Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Cosmic77]

A better way to look at it is this; is he high priority for GameFreak and the Pokemon Company? I could see the various others being higher priority at this point. That is, the Smash 4 options, plus maybe a Gen 7(or 8). I still think he's coming back too, hopefully base roster. But it's clearly not as simple as "Sakurai thinks the character should be high priority" at this point either.

At the very least, I'd say Mewtwo is close to being just as much of a priority to Game Freak as Charizard and Lucario. He's still very popular, and I'm seeing a lot more regular promotion for him than I remember several years ago.

Greninja is popular, but I don't think the guy has done much since the end of the XYZ anime and the Ash-Greninja giveaway in the SuMo demo. Truth is, it's hard to advertise modern starters in new Pokémon games, as most people associate them with the previous generation. Happens to the best of them, and even Lucario himself took a little break in Black and White. Maybe his importance will flip around in a future Gen, but for now, Game Freak doesn't have much to gain by keeping Greninja.

I'd say most of us would agree that Jigglypuff is easily the lowest priority for Game Freak. However, Sakurai is her savior. Doubt she'll get cut thanks to her status as one of the orginals, regardless of what Game Freak might say.

 

[BluePikmin11]

In Snake's codec in Brawl it was kind of alluded that him being able to fight Mario was a "once in a lifetime chance". Considering that Sakurai never contacted Kojima during Smash 4's development and that the whole drama with Konami didn't really start until a year or two later. It could be that Sakurai didn't have any plans to bring back Snake when the roster was decided, at least for Smash 4. It was a favor for Kojima to please his son initially after all.

That is a good point, it just might be a favor and nothing more, although perhaps he might want to try negotiate Snake again after realizing the high demand, like with Mewtwo after he was cut from the roster.

Though when it comes to translating characters like Wolf, Mewtwo, and Snake, it's going to be harder to translate from Brawl to Smash Switch, but who knows?

 

[Curious Villager]

That is a good point, it just might be a favor and nothing more, although perhaps he might want to try negotiate Snake again after realizing the high demand, like with Mewtwo.

Though when it comes to translating characters like Wolf, Mewtwo, and Snake, it's going to be harder to translate from Brawl to Smash Switch, but who knows?

Yeah he probably will this time, I don't know much about Kojima and Konami's current state but Sakurai may just try to renegotiate things this time anyway if he can.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

At the very least, I'd say Mewtwo is close to being just as much of a priority to Game Freak as Charizard and Lucario. He's still very popular, and I'm seeing a lot more regular promotion for him than I remember several years ago.

Greninja is popular, but I don't think the guy has done much since the end of the XYZ anime and the Ash-Greninja giveaway in the SuMo demo. Truth is, it's hard to advertise modern starters in new Pokémon games, as most people associate them with the previous generation. Happens to the best of them, and even Lucario himself took a little break in Black and White. Maybe his importance will flip around in a future Gen, but for now, Game Freak doesn't have much to gain by keeping Greninja.

I'd say most of us would agree that Jigglypuff is easily the lowest priority for Game Freak. However, Sakurai is her savior. Doubt she'll get cut thanks to her status as one of the orginals, regardless of what Game Freak might say.

The fact Jigglypuff is super easy to recreate is pretty much what keeps her in. She's slightly more relevant thanks to some appearances in the Sun/Moon anime, I guess?

Anyway, Mewtwo seems to actually not be promoted nearly as much as Lucario and Charizard, so I wouldn't say it's on the same level, but it's clearly close to them. Maybe right below?

 

[BluePikmin11]

I guess one thing to keep in mind is that even if Sakurai has the basis moveset in the previous game already, the character would still have be greatly adjusted in a way that fits Smash Switch game's aesthetic and gameplay balance/speed. It kinda makes me reconsider my decision to put Pokemon Trainer in my predictions, given that Sakurai would have to translate both Ivysaur and Squirtle from Brawl to Smash Switch. Though, I generally think transformation characters will be first in priority due to the complicated technical nature of transformations.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

The fact Jigglypuff is super easy to recreate is pretty much what keeps her in. She's slightly more relevant thanks to some appearances in the Sun/Moon anime, I guess?

Anyway, Mewtwo seems to actually not be promoted nearly as much as Lucario and Charizard, so I wouldn't say it's on the same level, but it's clearly close to them. Maybe right below?

I know this is off-topic, but I am happy that Jigglypuff returned to the anime. I loved her antics.

