Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Sarki Soliloquy]

How do you lot think Isabelle would fight, if confirmed? What do you think is the best way to give her a unique moveset?

 

[Pacack]

How do you lot think Isabelle would fight, if confirmed? What do you think is the best way to give her a unique moveset?

Summoning/Rearranging furniture and public works projects. A true terrain-modifying character.

 

[Chandeelure]

Fair enough I guess. I don't understand the logic in that but okie dokie. Villager is from sweet and peaceful Animal Crossing yet its ok to shoot him?

And Pokemon aren't fought with firearms either (inb4 gun pokemon). The argument is just kind out there for me.

I mean, it's a silly argument, but we are talking about Sakurai, the man who said one of the reasons Ridley is not in the game is because he wouldn't be Ridley anymore if he couldn't fly around freely.

 

[NintenZ]

Anyone feeling Gunvolt for Smash? He is pretty popular, has made a ton of appearances including guest appearances, and communication would be easy since Inti Creates is in Japan. He’d also be really unique with his elextricity-based gameplay and attacks.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Ok, I have a topic for you guys to discuss. I was considering removing Octolings from my predictions until I re-read this portion of a Sakurai article:

"Initially, I had considered including Lucina as one of Marth's alternate costumes. After all, she has a close relationship with him in FE:A. In such cases, even if two characters' names and voices differ, as long as they function the same way, I assign them as alternate costumes. The Wii Fit Trainers, Villagers, and Robin are examples of this setup.

However, even though Lucina shares her physical stats and techniques with Marth, the characteristics of their attacks differ. When two such similar characters function in an even slightly different manner, I give them a separate spot on the roster since that will affect battle records and whatnot. In that sense, you could say she was very lucky to join the fray!"

Do you think Octolings act different enough from Inklings in terms of characteristics of attacks for them to be separate characters on the roster?

 

[Fenriraga]

How do you lot think Isabelle would fight, if confirmed? What do you think is the best way to give her a unique moveset?

Go completely feral and rip the guts out of every fighter with her fangs, leaving nothing but meat and blood in her wake.

...

Or, y'know, maybe just use tools the villager doesn't use. Maybe her Smash Attacks could be different public works projects popping out of existence, kinda like Dr. Wright's Assist Trophy and Palutena's up smash. Maybe place furniture traps, smack people with her clipboard, iono.

 

[Roberk]

I've already harped on this, but Smash has too many of those movesets. I'd much rather have a character with a single weapon applied differently than one who uses 10 different weapons a couple times each. If it's Lyndis doing Iaido but pulling out a bow for a special or two, that's fine, but we don't need any more Game and Watches with entire arsenals that they barely make use of.

Yeah, I understand that using all of those weapons would spread them too thin. I was actually thinking about the fact that he wouldn't get to use his signature sword, the Light Brand, as much as he should. My point was really about the potential. A lot of the lords we have in Smash are locked to just a sword and mainly a bow/lance in their promotion, which obviously were not represented.

Even then, just with the Light Brand Leif can represent both swords and magic as magic swords in the Jugdral series were just swords with spells tacked onto them at 2 range. Leif doesn't have to use all of the weapons ever to be unique, it's about the fact that he can and that he has the potential.

 

[NintenZ]

Ok, I have a topic for you guys to discuss. I was considering removing Octolings from my predictions until I re-read this portion of a Sakurai article:

"Initially, I had considered including Lucina as one of Marth's alternate costumes. After all, she has a close relationship with him in FE:A. In such cases, even if two characters' names and voices differ, as long as they function the same way, I assign them as alternate costumes. The Wii Fit Trainers, Villagers, and Robin are examples of this setup.

However, even though Lucina shares her physical stats and techniques with Marth, the characteristics of their attacks differ. When two such similar characters function in an even slightly different manner, I give them a separate spot on the roster since that will affect battle records and whatnot. In that sense, you could say she was very lucky to join the fray!"

Do you think Octolings act different enough from Inklings in terms of characteristics of attacks for them to be separate characters on the roster?

Not really, the thing with Octolings are that they’re practically the same characters as the Inklings, and share the exact same stats and abilities as them. I suppose to differentiate them Inklings could use attacks found more in Turf Wars while Octolings could use attacks more found in the Campaign, but I don’t think it’d be enough to differentiate them.

