Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Fenriraga]

Or perhaps... Geno and Mallow tag team for SSB5? :O

S T O P
DON'T MAKE ME DAYDREAM ABOUT MARIO RPG REPRESENTATION ANYMORE THAN I ALREADY DO

 

[Crap-Zapper]

If Geno became playable. Mallow should really be an Assist Trophy! (Unless he also got playable ... One can dream, right?)

 

[True Blue Warrior]

My reasonings for Dee's lack of substantial potential is not just that. You are reading and simplifying my points too much. :/

It's a rubbish and biased argument, especially when you think Kawashima of all characters has a decent chance.

 

[Roberk]

Even if so, they'd need Square's permission to use the characters.

Right now, my gut says it's slow news day filler but we'll see where this goes.

But wouldn’t they have to have Square’s permission to use them in the tweet? Sure, maybe it’s just for a quota, but would they really go up to Square Enix and ask permission to use these characters that they haven’t acknowledged in years? It doesn’t add up, there’s something going on here...

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

One thing I love is costumes in games. Notably in Overwatch, Heroes of the Storm, and, yes, Street Fighter V. That being said, what if we get Halloween themed costumes for 15 characters; veterans only. What would they be?

1. Dracula Mario
2. Sucubus Peach
3. (Were)Wolf Link
4. Witches Brew Pikachu (witch hat and tail resembles a broomstick)
5. Mummified Fox
6. It Came from The Swamp Greninja (swamp monster merman thing)
7. Gandorfrankenstein
8. Zombie Pit
9. Icabod Falcon (trench coat wearing Cap Falcon with a pumpkin for a head)
10. Skull Kirby
11. Impish Villager (imp costume)
12. Cheerlead Captain Wii Fit Trainer
13. Demon Lord Marth
14. Necromancer Robin
15. Pirate Sonic

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I don't think Geno is going to be playable because I doubt Square Enix would be cool with the idea.

 

[BluePikmin11]

It's a rubbish and biased argument, especially when you think Kawashima of all characters has a decent chance.

I would discuss Kawashima, but that is for another discussion for another day. I already settled my matter with Bandanna Dee after seeking for other perspectives, and I got that today.

I will be off doing more research for Smash speculation.

 

[Kotor]

Guys you know what this means?

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Mallow confirmed for Smash!

Nah, it's for Splatoon 2. The next Splatfest theme after the TMNT crossover will be Mallow vs Geno.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Geno would require more hoops for Nintendo to jump through than the average Mario character, I can't see them willing to do that. It still blows my mind we got a Geno Mii Costume in Smash 4.

 

[Fenriraga]

One thing I love is costumes in games. Notably in Overwatch, Heroes of the Storm, and, yes, Street Fighter V. That being said, what if we get Halloween themed costumes for 15 characters; veterans only. What would they be?

1. Dracula Mario
2. Sucubus Peach
3. (Were)Wolf Link
4. Witches Brew Pikachu (witch hat and tail resembles a broomstick)
5. Mummified Fox
6. It Came from The Swamp Greninja (swamp monster merman thing)
7. Gandorfrankenstein
8. Zombie Pit
9. Icabod Falcon (trench coat wearing Cap Falcon with a pumpkin for a head)
10. Skull Kirby
11. Impish Villager (imp costume)
12. Cheerlead Captain Wii Fit Trainer
13. Demon Lord Marth
14. Necromancer Robin
15. Pirate Sonic

Random but fun idea! Let's see...

Pirate Mario (Mario Party 2)
Western Peach (Mario Party 2)
Spaceman Luigi (Mario Party 2)
(Were)wolf Fox
Pumpkin Sonic (SA2)
Super-Hero Pac Man (Pac Man 2)
Arthur's Knight Armor for Megaman (Ghosts n' Goblins)
Mad-Scientist Shulk (He IS a bit of a scientist)
Ghost Kirby (Just him wearing a bed sheet with holes cut in it, lol)
Demon King Marth (Just love that idea, haha)
Vampire Robin
Headless Horsemen Ganondorf
Goblin/Bokoblin Link
Detective Pikachu (just give him a trentchcoat along with the hat)
Mine Climbers (Icies with miner costumes and Pickaxes)

 

[Roberk]

One thing I love is costumes in games. Notably in Overwatch, Heroes of the Storm, and, yes, Street Fighter V. That being said, what if we get Halloween themed costumes for 15 characters; veterans only. What would they be?

