Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Captain Shwampy]

That wasn't my point. More that there's no patterns and we don't know what to expect. At best, we're expecting at least 1 newcomer. I honestly think we'll get 2 myself. We have a lot more games to note and DLC to take into account.

ah i read wrong
I hope Sakurai just surprises us all. I didnt expect 2 new Mario characters and 3 new Fire Emblem characters last time.
Maybe we'll get 2 new Zelda characters this time around

 

[osby]

While i actually enjoy playing with ganondorf, I cant stand some of the animations and warlock punch.

Animation wise, make him float while running, and remove and change all "acrobatics" and "Yoga kicks" remnants from captain falcon and im golden, dont care for a sword, dont care if he still magically punching .

And we all agree that dorf could use a buff, i actually would love a new tool instead of just adjusting numbers, and noone is gonna miss warlock punch (if you want to disrespect people, just charge smash attack or something) and give him a useful and original move as neutral b.

Add a reflect to his jab so we can still play tennis and make people think twice before throwing projectiles at dorf, and im happy.

For a more elaborate idea, refer to my post at ganondorf thread :3

Did Ganondorf made a major appearence in a main line canon game after Twilight Princess?

 

[Arcadenik]

Did Ganondorf made a major appearence in a main line canon game after Twilight Princess?

Yes. Ocarina of Time 3D.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Yes. Ocarina of Time 3D.

On the other hand, we did get a stage from that.

It's also part of why some thought Young Link would return over Toon Link(not counting the fact Toon Link was part of a stage, which gave people the impression he was cut, which wasn't the case of course).

If anything, it finally let us get some trophies of the Sages. I mean, the fact Impa had to wait till 4 to get a trophy at all kind of sucked. Like, Brawl is one thing, but she was actually notable enough to get one in Melee, same with the other Sages. They were pretttttty important.

 

[Pacack]

Sakurai said he always asks companies for their latest and greatest when picking newcomers. We see this constantly with FE and Pokemon. Based on its design XBC is in a similar boat.

"Latest and greatest" =/= future releases.

Fire Emblem is actually a great example of this.

Marth was not the most recent Fire Emblem protagonist at the time of his inclusion, but was rather the first Lord in the series. There's not much we can conclude from that.

They already did this with Roy in Melee...

Roy was included before his game's release because his fire offered an easier way to differentiate a Marth clone than other potential Fire Emblem characters at the time had. This was a special case.

Ike was included in Brawl because he was the primary protagonist of Path of Radiance and the primary protagonist of the second half of Radiant Dawn.

Notably, it is Micaiah - not Ike - who is the protagonist for the first half of the latter game. She's also the character on Radiant Dawn's boxart, but it was Ike who was chosen instead.

This indicates that Ike was chosen mainly because of his role in Path of Radiance rather than Radiant Dawn. The latter was released in early 2007, while Brawl was released in 2008. It's entirely possible that Radiant Dawn wasn't even considered when the roster was finalized.

Robin and Lucina were lucky to get in on Sakurai's own account. Awakening was barely considered despite releasing in April 2012, more than two years before Smash for 3DS released in September 2014.

Corrin was added because Sakurai wanted to include a transforming character to represent that aspect of the series. He also noted that he knew Corrin's inclusion meant a lot of Fire Emblem characters, but hoped the character would be accepted regardless.

In this case, Elma vs. Rex is similar to Ike vs. Micaiah, albeit with Ike having the advantage of appearing in Micaiah's game as well. Regardless, Sakurai did not go out of his way to learn about future Fire Emblem characters barring Roy, who was a weird case.

Additionally, Pokemon characters are always a bit odd, being requested to Sakurai as promotion. That's atypical, and isn't something we should compare other series to.

 

[Pacack]

<Quote Redacted>
I hate to tell you, but that's not a rebuttal of any of my points.

 

[Autumn ♫]

We could easily see either Rex or Elma as our next Xenoblade character.

Me however, I'm hoping for Nia.

 

[Tailisu10]

TBH I would have prefered if Ganondorf didn't appear in Melee at all if it meant that he would become more faithful in Brawl, I'm kinda disappoint in his current state cuz he had plenty of potential.

 

[MysticKnives]

It's interesting to see the general consensus of the new Pokemon rep change over time.