 

[PLATINUM7]

I guess one thing to keep in mind is that even if Sakurai has the basis moveset in the previous game already, the character would still have be greatly adjusted in a way that fits Smash Switch game's aesthetic and gameplay balance/speed. It kinda makes me reconsider my decision to put Pokemon Trainer in my predictions, given that Sakurai would have to translate both Ivysaur and Squirtle from Brawl to Smash Switch. Though, I generally think transformation characters will be first in priority due to the complicated technical nature of transformations.

Or we could just not include transformations again.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I had a post that apparently a lot of people agreed with yesterday. This may be another one.

When people are throwing random percentages and reasons as to why particular 3rd parties aren’t going to return to Smash, it’s a combination of bias and bull****.

While I would like to see Snake return one day, his situation is nothing like Cloud and Square Enix. I’ve said it before and i’ll say it again. Just because Square was “stingy” with Final Fantasy content in Smash Wii U/3DS doesn’t mean Cloud doesn’t have a chance to come back or poor chances of coming back. That is flat out conjecture and based on a biased view of it.

If you want to know why the amiibo production was a mess, it was probably partially because there isn’t a whole lot of easy to find, cheap collectibles for Cloud. Does anyone really think SE is going to just say, “Uh, yeah we’re fine with you making more off of our character amiibo than us”. No, they wouldn’t be. That doesn’t mean they’re being “difficult”. It means they’re being practical with their IP.

Let’s also make sure we address the fact that Cloud was added because “he was a popular request” according to Sakurai. At the very least, Nintendo and SE will come back to the table. I don’t see why they wouldn’t when you consider the fact that Cloud shattered expectations of 3rd parties, is popular, and is the most notable character of one of the most well known gaming series of all time.

Finally, can we PLEASE stop basing things related to 3rd parties on “their relationship” to Nintendo? That’s not entirely why they get added. If it was, we’d have Layton or others. Sonic, Mega Man, Pac Man... they’re cartoony but they aren’t Nintendo. By no means should the 3rd parties be cut because of the arbitrary “relationship with Nintendo”. They aren’t meant to be Nintendo in the first place. That isn’t to say that we’re going to get Kratos or Master Chief, but you know what I mean.

EDIT: Side note...Blue, we’ve told you to change your stance on transformations because the concept doesn’t work. Yet, you continue to believe they’re going to happen...why???

 

[Gumzilla]

Melee Marth grab vs Sm4sh Bowser pivot grab

 

[BluePikmin11]

I still have to make an analysis on transformation characters before I can finalize the decision Scoliosis. Something about it keeps making me think that the concept will be explored again, but I don't know the exact reasons why yet.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Finally, can we PLEASE stop basing things related to 3rd parties based on “their relationship” to Nintendo. That’s not why they get added. Sonic, Mega Man, Pac Man... they’re cartoony but they aren’t Nintendo. By no means should the 3rd parties be cut because of the arbitrary “relationship with Nintendo”. They aren’t meant to be Nintendo in the first place.

When people talk about relationship to Nintendo is it Nintedno like qualities they refer to or the series presence on Nintendo consoles?

I see both discussions but in my experiences at least, "relationship" refers to how many games have been on a Nintendo console. I think that's a fair thing to discuss. Yeah some like Cloud and Bayo haven't had many Nintendo appearances but there's still a connection to Nintendo, FF having several Nintendo installments and Bayo 2 was exclusive to and financed by Nintendo.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I still have to make an analysis on transformation characters before I can finalize the decision Scoliosis. Something about it keeps making me think that the concept will be explored again, but I don't know the exact reasons why yet.

I think you can stop looking because I have the answer.

Spoiler: A real compelling reason

There's none

 

[Polan]

regarding snake, i'm pretty confident that him not coming back was one-hundred percent konami's doing. video games have always been a side show over at konami outside of metal gear (gotta make that pachinko and gym money) so konami execs probably didn't care about snake returning to smash bros. and its likely that the konami-kojima drama had been going on for a while (there were rumours flying around that konami's founder hated kojima) but not as openly as it was in 2015. i wouldn't be surprised if snake getting axed in smash bros was the result of one of these petty feuds, especially since the whole idea of snake in smash was kojima's.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I still have to make an analysis on transformation characters before I can finalize the decision Scoliosis. Something about it keeps making me think that the concept will be explored again, but I don't know the exact reasons why yet.

