Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Zinith]

I didn't vote until after the Direct. Looks like my instincts paid off

 

[Tree Gelbman]

The real Verg in that thread also says there's 'about half a dozen reveals left'

Now I have to wonder, if he only knows of Simon and potential Minecraft stuff, how would he know there's 'about half a dozen' left?

It really bugs me how his source is constantly peppering him new information.

 

[Skyblade12]

The real Verg in that thread also says there's 'about half a dozen reveals left'

Now I have to wonder, if he only knows of Simon and potential Minecraft stuff, how would he know there's 'about half a dozen' left?

A different, less trustworthy source told him the number.

Anytime he has a new piece of info, it's from a new source that he's usually not sure of.

And his info pieces are usually just common guesses.

 

[L9999]

I think they did. I mean Trinen said 4 year cycle, but that could've been misinterpretation.

However there was the job posting by Bandai Namco DURING the creation of DLC if I'm not mistaken for a Smash 6.

Internally Sakurai considers Smash Wii U and Smash 3DS separate games and thus they would be 4 and 5.

So I do think production started early with the knowledge of the Switch's kit and an intent to get everyone back in the game.

It'll be interesting to see just how much content does get into the game if THIS is the case.

Smash Run would be fun.

I'm fine with clones as long as they don't start to clog up the character select screen. Weither you like it or not, a lot of these characters can be alternative costumes and not actual clones filling up slots. Sakurai could easily increase the max limit of costumes per character. Just because Sakurai said there won't be that many newcomers does not mean it's okay to just fill up the character select screen with a bunch of clones. That comes off as lazy and bootleg. Alph is the perfect example on how to do these type of characters. Pretty much I'm against having a bunch of clones filling up an already congested character select screen anyway.

Fighting games and clones go together. So long as they aren't abortions like Dark Pit they are fun filler.

 

[Deleted member]

An unimportant detail you would say but,

Why.

Why the Hoenn Victory Road plays in Mewtwo's 4 and Ultimate trailers instead of Poké Floats's like in Melee?

Doesn't make sense as Mewtwo doesn't have any link to the Hoenn region.

 

[L9999]

An unimportant detail you would say but,

Why.

Why the Hoenn Victory Road plays in Mewtwo's 4 and Ultimate trailers instead of Poké Floats's like in Melee?

Doesn't make sense as Mewtwo doesn't have any link to the Hoenn region.

A) The song sounds great.
B) It was used in his Smash 4 trailer and it fits.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

An unimportant detail you would say but,

Why.

Why the Hoenn Victory Road plays in Mewtwo's 4 and Ultimate trailers instead of Poké Floats's like in Melee?

Doesn't make sense as Mewtwo doesn't have any link to the Hoenn region.

The last Event Pokemon you could download at the time was XY?ORAS, so maybe they just went with his last technical download appearance?

I mean, the latest Gen 1 remakes were also part of Gen 3, the Hoenn region. Could be related to that too. It's really weird. Huh.

Or what L9999 said. Which somewhat fits into what I said about its timing too. Wasn't he released in Smash 4 before Sun/Moon got released? Makes sense to use the latest music at that time, and reusing it again for a quick video is logical enough.

 

[Shroob]

I actually have to ask, are these boxes affected by screen resolution ala Smash 4's boxes?

Because if not, I honestly can't imagine them leaving a row unfilled by the final character's inclusion, meaning it'd be safe to assume 2, 5 or 8 more characters in that case, which would line up with "About half a dozen".

 

[Whababa]

A) The song sounds great.
B) It was used in his Smash 4 trailer and it fits.

Or maybe... Hoenn confirmed???????

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

View attachment 148586

I actually have to ask, are these boxes affected by screen resolution ala Smash 4's boxes?

Because if not, I honestly can't imagine them leaving a row unfilled by the final character's inclusion, meaning it'd be safe to assume 2, 5 or 8 more characters in that case, which would line up with "About half a dozen".

If you make your tab smaller, no. If you make your tab bigger, yes. It can be a row of 1 or 2 otherwise. So it seems that it just works best that way, with 3 max per row.

