Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Bradli Wartooth]

Sakurai has been very clear that his intention every game is to give us the most complete game possible. Any veterans who are cut and returned to us in the form of DLC are only happening that way because they flat out could not fit within the time constraints. I don't find it possible that Sakurai will ever intentionally hold off characters for DLC unless he is being forced by Nintendo, and I don't think that'll happen. I think they could potentially pressure him into making more DLC than he initially wants, but I don't think they'd make him release a less complete game to make additional money.

 

[MrReyes96]

I don’t know what to expect for DLC, I was kinda disappointed by smash 4 dlc being veterans or 3rd party characters instead of new Nintendo characters
Hopefully we get that this time

 

[Danpal65]

In a way I kinda hope we don't get DLC for this game. Once the game is released it is good to go, with maybe some balance patches.

This would allow Sakurai to go on and work on another project for a change, we can enjoy Smash for what it is and speculate on what the next one might be like.

 

[osby]

I don’t know what to expect for DLC, I was kinda disappointed by smash 4 dlc being veterans or 3rd party characters instead of new Nintendo characters
Hopefully we get that this time

The thing is DLC is for characters that couldn't fit into the project plan: Character that weren't in Melee (Mewtwo), without an original moveset (Lucas, Roy), third parties that wasn't easy to negotiate (Ryu, Cloud) or the ones who only could be decided after the game is out (Bayonetta, Corrin).

If characters like say, King K.Rool or Isaac has enough going for them, they would've enter the roster in the base game. I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's probably isn't likely considering how last DLC designed.

 

[MrReyes96]

The thing is DLC is for characters that couldn't fit into the project plan: Character that weren't in Melee (Mewtwo), without an original moveset (Lucas, Roy), third parties that wasn't easy to negotiate (Ryu, Cloud) or the ones who only could be decided after the game is out (Bayonetta, Corrin).

If characters like say, King K.Rool or Isaac has enough going for them, they would've enter the roster in the base game. I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's probably isn't likely considering how last DLC designed.

I think I’d be fine with just those last 2

Ideally we’d just get free character updates like arms or overwatch

 

[osby]

I think I’d be fine with just those last 2

Ideally we’d just get free character updates like arms or overwatch

I doubt it will reach to the position of those two. Smash is designed with primarily casual audiences in mind (even though it started to cater competitive fans as well).

I'm not sure if it's really a game that needs to be "keep fresh", considering how much you can do with it in the first place.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I'm a casual gamer for the most part. I play to have fun. Not to win and I'm not overly competitive in anything.

I can safely say that I don't mind paying for DLC content if it's good content. Smash's DLC content for Wii U was excellent.

And I'd most assuredly have payed for the DLC Heroes in Overwatch. Ana, Sombra, Orisa, Moira, Brigitte are not only all very fun to me to play? All of them have some of the neatest concepts and characters in the game.

Screw Doomfist though. Overhyped piece of garbage he turned out to be. Lol.

Blizzard was being really generous giving the post launch heroes away for free.

 

[Murlough]

I doubt Sakurai would cut a character for the sake of it being DLC later, but if time constraints are a thing, I'd rather a "not-quite-made-it", low priority character be left for DLC with actual enhancements rather than be rushed into the main game.
But Pac-Man is definitely not low priority though lol.

I'm not actually saying that they may go the Destiny route of DLC. I'm just saying the whole deal with Lucas was something I'd rather they did not make a habit of. I didn't mind the Lucas DLC, and if they don't have Wolf in the base roster than release him as DLC this time around I will be cool with it.

But if I see two or more 4 newcomers come in as DLC I'm gonna be pretty peeved. If they make the "low priority" characters into DLC then I hope they have them be reduced in price compared to the DLC like Cloud and Ryu that add something exciting and new to the series.