I’m going to be honest...you shouldn’t worry about it. It’s probably not going to be explored again.

I’ve already explained why, and it’s mainly because it would be bad game design. There’s no reason to go back to it.

I’m not really sure why you’re even considering it frankly. If it costs more dev time to do transformations of previous characters, why go back to it in the first place? Especially when the concept doesn’t hold up in its most basic premise. Sheik and Zelda doesn’t work because then Zelda isn’t used. If Zelda isn’t used, then from a gameplay perspective, why keep Zelda?

If Zelda becomes BOTW Zelda, why combine her and Sheik in the first place? It wouldn’t even make sense anymore.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Or we could just not include transformations again.

This.

The transformation concept was removed for a reason. It worked better for the balance of the characters who were involved with them. PT and Samus/ZZ's transformation methods in particular were horrendous in that regard, so at the very least there is no good reason why transformations that worked like those ones would return.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Honestly for all we really know, we may as well be trying to predict when the Rapture will come.

But darn it if speculating isn't fun. And we don't drive people to irrationally build Arks in the middle of the desert so that's a plus too.

 

[Deleted member]

Here's a question I've asked myself on multiple occasions:

Does Sakurai himself view fictional characters as being "close to" or "related to" a corporation? Because the only people I've seen make these kinds of statements are, well, Smash fans and speculators.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Spoiler: Infinity War Spoilers

The rapture came 6 days ago. It claimed the lives of Loki, Gamora, Winter Soldier, Spider-Man, Falcon, Drax, Mantis, Heimdall, Vision, Scarlet Witch, Black Panther, Doctor Strange, Nick Fury, Maria Hill and Star Lord.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Here's a question I've asked myself on multiple occasions:

Does Sakurai himself view fictional characters as being "close to" or "related to" a corporation? Because the only people I've seen make these kinds of statements are, well, Smash fans and speculators.

Developing associations between two things, be it a character and a corporation or other , is quite a normal thing to do.

Even look at a similar example within video games, see discussions regarding third party characters for PSASBR.

 

[-crump-]

Spoiler: Infinity War Spoilers

The rapture came 6 days ago. It claimed the lives of Loki, Gamora, Winter Soldier, Spider-Man, Falcon, Drax, Mantis, Heimdall, Vision, Scarlet Witch, Black Panther, Doctor Strange, Nick Fury, Maria Hill and Star Lord.

Spoiler: Also Infinity War spoilers

*adjusts nerd glasses*
I’m almost certain Gamora isn’t dead, her soul is trapped inside Soulworld that resides in the Soul Stone. That’s what was represented by the final scene with Thanos in the empty yellow plane talking to little Gamora. She’ll be back, mark my words.

And also, come on. We know everybody else is gonna come back too. Marvel’s gotta keep putting those butts in the seats, and they can’t do that with a bunch of older actors whose contracts are running out.

Except for Loki and Heimdall, those two are dead fo sho

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Spoiler: Also Infinity War spoilers

*adjusts nerd glasses*
I’m almost certain Gamora isn’t dead, her soul is trapped inside Soulworld that resides in the Soul Stone. That’s what was represented by the final scene with Thanos in the empty yellow plane talking to little Gamora. She’ll be back, mark my words.

And also, come on. We know everybody else is gonna come back too. Marvel’s gotta keep putting those butts in the seats, and they can’t do that with a bunch of older actors whose contracts are running out.

Except for Loki and Heimdall, those two are dead fo sho

Spoiler: Infinity War Spoilers

I'm pretty sure Vision is also gone for good.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Whoa guys. I didn't mean to turn this into the Infinity War thread. I was just making a dumb joke. Lol.

We should probably get back on topic. Let's play a game.

Think of the following franchises: Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Star Fox, Sonic, Street Fighter, Final Fantasy, Fire Emblem, and Pokemon.

Now you're being forced to put your LEAST wanted newcomer from each franchise into Smash Brothers. Tell me who they are and how you would go about handling their inclusion in terms of moves and what not.

 

[-crump-]

Spoiler: Infinity War Spoilers

I'm pretty sure Vision is also gone for good.

Spoiler: Yet another post full of IW spoilers

I’m convinced Vison will come back in his “White Vision” form. When he got bodied in a West Coast Avengers, Hank Pym rebuilt him, but he lost his emotions in the process and ended up being unable to love Scarlet Witch. He looked like this:

The Avengers are gonna need all the help they can get in A4. Bruce and whoever is left on Wakanda will probably fix him.