 

[splat]

I'm surprised people still expect 13+ sakurai said dont expect many and we already have 3, im guessing at 7 more (10 total) and even then i think im being hopeful.

Yeah, me too.

People seem to forget that between Squirtle, Ivysaur, Ice Climbers, Wolf, Snake, Young Link and Pichu we already got a lot of additional characters that weren't in Smash 4. While they definitely take up less time to create than entirely new characters, I feel they are being glossed over too easily - they still need a lot of tweaks and balacing since they have no recent data. Keep the amount it took for Mewtwo to be finished in mind, it's no small feat.

 

[Shroob]

If you make your tab smaller, no. If you make your tab bigger, yes. It can be a row of 1 or 2 otherwise. So it seems that it just works best that way, with 3 max per row.

If that's the case, then I'll shoot for 5 more newcomers.

While I don't necessarily trust Verg, that would give credence to his "About half a dozen more", while giving us 8 newcomers(Less than Smash 4's before DLC), and keeping the site's layout without an empty row.

 

[DYED]

Talking about Mewtwo, I just rememberd I actually have his ... "Amiibo"?

That card they give you bundled with Pokkén for the Wii U.
I wonder if it'll be compatible with the new Smash.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Talking about Mewtwo, I just rememberd I actually have his ... "Amiibo"?

That card they give you bundled with Pokkén for the Wii U.
I wonder if it'll be compatible with the new Smash.

Is it compatible with Smash 3DS/Wii U?

 

[Rhus]

As far as I know it only saved you approximately 3 hours of playtime to unlock Shadow Mewtwo in Pokken.

 

[DYED]

Is it compatible with Smash 3DS/Wii U?

Nope.
It doesn't work in any game except for Pokkén, that's why it made me wonder.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Nope.
It doesn't work in any game except for Pokkén, that's why it made me wonder.

Then probably not? But it could change.

 

[MysticKnives]

Speaking of stages (I pretty much assume they will all come back), I cannot wait to see the 3DS Rainbow Road in HD. It would be spectacular.

I really want this stage to return. It and Fountain of Dreams are the two stages I'm pulling for the most that aren't confirmed yet.

 

[KingBroly]

As far as I know it only saved you approximately 3 hours of playtime to unlock Shadow Mewtwo in Pokken.

It wasn't even a permanent unlock.

 

[dezeray112]

The real Verg in that thread also says there's 'about half a dozen reveals left'

Now I have to wonder, if he only knows of Simon and potential Minecraft stuff, how would he know there's 'about half a dozen' left?

I'm aware that Vergeben does have a bit of a spooty record, but I guess we'll find out whether his further claims are legit as the months progress.

 

[Shroob]

Honestly, if June ends up basically being moreso a "Recap everything we already know" month, I could see a habit of us getting a Newcomer reveal a month starting in July if, and this is a big if, Verg is to be trusted with his "About a half-a-dozen" guess.

If we started getting a newcomer a month starting in July, that would give us 5 more newcomers(July-December), which would be "About half-a-dozen".


Basically, on months were there's no Nintendo Direct, they could drop an Echo Fighter(Dixie, Dark Samus, Isabelle, etc), and on months were there IS a Direct/Launch Day they'd drop a new character(New Pokemon Rep, New 3rd Party, New Retro, etc).

There's 5 months until the game comes out starting in July, and if we get no more newcomers this month, which is unlikely for us to get something that we don't know yet, it'd add up to what he says.


That, and like I mentioned before, how the website lists characters is in rows of 3, and I really doubt Sakurai would leave a row not full, meaning the number of newcomers left has to be around 2, 5, 8, etc etc etc, basically add 3.

Simply put: The final roster would look something akin to this if we got 5 more characters, bumping the count to 69, not counting all 3 Miis and PKMN Trainer:

69 characters+Random = 70 spots on the CSS, obviously the extra characters on here are just who I think will get in.


I'd almost bank on a new Pokemon rep, no idea who, it could be anyone.