I'm aware this post may sound entitled but I really don't think its unjustified. Other series catch **** for the kind of practice this post is discussing, I'm not willing to give Nintendo and Smash a pass just because its Nintendo and Smash, nor should any of its other customers.

tl;dr if the Lucas thing becomes a common occurrence for "low priority" characters then they already have a moveset and if the character stays exactly the same then they should not cost as much as a true newcomer.

Once again I'm not saying this will happen and I'm not really worried it will.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

As for Smash DLC?

Cut veterans of important status (sorry no Pichus here), third party icons/characters, and Nintendo hits that come out after the roster is planned should be the marketing plan for ANY Smash Brothers.

Like say Pokemon Switch comes out and a new Pokemon lights the world on fire. They are prime DLC opportunity.

Crash Bandicoot? Perfect for DLC.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

If the character is unfinishable on time? DLC is fine. Perhaps make those particular ones free updates or cost vastly less. Depending whatever is more feasible, being Nintendo is still a business, after all. And it's still extra work.

I like the idea of adding DLC beyond patches later on as new ideas come up. Seems normal to me. Not like we don't think of things way later that could be fun in content we're making. I have been working on all kinds of development for games myself(albeit, I only get so far as jotting down ideas and some graphical work via sprites, and rarely music, which I can't even access my old songs due incompatible old tech, but...).

 

[PLATINUM7]

As for Smash DLC?

Cut veterans of important status (sorry no Pichus here), third party icons/characters, and Nintendo hits that come out after the roster is planned should be the marketing plan for ANY Smash Brothers.

Like say Pokemon Switch comes out and a new Pokemon lights the world on fire. They are prime DLC opportunity.

Crash Bandicoot? Perfect for DLC.

Bringing up Pichu for DLC (well rather dismissing it but whatever) reminds of something I thought about previously.

I'm not sure Pichu would end up being DLC just because making people pay for a joke character doesn't seem ok.

Free DLC maybe, which might be justified if it remains a clone but I'm not sure that path will be taken.

 

[Deleted member]

If we get Pichu his electric moves better be busted in exchange for hurting himself. Make him a real glass cannon instead of a joke and I'd love to have the little guy back. And give Up Air a tail spike; that's the coolest thing Pikachu ever had.

 

[mario123007]

I don’t know what to expect for DLC, I was kinda disappointed by smash 4 dlc being veterans or 3rd party characters instead of new Nintendo characters
Hopefully we get that this time

I also hope once Smash Bros Switch is released it supports video capture. And Nintendo Switch will have new update where it supports video capture up to 5 minutes.

Let's face it, back in Wii U/3DS days where your replays becomes unplayable after every update is just.. Dumb...

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

I found DLC to be one of the most hype parts of Smash 4, and I really want it to return. Heck, it extended our speculation period by like 2 years. I will be very disappointed if they announce that DLC isn't coming to this game.

I don't really care what characters they add as DLC, as long as its properly balanced (lookin' at you, witch). Aside from characters, I hope they add a lot of stages. It'd be extra cool if they added stage packs, such as a "For Glory" pack with all tourney legal stages, and a "For Fun" pack with all goofy gimmicky stages.

 

[Hinata]

I found DLC to be one of the most hype parts of Smash 4, and I really want it to return. Heck, it extended our speculation period by like 2 years. I will be very disappointed if they announce that DLC isn't coming to this game.

Even if they do make an announcement to that extent, keep in mind Sakurai said the same thing for Smash 4 before Mewtwo was revealed.

 

[MrRoidley]

I think DLC is a surefire thing to come back, I mean it's a huge seller like Smash we're talking about\
I personally wasn't too excited about the DLC choices aside from Mewtwo and Bayo, but I get that the character picking process for DLC can work differently than the base game (case and point: Corrin being chosen solely to promote Fates)
No clue which could be the characters, it all depends on who gets in the base game, and who doesn't. Particularly, if there's a cut that's as shocking as Mewtwo, be sure they'll be first in line to come back as DLC

 

[Tree Gelbman]

We are in an age of DLC. Almost every major release has DLC.