At first it was overwhelming Decidueye support.
Whereas this Pokemon isn't as high prestige as the others to appear in the series it has the type advantage.
Smash already has a fully evolved starter for the water and fire types so it would make sense to complete the circle with a fully evolved grass starter. It is also a rep from the newest Pokemon series and Pokken has proved it would be a great fighter.

But now with the games and anime pushing Lycanroc more into the spotlight it seems like the fanbase is splitting.
This character also represents the Sun and Moon era and would be a really unique addition.
Being on four legs would add for some interesting gameplay, especially since it couldn't pull off the moves that Duck Hunt does.
But how far does the popularity of this character go? Does it reach Greninja level heights? Or will it taper off once this era is complete.

But now we're seeing some other options pop up.

Mimikyu is a name I see a lot. Also another rep from Sun and Moon.
Definitely would have an interesting moveset.
This Pokemon was also a hit once it was announced and has seen a lot of spotlight in the anime.
However I think being a pokeball Pokemon would make the most sense for this character.

Another one is Meowth.
He continues to be a prominent character in the anime and has been for years.
However I feel like the ship has sailed for Meowth to be playable.
If he made it into Smash 64 over Jigglypuff than he would still be on the roster today.
But adding Meowth this late into the game would be strange.
He would for sure be welcome and a good choice, but just a weird choice.

Last up is Eevee.
This support push has only come from the recent Let's Go Pikachu and Eevee Pokemon Switch rumours.
If this turns out to be true, then Eevee might just be the perfect wtf character inclusion.
It has always been a popular Pokemon in the series, and has enough potential to be an interesting fighter.
Calling on the power of the Eeveelutions for attacks would make for a completely new concept.
There is a lot of potential for this Pokemon, so I back it.

I personally understood and still understand the request for Decidueye, but I never felt it was as likely as many Smash fans believed/believe it to be.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

I think the worst part about picking the better option for a new Xenoblade character is that none of the logical options hold a candle to Shulk. Imo Rex has the edge over Elma just because Xenoblade 2 wound up being pretty popular, though Xenoblade 2 might've come along too late. I'm down for basically anything because most of my most waned are sort of long-shot characters, but I won't be upset if we don't get any new Xenoblade character.

 

[SchAlternate]

Whichever Xenoblade character we end up getting, I just hope we get lots of music from both X and 2.

 

[ColietheGoalie]

Smash Character Conversation Quick Takes:

Funky Kong:
I don’t think adjusting his posture would be even close to the biggest hoop a character has jumped through to become a clone. I’m sure it’d work fine.

Dark Samus:
Lots of unique move potential? Yes. But it could easily become a Samus clone, and I’d be OK with that.

Ganondorf:
I’ve only played BotW in full, so I’m not the best reference, but he comes across as a powerful, intimidating character, which seems to match his persona from the games.

Baby Mario:
Bluntness begets bluntness. This is a dumb idea. That being said, I really don’t think the ESRB cares that much about what cartoon characters do to each other.

Rex v Elma (v Fiora?):
I’m not sure there is a clear front runner. I feel like someone will get in due to his love of the series, but each option has its detractors.

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

It'll depend on when Sakurai started work.
Impossible atm to know if Elma or Rex is more likely.
We'll see.
We might also get Cross though.

 

[SvartWolf]

Smash Character Conversation Quick Takes:

Funky Kong:
I don’t think adjusting his posture would be even close to the biggest hoop a character has jumped through to become a clone. I’m sure it’d work fine.

Talking about questionable clone choices, funkly more likely will end as a bowser clone, cause both stand upright.

 

[ColietheGoalie]

Whichever Xenoblade character we end up getting, I just hope we get lots of music from both X and 2.

THIS MAN GETS IT

 

[Pacack]

We might also get Cross though.

Honestly, I would be shocked. Unlike Robin vs. Chrom, there's nothing the avatar has that's more unique than the main character; in fact, Elma has more to work with given the whole two-blades thing.

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

Talking about questionable clone choices, funkly more likely will end as a bowser clone, cause both stand upright.

Make Funky Kong a Marth clone and we are set.

Nice pun.

