Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[ThreeT]

Look, I'll be real. This whole debate on whether Elma or Rex will be the next Xenoblade Rep is getting tedious and repetitive. We're just talking about the same stuff. We can't decide who will the next rep with certainty so there is no reason to keep arguing about it back and forth. Only time will tell who is the next character is. We will probably discuss these character later anyway so I think its a good time to change this discussion.

 

[osby]

Oh god the Waluigi theory. I was one of those that thought there might be something more to the Pyrosphere Ridley shadow. I think Waluigi fans should take it from Ridley fans to not create such theories. That was not a fun time.

And it's weird, since they act like Waluigi is the only popular, disconfirmed character.

 

[DYED]

And it's weird, since they act like Waluigi is the only popular, disconfirmed character.

*sniff*
Midna ... My beautiful, beautiful Midna ...
Also Lyn.

 

[Idon]

*sniff*
Midna ... My beautiful, beautiful Midna ...
Also Lyn.

Fifteen years and counting, baby.

 

[DarkFalcon]

And it's weird, since they act like Waluigi is the only popular, disconfirmed character.

Yea. A LOT of popular characters were shown off in rapid succession as Assist Trophies. I think that was Sakurai's main way of not stringing fans along and showing who didn't make playable status right away.

Of course there's some notable Assist Trophies MIA that have popularity that makes you think, but it was also not the full build. I'm just glad my girl Ashley survived the first wave.

 

[Slavic]

Yea. A LOT of popular characters were shown off in rapid succession as Assist Trophies. I think that was Sakurai's main way of not stringing fans along and showing who didn't make playable status right away.

Of course there's some notable Assist Trophies MIA that have popularity that makes you think, but it was also not the full build. I'm just glad my girl Ashley survived the first wave.

Still hope for my playable Helirin

 

[MBRedboy31]

New main icons? That’s cool to see, but... how does one pick a main for a game that isn’t out, such that we can’t see if our anticipated mains are actually fun to play as or not?

Oh yeah, I saw the Waluigi theory... that is kinda weird that Waluigi wasn’t in the demo, but, at the same time, they had tons of stages and characters not in the demo, so, withholding an AT isn’t so weird.
(Announcing a character already confirmed as an AT to instead be playable would be the ultimate troll, though, and would be make future speculation so hard since we wouldn’t be able to trust anything anymore, ahaha...)

 

[Idon]

New main icons? That’s cool to see, but... how does one pick a main for a game that isn’t out, such that we can’t see if our anticipated mains are actually fun to play as or not?

Oh yeah, I saw the Waluigi theory... that is kinda weird that Waluigi wasn’t in the demo, but, at the same time, they had tons of stages and characters not in the demo, so, withholding an AT isn’t so weird.
(Announcing a character already confirmed as an AT to instead be playable would be the ultimate troll, though, and would be make future speculation so hard since we wouldn’t be able to trust anything anymore, ahaha...)

Well some people's character loyalties expand across games.
They're usually more invested in the character themselves than the gameplay they exhibit and will probably use the same character regardless.

 

[PlayerOneTyler]

New main icons? That’s cool to see, but... how does one pick a main for a game that isn’t out, such that we can’t see if our anticipated mains are actually fun to play as or not?

Well, I played the demo at E3, so I get a pass, right?

 

[P.Kat]

So, this game is called; "Super Smash Bros Ultimate"

Now, what would define Ultimate for you?
I'll give some rules for this game.

You are to add up to "10" Nintendo characters/first n' seond party characters.
And you can have up to "5" 3rd parties.

Now, it's to personalize what would for "you" make the Smash from where it currently is, to the "Ultimate".
Which characters are left, who are realizable still that is.

I'll write mine, but in the mean time, I'd love to hear from your perspectives.
Try to reason why they'd be a good fit to make it your ultimate.

This probably late but:
1st Party.
Lyn: One of the most Popular FE character with a unique and swift Iaido/eastern swordstyle

Krystal: A telepathic staff wielder that can use powerful elemental attacks, plus Star Fox could use more representation

Lycanroc:: A unique and popular Rock type Pokémon that has one of the best chances of a few Pokémon to make it to this game.

Gardevoir: A graceful yet powerful Psychic type Pokémon that's one of the more popular among Pokémon, having been in the anime, and movies a couple of times

Zeraora: The last and newest of the Gen VII Pokémon it has a sleek look, it's combat ready look, and unique way of drawing electricity from nature instead of producing its own would make it fun to play.