EDIT:
But yeah Roger is right. I’m gonna drop the IW discussion since this isn’t the place, sorry for clogging up this page.

hit me up in PMs if anyone wants to talk about the movie for some reason. If my avatar and stuff didn’t make it obvious I’m a huge Marvel geek.

But anyways; how bout them Smash Brothers?

 

[Sonic Poke]

Thinking about cuts, I would rank the probability of cut like this:
Impossible:

Almost impossible:

Really unlikely:

Unlikely:

Possible:

Probable:

Likely:

Almost garanteed:

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Thinking about cuts, I would rank the probability of cut like this:
Impossible:

Almost impossible:

Really unlikely:

Unlikely:

Possible:

Probable:

Likely:

Almost garanteed:

More or less right I'd say but I'd up Marth and Pit to Impossible and put Jigglypuff in almost.

 

[TumblrFamous]

Whoa guys. I didn't mean to turn this into the Infinity War thread. I was just making a dumb joke. Lol.

We should probably get back on topic. Let's play a game.

Think of the following franchises: Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Star Fox, Sonic, Street Fighter, Final Fantasy, Fire Emblem, and Pokemon.

Now you're being forced to put your LEAST wanted newcomer from each franchise into Smash Brothers. Tell me who they are and how you would go about handling their inclusion in terms of moves and what not.

Oh no, I hate this. I'll just do Mario right now. I think my least wanted newcomer is Daisy. I think she adds absolutely nothing and brings nothing to the table. I can see her having a unique moveset, but I can also see her as a Peach semiclone, without the floating, and flowers instead of hearts. Maybe a bit more power than Peach as well.

I also have a grudge against Toadette in playing Mario Kart with my friends, so she's a good choice too (thought I'd want her in so I can wail on her).

 

[ColietheGoalie]

This.

The transformation concept was removed for a reason. It worked better for the balance of the characters who were involved with them. PT and Samus/ZZ's transformation methods in particular were horrendous in that regard, so at the very least there is no good reason why transformations that worked like those ones would return.

Honestly, I liked the transformation idea. I’d especially take the Pokémon Trainer back (minus the fatigue idea). Agree that Samus to Zero Suit sucked, but Zelda/Sheik wasn’t bad.

Granted, I’m not sure they’d ever go back to that idea, but I wouldn’t hate it for the right character.

 

[TumblrFamous]

Thinking about cuts, I would rank the probability of cut like this:
Impossible:

Almost impossible:

Really unlikely:

Unlikely:

Possible:

Probable:

Likely:

Almost garanteed:

Can i ask why you put Little Mac as possible? I would make there be a large large gap between Possible and Probable. A lot of the characters Possible and above I do not see being cut. Just because a character comes from a new game in the series also doesn't make them less likely to return. In fact, I'd put Jigglypuff further down on this list as she has always been a character with low priority.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

The problem wasn't the concept, really. Transformations were a cool idea. The execution on the other hand was bad, as it basically put you in a vulnerable position right after, and you couldn't immediately use a move. It'd work better if you could chain attacks to switch between forms to have a coherent battle style. Of course, this could also be an issue, so it'd require tons of balancing. Like cooldown between specific moves, though other transformation moves could work. Marvel VS Capcom had a similar idea for switching where you could use a move to switch out, meaning you aren't left vulnerable. It however was easy to spam, which creates a serious issue with balance.

 

[-crump-]

Thinking about cuts, I would rank the probability of cut like this:
Impossible:

Almost impossible:

Really unlikely:

Unlikely:

Possible:

Probable:

Likely:

Almost garanteed:

Cool list, buuuut...
I highly disagree on your “probable” section, and some of your other points.

-Mewtwo and Lucas are very safe. They came back because they’re super popular, and they were greeted with universal fanfare. I seriously, seriously doubt Sakurai would cut them a second time.

-Lucina is in the same boat. She’s one of the most popular FE characters, bar none. Besides that, she’s super easy to bring back and I’m sure IS would be pissed if Sakurai didn’t.

-Cloud is in an odd boat, but I think he belongs in “unlikely”. Square and Nintendo are on very good terms, especially now in the Switch era. Sakurai seemed to like adding Cloud, because of how many fans it pleased, and I don’t think he would want to cut the character unless he really had to.

-I would drop ICs down a tier or two just because of Sakurai’s “no future” comments. I think they are more likely for DLC than base game.