That being said, I'm absolutely confident that people will be wrong about the newcomers for Smash Switch just like the way they were with Smash 4. The top ten characters according to the Rate Their Chance thread at this point?

1. Rex and Pyra (64.69%)
2. Decidueye (57.87%)
3. Takamaru (57.56%)
4. Dixie Kong (57.51%)
5. Bandana Dee (56.64%)
6. Captain Toad (48.60%)
7. King K. Rool (48.49%)
8. Rayman (48.29%)
9. Isabelle (46.09%)
10. Elma (42.60%)

I wouldn't be surprised if only 1 or 2 of these guys made it in.

Well last time most people got their predictions rights due to the Gematsu leak (except for Chrom and the Chorus Men).

I doubt we'll get two Xeno and DK characters.
Honestly, those I find the more likely in this list are Rayman (personnale bias) and Toad.
I'm ready to be wrong again.

Honestly, I would be shocked. Unlike Robin vs. Chrom, there's nothing the avatar has that's more unique than the main character; in fact, Elma has more to work with given the whole two-blades thing.

True but it's not impossible to see him instead of Elma.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Question: how many times a day do specifically check the internet for any sort of Smash news and, before doing so, hope that theirs something there?

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

Question: how many times a day do specifically check the internet for any sort of Smash news and, before doing so, hope that theirs something there?

Twice. Once in the morning before going to work, once when I come back from work.

 

[Hinata]

Question: how many times a day do specifically check the internet for any sort of Smash news and, before doing so, hope that theirs something there?

I only specifically check for news in the morning when I wake up. Outside of that, I just kinda check my social media periodically, and if I happen to see some Smash news, cool.

 

[osby]

Question: how many times a day do specifically check the internet for any sort of Smash news and, before doing so, hope that theirs something there?

How many times a day I don't specifically check the internet for any sort of Smash news?

 

[Edgelord_197]

Corrin was added because Sakurai wanted to include a transforming character to represent that aspect of the series. He also noted that he knew Corrin's inclusion meant a lot of Fire Emblem characters, but hoped the character would be accepted regardless.

Wasn’t Corrin added to promote Fates and that the development wanted them and had to convince Sakurai that they would be unique.

 

[mario123007]

Lara Croft was a gaming icon in the 90s. Her popularity and iconic-ness rivals Cloud. People know who she is, she's a such a prominent force in the gaming industry.

These were her Guinness records: "...most successful video game heroine.

Croft also scooped awards for the most recognisable female in a video game; most detailed game character; most real-life stand-ins; highest grossing game spin-off and most successful live-action transfer."

I don't know how they gauge "detail", but even without that you have most recognizable female video game character, most successful heroine (probably gauged by sales), highest grossing spin-off, and most successful live-action transfer. That's nothing to bat an eye at.

If we are still following the notion that third-party requests must be gaming icons who have shaped game industry, Lara Croft should be at, or at least very near the top of the list.

Well I'd argue that Xenoblade 2 feels like a worse version of the original, managing to both dumb down the gameplay while offering a less interesting story with less interesting, engaging and relatable characters and a plot that just felt far more generic. X is very different from the original with a focus on gameplay and exploration so I don't compare them since they're both great in different ways but 2 just felt like a worse take on the first game

Extremely dusafreing with you on lot of parts besides the story, but even Story I don't feel it was that bad.
You can't say gameplay is dumbed down when the battle system is greatly improved and so are the quests. Also the Blades makes XC2 gameplay way better than XC1
Characters, debatable, but all female characters are very well casted.
So, yeah, besides story being slightly weaker than XC1, other aspects of XC2 smokes XC1.
And yes, this is still my own opinion though.

And just leave a conclusion... It is never good to compare which Xenoblade is the best... You are jusy hurting yourself when you do this.

About Smash... I get some give out some legit point on which character might not be in Smash, but if your main reason is just because you don't like a certain series or characters... Then that is not really good..
Like how people used to dislike FE series getting new characters....just because they argue Fire Emblem is just anime... And niche. .

(but I want to see if Smash cencorship can make Pyra's design better)

Oh boy here's the "Censorship makes Pyra designs better" argument... It's not good to support unnecessary censorship imo.
And no, please don't quickly expect that Smash Switch is going to be E10+ rating...

I think still it will happen but I think it will only be some minor design tweaks that people will barely notice.