Celica: Her use of magic and swordplay would be different from Robin, and would be welcomed in Smash.

Impa: The most likely newcomer using a unique blend of water and shadow magic to defeat enemies. Also GIANT BLADE OF DOOM, and a Naginata that can summon a fire dragon.

Fi: She would be unique pick due to her elegant fighting style and her ability to transform into a blade.

Elma: Xenoblade could always use more representation and who better than one can wield dual blades and guns as well as pilot a mech suit.

Rex & Pyra: Another rep for Xenoblade that would make their to Smash easily with their various arts blade combos and teamwork.

3rd party

Shantae: A Genie with long and deep history with Nintendo and a company that wants to she her in Smash (they even made pallet skins for her). With her swift and powerful hair combat ,powers of transformation and various Genie abilities there's tons of fun to be had In defeating enemies with Shantae.

Sora: Who better than a world traveling, dimension hopping, famous Adventure/Keyblade Warrior to join Smash from another world? And when you have impressive sword skills, speed, gliding, flight, healing abilities, dual blades, can slash through a Skyscraper multiple times in one cut, different forms, elemental magic, and magic that can reflect attacks, wield magnetism, manipulate gravity, and slow down, or completely stop time, you're ... completely overqualified to join Smash (but considering we have OP Pokémon, angels, witches and goddesses I guess you'd be at their playing level). NEXT!

Rayman: A iconic 3rd party character that like Shantae, has a company with a good relationship with Nintendo to the point they're asking for Rayman to join Smash, and for good reason it can't be Ultimate with out Rayman.

Kat: From the world of Gravity Rush, Kat and her loyal... cat Dusty come to turn the competition on its head with her powers over gravity. With her powers, Smash can easily dwell into a gravity mechanic deeper than what Rosalina brought with her Down Special.

Amaterasu: This 3rd party character from has really grown on me. The more I remember her the more I want her as a 3rd party newcomer. Her game Okami came out on the Gamecube and Wii and will be coming out on the Switch in HD August 9 of this year which could potentially set her up to join Smash through a character reveal. She controls 4 different weapons giving her a variety of unique moves.

A reflector on her back that can be use offensively and defensively, Rosary Beads around her neck that acts like a whip, and can also act like bullets to shoot enemies from a distance, a giant blade on her back to carve enemies to pieces, and finally a Celestial Brush that uses ink to attack and cut enemies as well as to create objects and obstacles making the usage of ink different from the Inklings. If they are any doubt of how this quadruped wolf can fight, the two videos below should give you an idea of how she'd fight in Smash.

Spoiler: Amaterasu gameplay MvC3

 

[Skyblade12]

There’s a difference between silent protagonists and avatars. Outside of a few “Hyah!” and “HUYAHH!”s Link is a silent protagonist. (Also, doesn’t WFT narrate/talk a ton in Wii Fit?) Avatars are self-insert characters, meant to have as little personality and development as possible to include more people projecting themselves into them. When these flat as cardboard characters are shoved into a game/franchise that focus on interactions and a character-driven story, that’s when people people have a problem with silent protagonists and by extension avatars.

Interestingly enough, Robin's success may come from the fact that he's not a self-insert the way you describe. He has plenty of development and personality. Enough to make him the main character of the story.

 

[osby]

There’s a difference between silent protagonists and avatars. Outside of a few “Hyah!” and “HUYAHH!”s Link is a silent protagonist. (Also, doesn’t WFT narrate/talk a ton in Wii Fit?) Avatars are self-insert characters, meant to have as little personality and development as possible to include more people projecting themselves into them. When these flat as cardboard characters are shoved into a game/franchise that focus on interactions and a character-driven story, that’s when people people have a problem with silent protagonists and by extension avatars.

It was a joke.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

So what's the latest on vergeben? He's still just claiming 6 newcomers left and that Konami has an embargo lifting on Wednesday?

 

[papagenos]

This is an old topic from a few hours ago but I wanted to clear a few things up. There seems to be a lot of misinformation and miscommunication.

It does make sense for Chrom to be an Echo of Ike.

Canonically, Chrom taught himself how to fight and he taught Lucina that style. While Lucina is an ancestor of Marth, uses his identity briefly, and shares a lot of visual aspects with Marth, Lucina is the one out of character. It wouldn't be wrong for Chrom to fight like Ike because he's supposed to be like Lucina, Lucina is the one who is supposed to be like Chrom. Chrom -> Lucina, Chrom is the originator.