Either Elma or Rex+Phyrra will probably get the slot on the base roster, probably Elma due to that tweet Sakurai did.

Dixie can be swapped with K.Rool, I just think she'd be an echo fighter.

And Simon because, if Verg is right, Simon is in.

The last spot could be a new Retro, or anything, really.

 

[mario123007]

4) Rex & Pyra (Xenoblade Chronicles):

A tough one to think about here (If we dont get two playable reps in this series). Elma from "Xenoblade Chronicles X" in the 2015 title, one the main characters in Chronicles X could provide a great addition to the xenoblade franchise. But i have both a weak and strong argument aganist tge characters inclusion if we were to choose ONE new rep. The weaker argument is that the players avatar was the true protagonist throughout the game compared to Xeno 2 where you play as Rex & Pyra, the stronger argument is Xenoblade 2 is very popular and with Ultimate coming to the switch and the game going to be atleast a year old by its release, I could see Rex getting implented especially since the game considered the 2nd in its series. (The alternative for Elma in my case would be her as an assist trophy).

Sorry I didn't read all of your analysis, I do found your analysis on Rex and Pyra very interesting.

I think we can somewhat count out the popularity argument since Smash Ultimate got to be still in development before XC2 releases.

So I think it is safe to say Elma (Or Cross) might be in the base game while Rex and Pyra are DLC characters.

 

[.Shìkì]

Then probably not? But it could change.

Pretty sure Sakurai said that non-smash amiibo work with Ultimate this time around, so it is possible.

 

[Jak_spoon]

I really don't see any reason to put Mr. Saturn there as a place holder. They didn't bother to try to hide the space for Daisy or Ridley and then you can clearly see the open space after the fact of the matter of them being revealed.

Mr. Saturn means nothing. It's probably just the artist's little easter egg.

Did they even say who drew that beautiful piece of artwork yet?

They have done this before too. Like when they drew me Saturn on the white board sketch for the beginning announcement of smash 4

 

[One winged Devil]

Shadow-a slower but stronger Sonic, I'd main him.

Like seriously I would not be surprised if if he got in as a Echo Fighter, the fact that we haven't seen him as an assist trophy and the Knuckles is one now must mean that.

 

[Shroob]

Shadow-a slower but stronger Sonic, I'd main him.

Like seriously I would not be surprised if if he got in as a Echo Fighter, the fact that we haven't seen him as an assist trophy and the Knuckles is one now must mean that.

Or, it could mean that we only saw around 25 Assist Trophies out of the 50+ available.

It was a demo, it didn't even have all the items in it, there's no reason to believe that it had every Assist Trophy either.

Hell, I have yet to hear about anyone actually summoning Waluigi, when he's been the meme this whole time.

 

[Skyblade12]

Shadow-a slower but stronger Sonic, I'd main him.

Like seriously I would not be surprised if if he got in as a Echo Fighter, the fact that we haven't seen him as an assist trophy and the Knuckles is one now must mean that.

Not necessarily. We’ve seen 30 Assist Trophies. Sakurai said there are more than 50. We’ve likely only seen about half of them. And there are about 28 that can still return from past games, IIRC.

I doubt we’re getting 28 new fighters.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

An unimportant detail you would say but,

Why.

Why the Hoenn Victory Road plays in Mewtwo's 4 and Ultimate trailers instead of Poké Floats's like in Melee?

Doesn't make sense as Mewtwo doesn't have any link to the Hoenn region.

Doesn't make sense how Ridley's trailer used the Brawl remix instead of the new one in his character video on the site either

 

[Shroob]

Not necessarily. We’ve seen 30 Assist Trophies. Sakurai said there are more than 50. We’ve likely only seen about half of them. And there are about 28 that can still return from past games, IIRC.

I doubt we’re getting 28 new fighters.

I don't think we've seen 30. Gamexplain lumped Xerneas into their video for some reason, and Xerneas is a Pokeball Pokemon. The true number is around 28-29 that we've seen.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Is Shadow a possible Echo? Sure. But he might not be. He could still be an AT.

