Smash 4 - Weight Rankings

[Ffamran]

One thing is certain though. Tall and very light are not a good combo, as Melee Mewtwo has shown us. The best fighters are portrayed as being small targets who are very mobile, as Pikachu, Fox, and Meta Knight have shown us. Funny how all three of those fighters are heavier than a 7'7" female.

I'm reminded of that seen from Jack*** where the ******... er... Vertically-challenged fellow headbutted a guy in the groin. Small doesn't mean they can't pack a mean punch or headbutt in that scenario.

 

[UberMadman]

By the weigh, (ha,) Shulk actually has a custom B that enhances the buffs and debuffs granted by Monado Arts but for a lesser time. I'm not sure if that actually affects his weight when in Shield Stance more or not.

 

[JamietheAuraUser]

Actually, all this talk of characters having a hidden second weight value actually might make quite a few complaints about Custom Equipment completely moot. One argument I see a lot of is "lower defence = can't be combo'd", which, if this theory about multiple weight values is true, could easily be completely false.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

By the weigh, (ha,) Shulk actually has a custom B that enhances the buffs and debuffs granted by Monado Arts but for a lesser time. I'm not sure if that actually affects his weight when in Shield Stance more or not.

oh, what the ****

ty for bringing this to my attention

Actually, all this talk of characters having a hidden second weight value actually might make quite a few complaints about Custom Equipment completely moot. One argument I see a lot of is "lower defence = can't be combo'd", which, if this theory about multiple weight values is true, could easily be completely false.

Well, weight2 has never been completely noticable. Fox had one of the worst ones in Brawl iirc yet he was one of the ones that got completely destroyed by moves like Sheik ftilt. =P

 

[Game7a1]

Just to ask two Q's.
Petch = Peach, and
Frog = Greninja, yes?
And is weight2 another factor in the knockback, defense value or something else?

 

[SonicZeroX]

It's a good thing there isn't that much of a difference between the max and the min weight of a Mii.
If the speed differences are also minor, it might make managing Miis in tournaments a bit less of a headache.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Just to ask two Q's.
Petch = Peach, and
Frog = Greninja, yes?
And is weight2 another factor in the knockback, defense value or something else?

Yeah, I couldn't remember Frog's English name and I couldn't spell his Japanese name either.

Also weight2 is just a calculation for knockback.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

@ UberMadman

Shulk's Shield Stances are in the OP.

Please note that I did have to use special means to get these values because of the way Shield reduces damage output, and they were inconsistent by 1%, so I believe that the values that I've given are right, but the possibility is always there that they're wrong.

If they are wrong, it's by no more than a (one, 1) point on the weight scaling.

 

[san.]

Is shield stance Shulk similar to having a certain level of defensive equipment? Ex. Extreme defense Shulk = 200 defense and defense Shulk = 100 defense, or does Shulk's Monado work independently from the way equipment stats work?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

No, Shield Stance increases your launch resistance (aka weight) but it also reduces the damage you take by a multiplier.

I've written about Shulk's Monado Arts here.

http://smashboards.com/threads/shulk-moveset-data-thread.368429

 

[san.]

Interesting, thanks!

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

So here's a question about Miis. Are you able to make Miis with any weight in the spectrum, or are max, default, and min the only three possibilities? If you can make middling Miis, can you make Miis with non-integer weights? For the purpose of competitive rulesets, it could be important how much variation is possible on the Mii.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

So here's a question about Miis. Are you able to make Miis with any weight in the spectrum, or are max, default, and min the only three possibilities? If you can make middling Miis, can you make Miis with non-integer weights? For the purpose of competitive rulesets, it could be important how much variation is possible on the Mii.

I have not tried, but I believe that you can have any weight between 102 and 97, even non-integer ones.

I shall test this for you tonight.

 

[Virum]

Excellent stuff Aero! Though admittedly my mind is blown at the fact that Bowser got a massive 8 points heavier from Brawl, where his weight had already been buffed from Melee. The even more frustrating fact is the fact that his model doesn't look that big (it almost seems like DK's is bigger) though maybe I'm just used to PM Bowser being so damn huge. Infact all of the super-heavyweights received big weight buffs this time round.