 

[Sigran101]

Fair enough I guess. I don't understand the logic in that but okie dokie. Villager is from sweet and peaceful Animal Crossing yet its ok to shoot him?

And Pokemon aren't fought with firearms either (inb4 gun pokemon). The argument is just kind out there for me.

I don't really know why but it feels different from villager with Isabelle. She seems more frail I guess. I don't really have evidence or anything, it's just something I thought of. I can definitely understand your disagreement. I hope I am wrong.

 

[Roberk]

Ok, I have a topic for you guys to discuss. I was considering removing Octolings from my predictions until I re-read this portion of a Sakurai article:

"Initially, I had considered including Lucina as one of Marth's alternate costumes. After all, she has a close relationship with him in FE:A. In such cases, even if two characters' names and voices differ, as long as they function the same way, I assign them as alternate costumes. The Wii Fit Trainers, Villagers, and Robin are examples of this setup.

However, even though Lucina shares her physical stats and techniques with Marth, the characteristics of their attacks differ. When two such similar characters function in an even slightly different manner, I give them a separate spot on the roster since that will affect battle records and whatnot. In that sense, you could say she was very lucky to join the fray!"

Do you think Octolings act different enough from Inklings in terms of characteristics of attacks for them to be separate characters on the roster?

I could see Octolings being used as an alternate moveset to the Inklings to represent the many weapons Splatoon has. Other than that, they'd make a great costume.

 

[Fenriraga]

Anyone feeling Gunvolt for Smash? He is pretty popular, has made a ton of appearances including guest appearances, and communication would be easy since Inti Creates is in Japan. He’d also be really unique with his elextricity-based gameplay and attacks.

I love GV, but hell no. He's still on the lower end of the indie spectrum and I feel there's a large handful of Indies that would make it before he did. And that's saying something, because I'm not expecting Indies.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Anyone else tired of aimless speculation? I can't wait to actually see the game and then we can talk about the actual game. We can't even talk about the actual game yet! Isn't that crazy?! E3 can't come soon enough :/

How funny, my brother just asked me today if any Smash-news had popped in since the trailer aside from the Players announced for the upcoming Invitational.
Never thought we'd be given this much of a newsdrought, and it's still a month to go.

 

[Sarki Soliloquy]

Go completely feral and rip the guts out of every fighter with her fangs, leaving nothing but meat and blood in her wake.

...

Or, y'know, maybe just use tools the villager doesn't use. Maybe her Smash Attacks could be different public works projects popping out of existence, kinda like Dr. Wright's Assist Trophy and Palutena's up smash. Maybe place furniture traps, smack people with her clipboard, iono.

I always thought those tufts on those floppy ears of her's were fingers. She's resting those secret pair of buff arms for a reason.

"Sorry, Mayor, but you can't place your life here."

Summoning/Rearranging furniture and public works projects. A true terrain-modifying character.

This too is how I imagine here. She could be a quasi-Faust in regards to how she erects Public Works Projects & obtaining Bells thru a special mechanic to affect the RNG.

Also, how about using Animal Crossing's emote animations for her standard attacks?

 

[osby]

Ok, I have a topic for you guys to discuss. I was considering removing Octolings from my predictions until I re-read this portion of a Sakurai article:

"Initially, I had considered including Lucina as one of Marth's alternate costumes. After all, she has a close relationship with him in FE:A. In such cases, even if two characters' names and voices differ, as long as they function the same way, I assign them as alternate costumes. The Wii Fit Trainers, Villagers, and Robin are examples of this setup.

However, even though Lucina shares her physical stats and techniques with Marth, the characteristics of their attacks differ. When two such similar characters function in an even slightly different manner, I give them a separate spot on the roster since that will affect battle records and whatnot. In that sense, you could say she was very lucky to join the fray!"

Do you think Octolings act different enough from Inklings in terms of characteristics of attacks for them to be separate characters on the roster?

I don't know much about Splatoon but I think it depends on whether Octoling can differeantiate themselves from Inklings or not in terms of visual attitude or voices. Or they can't canonically use something Inkilngs can. Then it'd be weird to make them alts.

But in any case, I don't think Inklings can have clones. They will probably have a unique mechanic and it's hard to make this in two characters. That's most likely the reason why Alph plays exactly the same as Olimar.

 

[Chandeelure]

Do Octolings have different personalities or attacks?

Because they look just like Inklings skins, at least in the Octoexpansion multiplayer thing.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

With the clear exception of new third party characters whose debut game has yet to release.