-Bayonetta should be in “really unlikely”. She’s basically been adopted by Nintendo at this point.

 

[Sonic Poke]

Pokemon Trainer was a brillant idea but was awfully executed. If wasn't for the limitations of the 3ds version, we would probably have a much better executed PT (and Ice Climbers).
If people see the icies as shoe in in smash, perhaps transformations are not that unlikely to return. Both were cut for the same reason to be fair.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Can i ask why you put Little Mac as possible? I would make there be a large large gap between Possible and Probable. A lot of the characters Possible and above I do not see being cut. Just because a character comes from a new game in the series also doesn't make them less likely to return. In fact, I'd put Jigglypuff further down on this list as she has always been a character with low priority.

There was no confirmed evidence she was low priority in Smash 4. The closest thing is the somewhat conflicting file listings for Smash 4 3DS and Wii U which respectively implies that she either was higher priority than the newcomers or one of the lowest priority characters.

 

[Sonic Poke]

Jigglypuff is low priority because she is easy not because she may be cut. Worst case scenario they leave her unchanged from the previous entry. That is clear on how they handled her with patches.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Pokemon Trainer was a brillant idea but was awfully executed. If wasn't for the limitations of the 3ds version, we would probably have a much better executed PT (and Ice Climbers).
If people see the icies as shoe in in smash, perhaps transformations are not that unlikely to return. Both were cut for the same reason to be fair.

But one of those cuts led to an improvement, at least in my opinion.

 

[YoshiandToad]

Whoa guys. I didn't mean to turn this into the Infinity War thread. I was just making a dumb joke. Lol.

We should probably get back on topic. Let's play a game.

Think of the following franchises: Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Star Fox, Sonic, Street Fighter, Final Fantasy, Fire Emblem, and Pokemon.

Now you're being forced to put your LEAST wanted newcomer from each franchise into Smash Brothers. Tell me who they are and how you would go about handling their inclusion in terms of moves and what not.

Alright I'm going to do my best to make my least favourite characters sound workable or even fun here....what a challenge....

Mario: Bowser Jr. is already in, and ironically he's one of my favourite Mario additions(certainly more so than Rosalina who I was just ambivalent towards) thanks in part to the moveset and Koopaling skins.
HOWEVER, if we ignore characters already in(Doc is saved too then) I guess we're looking at Geno.
I'd implement him in the way he'd obviously be implemented using his RPG skills, BUT I'd put the infinitely more interesting Mallow in for a few of his moves to give him a little more variety and have them fight as a semi pair.

Zelda: Ignoring Toon Sheik as it's not a real character, Toon Zelda. I'd utilize her phantom abilities since it's the most interesting part about her, allowing her to possess not only Phantom armours but a few other iconic Zelda enemies too(not sure on what right now but it's an idea)

Metroid: Not too up on Metroid, but Adam sounds like he'd be the guy. Since his main role seems to be ordering Samus around and preventing her from using her gear, I guess I'd have him as a very irritating fighter who's special move can temporarily lock out a random special attack. Imagine trying to recover and your up+b special is blocked. What a jerk.

Star Fox: I actually unironically want Slippy with a Guard inspired moveset, and although Krystal is a bit more meh to me, I guess she has some moveset potential so I guess we're gonna go with Peppy even though I don't dislike him. High jumps, lots of barrel roll based attacks, a slower version of Fox probably with far better aerial recovery.

Sonic: Shadow. Make him a teleporting Sonic clone. Give him guns and have him be able to stop time and...wait...is Bayonetta Shadow the Hedgehog in human...err...witch form?!?

Street Fighter: Balrog. Make him a slower, heavier hitting Little Mac clone...

Final Fantasy: Ah jeez...I know so little of this series proper but I hate nearly every main protagonist outside Zidane and MAYBE Noctis so pick any of them. Squall seems like a fine choice. Guess he'd be a gunblade user with a dancing final Smash or some nonsense. It's been a while since I watched gameplay of Final Fantasy 8.

Fire Emblem: Tharja. I've only played Awakening, but she's easily the worst person in the world. Have her as a magic heavy offensive fighter who specialises in traps and long range. Up close she'd get absolutely annihilated though. Unique buff if Robin is a team mate in team Smash.

