Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[TheLastJinjo]

On the topic of historical retro reps, are there even any more retro characters relevant to Nintendo's history who could make it into Smash as a playable character?

• Mach Rider is a notable NES game, and the character originally debuted as a toy in 1972, making an ideal fighter to represent Nintendo toys, specifically car related ones.
• Balloon Fighter is easily an iconic Famicom classic and would be an honorable tribute to the memory of Satoru Iwata.
• Excitebike was the 9th best selling Famicom game. However unlike Sheriff, Duck Hunt, Ice Climber, Balloon Fight, and Mach Rider, it has actually had multiple installments where as those characters have only had one. So it's debatable if Excitebike would be considered a true retro.

I think Sheriff is a likely possibility as a legacy character similar to Mr. Game & Watch & Duck Hunt. It wasn't a successful arcade game, but he is literally the first Nintendo character ever and it is a single installment, never re released with the exception of a Wario skin in WarioWare Inc.:MegaMicroGame$.

There aren't a lot of characters left, which is why I consider him more likely this time around.

 

[Deleted member]

Pit/Link shoot arrows for literally one move.

And literally WHAT is stopping the same thing from happening to Decidueye?

Seriously, this is where I don't understand the "oh it's an archer" logic people give.
Sakurai took a character whose entire modus operandi was being an archer....

...and instead of making arrows the main source of combat just like what he was known for, he makes Pit fire arrows for only a SINGLE ATTACK and instead puts more focus on a brand new bladed bow for melee combat that can be split into two smaller blades for his Smash debut.
And yet the symbol used for his franchise in Smash is a BOW AND ARROW. You'd think that would mean something as far as Pit's fighting style considering that was his signature weapon, but nope.

So why would Sakurai think to make an "archer" style of fighter for a Pokémon who only has a single bow-and-arrow related attack in the source material? Just because "it looks like an archer"?

The other trapping characters did slip my mind, but it's still a relatively unexplored niche that would be implemented with a ranged move in Spirit Shackle since Decidueye is an archer.

Implying Spirit Shackle will actually even DO that in Smash.
Think about it; when has a Pokémon's attack in Smash EVER actually done the secondary (or even PRIMARY in the case of status moves) effect from the games or even referenced them?
Chances are Spirit Shackle would have some sort of different feature in Smash if it has one at all and isn't just an "arrow with spooky energy". Hell, even Pokken does something different, making it lock the usage of Supports rather than actually keep the opponent in place.

Olimar doesn't incorporate grass moves into his moveset, he just smacks plant creatures around that fight with other elements. That's not really the same thing that Ivysaur used to do, which Decidueye would.

Would it, really?
The thing about Ivysaur is that it actually had to use several "grass" based attacks given it had little to work with otherwise due to its body. I would say it also had to do with the Type Advantage gimmick of Pokémon Trainer, but Charizard and Squirtle actually didn't have quite as many fire/water based attacks in comparison.
Decidueye doesn't really have the same limitations as Ivysaur and instead has a lot to directly fight with such as its wings, talons, beak, etc. It doesn't really "need" that many attacks that involve vines or firing things from a flower on its back, etc.
And when you look at Decidueye's movepool, it doesn't even have that many Grass attacks that really convey the "grass" aesthetic like Ivysaur.

I'll give you one but the overall point stands that Decidueye would be a completely unique fighter judging from his concept art alone.

From concept art alone, all it shows is that Decidueye can fire an arrow using its wings.

If an entire game where you use a bow as your primary means for attack wasn't enough to convince Sakurai to make a moveset centered around it, a single piece of concept art that shows an arrow is sure as hell not going to be enough to convince him.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

And literally WHAT is stopping the same thing from happening to Decidueye?

Seriously, this is where I don't understand the "oh it's an archer" logic people give.
Sakurai took a character whose entire modus operandi was being an archer....

...and instead of making arrows the main source of combat just like what he was known for, he makes Pit fire arrows for only a SINGLE ATTACK and instead puts more focus on a brand new bladed bow for melee combat that can be split into two smaller blades for his Smash debut.
And yet the symbol used for his franchise in Smash is a BOW AND ARROW. You'd think that would mean something as far as Pit's fighting style considering that was his signature weapon, but nope.