Take for example in Warriors, Chrom and Marth were their own characters with original movesets. When Intelligent Systems pushed to add Lucina late in development, who did they make her a clone of? Was it Marth, the character who she's already been a clone of? No, it was Chrom, because Lucina is supposed to be like Chrom. Chrom not being like Lucina doesn't hurt him because he is the one staying most true to canon in the scenario that he takes Ike's brash and aggressive style that Chrom himself is known for. And bashing Chrom by saying Chrom and Lucina's swords are supposed to be the same, that it would be weird if Chrom wielded it two-handedly? That's the canon, the Exalted Falchion and the Parallel Falchion are big two-handed swords. Lucina's Parallel Falchion was sized down to fit Marth's Falchion. "Aether is Ike's signature move, no one else can use it!"... When Aether is a signature skill of Chrom and Lucina? Even in this cutscene, while not exact, Chrom is basically doing "the Ike jump spinny move". (You also see that they are using their Falchions two-handedly)

A lot of confusion and controversy comes with how Awakening was designed, it was basically a last-ditch effort to include basically every design and mechanic in the series in one large final amalgamation of a game. Even Sakurai called it the "definitive Fire Emblem". Lucina sharing Marth's visual design, Chrom having a brash non-royalty style like Ike, Genealogy's 2nd generation, Rescue being turned into pair-up, being technically set in Archanea, and other references littered everywhere. Pretty much everything in Awakening is a mix and match of old archetypes to call back old games with new tropes to appeal to a new audience. Lots of Awakening is inherently not unique, lots of it is designed to be like old things, so that's why Chrom makes sense as an Echo of Ike.

Do I want Chrom in Smash? Not really, he and Awakening have had their time, and I don't care for him too much. Should he be in? Yeah, Chrom should be in. While it would be a bit disappointing that 3/7 of the characters would be from one game, it's pretty much already there. Chrom has an HD model for Robin's victory animations and Final Smash. The fan demand exists, FE is mostly Awakening and Fates now and Awakening was still relevant near the ballot (Fates didn't even exist.) Chrom must've placed highly to get a Mii Costume for consolation. Chrom as Ike works, just make Eruption have white flames to represent the titular Awakening or electricity (don't know about that yet from Awakening but I know he uses it a ton in Warriors.). We've already gone over Aether, Chrom has the skill and can perform a move close enough to it. If Echoes have minimal changes like no tipper and Electroshock/arrow trajectory, this could be where Chrom could be a bit different by having his Aether a straight jump without the sword throw and a bit more horizontal movement than vertical. Other than those minimal changes, slap Chrom onto an Ike skeleton model and you're good to go. We have reason to believe that there is space for Chrom, Ike's Chrom inspired color palette has been removed and Robin's origianl Final Smash and victory animations which featured Chrom are no where to be found. Chrom is definitely possible as an Ike Echo, and he should be at least suspected as one. I'll start a petition to add in the Blazing Sword trio once it gets a remake though.

thank you for this! I'm not a huge fire emblem fan and before getting "everyone is here" and "echo fighters" i actively did not want any fire emblem newcomers in this smash game but now i find myself thinking chrom is very very likely. in fact he is the ONLY unrevealed echo fighter on my prediction roster right now.

So i'm happy to read a very good explanation from someone with far more expertise on the series than myself for why chrom being an echo fighter fits him well, its good to hear and im definitely thinking it'll happen now.

 

[DYED]

Does Vergeben still talks about Simon Belmont, by the way?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Does Vergeben still talks about Simon Belmont, by the way?

Yep. Still banking on the guy hard.

So what's the latest on vergeben? He's still just claiming 6 newcomers left and that Konami has an embargo lifting on Wednesday?

Pretty much. Though "around half a dozen" was more his statement, so 5-6 left.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I still think he's piggybacking like a champ and got lucky.

But we'll see come Wednesday I suppose. Still doubtful someone could have handed him the whole roster amount either.

Every true leak is typically incomplete in this particular type of manner.

 

[Skyblade12]

I still think he's piggybacking like a champ and got lucky.

But we'll see come Wednesday I suppose. Still doubtful someone could have handed him the whole roster amount either.

Every true leak is typically incomplete in this particular type of manner.

I believe most of this. I'm pretty sure Vernob is fake. I'm pretty sure most leaks are fake, incomplete, and hopelessly wrong.

I'm still convinced that the final roster is going to suck. I don't care about hardly any of the characters that keep popping up on these fake leaks.