Smash won't be any different I'm sure.

 

[YoshiandToad]

DLC can be a great inclusion to bolster an already great game and Nintendo has done a pretty good job with it during the Wii U period with Fire Emblem Awakening, Hyrule Warriors, Mario Kart 8 and Super Smash.

The cynical part of me has however gotten used to other companies dodgy DLC practices of the past though so I'm expecting some of the bigger names in Smash speculation to be kept back as DLC to make the most amount of cash possible

Not that it'd matter for most people on Smashboards, I dare say most members bought all the DLC even if they didn't like the character for the sake of an extra playable character option.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Nintendo has yet to be scummy with DLC practices.

So I don't think I can see them cackling and going ''And we'll hold back Ridley for DLC! MWHAHAHA."

Nintendo is a lot of things. Scummy isn't one of them.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I think that we're not gonna experience a lot of cuts because it now seems quite damn easy to port over character data from Smash Wii U than ever before. This is why I think if there's gonna be cuts, it's from 3rd party characters, Cloud being my best guess.

 

[Deleted member]

Honestly, I do not care if they do not add another Subspace, but... Adventure Mode should be a priority over Smash Tour.
Smash Tour is something, but it is a mess.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Honestly, I do not care if they do not add another Subspace, but... Adventure Mode should be a priority over Smash Tour.
Smash Tour is something, but it is a mess.

What about Smash Run?

 

[True Blue Warrior]

man, why the **** is everyone cutting corrin? fe fates is one of the few big games that nintendo released during the 2015/2016 time period and if corrin hadn't made it in as sm4sh dlc then they would absolutely be a top contender for smash 5. it makes no sense whatsoever to cut them. is it just leftover salt or are people still pushing that reps bs?

Well there is still the factor of Shadow of Valentia to consider, particularly as it was intended to be released in 2016 before being delayed.

As for the "reps" arguments, we already know that Sakurai already thought there were too many FE characters before Corrin was added, so if any franchise is at risk of getting a character cut it makes sense to think FE is the most likely one (and it is the only franchise in Smash 4 Sakurai has made the "overrepresented" argument about). I still think Roy is far more likely than Corrin to be low priority since he already was a cut veteran (due to low priority) that despite fan demand only came back as DLC.

To move on to a different topic, how much do you guys think Switch-era content will factor into Smash Switch? I'm pretty sure that we're at least getting Breath of the Wild and Mario Odyssey stages. I'm not sure whether the Splatoon content in Smash would solely focus on 1 or if we could still see a significant amount of representation from the second game. Maybe even an Assist Trophy of Snip and Clip (the main characters of Snipperclips)? At the very least, trophy and music representation is a given for Switch-era content.

 

[-crump-]

I’m more than ok with DLC, honestly. It gives casual players with no friends (like me) a reason to keep coming back and playing more Smash, and it offers new potential for characters that might have missed the boat in the base game.

I thought DLC in Smash 4 was done perfectly, and Nintendo has never been crummy with it in the past.

Screw Doomfist though. Overhyped piece of garbage he turned out to be. Lol.

Spoiler

Doomfist is my main, fight me irl

Seismic Shock -> Rocket Punch is the most satisfying method of attack in the game

 

[KingBroly]

Honestly, I do not care if they do not add another Subspace, but... Adventure Mode should be a priority over Smash Tour.
Smash Tour is something, but it is a mess.

If they do another proper Story Mode, if it's focused on 2-player co-op because of the Switch's joy-cons, it'd be best to think up possible team-ups besides Mario and Link.

 

[osby]

If they do another proper Story Mode, if it's focused on 2-player co-op because of the Switch's joy-cons, it'd be best to think up possible team-ups besides Mario and Link.

If Wolf ever returns, I want him to team up with Jigglypuff and Toon Link solely from the fact that they were absent from the previous one.