1. Dracula Mario
2. Sucubus Peach
3. (Were)Wolf Link
4. Witches Brew Pikachu (witch hat and tail resembles a broomstick)
5. Mummified Fox
6. It Came from The Swamp Greninja (swamp monster merman thing)
7. Gandorfrankenstein
8. Zombie Pit
9. Icabod Falcon (trench coat wearing Cap Falcon with a pumpkin for a head)
10. Skull Kirby
11. Impish Villager (imp costume)
12. Cheerlead Captain Wii Fit Trainer
13. Demon Lord Marth
14. Necromancer Robin
15. Pirate Sonic

>Not thinking that Grima Robin would be the most fitting Halloween skin ever.

 

[Opossum]

One thing I love is costumes in games. Notably in Overwatch, Heroes of the Storm, and, yes, Street Fighter V. That being said, what if we get Halloween themed costumes for 15 characters; veterans only. What would they be?

1. Dracula Mario
2. Sucubus Peach
3. (Were)Wolf Link
4. Witches Brew Pikachu (witch hat and tail resembles a broomstick)
5. Mummified Fox
6. It Came from The Swamp Greninja (swamp monster merman thing)
7. Gandorfrankenstein
8. Zombie Pit
9. Icabod Falcon (trench coat wearing Cap Falcon with a pumpkin for a head)
10. Skull Kirby
11. Impish Villager (imp costume)
12. Cheerlead Captain Wii Fit Trainer
13. Demon Lord Marth
14. Necromancer Robin
15. Pirate Sonic

One alternative for Marth could be taken from a bit of dialogue from Shadow Dragon, where King Jiol of Gra calls Marth nothing but a "Prince of Ghosts," threatening to kill him then and there. Having Marth have a literal ghost alt for a Halloween costume would be a neat callback, plus it'd make thematic sense considering how much permadeath factors into the series.

Other than that, Zombie Mario from the unused Odyssey costumes, Mr. L Luigi, and Gnome Little Mac would be great.

 

[TumblrFamous]

Alright folks, I'm posting another roster. This one is a little different from ones I've previously posted. This is probably the last one I'm posting pre-E3, and I will update it accordingly once we get the new information, as I think having any sort of information will change expectations everywhere and for everyone.

View attachment 144089

First, this is different from my previous rosters for a few reasons. Wolf is no longer there, there are placeholder icons for newcomers and 3rd parties. This roster is a mix of expectation and what I'd like to see. What I'd like to see is based on a mix of expectation and gameplay possibilities.

Some notes:

This roster is based on a mindset that this game is being built off of Wii U. Characters have been ported over and updated with visuals, hitboxes, animations, etc. This is based on my mindset I posted yesterday regarding the timetable and the situation Nintendo was in, as well as looking to the future. I'm posting this before I had a link to the comment, but I'm sure you can find it. If you're interested in more about it, I can link you to it.

Other notes:

We know Inklings are in.

With Tropical Freeze happening and a new game potentially around the corner, I think Dixie could very well get added this time. She hasn't appeared as an AT or anything in Smash up to this point, and I think with her establishment as the "3rd Kong" in the series, I think she's got the best shot of anyone from the series. Next in line might be Cranky or Funky. I think K.Rool would be great, but he's been absent for quite awhile. I don't think he'll get into Smash until he actually shows up in mainline DK games.

While I do desire Decidueye, I just think he'd be a great fit. I understand the desire for Incineroar, but personally I think Decidueye gives an opportunity for not only gameplay differences, but visual as well. There's simply something that seems weird to have two of the same type on the roster at this point as far as Pokemon. Mimikyu is another option that could happen, but based on the suggestions I've seen from some fans on a gameplay level, I'm not entirely sure it would work as well as some think. I think there's potential, and I won't rule the little dude out, but I'm sticking to Decidueye.