It’s funny you say that. In Brawl on Snakes stage, did you know the Metal Gear in the background premiered in Brawl before the game they are supposed to be in, Metal Gear Solid 4, released?

Same with Roy in Melee, but he was a clone so...

Honestly- while I have no opinion on Bandana Dee, or Captain Toad.
I believe the argument of people thinking of them as "generic species" comes mostly that...Well-
You have a roster with Sonic, Mario, Link, Zelda, Samus... You can argue that the pokemons are generic species, but when people see Pikachu, they think of Ash's one, Same of Charizard or Jiggllypuff, Lucario is totally based from the movie, same for Mewtwo. Only Greninja could be applied to the "generic species" and even then, now that the Pokémon XYZ anime is over, people will link him to Ash. Same as Yoshi, as people directly link it as THE buddy of Mario from all the games/Spin-off

However, if in the middle of the roster, there a Toad with a backpack- or "just" a Waddle dee with bandana and a spear.
They can't really link it to anyone "famous" in the pop-culture, even f Bandana dee is the "fourth player" in Kirby, a lot of people maybe only did the Kirby games alone-
And as for Captain Toad, people maybe link it as THE toad that Peach already use?

I'm not defending their point, I'm just looking at their reasoning. While not very true, there still a bit of logic behind it-
Those characters will lack the "appeal" that other "generic" species characters we have had.

I wanted to just quote this for clarity and that others may read it. I tried to explain this earlier, but you’ve done a much much better job then I did.

I can see why people can get so invested in these characters and see their strengths and think “wow, this is an amazing character! he/she deserves a shot!” But these developers aren’t doing any of us favors, at the end of the day, Nintendo is trying to sell games. Period. If something is pleasing to the eye, or envokes a positive emotion/memory, and is recognizable from many ways, it will sell. Sonic was a great example, because you can see the outlining of his eyes on something and know it’s him. Even at my local gs station, when an item is rung up, it makes the sound when sonic collects a ring, and I immediately remember him and the games he was in.

There are so many things that matter, and while it isn’t far fetched to see some “random” characters like Wii-Fit Trainer, these characters a carefully curated to be appealing.

It shouldn't really matter how people initially interpret the character. Captain Toad is not Toad and Bandana Dee is not a generic Waddle Dee. If people can't see that, then hopefully a playable appearance in Smash will give them more independence and help people distinguish the two from their generic counterparts.

Either way, I don't think it's fair for Sakurai to write these guys off just because of the way they look. His focus should be moveset potential, not the appearance.

Yeah, it does suck, and I get that fear that your favorite characters may fade into obscurity if they aren’t in smash, but that’s the luck of the draw. Growing up I loved a lot of odd characters from games that this day and age few have actually played, but like I said above, this is a business, and looks do sell.

If I was an impressionable and very young gamer and I saw two characters. Jin from Tekken, or Bandana Waddle Dee, I would probably be juiced to play with Jin, because he’s a strong looking martial artist with cool ass hair and a design that sticks out. The Waddle Dee I may try later, but only because he’s there. I reacted the same way when I first saw Game and Watch, as I really didn’t care for him, but the difference is he brought something new to the table, so I had some respect and slight admiration for his stance in the game, but I’ll never truly like him because of how he looks. Same with Ice Climbers.

Please, by all means don’t take this as fact, these are all personal experiences. But just think about the cuts and see what they have in common with one another and see if any of that can relate to whatever character you may want.

 

[papagenos]

Guys you know what this means?

Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars launched for the Super NES on this day in 1996. Are you Team Mallow or Team Geno? pic.twitter.com/auvmZWJsfM

— Nintendo of America (@NintendoAmerica) May 13, 2018

Mallow confirmed for Smash!

Dont play with me like that nintendo... Geno / Mallow tag character would be sweet also just sayin'

 

[Fenriraga]

Do Octolings have different personalities or attacks?

Because they look just like Inklings skins, at least in the Octoexpansion multiplayer thing.

Based on their recently leaked victory animations, they do have a very different personalities from the regular squid kids. Attack wise though, they're identical.

 

[Arcadenik]

Do you think Octolings act different enough from Inklings in terms of characteristics of attacks for them to be separate characters on the roster?

In other words, could Octolings get in Smash as a Lucina-type clone (aka last-minute filler clone) of Inklings? Possibly.

