Smash Back Room Weekly Character Discussions! FINAL UPDATES: Ness + Lucas. All done!!

[Earthbound360]

Ness doesn't have that much trouble dealing with ranged characters. Most of them have absorbable projectiles and those that don't can be bounced back with his bad. Also he has his own projectiles that could be used at mid range. Ness fits somewhat though. His aerial game is pretty good but devestating seems exaggerated. His recovery also can be gimped sometimes.

Why is everyone saying Ness has good range on campers? I HATE fighting a Toon Link or Wolf. The only option he really has sometimes is a PK Jump, and PSI Magnet doesn't stop everything. Arrows anyone? Missiles? Bombs?

Saying his aerial game is not devastating is blasphemy. Have you seen the power of his uair, dair, and bair? He has someo f the most powerful ones in the game, and they are all pretty quick for their strength.

And Ztarfish, I cant believe you forgot Ness bair. Probably the BEST kil tool he has, and his aerials DO kill at low percents.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

I don't like Falcos new form. I did at first but I don't.. mesh well with him. Wish I did because he is SO cool.

The lack of Pillar action makes him hard for me. I don't think I'd be that bad if I practiced and got the Melee Falco mindset out of my head but I can't. Or rather I'm not willing to when I have my hands full already.

My vote for next week is Ness.

 

[Mawu]

maybe it is uhm..... Luke skywalker!
or ganondorf

 

[Viewtiful-FX]

I bet it's Olimar:

Underestimated? Check

Sweet aerial game? Check

Not many options against range or projectile spammers? Cheeeeck

 

[Betaz]

I vote Lucario >.>

 

[~Shao~]

"...other than one of their B attacks." Maybe Kirby?

He can kill at relatively low percents (~110%), good aerial game, has trouble approaching projectile spammers, recovery can be easily gimped if done wrong and the opponent is smart.

 

[Zombie-Hero]

I'm going with my biased guess of Wario.

-Great Aerial Game, with up+air taking some characters out at relatively low percents
-Only way to deal with projectile spammers while staying on the ground is Side+B 'Cycle.
-Recover is awesome when he has the bike, but not very good if he doesn't have it, or gets knocked off of it.
-As far as underestimated goes, that one is hard to measure, but i would say that it is arguably true

 

[Ace55]

So next weaks character is gonna be Jigglypuff? Underestimated, yes. Few options on the ground except B-Moves, yes. Low percent kills, if 50+ is low percent, yes. Great aerial game, yes. Gimpable recovery, not really though.

Could be Wario I guess, he can gimp like a beast and can be gimped by hitting him of his bike.

 

[TheKneeOfJustice]

My guess would be Ness.

 

[Vaul]

Since when is olimar underestimated?

Wario/Luigi/Jiggs...most likely wario just due to the fact the SBR is paying strict attention to the 'better' characters.

And think about it...why would they talk about Ness when they're currently still debating whether or not to ban the chaingrab against him (and Lucas)? You may argue that these are unrelated, but think about it....as an SBR member, what would the chances be you would want to publicize Ness when his tourny fate still hangs in the balance?

 

[Takeshi245]

The moment it said "underestimated", I thought of Mario. He really is.

 

[MiraiGen]

To be fair that change to his Fair really hurt - Making him neither Dr Mario or Mario really flubbed him. The physics change didn't help either.

 

[matthewmilad]

I can't wait until they say it's someone like Ness,Captain Falcon, Ganondorf, Bowser, DK, etc. etc. This one is way too hard to guess at, and it IS NOT WARIO OMG.

 

[manhunter098]

I dont know, hes really not that bad. Hes got a bit more power, but I can agree that the physics have definitely hurt him a bit. But he still has rather nice combo ability, great setups still too and his n-air has been improved a lot. Overall Mario still has a strong aerial game, but its not the type that is going to kill people at low percents very often.

I can't wait until they say it's someone like Ness,Captain Falcon, Ganondorf, Bowser, DK, etc. etc. This one is way too hard to guess at, and it IS NOT WARIO OMG.

What honestly stops this from fitting Wario pretty much perfectly?


I really dont think Wario deserves the title of 8th in this thread either...but he does fit better than ANY other character for this hint.

 

[Renufus]

Probably Wario. Fits the criteria, and follows the "SBR only wants to talk about the good characters" pattern.

 

[matthewmilad]

Probably Wario. Fits the criteria, and follows the "SBR only wants to talk about the good characters" pattern.

Wario does not fit the criteria. I can't believe all these n00bs saying they think it's Wario.... just like last time it was Toon Link and Lucas huh?