 

[DYED]

I still think he's piggybacking like a champ and got lucky.

But we'll see come Wednesday I suppose. Still doubtful someone could have handed him the whole roster amount either.

Every true leak is typically incomplete in this particular type of manner.

So, wait, did Vergeben say that we'll have news this Wednesday?
Or that he will reveal his leaks on Wednesday?

 

[Zinith]

I find it odd how Robin's Final Smash hasn't been revealed yet...

*hint hint*

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

So, wait, did Vergeben say that we'll have news this Wednesday?
Or that he will reveal his leaks on Wednesday?

The embargo on the supposed Castlevania content that Konami shows ends on Wednesday.

All it does is basically show if Verg is lying or not. He didn't specify the Wednesday thing, from what I remember.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

A lot of his claims rode on the Castlevania titles being revealed however.

They are so far missing in action.

The most telling thing about this however is?

Even if he gets this right. It doesn't really prove much. He could still be piggybacking. There have been murmurs about a new Castlevania coming way before he opened his mouth about his information.

 

[Deleted member]

I don't believe vergeben because of my "leaks are always bull****" mindset.
However, I do feel that Simon Belmont has a decent chance of getting in nonetheless.

 

[osby]

I find it odd how Robin's Final Smash hasn't been revealed yet...

*hint hint*

Palutena's Final Smash is same.
We got a Black Hole item.
Logical conclusion: There will be two Chroms.

 

[Skyblade12]

I feel as though if we get Simon Belmont, we'll get Rayman.
And if we get Rayman, we'll get Banjo.
And if we get Banjo, we'll get Crash.
And if we get Crash, we'll get Spyro.
And...

And pretty soon the entire roster is going to be filled with a bunch of third party characters I don't care about.

So, while Simon Belmont may have earned a place, I hope he never makes it in.

 

[Pakky]

I feel as though if we get Simon Belmont, we'll get Rayman.
And if we get Rayman, we'll get Banjo.
And if we get Banjo, we'll get Crash.
And if we get Crash, we'll get Spyro.
And...

And pretty soon the entire roster is going to be filled with a bunch of third party characters I don't care about.

So, while Simon Belmont may have earned a place, I hope he never makes it in.

Woah bro what's with the pessimism?

 

[papagenos]

I feel as though if we get Simon Belmont, we'll get Rayman.
And if we get Rayman, we'll get Banjo.
And if we get Banjo, we'll get Crash.
And if we get Crash, we'll get Spyro.
And...

And pretty soon the entire roster is going to be filled with a bunch of third party characters I don't care about.

So, while Simon Belmont may have earned a place, I hope he never makes it in.

Simon just feels like he should be here to me, same with banjo, growing up those WERE nintendo characters for me.

in the 80s/90s there was no distinction that konami was something separate or capcom owned megaman not nintendo etc... these were the nintendo games and so there are definitely a lot of the older fan base who sees these characters at home in smash. Rare was basically nintendo during the n64, i dont think i need to go over that at all.

with rayman/crash etc... i feel less inclined to actively want them in smash though im not against them. i do draw the line after pretty much those characters you just listed though, after that theres few third parties id really be O.K. with or feel right in a smash game.

I was once pretty against third parties, honestly i wasnt exactly happy when snake was revealed, just didnt feel right to me, but now that we have sonic/megaman/pacman im happy and if clouds in smash then the floodgate has already been opened so im not going to try and stop third parties, rather instead i think "filtering" them so belmont and banjo make it in instead of master chief and ezio is the right approach at this point.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

More like "what's with these fallacies?"

One 3rd party does not lead to another. It doesn't make sense. Rayman, Banjo, Crash, and Spyro have little to do with each other. Hell, Banjo isn't even in the same ballpark as iconicness as the rest, and is more of a smaller 3rd party that has a good amount of hype and want due to its hefty association with Nintendo. Which would make 'em a pretty cool ballot pick, honestly.

Simon leads to... maybe more Konami AT's? Yeah, that's kind of it(and that's ignoring obviously more music and a stage). That's really the only thing to honestly think about. Because that's the most logical.

 

[MBRedboy31]

Well some people's character loyalties expand across games.
They're usually more invested in the character themselves than the gameplay they exhibit and will probably use the same character regardless.

Is it weird that I let gameplay changes get in the way of what characters I main? I have some characters I’m a fan of, but, if the changes make them no longer feel fun (at least compared to other Smash games I’ve played, including fan projects,) then I’ll drop them. After all, the point of a game like this is to play as characters you like and to have fun, and, if you can’t have fun, then what’s the point?