 

[Cosmic77]

To move on to a different topic, how much do you guys think Switch-era content will factor into Smash Switch? I'm pretty sure that we're at least getting Breath of the Wild and Mario Odyssey stages. I'm not sure whether the Splatoon content in Smash would solely focus on 1 or if we could still see a significant amount of representation from the second. Maybe even an Assist Trophy of Snip and Clip (the main characters of Snipperclips)? At the very least, trophy and music representation is a given for Switch-era content.

Stages and trophies are definitely a given, but I still say that there's going to be a few new characters inspired from Switch games.

Again, this Smash is very different from past entries. There are so many assets available to port over from the Wii U that I'd be surprised if time was a huge issue with the development team. If Sakurai worked hard enough, I could see him finding the time to add some newer characters from games released in 2017. The wide variety and selection is just too good to pass up.

• Poochy and Yoshi's Woolly World
• Fire Emblem Heroes
• Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild
• 1-2-Switch (...Actually, I'd be fine if Sakurai ignores this one.)
• Mario Kart 8 Deluxe
• Fire Emblem Echoes: Shadows of Valentia
• ARMS
• Ever Oasis
• Hey! Pikmin
• Miitopia
• Splatoon 2
• Mario + Rabbids: Kingdom Battle
• Pokken Tournament DX
• Metroid: Samus Returns
• Mario and Luigi: Superstar Saga + Bowser's Minions
• Fire Emblem Warriors
• Super Mario Odyssey
• Animal Crossing: Pocket Camp
• Xenoblade Chronicles 2

Honestly, I think 2017 showed more love to Nintendo's franchises than 2015 and 2016 did combined. Unless Sakurai is content with withholding a bunch of new, popular, and relevant characters from the base game and adding a few of them as DLC characters, I would think he'd go the extra mile and try to get some of these guys done in time for Smash Switch's release.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

I took a trip down memory lane and visited the old Smash 4 site. I once again realized that “Damn, that roster was freakin’ amazing!”

Even with (if) Ridley added, I have no idea how it could be topped.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I do hope Sakurai acknowledges Pichu's popularity and brings him back since Dr. Mario's return made so many people happy. His return probably a boost in people who want/expect Pichu to return now as well. Hopefully that's something that could be done easily.

There is one problem for Pichu though, and that's the fact that various gaming communities show massive amount of hatred towards it for not only being among the worst fighters in Melee, but also because it damages itself while using a good portion of its attack options. The latter reason is rather feeble when you remember that even to this day, some fighters do take damage while using certain attacks (such as Charizard and its Flare Blitz).

Also, as bad as Pichu was in Melee, it's not really THE worst fighter in that game, as being short makes it a more difficult target to hit.

I also hope once Smash Bros Switch is released it supports video capture. And Nintendo Switch will have new update where it supports video capture up to 5 minutes.

Let's face it, back in Wii U/3DS days where your replays becomes unplayable after every update is just.. Dumb...

It doesn't exactly help when replay data is simply coding that replicates the match that you've played. Obviously, that uses much less memory than making a .mp4 video.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

-crump-

Doomfist is fine. Design, lore, and overall concept wise for a first person shooter.

However I personally find him the weakest of the DLC added because while it adds up to what should work.

For me it just doesn't.

A fighting game type character type of person in a first person shooter just feels awkward and off putting to me. And to be effective with him you pretty much have to result to one tricking it. Just not my cup of tea.

 

[AlphaSSB]

Imagine Slippy Toad got in because of Star Fox Guard.

Funny enough, I'm going to start working on a moveset for him soon, partially based on Star Fox: Assault and Star Fox Guard. Guard actually has a lot of content that could be used as a moveset.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Slippy Toad would potentially be the most interesting Star Fox character because he's such a coward you can't rely too much on ''PEW PEW" like you can with Fox/Wolf/Falco.

I still think if he did get in his Final Smash should just be him saying ''FOX GET THESE GUYS FOR ME!" and Fox shooting around the stage in his Arwing.