Pyra is literally designed by a hentai artist, made to be the cheesecake sidekick to a soul-crushingly generic-looking anime protagonist who is collecting an arsenal-harem of weapon-waifus.
I personally don't like either of them, but Elma is much more compelling.

LOL get out of here. I doubt you even played XC2...
All of your points are either wrong or just being exaggerated.
If you are just joking though then hey, I can have some chuckle.
If serious. .
Saitou draws hentai FANARTS/DOUJINS, so are other artist who design other blades. So if your argument is any artist who has drawn hentai at least once count as hentai. , then oh. .. It's really hard to name one that is notable... And back again... What's wrong even if he is?
I mean....the artist who design Shing Resonance characters is very popular for drawing hentai.

Rex, soul crushing. .. No, until chapter 6...generic? Maybe.... But not a bad generic.

 

[PLATINUM7]

As Smash Switch is the focus of Nintendo's E3 this year, and my own speculation that we aren't getting frequent updates leading up to the release, I'm banking on a 45-60 minute video about the game. Smash has a million things to talk about, they could make it several hours if they really wanted.

Seeing as it's going to be the spotlight title like Odyssey and BotW before it, we'll most likely get a ~5 minute trailer, maybe longer, in the main presentation with several 30-40 minute live gameplay sessions and discussions by the Treehouse throughout E3. On top of that there's also the invitational which will be even more live recordings of gameplay

 

[osby]

Oh boy here's the "Censorship makes Pyra designs better" argument... It's not good to support unnecessary censorship imo.
And no, please don't quickly expect that Smash Switch is going to be E10+ rating...

I don't actually like censorship all that much, I really didn't like they had to censor Peach or Palutena to give the game E10+ when there is really nothing to see anything mature in both of them.

However, I did like the less open clothes given to Corrin and Bayonetta because it made their designs flow better, and you can still see the diamonds on Bayonetta's legs.

If they had to redesign Pyra a bit and it gives her clothes a more compact look, I wouldn't oppose. Original version looks like some parts of her clothing is cut while she's wearing it.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Seeing as it's going to be the spotlight title like Odyssey and BotW before it, we'll most likely get a ~5 minute trailer, maybe longer, in the main presentation with several 30-40 minute live gameplay sessions and discussions by the Treehouse throughout E3. On top of that there's also the invitational which will be even more live recordings of gameplay

I think this is a lot different from a game like Mario Odyssey, though. The game is going to be stuffed to the brim with content, but its not a story driven game. Its not like there's a lot of story/plot details they'd spoil by showing a lot, unlike Mario Odyssey. Plus there's about a million more mechanics and characters to show off as opposed to Mario Odyssey. I think the two situations are very different, especially in regards to what is going to be revealed/discussed in depth. A little past the comment you quoted, you can see that I changed my idea on how long the presentation will last. That being said, even reducing the time to 20 minutes makes it half of the Smash Direct which happened when we were getting updates on the game every single work day.

And, honestly, do people really think Sakurai is going to let the Treehouse reveal and discuss his work in depth? He was the lead in the Smash Direct himself. He is passionate about this work. I'm sure he wants to be the one to show it to us. Sure, the Treehouse can do the follow up and show off more specific small things about characters and game modes. I just can't imagine Sakurai not doing at least a 15-20 minute video to talk about what he's made for us.

 

[mario123007]

I don't actually like censorship all that much, I really didn't like they had to censor Peach or Palutena to give the game E10+ when there is really nothing to see anything mature in both of them.

However, I did like the less open clothes given to Corrin and Bayonetta because it made their designs flow better, and you can still see the diamonds on Bayonetta's legs.

If they had to redesign Pyra a bit and it gives her clothes a more compact look, I wouldn't oppose. Original version looks like some parts of her clothing is cut while she's wearing it.

Your saying of better design flow... Doesn't make sense in general. Sure I aware some will prefer those designs, because of personal preference.

Regardless of design are better or not if censored I just think the team who put the characters in Smash should take less time on tweaking their designs and try to make other aspect of the game better.

Also...
I have heard people debating whether Smash Switch is going to be an entire new game, port, semi-port, or even reboot...

I recently watch Smash Academy's "What makes Smash Different" and something clicked.