 

[MopedOfJustice]

I was against Octolings at first, but if they just use different weapons and take advantage of the painting mechanic that Inklings almost certainly have, I think it could actually be worthwhile to have them in the game just to further explore that new element.

 

[Fenriraga]

I was against Octolings at first, but if they just use different weapons and take advantage of the painting mechanic that Inklings almost certainly have, I think it could actually be worthwhile to have them in the game just to further explore that new element.

That's what I wanted out of Dark Pit.

...I didn't get that wish.

 

[Megadoomer]

I was against Octolings at first, but if they just use different weapons and take advantage of the painting mechanic that Inklings almost certainly have, I think it could actually be worthwhile to have them in the game just to further explore that new element.

I feel like if Octolings got in, it'd be as clones of Inklings. Lucina and Dark Pit could have potentially used different weapons, or had different move-sets, compared to Marth and Pit, but they wound up as clones regardless.

 

[PeridotGX]

In other words, could Octolings get in Smash as a Lucina-type clone (aka last-minute filler clone) of Inklings? Possibly.

I think if any clone fit's Octoling's situation best, it's probably Roy. I can imagine the Splatoon Devs requesting Sakurai to add the Octolings in to promote the Octo-Expansion. Also, they could easily be more unique then the Smash 4 clones. Where Inkling has the Roller, the Octolings could use a multi-hit Inkbrush. Where Inkling uses a Splat Bomb, the Octoling could use a fast-but-weak Burst Bomb, or a mobile Curling Bomb. Where Inkling uses a normal Charger, the Octolings could use a quick but weak Bamboozler.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

I think if any clone fit's Octoling's situation best, it's probably Roy. I can imagine the Splatoon Devs requesting Sakurai to add the Octolings in to promote the Octo-Expansion. Also, they could easily be more unique then the Smash 4 clones. Where Inkling has the Roller, the Octolings could use a multi-hit Inkbrush. Where Inkling uses a Splat Bomb, the Octoling could use a fast-but-weak Burst Bomb, or a mobile Curling Bomb. Where Inkling uses a normal Charger, the Octolings could use a quick but weak Bamboozler.

But why can’t think Inklings just have those moves? Inklings are pretty much avatars.

And Roy is in the same field as Falco now, where they have drastically different capabilities then their clones. In Smash 4 Roy is a fast faller, has different knock back on all his attack’s, drastically faster air and ground speed, Fair with the lowest cool down in the game. I can go on.

I personally want to see what new franchises they can bring to the table. That’s tricky, though.

 

[PeridotGX]

But why can’t think Inklings just have those moves? Inklings are pretty much avatars.

And Roy is in the same field as Falco now, where they have drastically different capabilities then their clones. In Smash 4 Roy is a fast faller, has different knock back on all his attack’s, drastically faster air and ground speed, Fair with the lowest cool down in the game. I can go on.

I personally want to see what new franchises they can bring to the table. That’s tricky, though.

The Inklings would have the "basic" items, for the most part. Splattershot, Splat Roller, Splat Bombs, etc. The Octolings would be semi clones that use more unique items that have weird properties (Like Wolf).

And I meant they'd be like Roy in that they'd be promotion, mostly. Roy for FE7 and Octolings for the Octo-Expansion.

 

[Roberk]

But why can’t think Inklings just have those moves? Inklings are pretty much avatars.

And Roy is in the same field as Falco now, where they have drastically different capabilities then their clones. In Smash 4 Roy is a fast faller, has different knock back on all his attack’s, drastically faster air and ground speed, Fair with the lowest cool down in the game. I can go on.

I personally want to see what new franchises they can bring to the table. That’s tricky, though.

The thing is that each character can only have so many moves. Sure, a lot of the proposed moves for Octolings work on Inklings, but Inklings can't have both their moves and Octoling's moves. There's just not enough space. Octolings are being used as a way to represent more Splatoon weapons without clogging up the Inkling moveset in this scenario.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

We don't even know the Inklings moveset yet. The idea they'd get a last-second clone is kind of hard to say until we know more about them.

@Mario & Sonic Guy: Yeah, if Rowlet isn't playable, it should at least be a Pokeball Pokemon for sure. Showing up is definitely highly likely, imo.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

I just imagine an Inkling having Clouds Fair with a roller and just smacking someone’s **** up.