But knowing Sakurai ''LANDMASTER!" would happen even with Slippy.

 

[92MilesPrower]

What about Smash Run?

If anything, a Melee-like Adventure Mode is definitely the next step up from Smash Run, imo. Smash Run is probably best off remaining as a 3DS exclusive, with it being made with the fact that it was on a handheld system in mind. The Switch may be a hybrid, but since it's far more powerful than 3DS, I doubt Sakurai wouldn't take advantage of it, and he'll likely make something bigger than Smash Run.

 

[YoshiandToad]

Slippy Toad would potentially be the most interesting Star Fox character because he's such a coward you can't rely too much on ''PEW PEW" like you can with Fox/Wolf/Falco.

I still think if he did get in his Final Smash should just be him saying ''FOX GET THESE GUYS FOR ME!" and Fox shooting around the stage in his Arwing.

But knowing Sakurai ''LANDMASTER!" would happen even with Slippy.

I genuinely really want a Starfox Guard based move set for Slippy with turrets and traps since Guard was actually... Pretty good?
But yeah, probably Landmasta again if he did get in and the same damn move set again.

I'd take Slippy over Wolf to be honest if he had a move set not based on the old spacey standard.

Yeah, I know Wolf and Fox and Falco play differently but it'd be nice for Star Fox to get more variety in abilities.

 

[Wyoming]

Slippy AFTER Wolf, sure.

Unlike Krystal he actually uses the tools people want to give him for a moveset.

 

[Llort A. Ton]

Slippy has the potential and infamy to be the best (good) 'joke character' in Smash history. I think well be lucky to get any additional Star Fox characters after Wolf, though.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I took a trip down memory lane and visited the old Smash 4 site. I once again realized that “Damn, that roster was freakin’ amazing!”

Even with (if) Ridley added, I have no idea how it could be topped.

I feel like this when I visit the Brawl site again, it just hit all the right notes for me. You had this very healthy mix of proper allstars (Wario, Dedede, Diddy Kong, Meta Knight), recent characters (Ike, Lucario, Lucas, Olimar) and the unexpected (Pokémon Trainer, ZSS, R.O.B), and there was the initial euphoria of 3rd party additions, one which was the most surprising character we've ever gotten and the other being by far the most anticipated character we've ever had. It also had so much variety on other fronts, you had simple and complex characters, lightweights and heavyweights, cartoony and more realistic characters, humans and creatures, and a wide variety of fighting styles ranging from fists and swords to farts and C-4, there really was something for everyone.

I've long since accepted that Brawl's newcomer roster will never be topped for me, because it gave me everything I wanted, except for my most wanted that is. Because of this I try not to compare things to it too much, the only thing I'll accomplish by doing that is ruin what is otherwise going to be a good experience anyways. I really have no doubts that this game's roster will be great in its own right and will have a similar mass appeal to Smash 4's newcomer roster, because Sakurai is the best at what he's doing.

 

[mario123007]

So what are you thoughts guys?
The discussion starts at 2:40 of the video.

I get what GimR is trying to convey, but... call me bias or stubborn...

Even if Smash Bros Switch does turn out to be using the Smash 4 engine, most characters have their same movesets and even their mechanics stay the same, same stages, but have new characters, new modes, better online... which I am pretty sure of people in the Smash Community expects to be.

It is still a new game... it's just that it is not an ENTIRE new game.

GimR didn't explain why we have Botw Link though.... if it's going to be like the WiI U Smash.... then why Link is Botw Link this time?

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

When it comes to cuts...

Impossible:


Very unlikely:


Unlikely:


I just don't see cuts happening tbh

 

[Pazzo.]

If Slippy doesn't have a Fox, Falco, or Peppy assist his moveset will be incomplete.

Imagine an Arwing flying in for his Final Smash, the pilot depends on who's being fought, if Fox, it's Falco, if Falco, Fox, and if both, Peppy.