I think Smash Switch is probably... And I aware people will think I am being Captain Obvious when I say this the ultimate Smash Bros that will satisfy both the original, Melee, Brawl, and Smash 4 Fan.... Or
To say it more precise Smash Switch has to be the Smash Bros that has every best part of what makes every series the best. I mean all past Smash games somewhat feels something that drags it a bit down... N64 you have lack of characters, Melee being a bit too competitive focus, Brawl sure you have many new modes and story but it's competitive scene is lacking. Smash 4 has it's roster and mode being dragged by it's handheld version, bad online, and no story mode. And 3DS sure you can play Smash on the go for the first time poor graphics and has some modes removed. So I really hope Smash Switch will have everything that will appeal to every Smash fans, and it has high chance it will be.

 

[Pacack]

Wasn’t Corrin added to promote Fates and that the development wanted them and had to convince Sakurai that they would be unique.

Well, kinda. He and his team wanted to promote a new character, and Corrin was chosen because they fell into the right time period. Sakurai didn't want so many Fire Emblem characters, but decided Corrin could be unique, so included him.

"After internal analysis, we decided that if we’re going to make DLC, we would choose a character from a soon-to-be-released new game. After consulting many times with Nintendo and looking at the upcoming release schedule, Fire Emblem Fates was in just the right spot. It’s already been released in Japan, but is yet to be released overseas, making it a prime candidate in terms of timing. I personally felt that having too many Fire Emblem characters was a problem, but after talking it over with the development staff and discussing logistics, I felt certain that I could make them a fun character."

Emphasis mine.

 

[osby]

I think Smash Switch is probably... And I aware people will think I am being Captain Obvious when I say this the ultimate Smash Bros that will satisfy both the original, Melee, Brawl, and Smash 4 Fan.... Or
To say it more precise Smash Switch has to be the Smash Bros that has every best part of what makes every series the best. I mean all past Smash games somewhat feels something that drags it a bit down... N64 you have lack of characters, Melee being a bit too competitive focus, Brawl sure you have many new modes and story but it's competitive scene is lacking. Smash 4 has it's roster and mode being dragged by it's handheld version, bad online, and no story mode. And 3DS sure you can play Smash on the go for the first time poor graphics and has some modes removed. So I really hope Smash Switch will have everything that will appeal to every Smash fans, and it has high chance it will be.

Appealing every fan is a fantasy. There will still be fans who liked Brawl's roster or Melee's events or whatever. But if we are talking about what made every game better, a semi-objective sum would be (as far as I got from the fans):

• Melee's mechanics but without bugs and a more balanced cast
• Brawl's musical score and a similar adventure mode with story cut-scenes
• Wii U's online system but better, since it was still best we got.
• Every possible character, stage, mode, item etc. returning.

Now, I don't think 3DS hold back Wii U version back too much. As far as we know, it lead to the omission of Ice Climbers and likely Squirtle and Ivysaur and gave developers less time. However, it did allow them to make a project plan this big in the first place. I don't think last game would be big as it was if it wasn't on the two main consoles of the Nintendo at that time.

Secondly, you can't do everything on that list. At the same time. Even story mode is way too much work to add modes and characters that wasn't in the last entry while adding new content. Melee's speed would undoubtedly turn off some players, since it was one of the things that Melee was critisized for.

I think Smash is just to big for anyone to make a "ultimate" one. But I also think every previous game surpassed its predecessors generally, so I don't think this one will be different. It will be great butby no means not without its mistakes.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Yeah, I usually check in the morning (late afternoon in the States) and a couple of times throughout th day...which is to say I am checking the front page here. I remember during the dought periods of Brawl/4’s development that I would check half hoping there would be some sort of update but nothing. Then, finally, there would be an update when I was least expecting it after nonchanlantly checking up information without anysort of expectations.

 

[Deathcarter]

While extremely late to the Rex vs. Elma discussion, I did want to say one thing.

The roster is finalized for Smash games pretty quickly after development starts. Given the time period Sakurai likely was pulling from, Elma has the timing all on her side.

For Rex to get in we have to assume that Sakurai either rejected Elma as a character choice, decided to include the protagonist from XC2, or wanted both.

