started out rough. But you're right. I think Capcom's content with just letting that ship sink.

In all honesty, I hope that game's failure leads to a Capcom vs. Something Else. Tatsunoko made for a great game, and the SNK games were fun. I'd rather see something totally new in a similar system to MvCI that won't get the same immediate scrutiny that a MvC game would get.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Completely unrelated to the current topic, but I don't like this new trend of people writing Dixie off as an Echo Fighter just so we can get K. Rool as a unique newcomer.

Honestly, I'd rather get only one of the two as a unique character and wait until the next Smash game for the next. Both characters deserve to be unique, and I don't want people rushing Dixie Kong just so they can say, "Okay, Dixie's in Smash! It's K. Rool's turn now!"

THANK YOU! Dismissing Dixie as a Echo is the opposite of fan service. And people love to compare her to Daisy, but ignore that Daisy literally had NOTHING to work with besides "flowery theme", well she got that, but as a Peach-expy. Which is what she always was in the Mario cameo games anyway.

Not in the slighest comparable to Dixie in any shape or form. And am tired of the arguement so won't even defend it.

She could be a semi-clone yes, but her being even less different than Pichu, Y.Link, Dr.Mario and the like is straight up offensive. If they aren't Echoes, neither should Dixie Kong.

A semi-clone as Dixie and a unique newcomer as King K.Rool is what DKC deserves as a franchise. Even adding Funky Kong as a straight up Echo wouldn't be a bad move. 5 characters is still considerably tame, especially since Diddy's inclusion in Brawl was always stated as a late addition even by Sakurai himself.

Let me guess. Mimikyu?

I gave the little raggedy sheet a zero too, but I guess I can relate to your feelings. No one gives the Champions the time of day, and I'd be ecstatic to see one get in Smash just so I can smugly sit back and watch everyone complain that Impa or Skull kid didn't get in first.

Champions are slightly underrated yes. But I am still not expecting them. Even if, Urbosa seems most fitting, but Daruk would probably be the most unique due to being a super heavy. I'd love either honestly, but am warming up to all of the Champions as I've been playing BotW excessively.

Not that I don't think that Impa shouldn't be in; as she really should. And I think she's easily the most likely choice with considerable support and she would be relatively easy to add. There's not a whole lot stopping here, especially since they went as far as to include DAISY! That means that there are probably more Echo Fighters coming than we'll expect.

With Daisy as a Echo Fighter, there's really no solid reason to exclude Impa at this given point. Even if she's not a Echo, building her up from assets from Sheik's, Ike's, Cloud's or even Greninja's movesets wouldn't really be much of a challenge anyway (depending on what version of Impa they use of course). That's a positive side on having so many characters. They even resured assets of other characters for buiding up Corrin, Bayonetta and Cloud as stated by Sakurai (Marth, ZSS and Ike respectively).

Unique newcomers that require a lot of programming as say, Inkling, Ridley and now the predictive part; King K.Rool, Isaac, Elma / Rex & Pyra, Skull Kid or the Champions. Which makes me think that unique newcomers won't be a priority, and would be added with the ballot. Yet, the term Echo shouldn't be slammed on just each and every character.

 

[MBRedboy31]

As you can see, Knuckles has it at least:

Let me get this straight. From this video and others we can see that:

- Knuckles has a 3-hit neutral attack.
- A Homing Attack
- A Dash identical to Sonic
- Major Eruption (Burrows underground and launches with an uppercut)
- A Directional Air Dodge.

He's just a playable character lmao.

What if they added a side mode where we can play as the AT’s that function similarly to characters? Of course, they don’t have full movesets and their movements aren’t as smooth, but it could be a fun diversion.

 

[StrangeMann]

Zero has listed his opinions on all smash ultimate characters he could in a roughly 2 hour video

Interesting if you have some spare time

 

[TMNTSSB4]

So. Do you think the large amount of Mario, Pokemon, Zelda and Fire Emblem veterans will prevent newcomers from those franchises?

Mario and Pokémon could get one more each...Zelda and FE 50/50

 

[Iridium]

This video by Shesez definitely shows interesting detail to certain characters who have appeared in Smash (specifically those new and returning to Smash, except for Inklings).

 

[staindgrey]

What if they added a side mode where we can play as the AT’s that function similarly to characters? Of course, they don’t have full movesets and their movements aren’t as smooth, but it could be a fun diversion.

I actually think this idea of expanded movesets for ATs is hinting at single player modes. Think about how various Smash games try to put you in a situation that alludes to other games the roster is from (like Pikachu having a Pokemon battle with Jigglypuff).

Now imagine using simple AI assist trophies to expand the possibilities of those scenarios without getting redundant. Knuckles could assist Sonic on the GHZ stage, for example. Or Mario and Luigi fight Wario and Waluigi. Or Samus has to fight Fox, Falco, Wolf and Krystal all at once.