Not really a newcomer, but I think Ice Climbers are pretty much coming back. I removed Wolf this time, and with him it seems to be a Roy situation with last game. Everyone kinda figured Roy would be brought back because of "fan demand" and it didn't happen on the base roster. I think something similar could happen here. I played a ton of Wolf when I played Brawl all those years ago, so I'd love to see him return. I just have my doubts.

I think Celica would make for a great character in Smash. Something about Fire Emblem makes me think Corrin was an early newcomer as we are heading into this game, with the final DLC being handed out on what seems like yesterday. I think the icon will change to be Female Corrin, but that's effectively negligible.

Takamaru could make for a fun Samurai-like fighter. I've always thought of him using Shurikens like Genji from Overwatch, in that he could throw 3 at a time at a fixed speed. There are other gameplay ideas, but I think he'd be pretty cool. There is the fact that Sakurai seems wary to add Japan exclusive characters, but who knows?

Isabelle. I get the sneaking suspicion that Animal Crossing will get a character in this game, and it's mainly because Animal Crossing has become a titan series for Nintendo. One thing that makes me reconsider is just the fact that she IS a peaceful character, and Villager does use a "kitchen sink" type moveset. But knowing Sakurai, I think he's given her a look and could probably come up with something cool.

Rex & Pyra. When it comes to Xenoblade, I think there are two main options. There's Elma from XCX, and then the dynamic duo of Rex & Pyra. When I consider the development of Smash Switch, and the probable visits Sakurai made to various studios, something makes me think he'd be given the option of Elma or Rex. Xenoblade 2 started development in 2015 and was released just last year. XCX was released in 2015. It is my humble opinion that the smart thing to do, to be especially current, would be to look at Rex & Pyra. This especially fits into the mindset I am following as far as the goals of this game. If it's meant to be more current, I've got a feeling it's Rex & Pyra.

Dillon, while from a minor/niche series, would be epic imo. He's already been in as an AT, and with a mix of spin dashes and Torb Turret use, I think he'd be incredibly fun to play. He's got the gameplay opportunities, but he's probably a dark horse candidate.

Spring Man. This one is a bit tricky because it's been hinted that nobody from ARMS is in Smash. This is simply another pick in the "looking ahead" roster choices. I'm not sure when ARMS began development, but there IS the chance Sakurai could have had the mindset of, "This game will release in 2018, what will be out by then, and what looks interesting/not so interesting". I think Spring Man would be great, and would almost definitely be the inaugural ARMS character, but this is probably my shakiest prediction.

The Smash Bros. icons and Newcomer icons are there because I will not predict further. I will not try to predict which characters will be easiest to clone, or which 3rd parties will be chosen, or what the "off the wall character nobody expected" will be, because frankly there isn't much of a way to do that. What I will say on 3rd parties is that I think Crash and Spyro are out of contention simply based on timing.
---
If there are any questions, I'd love to answer them. If you have any constructive criticism/feedback, I would also like to hear it. Chances are that the day of the reveal, I'll reflect and make another prediction. By no means am I looking to necessarily get things 100% right and seem like a "Smash speculah god".

I love your roster Scoliosis. Fair, balanced, makes sense.

However, I'm still set on Wolf coming back base roster. I don't know how comparable it is to Roy, as (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong) there wasn't as much demand for Roy to come back, at least on here. Most people were pretty set on there just being an Awakening rep.

Other than that, awesome roster.

 

[osby]

I love your roster Scoliosis. Fair, balanced, makes sense.

However, I'm still set on Wolf coming back base roster. I don't know how comparable it is to Roy, as (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong) there wasn't as much demand for Roy to come back, at least on here. Most people were pretty set on there just being an Awakening rep.

Other than that, awesome roster.

It was far from Mewtwo, but there was a lot of people upset about Roy's absence from Brawl. Actually, it seems he and Lucas was significantly popular than other cuts, hence their DLC inclusion to Smash For.

I may be wrong but it seems a lot of people who are fans of Wolf tend to be a little more on the hardcore side who appreciates his semi-cloneness, while Roy and Lucas have more fans who doesn't have any problem with clone-ness and likes the characters themselves. But this is really just generalizing.