Next, we have to assume that, after deciding he wants to include XC2's protagonist, he approaches Monolith Soft and decides he likes the design and can implement the blade mechanic to his satisfaction.

Once we assume that, we also have to assume that Sakurai is willing to include a character who has yet to be revealed to the public.

Then, we have to conclude that Sakurai has considered the risk of including this character despite the possibilities of: a lackluster reception to Rex as a protagonist (design, personality, abilities); poor game sales/reception; or even of the Switch not selling well at launch. (Mind, not even developer insight can predict the success of a game/console.)

While all of this is possible, it is not something we have precedence for. When Greninja was chosen, it was because the Pokemon company gave him concept art to include a Pokemon from XY. In that instance, the games were already essentially guaranteed successes by virtue of being Pokemon games, and the anime was already planning on pushing Greninja as a popular character.

With all of this in mind, why are we assuming that Rex is a more likely choice than Elma, who was (basically) the protagonist of the most recently released Xenoblade game at the time the roster was being decided? As DLC, Rex makes perfect sense, but why is there any reason to suspect him for the base game?

Frankly, if the assumption is that Sakurai is considering a Xenoblade rep for the sake of a Xenoblade rep, then it makes complete sense to assume that Rex would be the one chosen since he'll be more recent and popularity was already not being considered when it came to Xenoblade. If we're instead assuming that Rex being an unproven character makes Sakurai not choose him than Elma being a proven failure in terms of popularity makes her (and a second Xeno rep in general) an unlikely addition as well.

 

[PLATINUM7]

I think this is a lot different from a game like Mario Odyssey, though. The game is going to be stuffed to the brim with content, but its not a story driven game. Its not like there's a lot of story/plot details they'd spoil by showing a lot, unlike Mario Odyssey. Plus there's about a million more mechanics and characters to show off as opposed to Mario Odyssey. I think the two situations are very different, especially in regards to what is going to be revealed/discussed in depth. A little past the comment you quoted, you can see that I changed my idea on how long the presentation will last. That being said, even reducing the time to 20 minutes makes it half of the Smash Direct which happened when we were getting updates on the game every single work day.

And, honestly, do people really think Sakurai is going to let the Treehouse reveal and discuss his work in depth? He was the lead in the Smash Direct himself. He is passionate about this work. I'm sure he wants to be the one to show it to us. Sure, the Treehouse can do the follow up and show off more specific small things about characters and game modes. I just can't imagine Sakurai not doing at least a 15-20 minute video to talk about what he's made for us.

The Treehouse segments often have developers and producers there with them. Also, there was a Treehouse stream before Smash for 3DS released that was them playing the game without Sakurai being there. From memory, the year the invitational was held there was some stream footage of the Treehouse members playing with the Invitational players and talking about the game's aspects. So yes, the Treehouse members are able to show off the game without Sakurai.

Looking at Smash 4 at E3, in 2013 where it was arguably the biggest game Nintendo was revealing, it only had a 5 minute reveal for the game + Villager, followed by Mega Man's trailer. The other stuff was Wii Fit Trainer's reveal later, the Mario vs Mega Man match and a short video narrated by Sakurai on the game's look and new character's movesets. The next year, we got Miis and Palutena's trailer in the main presentation, Pac-Man's trailer behind closed doors and the Invitational. The year later it got it's own pre-E3 presentation showing off DLC and then releasing it.

Now, Smash is going to be the biggest title again for Nintendo at E3. The difference between this year and E3 2013 is Nintendo's been pushing a format with a spotlight title. Even then the spotlight titles have received a traditional length trailer, with extra coverage then being given by the Treehouse. That can and I'm guessing will be the same for Smash. If they really want to go in depth for the trailers, Sakurai or Nintendo can do character specific trailers like what was done for Smash 4. Otherwise they could just do a more general trailer like what was done for Melee and Brawl, or even what Villager's trailer looked like before he netted Mario. Either way, I see most of the game being shown off outside the main presentation. Direct's and last year's E3 were more about quick announcements. In depth looks at games are saved for game specific directs, Treehouse streams or the occasional video uploaded on YouTube.