Pokemon: There's so many...I guess I'll pick from semi popular choices though: Blaziken; acts somewhat like Captain Falcon but hits less hard. Due to Blaziken's unique ability SPEED BOOST the longer the match goes on for the faster his speed becomes before he's KO'd. If he somehow survives a full 2 minutes he'll be at max speed which will put him on Super Sonic levels of insane speed, easily outpacing every other fighter. To make up for this he's a glass cannon, hits hard but a few good hits will send him flying.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

IC's cut is not exactly the same thing as Transformations. Transformations were an unbalanced concept that never really worked all that well in the first place. There's a reason hacks/etc. separated the characters to fully play as. They were more popular apart.

IC's main issue was the amount of characters was too taxing, along with the A.I. That's hardly an issue for the Switch itself, and at worst, they might be too much for 8-Player Mode on it, which isn't that likely to be the case, but it's not like removing them for that mode only would be a huge deal anyway. It's not a major mode like Classic, after all. They aren't shoo-ins either, but there's little keeping them out at this point.

Transformations have a good reason to stay out; they're unbalanced and don't actually work. They're also not popular with the majority of players as they barely use the other option outside of being forced.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Honestly, I liked the transformation idea. I’d especially take the Pokémon Trainer back (minus the fatigue idea). Agree that Samus to Zero Suit sucked, but Zelda/Sheik wasn’t bad.

Granted, I’m not sure they’d ever go back to that idea, but I wouldn’t hate it for the right character.

It's actually a neat idea on paper. But I just don't think it does any real favors for the characters anymore, and even if it does, those favors still wouldn't cancel out the negatives that they also bring.

I suppose Zelda/Sheik and Pokémon Trainer weren't that bad, but separating the characters was the best choice as far as gameplay balance is concerned. That, and I didn't like how getting K.O'd as one of PT's Pokémon would forcibly switch you over to the next one in his line-up. That gimmick, in my opinion, wasn't much better than Samus/Zero Suit. And yeah, the fatigue thing was also a bad idea, for sure.

 

[TumblrFamous]

There was no confirmed evidence she was low priority in Smash 4. The closest thing is the somewhat conflicting file listings for Smash 4 3DS and Wii U which respectively implies that she either was higher priority than the newcomers or one of the lowest priority characters.

True. I shouldn't speak in absolutes.

I feel though that a simple character who was at least low priority in the original game and Brawl still carries some of that into other games. I ddon't necessarily think she's gonna be cute, but I'd definitely put characters like pretty much everyone from those two rows below above her in terms of likelihood.

 

[Sonic Poke]

But one of those cuts led to an improvement, at least in my opinion.

Indeed, but cutting two characters for the sake of one, including one that is very unique was quite sad.
If I were in Sakurai's position, I'd turn transformations custom moves for Zelda/Sheik. And create a new customizable trainer class next to the Miis. Then you could create your own trainer with all the pokemon from the roster, with the PT from Brawl as the default.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Whoa guys. I didn't mean to turn this into the Infinity War thread. I was just making a dumb joke. Lol.

We should probably get back on topic. Let's play a game.

Think of the following franchises: Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Star Fox, Sonic, Street Fighter, Final Fantasy, Fire Emblem, and Pokemon.

Now you're being forced to put your LEAST wanted newcomer from each franchise into Smash Brothers. Tell me who they are and how you would go about handling their inclusion in terms of moves and what not.

This will be a doozy

Pink Gold Peach for Mario because she is the definition of bottom of the barrel (But Blue Bowser comes ****ing close looking at today's Rate Their Chances). She would be a heavier Peach clone with worst specials and super armor.

Zelda. Agitha. Easily the worst character in Hyrule Warriors and filler at best. She can still have her bugs from the same game.

The Federation Farce Force soldiers... At best, I can see them being Samus minus most of their tech and no Morph Ball. Plus the Golem Final Smash.

Pigma Dengar, how I hate this greasy slime ball. He would be a fatter space that uses dirty tactics and use a certain Aparoid form.

Zavok, we all know how badly him and the Deadly Six sucks. he would be a heavy brute with fire powers and the power of electromagnetics in addition to using Eggman's Badniks.

Rufus, pretty self explanatory how this fat fool would fight in Smash.

This one will be controversial, Aeris from Final Fantasy. She would just be a simple staff fighter at best.

Excelleus, how I hate that hideous turd. He would be a dark mage using other black arts from the Fire Emblem series.

And lastly, Zubat. I loathe this bat for a long time. He can be a small pest that depends on his Supersonic and poison attacks in Smash like the games.