By making the character do more than a normal AT, they could remove the "AT" part and temporarily make them a character like any other within a set single player scenario. That would be pretty cool. (And the modding community will have a heyday with it.)

 

[Lattenzo]

peach has a new down tilt. u can see it in her trailer

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

If they’re doing this whole a newcomer a month thing, then this is what I would like to see;

July: Captain Toad (his game comes out that month and would make sense from a promotion stand point).

August: Dixie Kong

September: Elma

October: Simon Belmont

November: Bandana Waddle Dee

December: Chorus Kids

That would likely mean no secret newcomers though, I'd like at least a couple

Completely unrelated to the current topic, but I don't like this new trend of people writing Dixie off as an Echo Fighter just so we can get K. Rool as a unique newcomer.

Honestly, I'd rather get only one of the two as a unique character and wait until the next Smash game for the next. Both characters deserve to be unique, and I don't want people rushing Dixie Kong just so they can say, "Okay, Dixie's in Smash! It's K. Rool's turn now!"



Let me guess. Mimikyu?

I gave the little raggedy sheet a zero too, but I guess I can relate to your feelings. No one gives the Champions the time of day, and I'd be ecstatic to see one get in Smash just so I can smugly sit back and watch everyone complain that Impa or Skull kid didn't get in first.

Thisssss, Dixie is just as deserving of being included as a unique character as K Rool is and I'd be straight up mad and offended if she were to be included as an echo character, even a semi-clone doesn't quite sit well with me tbh, just because she looks like diddy in body type doesn't mean she would fight anything like he does. She's not comparable to a character like Daisy who has practically nothing to work with and is unimportant in her own series, Dixie has moveset potential, is popular, is relevant, and is a main character in her franchise, she should be her own character just as she is in the DKC games.

I would truly rather not have dixie at all than have her be a clone.

 

[Lady Byakugan]

Honestly, aside from a new UNIQUE zelda character, aside from Tingle, I wouldn't even care if all the other newcomers were echos.

 

[Ivander]

Correction NINTENDO modern era is great. these other companies are lacking. thats why they keep doing remakes and remasters.....

For one, Nintendo has done quite a bunch of remakes too. Nintendo is not exempt from that. And two, remakes and remasters aren't necessarily a bad thing.

 

[SuperMasterHand]

And as another stated, me, they could just disable the Waluigi trophy for eight player OR have the Waluigi trophy use one of the unused Palettes. Or as someone else suggested just disable the trophy summon for Waluigi when there is a playable Waluigi in the game.

"Calm down" Yeah, ok random guy on the internet who is completely incapable of figuring out how I am irl while typing this. I'm a ranter. That doesn't mean I'm keyboarding away in anger. I just type alot. Do me a solid and look up why assuming is wrong instead of telling strangers on the internet what to do.

What we are IRL doesn't matter at this point. The thing I told you to do is to not say I ignored you on purpose since i didn't talked to you before, so there is a misunderstanding

Talking about Waluigi being disabled as an At is just taking the problem on the wrong side
Why would sakurai put him in assist trophy in the first place then?

I think what happened to Ridley for Smash 5 could happen for Waluigi but only in another Smash
Otherwise Sakurai could have put Ridley as DLC in Smash 4 and disable Hazard Ridley right ?

People have to accept that if a character is choosen for a specific fonction in smash, it's almost garantee he won't do another, especially something as important as a character, it's just that he was not selected to be playable, that's it

 

[DLEAF]

What we are IRL doesn't matter at this point. The thing I told you to do is to not say I ignored you on purpose since i didn't talked to you before, so there is a misunderstanding

Talking about Waluigi being disabled as an At is just taking the problem on the wrong side
Why would sakurai put him in assist trophy in the first place then?

I think what happened to Ridley for Smash 5 could happen for Waluigi but only in another Smash
Otherwise Sakurai could have put Ridley as DLC in Smash 4 and disable Hazard Ridley right ?

People have to accept that if a character is choosen for a specific fonction in smash, it's almost garantee he won't do another, especially something as important as a character, it's just that he was not selected to be playable, that's it

I mean, if Alpharad says it's still a possibility, I will continue to have hope, no matter how naive it may be.

 

[Will]

That would likely mean no secret newcomers though, I'd like at least a couple

Bowser Jr. and Duck Hunt weren't really ever "secret" because of that amazing leak that happened for the 3DS version.
Shulk being Little Mac is still the funniest thing to me.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Bowser Jr. and Duck Hunt weren't really ever "secret" because of that amazing leak that happened for the 3DS version.
Shulk being Little Mac is still the funniest thing to me.