And pretty soon the entire roster is going to be filled with a bunch of third party characters I don't care about.

To be fair, how do you know you don’t care about those characters until you’ve played as them in Smash? Their movesets may turn out to resonate well with your playstyle, perhaps even more so than characters you expected that you’d have more fun playing as. Or, even without playing as them, you will come to have more of an appreciation of them. At least some of that happened for me with characters such as Snake, personally.

 

[Autumn ♫]

So, this game is called; "Super Smash Bros Ultimate"

Now, what would define Ultimate for you?
I'll give some rules for this game.

You are to add up to "10" Nintendo characters/first n' seond party characters.
And you can have up to "5" 3rd parties.

Now, it's to personalize what would for "you" make the Smash from where it currently is, to the "Ultimate".
Which characters are left, who are realizable still that is.

I'll write mine, but in the mean time, I'd love to hear from your perspectives.
Try to reason why they'd be a good fit to make it your ultimate.

Super late, but I'll bite!

Hmm...

Spoiler

Dixie Kong- DK's one of the larger Nintendo franchises, so only having two characters is something massively needed to work on, and Dixie has a bunch of relevance to the DK and is probably the 3rd most important Kong.

King K. Rool- DK's main villain, and definitely one of my favorites. I don't think there's much to explain that others haven't.

Meowth- The last villain I really deserves to be in Smash after K. Rool. He's been the antithesis to Pikachu since the beginning of the anime, and continues to be extremely prominent. A cat playstyle hasn't been established in Smash either, making a really interesting new fighter.

Eevee- A pokemon being promoted as Pokemon's 2nd mascot now, Eevee has always had a lot of relevance in the franchise. Eevee's main gimmick, being evolution, already makes it much more unique than any other Pokemon, and evolution doesn't have much to show in Smash currently, so adding Eevee would definitely help with that.

Captain Toad- Toad is the last of the 5 main characters that originated in the original Super Mario Bros, and has continued to have roles in Mario. He also has been becoming more prominent thanks to the Captain Toad games, so I definitely think it's time to see him again.

Waluigi- Waluigi's popularity is pretty much what gets this. He's a super fun character as well, and definitely has plenty of potential with the sports games, and is incredibly recognizable. Let's have him in plz.

Paper Mario- While the series hasn't been going as strong, Paper Mario is the last Mario newcomer I can really think of to be added to Smash that really deserves it. Paper Mario is a large franchise and has a very unique moveset, so having him in would also be super fun too.

Impa- Zelda definitely deserves more characters, and Impa's the most prominent of the non triforce trio. She appears in a ton of games, and has a really unique moveset to add, having her naginata and water bending, while also using her skills from Skyward Sword.

Bandanna Dee- The 4th main Kirby character, who's been used a bunch in newer Kirby games, and has been having as much relevance as Meta Knight and King Dedede. I definitely think he deserves it in.

Elma/Nia- Xenoblade is becoming a larger franchise, and is heavily supported by Nintendo. I feel that Elma or Nia could both do fine as characters to show Xenoblade's success. As for why Nia instead of Rex? Simply because I like Nia a lot more.

3rd parties:

Slime- Dragon Quest is absolutely huge in Japan, enough to where there's a law that it can't be released on a weekday due to too many people skipping work to play it. Slime is also the most recognizable character in it, and definitely has moveset potential.

Jack Frost- SMT and Persona have become really popular games, and Jack Frost is the mascot of Atlus, the company who makes these games. Jack Frost is also used frequently for promotion reasons, both in game and outside of the game, so I definitely think he's an interesting addition. We also don't have nearly enough ice users in Smash.

Banjo & Kazooie- Relics from my childhood that I just can't seem to put to rest. I absolutely love their games, and seeing them in Smash would make me happy beyond belief.

Crash Bandicoot- Frontrunner of the original Playstation and Playstation 2, rival to Nintendo much like how Sonic was to Mario. Having these two rivals in the game would definitely make the internet blow up, much like Sonic's reveal in Brawl.

Phoenix Wright- One of Capcom's bigger franchises, that's always debuted on Nintendo handhelds, and is still getting games. An defense attorney in a Smash? That'd make for one interesting scenerio.

 

[Zinith]

Well some people's character loyalties expand across games.
They're usually more invested in the character themselves than the gameplay they exhibit and will probably use the same character regardless.