So why would Sakurai think to make an "archer" style of fighter for a Pokémon who only has a single bow-and-arrow related attack in the source material? Just because "it looks like an archer"?



Implying Spirit Shackle will actually even DO that in Smash.
Think about it; when has a Pokémon's attack in Smash EVER actually done the secondary (or even PRIMARY in the case of status moves) effect from the games or even referenced them?
Chances are Spirit Shackle would have some sort of different feature in Smash if it has one at all and isn't just an "arrow with spooky energy". Hell, even Pokken does something different, making it lock the usage of Supports rather than actually keep the opponent in place.


Would it, really?
The thing about Ivysaur is that it actually had to use several "grass" based attacks given it had little to work with otherwise due to its body. I would say it also had to do with the Type Advantage gimmick of Pokémon Trainer, but Charizard and Squirtle actually didn't have quite as many fire/water based attacks in comparison.
Decidueye doesn't really have the same limitations as Ivysaur and instead has a lot to directly fight with such as its wings, talons, beak, etc. It doesn't really "need" that many attacks that involve vines or firing things from a flower on its back, etc.
And when you look at Decidueye's movepool, it doesn't even have that many Grass attacks that really convey the "grass" aesthetic like Ivysaur.


From concept art alone, all it shows is that Decidueye can fire an arrow using its wings.

If an entire game where you use a bow as your primary means for attack wasn't enough to convince Sakurai to make a moveset centered around it, a single piece of concept art that shows an arrow is sure as hell not going to be enough to convince him.



EDIT:
I swear, I will outright flame the next poster who suggests the idea of Balloon Fighter getting in "to serve as a tribute to Iwata".

If you sick ****s think using someone's death to support your wanted character getting into Smash is in ANY way or shape ok, then you deserve to be assaulted with no mercy.

I have no particular tie to the character. They asked about a character that has historical context within Nintendo and I along with others gave one. Nintendo has put other references and honors to Iwata in their games and products.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

are we still talking about Pokémon type representation. I’m ok with certain types getting in as long as they warrant an inclusion. That being said, I do like seeing a fair distribution in represented types which thankfully we have in Smash. This is something this hat I find lacking in Pokken where every other Pokemon is either a Fire or a Ghost type. Fighting I understand but do we seriously need so many Fire and Ghost types?

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Sheriff interests me as a historical character, but I think he is too obscure. The Game and Watch line of games was a big success, R.O.B. got people in the west to care about video games again, and Duck Hunt is one of the best selling video games ever.

Sheriff's game was a failure in pretty much every way, and hardly anybody remembers/cares about him or his game.

You have a good point. All of the IPs introduced in Super Smash Bros for Wii U were undeniably successful.

But, the reason I consider him more likely this time around is because there is a shortage of legacy characters. Sheriff being as obscure and forgotten as he is is kind of the draw in my opinion. It was a single installment that's never been re released and it's probably impossible to get a hold of. Unless you own a copy of WarioWare, it's likely you will never play this game without an emulator. That's something very unique for a Super Smash Bros newcomer, cuz you could get a copy of Duck Hunt at a store for 5$, or a Game & Watch for a couple hundred or sometimes 40$ on ebay.

Being the first Nintendo character ever makes him kind of a history lesson character, and there's a lot of history about the games you can't find easily on the internet. For example, there are names for the characters. The cabinet refer to Sheriff as Mr. Jack and the damsel as Betty where as in the american version, the cabinet refer to Betty as Pretty Priscilla and Sheriff as "Our Hero".

With a shortage of easy pickings, I can see them wanting to do something out of the ordinary this time around. I think it all comes down to the timing.

 

[Opossum]

And literally WHAT is stopping the same thing from happening to Decidueye?

Seriously, this is where I don't understand the "oh it's an archer" logic people give.
Sakurai took a character whose entire modus operandi was being an archer....

...and instead of making arrows the main source of combat just like what he was known for, he makes Pit fire arrows for only a SINGLE ATTACK and instead puts more focus on a brand new bladed bow for melee combat that can be split into two smaller blades for his Smash debut.
And yet the symbol used for his franchise in Smash is a BOW AND ARROW. You'd think that would mean something as far as Pit's fighting style considering that was his signature weapon, but nope.

So why would Sakurai think to make an "archer" style of fighter for a Pokémon who only has a single bow-and-arrow related attack in the source material? Just because "it looks like an archer"?