 

[TumblrFamous]

It was far from Mewtwo, but there was a lot of people upset about Roy's absence from Brawl. Actually, it seems he and Lucas was significantly popular than other cuts, hence their DLC inclusion to Smash For.

I may be wrong but it seems a lot of people who are fans of Wolf tend to be a little more on the hardcore side who appreciates his semi-cloneness, while Roy and Lucas have more fans who doesn't have any problem with clone-ness and likes the characters themselves. But this is really just generalasing.

Gotcha. However, I said it yesterday, I'll say it again.

Lucas is not a clone.

Sorry, but anyone that says this shows how little they play the character.

 

[osby]

Gotcha. However, I said it yesterday, I'll say it again.

Lucas is not a clone.

Sorry, but anyone that says this shows how little they play the character.

I'm using clone as a blanket term for Ganondorf, Luigi, Dark Pit, Pichu... everyone because I really don't want to compare who shares what percent of their moveset with who every time I talk about them.

 

[Arcadenik]

"I can't imagine how the Duck Hunt Dog would be interesting, therefore Sakurai won't add him" - detractors before the Duck Hunt Dog was confirmed.

All of these are so true, especially this one. Oh my goodness! After 12 years of supporting Duck Hunt Dog, vindication is indeed a wonderful feeling.

 

[Murlough]

One thing I love is costumes in games. Notably in Overwatch, Heroes of the Storm, and, yes, Street Fighter V. That being said, what if we get Halloween themed costumes for 15 characters; veterans only. What would they be?

1. Dracula Mario
2. Sucubus Peach
3. (Were)Wolf Link
4. Witches Brew Pikachu (witch hat and tail resembles a broomstick)
5. Mummified Fox
6. It Came from The Swamp Greninja (swamp monster merman thing)
7. Gandorfrankenstein
8. Zombie Pit
9. Icabod Falcon (trench coat wearing Cap Falcon with a pumpkin for a head)
10. Skull Kirby
11. Impish Villager (imp costume)
12. Cheerlead Captain Wii Fit Trainer
13. Demon Lord Marth
14. Necromancer Robin
15. Pirate Sonic

1. Raichu/Mimikyu Hoodie Pikachu or PikaLibre
2. Thing 1/2 Ice Climbers
3. Banana Diddy
4. Witch Peach
5. Mario Hat and Mustache Jigglypuff
6. Vampire Luigi
7. Definately NOT Bowser
8. Boo Kirby
9. Silver Man Little Mac
10. Ryu costume Mario
11. Warioman
12. Cheerlead Captain Wii Fit is too good
13.Witch Rosalina (w/ Black and Orange Lumas)
14. Ghost Rider Falcon
15. Skeleton Paint Yoshi

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I was going to say before you get your hopes up on geno the roster was finalized back in 2016 or 2017

But however a chance he knew the annverisary was coming up so he could have decided on geno or mallow for that purpose

 

[Roberk]

When talking about these costumes and such, I would definitely pay money for costume DLC/seasonal costumes. I believe it’s a great way to represent characters who would be too similar to existing move-sets/characters already in Smash.

Chrom would work great as an Ike skin, just make Eruption have lightning effects instead of Fire, they already have an HD Chrom model in Smash 4. A lot of the sword lords can fit into Marth alternates with their similar body types and play styles (Eliwood, Seliph, Leif kinda). Just having respective masks on Luigi and King De De De would be cool. While generally unpopular, it worked great with the koopalings, allowing 8 whole characters to be playable in just one slot.

Costumes can do what assist trophies can’t: actually letting you play as the character. Not just an alternate color palette will do anymore. Costumes have so much potential when it comes to representing characters who deserve being in Smash but don’t make it due to external reasons (like Chrom not getting in due to potentially being too similar to Ike). It’s a great way to spice up the game’s roster and lifespan with periodic updates without having to create a whole newcomer.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

I just realized that if the switch life is as long as Nintendo wants it to be (up to 10 years) and there is only one smash game on this console like there has been in the past, then while this will be the shortest time between smash games, we could be looking at the longest time between smash games after Smash Switch, even if the next one is a launch title for the next system.