 

[blackghost]

Some 200 pages ago there was an inclusive discussion about elma vs rex regarding gameplay uniqueness. It is honeslty veru subjectively in a jrpg game which character you liked more. As someone who hasnt played either (and there are many lurking rwading these arguments) what males these characters separate from shulk gameplay wise becuase we know that matters to sakurai.
As i understanf it the blades modify the drivers right in xenoblade 2? How or is that much different from the manado? I would like an objective answer on that.
And elma fights how? Ive never seen that covered.
If in xenoblade 2 the blades dont really fight, i cant see the baldes being in as playable much like the trainer.

Lastly drop this evee thing. We arent getting a mew transformation character that has multiple forms and movesets. Even in speculation seems like so much extraness for a what gen 1 pokemon?

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

The Treehouse segments often have developers and producers there with them. Also, there was a Treehouse stream before Smash for 3DS released that was them playing the game without Sakurai being there. From memory, the year the invitational was held there was some stream footage of the Treehouse members playing with the Invitational players and talking about the game's aspects. So yes, the Treehouse members are able to show off the game without Sakurai.

Looking at Smash 4 at E3, in 2013 where it was arguably the biggest game Nintendo was revealing, it only had a 5 minute reveal for the game + Villager, followed by Mega Man's trailer. The other stuff was Wii Fit Trainer's reveal later, the Mario vs Mega Man match and a short video narrated by Sakurai on the game's look and new character's movesets. The next year, we got Miis and Palutena's trailer in the main presentation, Pac-Man's trailer behind closed doors and the Invitational. The year later it got it's own pre-E3 presentation showing off DLC and then releasing it.

Now, Smash is going to be the biggest title again for Nintendo at E3. The difference between this year and E3 2013 is Nintendo's been pushing a format with a spotlight title. Even then the spotlight titles have received a traditional length trailer, with extra coverage then being given by the Treehouse. That can and I'm guessing will be the same for Smash. If they really want to go in depth for the trailers, Sakurai or Nintendo can do character specific trailers like what was done for Smash 4. Otherwise they could just do a more general trailer like what was done for Melee and Brawl, or even what Villager's trailer looked like before he netted Mario. Either way, I see most of the game being shown off outside the main presentation. Direct's and last year's E3 were more about quick announcements. In depth looks at games are saved for game specific directs, Treehouse streams or the occasional video uploaded on YouTube.

Well by citing what was shown off in past E3's for Smash, you're yet again ignoring the fact that we aren't getting content updates every day. Also, back around the post you're originally quoting, Scoliosis made a great post commenting on why we should be getting a ton of information at E3 this year as opposed to previous years. Lastly, I never once said Treehouse wasn't allowed to show things off without Sakurai. I don't know where you're getting that. I said Sakurai will likely want to discuss the larger changes up front in the main digital event, just like he did in the Smash Direct. After that, the Treehouse can do whatever the hell they want.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Well by citing what was shown off in past E3's for Smash, you're yet again ignoring the fact that we aren't getting content updates every day. Also, back around the post you're originally quoting, Scoliosis made a great post commenting on why we should be getting a ton of information at E3 this year as opposed to previous years. Lastly, I never once said Treehouse wasn't allowed to show things off without Sakurai. I don't know where you're getting that. I said Sakurai will likely want to discuss the larger changes up front in the main digital event, just like he did in the Smash Direct. After that, the Treehouse can do whatever the hell they want.

You asked if people really think Sakurai would really let the Treehourse show off and discuss the game.

If there's no constant content updates and a lot of things we got in those updates were minor things like items or alterations to moves, then wouldn't that be the perfect stuff to show off in 30-40 minute segments of the Treehouse playing and talking about the game? If it's big enough Sakurai can talk about it but again, I don't see why all that discussion has to be thrown into the main presentation. Put it after. You've got hours of streaming for extended looks. Really the juicy stuff that gets shown off in the main trailer is what the game looks like and what characters are in. You can get that done in a few minutes. Even without the Treehouse, Sakurai's discussed more specific things outside the main presentation. Before all those Miiverse Pics of the Day, he did a discussion video outside the main presentation.

Then there's also the possibility that we start getting content updates after E3. There wouldn't be much time to have them between E3 and release but it's still possible. That would fall into the usual order of things, in which the game gets revealed and then we get updates. I think the biggest difference is that this game was announced with a teaser trailer, rather than just word that it's happening. Otherwise it's still getting an E3 reveal like Melee, Brawl and Smash 4.