Implying Spirit Shackle will actually even DO that in Smash.
Think about it; when has a Pokémon's attack in Smash EVER actually done the secondary (or even PRIMARY in the case of status moves) effect from the games or even referenced them?
Chances are Spirit Shackle would have some sort of different feature in Smash if it has one at all and isn't just an "arrow with spooky energy". Hell, even Pokken does something different, making it lock the usage of Supports rather than actually keep the opponent in place.


Would it, really?
The thing about Ivysaur is that it actually had to use several "grass" based attacks given it had little to work with otherwise due to its body. I would say it also had to do with the Type Advantage gimmick of Pokémon Trainer, but Charizard and Squirtle actually didn't have quite as many fire/water based attacks in comparison.
Decidueye doesn't really have the same limitations as Ivysaur and instead has a lot to directly fight with such as its wings, talons, beak, etc. It doesn't really "need" that many attacks that involve vines or firing things from a flower on its back, etc.
And when you look at Decidueye's movepool, it doesn't even have that many Grass attacks that really convey the "grass" aesthetic like Ivysaur.


From concept art alone, all it shows is that Decidueye can fire an arrow using its wings.

If an entire game where you use a bow as your primary means for attack wasn't enough to convince Sakurai to make a moveset centered around it, a single piece of concept art that shows an arrow is sure as hell not going to be enough to convince him.

As far as the Pit thing, it's more conjecture than anything, but I honestly think Sakurai had something against having projectiles in non-special moves until Smash 4. I know I'm not alone in thinking that either, as when it was shown that Mega Man and Villager (and later Mii Gunner and Palutena) had non-special projectiles, people were surprised. No one even considered it an option in any of the proposed fan movesets I saw. Look no further than all the sets for Mega Man with the Mega Buster as a neutral special, and a weapon changer for a down special to get his other projectiles in.

I fully believe that if Pit's first appearance was in Smash 4, he'd be much more of a "true archer." Same with Samus and Link having more projectiles. But since Sakurai doesn't like doing full scale moveset overhauls, Decidueye could be the first real chance for a true archer.

 

[Pazzo.]

Imagine if Sakurai doesn't do a single moveset overhaul for all veterans.

Hold it, has he only changed specials and maybe one or two normals between games?

 

[Sarki Soliloquy]

I remember one time I drew Kirby hats for all 151 Pokemon. This was before Gold and Silver came out in the States - back during the 64 days. Those were the days. I would use my Nintendo figurines and plus toys to reenact Smash fight scenes. Mewtwo, Wario, Bowser, and Peach were all newcomers in those mock battles

So what you're saying is... you're the true Master Hand?

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Imagine if Sakurai doesn't do a single moveset overhaul for all veterans.

Hold it, has he only changed specials and maybe one or two normals between games?

Captain Falcon and Falco had major animation overhauls between M & B and Roy got a few different moves when he returned in 4 but nothing earth shattering.

Kirby and Jigglypuff also got movest changes with Kirby getting new aerials.

 

[Deleted member]

As far as the Pit thing, it's more conjecture than anything, but I honestly think Sakurai had something against having projectiles in non-special moves until Smash 4. I know I'm not alone in thinking that either, as when it was shown that Mega Man and Villager (and later Mii Gunner and Palutena) had non-special projectiles, people were surprised. No one even considered it an option in any of the proposed fan movesets I saw. Look no further than all the sets for Mega Man with the Mega Buster as a neutral special, and a weapon changer for a down special to get his other projectiles in.

I fully believe that if Pit's first appearance was in Smash 4, he'd be much more of a "true archer." Same with Samus and Link having more projectiles. But since Sakurai doesn't like doing full scale moveset overhauls, Decidueye could be the first real chance for a true archer.

This...is actually a good point that I had not considered. Huh.

Though I do have one counter in that Decidueye isn't the first real chance for a true archer.
With Link being heavily changed up to reflect BotW as opposed to TP like Brawl and Smash 4, there is a major plausibility in a moveset overhaul with him.
And since BotW Link is actually shown to have his bow with him at all times....


And is represented more with a bow than anything else in general unlike other Links....