Pfft, there isn't anyone like that who exist. Character loyalty over gameplay?!!! Who on Earth woud be so obsessed with a fictional character to waver practicality like that?!! I mean who does that?!!!

 

[Deleted member]

I have several questions

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

View attachment 148699
View attachment 148696
I have several questions

Warchamp7 just started working them in. Expect some bugs. Don't be afraid to tag him too.

 

[osby]

Pfft, there isn't anyone like that who exist. Character loyalty over gameplay?!!! Who on Earth woud be so obsessed with a fictional character to waver practicality like that?!! I mean who does that?!!!

Who, indeed.
Btw, I love Sonic but I can't play him in any Smash game, period. He's too fast.
I play Ness, Jigglypuff and Zelda in any game though.

 

[Deleted member]

Warchamp7 just started working them in. Expect some bugs. Don't be afraid to tag him too.

Woah okay then.
I'll be patient

 

[splat]

Super keen on these new stock icons. So much so, I made about nine of them myself for my new prediction roster.

Spoiler

I'm really feeling these new, simple and clean visual HUD styles Nintendo has been using for a lot of their games recently.

 

[Skyblade12]

More like "what's with these fallacies?"

One 3rd party does not lead to another. It doesn't make sense. Rayman, Banjo, Crash, and Spyro have little to do with each other. Hell, Banjo isn't even in the same ballpark as iconicness as the rest, and is more of a smaller 3rd party that has a good amount of hype and want due to its hefty association with Nintendo. Which would make 'em a pretty cool ballot pick, honestly.

Simon leads to... maybe more Konami AT's? Yeah, that's kind of it(and that's ignoring obviously more music and a stage). That's really the only thing to honestly think about. Because that's the most logical.

In my mind, it speaks to the focus of where Sakurai is looking. Is he looking to Nintendo's characters, or is he pretty sure that he's exhausted the first party lineup and is looking beyond it.

Is it weird that I let gameplay changes get in the way of what characters I main? I have some characters I’m a fan of, but, if the changes make them no longer feel fun (at least compared to other Smash games I’ve played, including fan projects,) then I’ll drop them. After all, the point of a game like this is to play as characters you like and to have fun, and, if you can’t have fun, then what’s the point?



To be fair, how do you know you don’t care about those characters until you’ve played as them in Smash? Their movesets may turn out to resonate well with your playstyle, perhaps even more so than characters you expected that you’d have more fun playing as. Or, even without playing as them, you will come to have more of an appreciation of them. At least some of that happened for me with characters such as Snake, personally.

Because I'm not concerned with how the characters play as most posters here. I'm strictly casual. I want them to be fun, yes, but I'll use bad characters just because I like the characters. I play with about half the cast of Smash 4, there are plenty who I don't care enough to be willing to spend long enough to give them even a fair shot.

Most of these third party characters are characters I've never played a game of, and have no connection to my past except remembering seeing them in ads and such in passing.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

View attachment 148699
View attachment 148696
I have several questions

Oh, you didn't hear about Greninja's new special move "Hydro Punch"?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

In my mind, it speaks to the focus of where Sakurai is looking. Is he looking to Nintendo's characters, or is he pretty sure that he's exhausted the first party lineup and is looking beyond it.

It doesn't mean anything at all. If Simon is in, all it means is he was interested in Simon specifically at best. Don't read into something that's not remotely there or has nothing backing it. There is absolutely zero reason to assume Simon means automatically more 3rd parties beyond that. That could be one of our two last ones for all we know. Or we could get more. Or we might not even get Simon. And so on.

Sakurai has looked at many 3rd parties throughout the years. Doesn't mean he chooses them. There's way more to it than "they interest him".

Again, it's a seriously huge fallacy. They have nothing to do with each other. In fact, at best, maybe we might see Geno and Banjo since Sakurai considered them before, which is a small thing for Banjo's chances, but he has quite constantly taken characters he considered before and brought them into Smash. Not all(as shown by Takamaru, of course).

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Super keen on these new stock icons. So much so, I made about nine of them myself for my new prediction roster.

Spoiler

I'm really feeling these new, simple and clean visual HUD styles Nintendo has been using for a lot of their games recently.

I'm getting used to them. I think it's the no eyes thing that's weirding me out a bit, but I'm sure I'll get to like them.

Your K.Rool one looks great. Hope to see that one in the real game. Impa and Simon also look good as well.

I knida want to try making my own when I get home.