 

[Mattnumbers]

Wario does not fit the criteria. I can't believe all these n00bs saying they think it's Wario.... just like last time it was Toon Link and Lucas huh?

It fits him pretty much perfectly, and you forgot to include any evidence against it being Wario.

 

[Earthbound360]

HARDLY ANY AERIAL KILL MOVES!!!

God, this is what? The twelfth time I've sad this? Only his uair kills well.

 

[betterthanbonds9]

wario, peach, jiggs, olimar make the most sense to me

underestimated: they all fit (everyone of my friends think olimar sucks--so he's the stretch)

low percent air kills: wario (uair), olimar (dair), jiggs(WoP)

1 b move against long range or spamming characters: wario, olimar
--jiggs' punches dont cancel projectiles and neither does rollout

gimpable recovery (but it's difficult unless smart): olimar
--wario shouldn't use the bike unless in the air or eating it...so i doubt that's easily gimpable, but tether recoveries in general are difficult to gimp

 

[Earthbound360]

WTF? Tether recoveries are the easiest recoverys in the game to gimp.

 

[comboking]

Next week's character will be a fun one to talk about. Underestimated by many, this character has a devastating aerial game that will surprise you when it takes you out at a low percent. But on the ground this character doesn't have very many options against long range or projectile spamming characters other than one of their B attacks. And this character's recovery can be fine sometimes, but against smart opponents this character can be gimped quite easily.

Can you guess who next week's character will be?

I think Ike
ike is underestimated because he is slow
his aerials are all good and kill at low percents they also have a lot of range!
his ground game stinks to much start up and ending lag
and his opponents can jump out in front of him when he is using his overB (QuickDraw) he will fall to his death.

that is why I think it is Ike

 

[manhunter098]

HARDLY ANY AERIAL KILL MOVES!!!

God, this is what? The twelfth time I've sad this? Only his uair kills well.

A characters aerial game doesnt require powerful attacks to be great. And B attacks when used in the air are still a part of the characters aerial game, the moves just arent standard aerials. Wario has a great gimp with his bike, a powerful killing aerial, good priority in the air, great aerial control, a bigger hitbox for the Wario Waft when you use in the the air (since some of the hitbox does come out below you its BEST used right at above the ground).

 

[GoForkUrself]

Ness is an aerial master. His sweet spotted b-air is one of the most deadliest aerial attacks. His d-air is competes with Ganon for the strongest spike in the game. His u-air is suprisingly deadly, and his f-air is great for damage building along with his neutral air as a "get out of my face" move.

His PSI Magnet grants him some protection from projectile spam. His PK Fire can sometimes trap opponents, or set up firewalls by hitting things like ROB's gyro. PK Thunder is a great recovery move except that opponents can gimp it by simply jumping off the edge and absorbing the shock.

Ness' ground game generally has one purpose; to get his opponents into the air so that he can use his strong aerial game. His f-smash is devastating, but requires knowing your opponents actions to land.

Ness' grab game also sets him apart from the rest of the cast. Having a back-throw that is a reliable kill move, it puts pressure on the opponent not to get grabbed. His forward throw sets up nicely for spikes, as it throws the opponent the same distance even if they are at 0%. Down-throw sets up nicely for aerials as well.

Ness has the potential to make the second highest tier. Ness is a force to be reckoned with.

 

[Earthbound360]

The grab thing is not much of a problem anymore. He CANNOT be infinited by any characters minus 2.

Also the analyzation on the special is wrong. PK Fire is spammed in the air and PK Flash is a great substitue for an uair if used uncharged. It has insan priority, good range, can DJC for mindgames, and can be lag cancelled.

Check out PK Cross at the Ness section for specifics.

Other than that, I agree with all of the above.

 

[matthewmilad]

WTF? Tether recoveries are the easiest recoverys in the game to gimp.

I love how only the two of us and a select few others are the only smart people posting on this thread.

 

[Earthbound360]

*high fives matthewmilad*

 

[Not-Beef]

#8 is either Wario or Jigglypuff. It's definitely not Ike.

I like Wario and Jigglypuff. ._.
Great thread, Pandha.

edit: it's probably not Wario. Maybe Luigi? He's gimptastic and definitely underestimated.

Not very, just definitely. : P

edit2: Actually Luigi isn't too bad on the ground. Iono. Jigglypuff I guess. Maybe the hint was exaggerated?