EDIT: Unless the fact Link has a sword means he isn't a "true archer", in which case we can't count Decidueye as one either because Leaf Blade.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I know this conversation is over with, but as far as Ganondorf with Dead Man’s Volley, there’s one glaring flaw in using it.

In a game like Smash...why bother reflecting a projectile that can damage you if you can just dodge it instead? Especially if your character of choice doesn’t have an actual reflecting move like Fox or Falco?

There may be an easy fix, but if it’s a heavily flawed move then it probably wouldn’t be worth changing in the first place. However, they could make it so that he could cancel it and get himself out of harms way.

 

[Pazzo.]

Never noticed you can see the glint in Link's right eye.

Oh wait, that was just a smudge on my screen. This is what happens when you stare too long for clues to Mr. Hanafuda Man.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Characters more likely than you think #8: Sheriff?
Character: Sheriff (A.K.A. "Mr. Jack" or "Our Hero")
Universe: Sheriff/Bandido
Debut: 1979
Role: Legacy Character

History:
Sheriff is the first Nintendo character ever. In a video game at least. It is not the first Nintendo video game, but he is the first character. When his game came out, Western themed arcade games were a trend. So that's something else that makes Sheriff a good representative.

The Cast: Mr. Jack (The Sheriff), Betty (The Damsel), Gang (The Bandits), Condor (The Vulture)

Sheriff is an arcade game that was released in 1979 by Nintendo. In the game, you must save the recently kidnapped woman by shooting the bandits that surround your player. Once they're all gone, another group of bandits will appear and you must start over until you complete the game. Once you beat the game, a heart will go above your player and the woman (indicating that they've fallen in love). The game's characters were designed by Shigeru Miyamoto.
- (Nintendo Fandom Wiki: http://nintendo.wikia.com/wiki/Sheriff)

Another version of the game titled Bandido was distributed by Exidy in 1980. The only difference is in the game's cabinet, sporting a different title and a "Cast of Characters" panel naming the girl "Pretty Priscilla", while calling the Sheriff "Our Hero" and showing Wanted signs for the bandit and the condor.
- (Nintendo Fandom Wiki: http://nintendo.wikia.com/wiki/Sheriff)

Other appearances

• Game Boy Camera: An animation based on Sheriff can be found in the credits menu.
• Super Smash Bros. Melee: Sheriff appears as a trophy.
• WarioWare, Inc.: Mega Microgame$!: One of 9-Volt´s mini-games is based on Sheriff and a game known as Wario´s Sheriff, with Sheriff´s head replaced with Wario´s, can be unlocked.
• WarioWare, Inc.: Mega Party Game$: This cameo is the same as the cameo in the original WarioWare.
• Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS: Sheriff makes an appearance as an assist trophy and shoots at fighters in one of 8 directions.

- (Nintendo Fandom Wiki: http://nintendo.wikia.com/wiki/Sheriff)

What makes Sheriff unique?:
Sheriff is the first character with EIGHT directional attacks, on the ground and in the air. This turns a larger portion of the arena into his territory (and he is very serious about protecting his territory).

Specials:

• Neutral Special: Charge Shot (unlike the directional tilts, this has a longer range and packs a punch, making opponents flinch. Hold down B and Sheriff's eyes will glow. Aim in eight directions, then release B. You can remain airborne when charging this move.)
• Side Special: Rogue (These are the Bandits in the game)
• Down Special: Barrier (These are the walls that have numbers on them. They can be used as a shield until the number hits zero)
• Up Special: Condor (Condor is the Vulture)
• Final Smash: Sheriff becomes his original pixel form. This Final Smash functions just like the Assist Trophy.

Music:

The Case:
Sheriff is something different this time around. His game was not successful, but there are not a lot of successful legacy characters remaining. I believe this time Super Smash Bros is going to do something a little different, and go for an intentionally obscure, yet historically significant character, like Sheriff.

Sheriff is the oldest character (by 39 years), his game was exclusively an arcade game, and it's a game that can't be played without an emulator, unlike other retro games that can be bought in stores or downloaded from Nintendo's shop channels. This provides an appeal that is not obtained by other characters in this day and age.

I think the timing is good. There is a shortage of easy pickings, and I think at least one of the newcomers is going to be a character who's NOT known to many people, but still has great historical significance to Nintendo's history.

 

[NintenRob]

If you’re talking playing all zelda games, Ganon outclasses Ganondorf.