I'm genuinely sad about the Yoshi weight nerf though. I miss the PAL Melee days of that meaty 111 weight.

EDIT: Part of me feels it may be beneficial to include any weight gains/losses for the returning vets comparative to Brawl (and in the case of Doc, Melee) just for additional clarity:

1) Bowser: +8
2) Donkey Kong: +6
3) King Dedede: +7
4) Charizard: +5
5) Ganondorf: +3
6) Samus: +/-0
7-8) Ike: +2
7-8) Wario: +/-0
9) ROB: +/-0
10-12) Captain Falcon: +/-0
10-12) Link: +/-0
10-12) Yoshi: -3
13) Lucario: -1
14-15) Dr. Mario: -2
14-15) Mario: +/-0
16) Luigi: +/-0
17) Pit: +2
18) Sonic: +/-0
19) Ness: +/-0
20-21) Toon Link: +1
20-21) Diddy Kong: +/-0
22) Marth: +3
23) Peach: -1
24-25) Zelda: +/-0
24-25) Sheik: +/-0
26) Falco: +/-0
27) Zero Suit Samus: +/-0
28) Meta Knight: +1
29-31) Pikachu: +/-0
29-31) Fox: -1
29-31) Olimar: -3
32) Kirby: -1
33) Mr. Game & Watch: +/-0
34) Jigglypuff: +/-0

 

[Strong Badam]

Are you sure Bowser Jr.'s weight is 107.5? I have never seen fractional weight in a Smash game.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Are you sure Bowser Jr.'s weight is 107.5? I have never seen fractional weight in a Smash game.

100% certain

 

[Turokman5896]

I'm actually really looking forward to play a heavier, ground based Marth... I'm wierd

 

[Aaronrules380]

Not surprised Rosalina is light, given Sakurai said she was during a pic of the day (His reasoning was related to her having a galaxy under her dress so gravity with her is lower or something)

Also, exactly how are the numbers determined?

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

100% certain

It is pretty funny how the Koopalings don't affect the weight stat at all. After all, Lemmy is the shortest Koopaling, while Morton is the biggest, but I guess the reasoning for the above average weight has more to do with the Koopa Clown Car than with the character who's riding on it.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Funnily enough the koopalings weigh the same after they up b.

CLEARLY the clown car is a hollow shell of sadness.

Do you guys think it would be best for me to seperate Shulks monado arts?

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Funnily enough the koopalings weigh the same after they up b.

CLEARLY the clown car is a hollow shell of sadness.

Yeah it is quite a sad sight, considering that Morton would appear to be super heavy, while Lemmy would appear to be super light.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Based on what I have seen, Lucario being middle weight is probably his weight being unchanged from Brawl.

 

[UberMadman]

Hey, I'm back, and I just remembered something. Kirby can copy the standard special of every character in the game... including Shulk. Which means that Kirby can use Shulk's Monado Arts to change his weight.

...Sorry. At least he can't copy custom moves, right?

 

[Reila]

It is pretty funny how the Koopalings don't affect the weight stat at all. After all, Lemmy is the shortest Koopaling, while Morton is the biggest, but I guess the reasoning for the above average weight has more to do with the Koopa Clown Car than with the character who's riding on it.

They are all the same height in Smash Bros, though, so it makes sense for they weight to be similar the same.

That also makes Roy and Morton look kind of stupid.

 

[Hyena]

Yoshi and Peach needed that weight tweaking. I'll rest easy now.

10-12) Yoshi: -3

23) Peach: -1

 

[solitonmedic]

Lucina is heavier than Little Mac? Wowza, lemme main

 

[HeavyLobster]

Excellent stuff Aero! Though admittedly my mind is blown at the fact that Bowser got a massive 8 points heavier from Brawl, where his weight had already been buffed from Melee. The even more frustrating fact is the fact that his model doesn't look that big (it almost seems like DK's is bigger) though maybe I'm just used to PM Bowser being so damn huge. Infact all of the super-heavyweights received big weight buffs this time round.

I'm genuinely sad about the Yoshi weight nerf though. I miss the PAL Melee days of that meaty 111 weight.