Doesn't mean much but is interesting. Kind of supports my thought about how this game will tackle dlc and its longevity.

 

[MopedOfJustice]

I'm using clone as a blanket term for Ganondorf, Luigi, Dark Pit, Pichu... everyone because I really don't want to compare who shares what percent of their moveset with who every time I talk about them.

Comparing Lucas and Luigi to someone like Pichu or Dark Pit is an extremely false equivalence. Even on a superficial level most of the attacks are very different, and if we're just going to say any recycling above a single move makes a clone, then that means Wolf is a Sonic clone.

 

[Sarki Soliloquy]

Are we going to get the Smashing Summer Swimsuits Costume Pack then? Wario's been priming himself up for bikini season.

...

I just killed the thread with that image, didn't I?

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

I just realized that if the switch life is as long as Nintendo wants it to be (up to 10 years) and there is only one smash game on this console like there has been in the past, then while this will be the shortest time between smash games, we could be looking at the longest time between smash games after Smash Switch, even if the next one is a launch title for the next system.

Doesn't mean much but is interesting. Kind of supports my thought about how this game will tackle dlc and its longevity.

Wait where did they say they wanted the switch to last for 10 years? no thank you sir

 

[KingBroly]

I wonder how people would react if Minecraft Steve was announced as playable for Smash...

during the Microsoft Press Conference the day before.

 

[Murlough]

Theres no way the switch is gonna last a decade. There are developers who don't want to reduce their game for a port to the Switch TODAY.

If Nintendo made it as good as PS4 and One then it may have been possible but as of now it just seems like wishful thinking, to put it as nicely as possible.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

I find it funny that Roy's fire supposedly made him start out as a character when Leif's sword uses light instead, and he promotes into a class that can use EVERY WEAPON TYPE IN THE SERIES except dark magic. He would've had far better moveset potential in future games if he got in Melee.

He's also a far better character from a much better game but you know.

Knowing that hurts my heart, but I understand why. He’s in Fire Emblem 4, right? Maybe they should remake that one, even though some of the newer games have adapted some of the features from it.

 

[osby]

Comparing Lucas and Luigi to someone like Pichu or Dark Pit is an extremely false equivalence. Even on a superficial level most of the attacks are very different, and if we're just going to say any recycling above a single move makes a clone, then that means Wolf is a Sonic clone.

I'm just saying I don't care how different they are unless we are talking about development type or spesific play style differences. They are different characters and I'm kinda bored everyone making a huge deal about this just because they play similarly.

 

[Sigran101]

I'm thinking it's possible Sakurai might opt to not add Isabelle because he feels it is too brutal to watch the innocent little puppy secretary get shot in the head with Bayonetta's guns and sliced with Cloud's sword and so on.

 

[osby]

It didn't stop him adding a innocent little kid mayor.

Though to be serious, I don't know how you can make a fighter out of Isabelle. "It done with Wii Fit Trainer etc." and "Sakurai will find a way" are easy to say.

 

[Sarki Soliloquy]

I'm thinking it's possible Sakurai might opt to not add Isabelle because he feels it is too brutal to watch the innocent little puppy secretary get shot in the head with Bayonetta's guns and sliced with Cloud's sword and so on.

I suuuuure do love running kids over with my Blue Falcon too. Teaches them for not looking both ways before crossing the street.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Wait where did they say they wanted the switch to last for 10 years? no thank you sir

https://www.google.com/amp/metro.co...-plans-support-switch-7-10-years-7281632/amp/

The then president (it was this past February) was quoted at extending the life to 7-10 years so I was using the max extension.

Also what's with the negativity. I love my switch and am completely down with not having to buy another console for a decade lol.

 

[Murlough]

I'm thinking it's possible Sakurai might opt to not add Isabelle because he feels it is too brutal to watch the innocent little puppy secretary get shot in the head with Bayonetta's guns and sliced with Cloud's sword and so on.

Is this a joke or trolling or what?

Jiggs, Pikachu, Kirby, Duck Hunt, etc. are equally as cute as Isabelle. Why would she stand out as a special case?