If you’re talking people that started playing zelda after it was already around for 10 years, Ganondorf, sure.

Moblin Lord > Gerudo Lord.

They're the same person.... I find this Ganondorf vs Ganon argument to be really silly.

 

[Metablaze]

Chrom
Virion
Celica
Merric
Caeda
Silque

Because dammit if I'm going to singlehandedly give Fire Emblem the most amount of characters by far, I'm adding my favorites. So with this I'd have my seven favorite Fire Emblem characters in Smash, since Marth rounds out my top five.


For a non-Fire Emblem answer:
Dixie Kong
Funky Kong

Since Robin already uses Chrom in his final smash he probably wont be able to be a smasher.

 

[viewtifulduck82]

Since Robin already uses Chrom in his final smash he probably wont be able to be a smasher.

Palutena was in pit's final smash in brawl.

 

[ToddCam]

Hi Smash Speculators,

This is my first post of this cycle. Please indulge me a bit. It's emotional, so feel free to skip.

I've been lurking on and off since the Inkling Smash trailer. I was excited about the new Smash, but far from how I've felt in the past. Part of that is probably just from getting older (16 and a half years since I joined this site!), but part of it is from recent events in my life that have made me listless. I've bought several games in the last year. At the beginning of 2017, I was super excited by Breath of the Wild, and it was indeed an excellent game. Fire Emblem Echoes: Shadows of Valentia was excellent, too. I pre-ordered Super Mario Odyssey and Fire Emblem Warriors and Pokémon Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon. I was having loads of fun with games.

Then last June, my mom died. She had been sick and I had moved her in with me. I brought her food and cleaned her commode. I suctioned her trach valve, and went with her to appointments. She was a wonderful lady, by no means perfect, but kind and wise, and cute in that grandma way. Every night, I would kiss her forehead. The night she died, I did so as well. She called me over in the middle of the night because she was having trouble breathing, and I ended up having to perform CPR on her as the 911 operator coached me through it. I failed, and I know it's not my fault, but it has broken me.

After that, I've tried to live my life as best I can. I still go to work, I still see friends. I had never experienced grief before on this scale, so I tried to fill my time thinking of ways to honor her. Started a blog, started going to the gym (she wanted me to be healthy), finally found a career path, still thinking about that tattoo... great things. But I am who I am, and I love video games. As the games I pre-ordered came out, I found myself not particularly excited anymore. I did pretty well with FEW, because it's pretty mindless. But I got Ultra Sun and Moon, and Odyssey, and I have found myself unable to finish them. I know US&M are rehashes, and so my reaction was probably warranted, but I was definitely excited about Odyssey, and I got to like, stage 3, and just stopped playing. Since, I have still kept myself aware of games, and keep pre-ordering things hoping to enjoy them when I get them, but... nothing. I even got my first Kirby game with Kirby Star Allies and it's adorable as hell, and super easy, and I am just trudging through it. I still haven't even renewed my Pokémon Bank subscription, even though I have Pokémon in there from my original Ruby (including my original starter Blaziken). I actually thought to myself, I don't think I care much if the data is deleted.

Why am I bringing this up to a bunch of mostly strangers and acquaintances I've never seen in person and most of whom have never directly interacted with me? I'm getting there. Well, about a month after my mother died, I was in a Wal-Mart. I am not much of an impulse shopper, but I saw, sitting on a clearance rack, a stuffed Rowlet. Now, I thought Rowlet was the cutest Pokémon. It was my starter in Moon, and it turned out to be female. I've always loved owls, and their cultural connection to wisdom was one I have always liked. That they are also fearsome hunters is another aspect I like. But seeing the stuffed Rowlet, I immediately thought of my mother. Not that it was hard to, but, she was wise, she was cute, and she could be fearsome when she needed to be. Like an owl. Like a Rowlet.

So I bought it. I don't have any other stuffed animals. Not really my thing. But I had it. That first night, I cradled it kind of how I did with my mom, and kissed it on the crown of its head (body?). I put it on my nightstand so it could watch me through the night. Stupid, silly, maudlin stuff. But it helped. When my apartment building burned down six months to the day she died (an extension cord in one of the other apartments was the culprit), the Rowlet was one of the few things I was able to salvage from that area where the fire and water had damaged most. In my new apartment, it sits in a similar place, watching over me.