EDIT: Part of me feels it may be beneficial to include any weight gains/losses for the returning vets comparative to Brawl (and in the case of Doc, Melee) just for additional clarity:

1) Bowser: +8
2) Donkey Kong: +6
3) King Dedede: +7
4) Charizard: +5
5) Ganondorf: +3
6) Samus: +/-0
7-8) Ike: +2
7-8) Wario: +/-0
9) ROB: +/-0
10-12) Captain Falcon: +/-0
10-12) Link: +/-0
10-12) Yoshi: -3
13) Lucario: -1
14-15) Dr. Mario: -2
14-15) Mario: +/-0
16) Luigi: +/-0
17) Pit: +2
18) Sonic: +/-0
19) Ness: +/-0
20-21) Toon Link: +1
20-21) Diddy Kong: +/-0
22) Marth: +3
23) Peach: -1
24-25) Zelda: +/-0
24-25) Sheik: +/-0
26) Falco: +/-0
27) Zero Suit Samus: +/-0
28) Meta Knight: +1
29-31) Pikachu: +/-0
29-31) Fox: -1
29-31) Olimar: -3
32) Kirby: -1
33) Mr. Game & Watch: +/-0
34) Jigglypuff: +/-0

The one trend I'm noticing is a deliberate attempt to buff heavyweights in general by making them heavier, which is a bigger advantage when it comes to Smash 4's mechanics. Traits like kill power and survivability are more valuable now than ever, so hopefully this means there'll be more heavyweights near the top of the tier list this time around.

 

[Lukingordex]

I can't accept Yoshi being lighter than Ike and Wario, i just can't.

 

[CrowGoesCaw]

Wario has his bike in his pocket and Ike is luggin that massive sword.

 

[Reila]

Yoshi being heavy never made much sense to me, to be honest.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Yoshi being heavy never made much sense to me, to be honest.

It almost makes as much sense as seeing Rosalina be very lightweight.

 

[TheTuninator]

I can't accept Yoshi being lighter than Ike and Wario, i just can't.

Have you seen Radiant Dawn Ike? That dude could probably break rocks with his bare hands. I have no problem with him being heavy.

I'm very surprised to see Palutena be that light. For balance purposes, I'm sure, but I figured she'd be heavier given her impressive stature.

 

[Espy Rose]

Glad to see that my favorites haven't changed for the worst. Thanks for the work Aero.

 

[Chiroz]

Greninja is just about where I expected him to be. Hopefully if Mewtwo gets back as DLC they actually make him a bit heavy.

Thanks for the info Aero.

Glad to see that my favorites haven't changed for the worst. Thanks for the work Aero.

So I take it you main anything that can curl into a ball and roll around?

Edit: Actually I just realized why your name sounded familiar. Back in the Brawl days I used to main Sonic at the beginning of the game for quite a while, I remember your name from those days. I can finally put that to rest.

 

[Espy Rose]

Yeah, I'm an old relic.

Sonic, Pac-Man, Little Mac, and Jiggs were who I was looking at mostly. I was surprised that Mac's weight was so light, but then I remembered that he's little.

 

[Chiroz]

Yeah, I'm an old relic.

Sonic, Pac-Man, Little Mac, and Jiggs were who I was looking at mostly. I was surprised that Mac's weight was so light, but then I remembered that he's little.

But Little Mac can't curl into a ball and roll. You deceived me.



Anyways, apart from 2 or 3 outliers weights are basically what you would expect them to be.

 

[Espy Rose]

Little mac curls into a ball and rolls while falling in free fall from sideB.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I woke up really scared.

I thought rage gene would have affected all these percentages in training mode

But then I tested it and apparently rage gene does no extra knockback in training mode.

Go figure.

 

[Noa.]

In Brawl, characters in training mode were slightly lighter than their weight in versus mode. Is that also true in Smash 4 or is it the same weight now?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

In Brawl, characters in training mode were slightly lighter than their weight in versus mode.

I've never heard of this before in my life

But seeing as I'm using training mode across both games and everything matches up perfectly, I'd say they're the same.