They were meant to be secret though. I'd expect two "secret" characters this time around too.

 

[SuperMasterHand]

I mean, if Alpharad says it's still a possibility, I will continue to have hope, no matter how naive it may be.

I was naive and had hope during the Ridley Shadow days and we all know how it ended up in 2014
Just don't make yourself be desapointed when the game comes out.

 

[Will]

They were meant to be secret though. I'd expect two "secret" characters this time around too.

We'll see if another leak doesn't happen like that, then.

 

[MopedOfJustice]

peach has a new down tilt. uu can see it in her trailer

Do we have footage of what Daisy's down tilt is? I'd assume it's identical to Peach's, but it seems like they've been changing up a bunch of moves to differentiate non-echo clones, so it seems like they could easily have kept it since this stuff is being ported anyway.

 

[MBRedboy31]

We'll see if another leak doesn't happen like that, then.

Even if a leak quite like that doesn’t happen, someone, somewhere, most likely will break street date and so they’ll be leaked.

 

[SonicMario]

I mean, if Alpharad says it's still a possibility, I will continue to have hope, no matter how naive it may be.

Alpha seemed to be pretty tongue-in-cheek about it though, he doesn't care if Waluigi makes it. He said in the video that he might even lean towards being glad Waluigi isn't playable. He also mentioned one reason he brought it up is getting Waluigi fans hope a 2nd time only to be crushed once again, heh.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

We'll see if another leak doesn't happen like that, then.

There likely will be.

Comes with the territory of Smash Speculation.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

As you can see, Knuckles has it at least:



Let me get this straight. From this video and others we can see that:

- Knuckles has a 3-hit neutral attack.
- A Homing Attack
- A Dash identical to Sonic
- Major Eruption (Burrows underground and launches with an uppercut)
- A Directional Air Dodge.

He's just a playable character lmao.

imagine if someone leaked an image of knuckles getting punched or air dodging before E3

 

[Dandelionel]

Do we have footage of what Daisy's down tilt is? I'd assume it's identical to Peach's, but it seems like they've been changing up a bunch of moves to differentiate non-echo clones, so it seems like they could easily have kept it since this stuff is being ported anyway.

She can't have Peach's old down tilt because it would go against the basic philosophy of echo fighters that is "You have the same moves except that their properties vary"

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Sakurai increased Toad in Peach's moveset for a reason.

And I don't think it bodes well for a playable Toad of any variety.

It literally screams ''See now he's actively fighting in the battle with her!"

 

[Idon]

Toad is like the good guy variant of a Goomba.

And who wants to play as a goomba in Smash?

 

[staindgrey]

They were meant to be secret though. I'd expect two "secret" characters this time around too.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to remember Brawl also having two secret characters up until release, and the community was speculating what those last two roster spots could be until they were leaked by Japanese players who got the game sooner than we did. One of them was Wolf, the other was... Jigglypuff...?

Do we have footage of what Daisy's down tilt is? I'd assume it's identical to Peach's, but it seems like they've been changing up a bunch of moves to differentiate non-echo clones, so it seems like they could easily have kept it since this stuff is being ported anyway.

Since she wasn't playable at E3, the short trailer on the Smash Dojo and the E3 reveal trailer are the only footage we have so far.

 

[Kabutops]

Crash is a Sony character is the worst argument I hear people use. He is not owned by Sony. He has 6 Nintendo exclusive games, so he holds great history with Nintendo.

That and Sony never gave a crap about Crash. They just needed a mascot to sell consoles. Sonybros need to come off it already. I realize the Sony aura from the glorious PS1 days can't be disentangled from Crash, but you have to accept that he's not Sony's guy anymore. He didn't even get into PSASBR and it's not getting a sequel either. Let it go.

 

[Slavic]

Toad is like the good guy variant of a Goomba.

And who wants to play as a goomba in Smash?

No, no one wants to play as a Goomba, I say, shoving Super Mario Party under my bed hastily

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Toad is like the good guy variant of a Goomba.

And who wants to play as a goomba in Smash?

Me

I actually think this idea of expanded movesets for ATs is hinting at single player modes. Think about how various Smash games try to put you in a situation that alludes to other games the roster is from (like Pikachu having a Pokemon battle with Jigglypuff).

Now imagine using simple AI assist trophies to expand the possibilities of those scenarios without getting redundant. Knuckles could assist Sonic on the GHZ stage, for example. Or Mario and Luigi fight Wario and Waluigi. Or Samus has to fight Fox, Falco, Wolf and Krystal all at once.

By making the character do more than a normal AT, they could remove the "AT" part and temporarily make them a character like any other within a set single player scenario. That would be pretty cool. (And the modding community will have a heyday with it.)

It would be the closest I get to playing as/against Lyn...and it sounds cool