I'm getting to the relevant part for those who are still reading. Again, when Smash was announced, I was excited, but it was muted. All the thoughts swirled through my head, and I started to wonder if maybe, maybe, I'm going to be done with video games if I can't muster the interest in this. But I have come here, lurking as usual. I don't know how I missed it, but until today I hadn't noticed, at least not consciously, the idea of Decidueye as a playable character in Smash, my favorite game series, and it had not occurred to me. I suddenly felt the pure excitement of yesteryear. Would I even enjoy playing as Decidueye? Who knows? I may be crazy, and desperately clinging to a part of my old identity, but I do want to thank you all, even those who hate Rowlet/Decidueye/Pokémon in general, for helping me get some of my old joy back, even if only for now. I have had a lot of fun mostly lurking on Smash Boards for these 16+ years, and I'd hate to stop now.

That's all. Thanks for reading.
-ToddCam

 

[Deleted member]

Palutena was in pit's final smash in brawl.

She only made a brief cameo as an image. Chrom is an active part of Robin's Final Smash.

Not comparable.

 

[Freduardo]

She only made a brief cameo as an image. Chrom is an active part of Robin's Final Smash.

Not comparable.

You’re still missing the obvious solution.

No not an alternate color/costume for The Chrom that appears in the final Smash....

Leave this to Alfonso.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

I kind of agree with Jinjo, a lot of people are sleeping on Sheriff.

He's like the last historical hardware character left.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

They're the same person.... I find this Ganondorf vs Ganon argument to be really silly.

In most cases, yep. (In FSA, it's a completely different Ganon with no relations to the original Ganon or Ganondorf, making him a literally different person. Otherwise, well, yeah).

Though there's very unique variations of Ganon who don't seem anywhere close to the Moblin guy. Like Puppet Ganon and Beast Ganon. Never mind the variation in HW. Nonetheless, they're different characters that people recognize anyway. Some don't know who Ganondorf is, but recognize his Moblin forms. And vice versa.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

It's kind of hard to predict Retro/WTF (Hardware) characters as a whole, so I can see why people would sleep on Sheriff.

 

[Deleted member]

I kind of agree with Jinjo, a lot of people are sleeping on Sheriff.

He's like the last historical hardware character left.

The only real historical significance is that Sheriff was the first game Nintendo made that starred an actual character.
And while that was good for a trophy and an Assist Trophy role, that isn't quite good for the future in comparison to the likes of Mr. Game & Watch, R.O.B., and Duck Hunt.

Especially since that now as an Assist Trophy, he would make a horrible "surprise" character, which those three served as more so than "hardware characters".

 

[Opossum]

Since Robin already uses Chrom in his final smash he probably wont be able to be a smasher.

I love how it was a post about hypothetically doubling the amount of characters in Fire Emblem's Smash roster that even included more minor characters like Merric, Virion, and Silque, but it's Chrom that's the deal breaker.

Literally ninety percent of that post was unrealistic. That was the point.

 

[Deleted member]

Beast Ganon

"Beast Ganon" isn't separate from Ganon. It's still Ganon.

That was as much a localization error for Brawl as "Meta Ridley" is for Smash Wii U.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

"Beast Ganon" isn't separate from Ganon. It's still Ganon.

That was as much a localization error for Brawl as "Meta Ridley" is for Smash Wii U.

Not what I meant. I was talking about how it wasn't a Moblin like Puppet Ganon was.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Palutena was in pit's final smash in brawl.

Difference was that Chrom was flat out shot down for not being unique, further emphasized arguably three times, going so far as the game itself basically degrading Chrom as a "carbon copy" of Ike. No other character in the history of Smash Bros. has this particular distinction, not even the actual clones.

The fact he even appears in Robin's Final Smash is one of the more merciful things that happened to him.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

The only real historical significance is that Sheriff was the first game Nintendo made that starred an actual character.
And while that was good for a trophy and an Assist Trophy role, that isn't quite good for the future in comparison to the likes of Mr. Game & Watch, R.O.B., and Duck Hunt.

Especially since that now as an Assist Trophy, he would make a horrible "surprise" character, which those three served as more so than "hardware characters".

So playable Virtual Boy then?

Inb4 Arcadenik brings up Track Meet.