 

[Foxy_Marth]

wario, peach, jiggs, olimar make the most sense to me

underestimated: they all fit (everyone of my friends think olimar sucks--so he's the stretch)

low percent air kills: wario (uair), olimar (dair), jiggs(WoP)

1 b move against long range or spamming characters: wario, olimar
--jiggs' punches dont cancel projectiles and neither does rollout

gimpable recovery (but it's difficult unless smart): olimar
--wario shouldn't use the bike unless in the air or eating it...so i doubt that's easily gimpable, but tether recoveries in general are difficult to gimp

How does he have limited ground options? Fsmash and Pikmin throw have very identical start up frames, therefore very good options. Dsmash and Usmash are great too. Dtilt and Utilt are pleasing too. Olimar is extremely unpredictable on the ground. WHAT DO YOU MEAN NO GROUND OPTIONS.

There is a 0 chance of Olimar.

 

[GoForkUrself]

Well, Ike fits many of the attributes, but what is his B move for dealing with projectile spam?
Ness really seems like the only character that it could be.

 

[MdrnDayMercutio]

It could just be that I main Sonic, but the clue SCREAMED Sonic to me.

 

[ShadowLink84]

Not sonic since he doens't spam a B move.

 

[hugglebunny]

It could just be that I main Sonic, but the clue SCREAMED Sonic to me.

I thought that at first too, but than i thought, what good b attack does sonic have.

It more says Luigi or ness to me IOM

 

[matthewmilad]

Ness is an aerial master. His sweet spotted b-air is one of the most deadliest aerial attacks. His d-air is competes with Ganon for the strongest spike in the game. His u-air is suprisingly deadly, and his f-air is great for damage building along with his neutral air as a "get out of my face" move.

His PSI Magnet grants him some protection from projectile spam. His PK Fire can sometimes trap opponents, or set up firewalls by hitting things like ROB's gyro. PK Thunder is a great recovery move except that opponents can gimp it by simply jumping off the edge and absorbing the shock.

Ness' ground game generally has one purpose; to get his opponents into the air so that he can use his strong aerial game. His f-smash is devastating, but requires knowing your opponents actions to land.

Ness' grab game also sets him apart from the rest of the cast. Having a back-throw that is a reliable kill move, it puts pressure on the opponent not to get grabbed. His forward throw sets up nicely for spikes, as it throws the opponent the same distance even if they are at 0%. Down-throw sets up nicely for aerials as well.

Ness has the potential to make the second highest tier. Ness is a force to be reckoned with.

Yay, another intelligent poster!
Well, technically only Marth and Charizard can infinite release grab. You can just avoid playing against them and learn a second character for those matches. Or just be careful against them not to get grabbed. You'll have an easier time against Charizard than Marth me thinks.

 

[hugglebunny]

I don't think ness has the potential to make it to high tier since he has the infinite grab against him.

 

[I_R_Hungry]

Ness. maybe lucas but Ness has the beastly ridiculous spike so yeah.

 

[hugglebunny]

Ness. maybe lucas but Ness has the beastly ridiculous spike so yeah.

Not lucas, i think its more screaming ness (and luigi but thats not the point)

Ness does have the ridicously good spike against him

 

[Grandeza]

Update #8: ?????

Next week's character will be a fun one to talk about.

Wario's tons of fun to talk about

Underestimated by many, this character has a devastating aerial game that will surprise you when it takes you out at a low percent.

Could be Wario, Jigglypuff, Olimar, maybe Ike

But on the ground this character doesn't have very many options against long range or projectile spamming characters other than one of their B attacks.

Wario-bike Olimar-Pimin throw??? (idk much about olimar) Jigglypuff-??? Ike- side-b i guess

And this character's recovery can be fine sometimes, but against smart opponents this character can be gimped quite easily.

Ike you just jump out in front of his side b. Olimar is obvious. Wario I'm not sure. Jigglypuff I guess falls short here.
Can you guess who next week's character will be?[/QUOTE]
My guess would be Ike or Wario or Luigi.

I'm very biased since I love Wario.

 

[smashbot226]

Falco has been updated.

Recovery in all forms...

LOLWAT

 

[Intercept]

Ness has enough options against projectiles. If I can start a PK Fire wall that stops them. PK Magnet can absorb, and the bat can reflect.

 

[Earthbound360]

^^^
No

PK Fire doesn't stop as much as you may think. Bat reflection is hard to time and slow, and PSI Magnet can't absorb everything.

Ness does have some trouble on campers. I know because I play good Wolves and Toonies. But with PK Jumping (his best option on Capmers) that may change. Im not sure if the backroom or TC was aware of PK Jumping when he made the update.