 

[Deleted member]

Ok, I have a topic for you guys to discuss. I was considering removing Octolings from my predictions until I re-read this portion of a Sakurai article:

"Initially, I had considered including Lucina as one of Marth's alternate costumes. After all, she has a close relationship with him in FE:A. In such cases, even if two characters' names and voices differ, as long as they function the same way, I assign them as alternate costumes. The Wii Fit Trainers, Villagers, and Robin are examples of this setup.

However, even though Lucina shares her physical stats and techniques with Marth, the characteristics of their attacks differ. When two such similar characters function in an even slightly different manner, I give them a separate spot on the roster since that will affect battle records and whatnot. In that sense, you could say she was very lucky to join the fray!"

Do you think Octolings act different enough from Inklings in terms of characteristics of attacks for them to be separate characters on the roster?

Seeing as they pretty much do exactly the same things as the Inklings, no.

Assuming they even get featured as costumes in the first place, they will be like the Koopalings and stay that way.

 

[Troykv]

Ok, I have a topic for you guys to discuss. I was considering removing Octolings from my predictions until I re-read this portion of a Sakurai article:

"Initially, I had considered including Lucina as one of Marth's alternate costumes. After all, she has a close relationship with him in FE:A. In such cases, even if two characters' names and voices differ, as long as they function the same way, I assign them as alternate costumes. The Wii Fit Trainers, Villagers, and Robin are examples of this setup.

However, even though Lucina shares her physical stats and techniques with Marth, the characteristics of their attacks differ. When two such similar characters function in an even slightly different manner, I give them a separate spot on the roster since that will affect battle records and whatnot. In that sense, you could say she was very lucky to join the fray!"

Do you think Octolings act different enough from Inklings in terms of characteristics of attacks for them to be separate characters on the roster?

I think the Octolings would appear for reasons similars to characters like Roy... Also, I think the Octoling's character is different enough from the Inklings to feel weird seeing them using the same Taunt/Victory Animations (something that also helped Dark Pit to appear in the game; alongside the TST thing).

 

[DGAMER]

Unless they basically made the octolings use completely different variations of the weapons the inklings utilize, they are best as a alternate costume IMO.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

As others have said, there’s no telling who clones would be because we don’t know anything.

For all we know, the moveset will utilize every weapon for different attacks, leaving little room for a clone to use different weapons. Who knows?

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

I'd like to play as Octolings in some form, be it alts, clones, or even fully-different characters.

 

[Fenriraga]

Clones are bar none the most unpredictable part of any roster, which is weird to say because in a lot of their cases it's a "no duh" situation.

Who constitutes a good character to clone? Who's significant enough, or even insignificant enough, to be a clone? Do they even need to be from the same series? Do liberties have to be taken for that character to be a clone? Partial clone, or major clone? It's a tough thing to predict, honestly.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Clones have typically been characters who where relevant, so there's that to go off of.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Clones are bar none the most unpredictable part of any roster, which is weird to say because in a lot of their cases it's a "no duh" situation.

Who constitutes a good character to clone? Who's significant enough, or even insignificant enough, to be a clone? Do they even need to be from the same series? Do liberties have to be taken for that character to be a clone? Partial clone, or major clone? It's a tough thing to predict, honestly.

I don't think we will ever get a clone from one series of another series (is that how you would say that?) ever again.
But, who knows lol.

Also I pointed out a few pages ago that the only clones we got last game were upgraded costumes and so we almost didn't get any clones. It could be possible we don't get any this time with how Sakurai makes rosters now.

 

[Fenriraga]

I don't think we will ever get a clone from one series of another series (is that how you would say that?) ever again.
But, who knows lol.

Also I pointed out a few pages ago that the only clones we got last game were upgraded costumes and so we almost didn't get any clones. It could be possible we don't get any this time with how Sakurai makes rosters now.

I would love that. But I also feel like some characters like Lucas should stay... But by that same token I think Ganondorf needs to get a complete rework. *Shrug*

 

[NintenZ]

I think Octolings could possibly be DLC but not in the base game.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

I think Octolings could possibly be DLC but not in the base game.

I don't see them making octolings a unique character though, like I really can't see them not being clones

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

I would love that. But I also feel like some characters like Lucas should stay... But by that same token I think Ganondorf needs to get a complete rework. *Shrug*

Sorry I should have been clear I meant no new clones. It seems unlikely, but we alkost didn't have any last game so eh?