 

[Deleted member]

So playable Virtual Boy then?

Inb4 Arcadenik brings up Track Meet.

Arcadenik can bring up "Track Meet" all he wants; doesn't change the fact it isn't an actual Nintendo IP nor does it have nearly as much significance as Duck Hunt did. The only argument made is "because there's a 3-pack of Mario, Duck Hunt, and Track Meet in North America". -_-

As for Virtual Boy, that would make for a good "surprise", but R.O.B. kinda already references it.

 

[FlareHabanero]

So playable Virtual Boy then?

Make the Virtual Boy a cold killing machine like in the commercials and I'll approve of it.

 

[---]

Inb4 Arcadenik brings up Track Meet.

Well if Bandai Namco gets involved again I'd be all for having a Stadium Events stage.

 

[MrRoidley]

On the topic of historical retro reps, are there even any more retro characters relevant to Nintendo's history who could make it into Smash as a playable character?

Balloon Fighter, Urban Champion, Excitebike Racer, to a lesser extent Takamaru I guess

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Make the Virtual Boy a cold killing machine like in the commercials and I'll approve of it.

Sakurai really screwed up by not making a Virtual Boy stage for the 3DS version of Smash.

 

[Cyn]

On the topic of historical retro reps, are there even any more retro characters relevant to Nintendo's history who could make it into Smash as a playable character?

On the subject of ROB, Professor Hector/Vector would be interesting to see.

 

[Gumzilla]

Now that I think about it I wouldn't mind if Sora was at least a trophy in the Final Fantasy or Other category.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Well if Bandai Namco gets involved again I'd be all for having a Stadium Events stage.

the nightmare of every collector ever

bad, tri. bad.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Japan Time Podcast mentioned the idea of Link's weapons being easily breakable in Smash like in BOTW, and that thought would seriously bring a new refreshing playstyle for Link TBH. Though technically Robin already does this though.

 

[NintenRob]

In most cases, yep. (In FSA, it's a completely different Ganon with no relations to the original Ganon or Ganondorf, making him a literally different person. Otherwise, well, yeah).

Though there's very unique variations of Ganon who don't seem anywhere close to the Moblin guy. Like Puppet Ganon and Beast Ganon. Never mind the variation in HW. Nonetheless, they're different characters that people recognize anyway. Some don't know who Ganondorf is, but recognize his Moblin forms. And vice versa.

But even in Four Swords Adventure, he starts off as Ganondorf off screen. One form form may be more recognized than the other, But as the same character, They're singularly the most iconic Zelda villain and the main antagonist. Which goes back to the original point of Skull Kid being the second most iconic villain in the series.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

But even in Four Swords Adventure, he starts off as Ganondorf off screen. One form form may be more recognized than the other, But as the same character, They're singularly the most iconic Zelda villain and the main antagonist. Which goes back to the original point of Skull Kid being the second most iconic villain in the series.

Person and Character are actually different things anyway. A character is a specific individual in a work, and every "transformation" is yet another character to note. They're the same person, but still different characters. Not everybody recognizes Ganondorf no matter how you cut it. Ganon is vastly more well known. It's always gone Ganon > Ganondorf in terms of recognizability. I'm not even sure Skull Kid truly comes in as a 3rd either. Agnahim might actually edge him out due to ALTTP being severely more well known than MM. The problem is MM isn't nearly all that well known compared to some others, and that's the only time Skull Kid is a specific villain. He's not nearly as well known as people think. Not that he isn't awesome.

Also, that's still an unrelated Ganondorf as is. So basically, it's an entirely different person either way. There's more than one Ganon/Ganondorf just like there is more than one Link and Zelda. Fact of the matter is, it doesn't matter if they're the same person or not. As long as they can have a unique/fun moveset, they're worth considering. Zelda/Sheik are the same person(but different characters), same with Samus/Zero Suit Samus. It's not like it matters one bit if they're the same person or not and never actually did.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

So what you're saying is... you're the true Master Hand?

I suppose so. I had plushies of much of the Mario cast plus Pokemon wind-up figurines. Oh and Diddy Kong was also added to the group too. And I suppose I also added a few 3rd or 4th party characters like Optimus Prime, Buzz Lightyear, the Power Rangers, Godzilla and Mothra, and Strech Armstrong.