EDIT: I'm not being negative about the Switch's lifespan. I'm just being honest and stating facts. The Switch is less powerful than its competitors today. What happens when next gen comes around? The Switch will be left behind even more and less and less companies will want to try and get a Switch port running.

I'll just be the Wii U all over again...for 10 years.

 

[Roberk]

Knowing that hurts my heart, but I understand why. He’s in Fire Emblem 4, right? Maybe they should remake that one, even though some of the newer games have adapted some of the features from it.

While he is technically in the 4th Fire Emblem, Genealogy of the Holy War, he’s actually the main character/lord of the 5th Fire Emblem: Thracia 776. These two games are set during the same time, with all of Thracia taking place right in the middle of Genealogy. They are the next FE games set for a remake, and while they function differently maybe they will both be made at the same time since they are heavily connected, but IDK.

Seriously though, Leif is one of the best FE lords for his character, game, and moveset potential. The ability use all FE weapons nigh dark magic would be the closest we could get to a perfect representation of the weapons in the series.

 

[Sarki Soliloquy]

https://www.google.com/amp/metro.co...-plans-support-switch-7-10-years-7281632/amp/

The then president (it was this past February) was quoted at extending the life to 7-10 years so I was using the max extension.

Also what's with the negativity. I love my switch and am completely down with not having to buy another console for a decade lol.

Who's ready for a decade of 3DS booooooooiz!?

 

[Chandeelure]

Is this a joke or trolling or what?

Jiggs, Pikachu, Kirby, Duck Hunt, etc. are equally as cute as Isabelle. Why would she stand out as a special case?

Well, Pokemon literally is about making the characters fight with super powers and Kirby is very violent when you ignore the cute characters and all that.

Animal Crossing and specially Isabelle are about being nice, innocent and peaceful.
Even in her Assist Trophy form she tries to not get hit and is scared.

 

[Sigran101]

Is this a joke or trolling or what?

Jiggs, Pikachu, Kirby, Duck Hunt, etc. are equally as cute as Isabelle. Why would she stand out as a special case?

It's not like I'm saying that will happen. Just a thought. Pikachu Jigglypuff, and Kirby fight in their games and duck hunt is from a shooting game. It's just something I can see happening. I personally want her in as a terraforming character but it just occurred to me that this mindset could be possible.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

https://www.google.com/amp/metro.co...-plans-support-switch-7-10-years-7281632/amp/

The then president (it was this past February) was quoted at extending the life to 7-10 years so I was using the max extension.

Also what's with the negativity. I love my switch and am completely down with not having to buy another console for a decade lol.

10 years is just too long for a console imo, the switch's visuals are already lackluster compared to competitors, they don't wanna fall behind even further and turn away 3rd parties. Plus I don't wanna be stuck with the switch's visuals for another 9 years tbh.

 

[MopedOfJustice]

Seriously though, Leif is one of the best FE lords for his character, game, and moveset potential. The ability use all FE weapons nigh dark magic would be the closest we could get to a perfect representation of the weapons in the series.

I've already harped on this, but Smash has too many of those movesets. I'd much rather have a character with a single weapon applied differently than one who uses 10 different weapons a couple times each. If it's Lyndis doing Iaido but pulling out a bow for a special or two, that's fine, but we don't need any more Game and Watches with entire arsenals that they barely make use of.

 

[Murlough]

Well, Pokemon literally is about making the characters fight with super powers and Kirby is very violent when you ignore the cute characters and all that.

Animal Crossing and specially Isabelle are about being nice, innocent and peaceful.
Even in her Assist Trophy form she tries to not get hit and is scared.

It's not like I'm saying that will happen. Just a thought. Pikachu Jigglypuff, and Kirby fight in their games and duck hunt is from a shooting game. It's just something I can see happening. I personally want her in as a terraforming character but it just occurred to me that this mindset could be possible.

Fair enough I guess. I don't understand the logic in that but okie dokie. Villager is from sweet and peaceful Animal Crossing yet its ok to shoot him?

And Pokemon aren't fought with firearms either (inb4 gun pokemon). The argument is just kind out there for me.