That said, have we seen anyone summon Knuckles in Green Hill Zone as is? I doubt it would affect the background Knuckles itself. This isn't like playing as a fighter. It's randomly generated. On the other hand, they could preset it so AT's don't appear in some stages as is. They did so for how the Fighters worked, as shown with Toon Link/Link and Conductor Link.

 

[PLATINUM7]

When Knuckles is an assist, Alfonzo takes his place on Green Hill Zone.

Alfonzo, "Leave it to me".

 

[One winged Devil]

Or, it could mean that we only saw around 25 Assist Trophies out of the 50+ available.

It was a demo, it didn't even have all the items in it, there's no reason to believe that it had every Assist Trophy either.

Hell, I have yet to hear about anyone actually summoning Waluigi, when he's been the meme this whole time.

Shadow was an assist for the last two games so if he was still an assist trophy then we would had seen him again, or they just removed him completely but that's very unlikely.

Not necessarily. We’ve seen 30 Assist Trophies. Sakurai said there are more than 50. We’ve likely only seen about half of them. And there are about 28 that can still return from past games, IIRC.

I doubt we’re getting 28 new fighters.

When did I ever imply that we're getting 28 new Fighters?

 

[Shroob]

Shadow was an assist for the last two games so if he was still an assist trophy then we would had seen him again, or they just removed him completely but that's very unlikely.


When did I ever imply that we're getting 28 new Fighters?

There were only about 28 assist trophies out of 50+ in the demo.

No, we wouldn't have, because there's a slew of Assist Trophies from the old games that we didn't see, that doesn't mean they're playable, that just means that they weren't in that build of the demo.


I'm all for Shadow, but this is jumping the gun way too quickly.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

View attachment 148586

I actually have to ask, are these boxes affected by screen resolution ala Smash 4's boxes?

Because if not, I honestly can't imagine them leaving a row unfilled by the final character's inclusion, meaning it'd be safe to assume 2, 5 or 8 more characters in that case, which would line up with "About half a dozen".

I messed with the window width and yes, they do move about. Though that's not a hard deconfimration at they must have been set up to look that way on most browsers.

Side note: I'm wondering if further Echos will be revealed before launch or if they'll be under wraps until the game comes out/some dingus nicks one from Best Buy's back room, dumps the files and is removed from the face of the earth.

 

[Jetsurge]

Sector Z needs to be back! Best Smash 64 stage.

 

[Shroob]

Sector Z needs to be back! Best Smash 64 stage.

I always thought Corneria was supposed to be the remade version of Sector Z, since they're effectively the same stage, just Corneria is smaller.

But hell, if we can have and together, may as well.

 

[One winged Devil]

There were only about 28 assist trophies out of 50+ in the demo.

No, we wouldn't have, because there's a slew of Assist Trophies from the old games that we didn't see, that doesn't mean they're playable, that just means that they weren't in that build of the demo.


I'm all for Shadow, but this is jumping the gun way too quickly.

The fact that Knuckles was made in an assist trophy and we saw Waluigi as an assist trophy but not Shadow might mean something.

I'm not saying that he's will be playable but it's is possible.

 

[Shroob]

The fact that Knuckles was made in an assist trophy and we saw Waluigi as an assist trophy but not Shadow might mean something.

I'm not saying that he's will be playable but it's is possible.

I don't see why Knuckles being an Assist Trophy has anything to do with Shadow being unable to be one.

Knuckles isn't using Chaos Control, he function completely differently than Shadow does.


Although it hasn't been done yet, 3rd Parties are allowed to have multiple Assist Trophies.


And no, no one at E3 was able to summon Waluigi afaik, which just proves that not all Assist Trophies were present in that build.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I'm not looking forward to a playable Shadow as every week I play Smash and one of my friends is a dumb Sonic main who I hate dealing with so if I tell him to stop using Sonic he'd go "Ok" and switch to Shadow

 

[vaanrose]

I don't think I shared it in this thread, but I took the liberty of organizing the CSS based on the new numbering scheme. I don't hate it as much as I expected to. I kind of love the original 12 getting put all on one row.