 

[osby]

Does anyone thinks we can get two main 1-Player modes? Like Smash Tour and Smash Run at the same time? Switch can be used as both handheld and home console. There can be two modes capitalizes on using one. It can be something Sakurai would do.

 

[Antimatter042]

Some 2oo pages ago there was an inclusive discussion about elma vs rex regarding gameplay uniqueness. It is honeslty veru subjectively in a jrpg game which character you liked more. As someone who hasnt played either (and there are many lurking rwading these arguments) what males these characters separate from shulk gameplay wise becuase we know that matters to sakurai.
As i understanf it the blades modify the drivers right in xenoblade 2? How or is that much different from the manado? I would like an objective answer on that.
And elma fights how? Ive never seen that covered.
If in xenoblade 2 the blades dont really fight, i cant see the baldes being in as playable much like the trainer.

Spoiler: Rex & Pyra's Potential

Rex and Pyra fight together in XC2 by Rex being the "Driver" and swinging the sword for regular attacks and Driver Arts, which are like Shulk's Back Slash and Air Slash, while Pyra stands back a little and provides . Rex's Driver Arts with Pyra's sword are Sword Bash: a grounded stabbing attack that has the same positioning benefits as Back Slash; Anchor Shot: an attack with Rex's grappling hook that can topple opponents (Ranged Spike perhaps); Rolling Smash: a flip followed by slamming the sword on the ground with a fiery burst from the impact; and Double Spinning Edge: a two hit horizontal sword swing that does more damage hitting an enemy's side. Rex has nothing like Shulk's Monado Arts or Vision, but rather a mechanic called Blade Affinity. Staying close to Pyra maintains an affinity link, which boosts their power and increases in potency the longer they stay together in battle. Additionally, maintaining affinity allows Rex to toss the sword back to Pyra for powerful Blade Specials that could possibly be Smash attacks in this game, meaning Rex lacks a lot of his better finishing attacks if he can't maintain affinity in Smash. Pyra can unleash Flame Nova: spinning the sword around her with a fiery burst, Prominence Revolt: a downwards stab with the sword that releases an upwards fire burst, Blazing End: an attack where Pyra wills the sword to spin rapidly in midair next to her slashing the opponent repeatedly, and for the likely Final Smash, Burning Sword: a jumping Slash with Rex and Pyra holding the sword together, which leads into an upwards swing that unleashes a flaming pillar like an eruption.

Spoiler: Elma's Potential

Elma, in stark contrast, fights with Dual Guns and Dual Swords, alternating between the two to suit her needs. She also has various Arts to pull from that use one of those two weapons like Sliding Slinger: a sliding attack with gunfire, Shadowstrike: an upwards leap followed by a dive forward with repeated slashes, Ghost Walker: an evasive maneuver with her guns that could make her briefly invincible against an opponent to take advantage of their previous move, and Stream Edge: a sweeping Slash that can stagger opponents (I might be remembering the XC1 version of the move). Her idea fighting style would involve swiftly alternating between sword and gun attacks to pressure opponents at all ranges. Her obvious Final Smash would be getting into her Skell and unleashing its full firepower on her opponents.

Both of these characters can offer a lot to Smash and absolutely deserve to be fighters. Each one has the potential to be more faithful to their home game than Shulk is and I hope my descriptions of their fighting styles and some of their attacks make that clear. If I had to pick one I'd go with Rex, but I genuinely can't see Sakurai turning his nose up at either character following a likely discussion with Monolith Soft about including new Smash characters and seeing their distinct potential.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

So did another rumour happen while I was sleeping or are we still on Ridley and Simon?

 

[osby]

We passed that, moved on to clones and Xenoblade, and there's still no new leak

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Wow, back to Xenoblade again already.

We're never gonna last these last 4 weeks if we burn through topic that quick.

About Simon tho, which version do you think they'll use? Will he be like Mega Man and be a super faithful recreation of his original form or will he take inspiration from later games?

Personally I hope they take stuff from later games as Simon was intentionally designed to be clunky in the original games, that's how you got your $50 worth. Though if they want to be faithful, Simon should play like a heavy character but when he's hit he's sent flying.