SINGLES Lucario Match-Ups and Directory! Mario will brb saving a princess

[culexus・wau]

but we've been discussing the same ones.

over

and

over

and

over

again

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

Well its not like you guys can't ask about stuff regarding other characters while discussing one.

How's about we talk about DK next?

I'd also like to talk about Wolf too.

Also, you guys could always help move along discussion of said top tiers so we could get to more characters sooner.

 

[iRJi]

Frankly, I don't think there was anything wrong with the old MU guide.

 

[MBlaze]

Well its not like you guys can't ask about stuff regarding other characters while discussing one.

How's about we talk about DK next?

I'd also like to talk about Wolf too.

Also, you guys could always help move along discussion of said top tiers so we could get to more characters sooner.

Wolf? No one uses Wolf offli-

Oh wait..

 

[TheOgbot]

Ok I'm a little late to the party, but since my friend D. Disciple didn't make it to the Wario discussion, I'll say what he wanted to say.

Never, NEVER let a Wario take you to Brinstar. If he's working towards a time out, he'll get it. I timed him out in a mm, and really my aerial mobility was beating every option of his. As long as I was where he wasn't, I was solid that match.

 

[culexus・wau]

why wolf?

why can't we talk about a character that is only now starting to place [san]


like

idk that guy with the really big yellow sword

 

[Braxton2011]

Let me look at the character list. I can't even remember all the charaters of the top of my head

Spoiler

so sad

Donkey Kong
DLA- I mean Ganondorf.
Lucas (seriously, PK Fire is wtf)
Mario (Maybe)
Peach
Pit
Wolf
Zero Suit Samus
Zelda

We definitely need to get some serious knowledge updates on these characters.

 

[culexus・wau]

ooh ooh Zero suit samus

 

[D. Disciple]

Ban brinstar!

Ok I'm a little late to the party, but since my friend D. Disciple didn't make it to the Wario discussion, I'll say what he wanted to say.

Never, NEVER let a Wario take you to Brinstar. If he's working towards a time out, he'll get it. I timed him out in a mm, and really my aerial mobility was beating every option of his. As long as I was where he wasn't, I was solid that match.

You're too slow! You were only faster with the bloody platform arrangement!

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Well its not like you guys can't ask about stuff regarding other characters while discussing one.

How's about we talk about DK next?

I'd also like to talk about Wolf too.

Also, you guys could always help move along discussion of said top tiers so we could get to more characters sooner.

That isn't very clean for discussion.

Also I think if we did do discussion we should do it on characters that give people trouble recently, Ike, Fox, Toon Link, Donkey Kong, etc. Some people are sick of the same old same old top tier MU's that a lot of people know.

But you are right about contributions so I'll try to help with that in the morning.

 

[Browny]

ZSS wasnt done that long ago :/

ike/lucas/ness/wolf imo... I dont remember the last time they were talked about.

 

[Braxton2011]

ZSS has changed a LOT since MLG man. We should discuss after the next MLG because we all know people will be like OMG I'M GOING TO BE THE NEXT NICK RIDDLE HURR then fail with ZSS.

 

[mew1000]

on the tear where is lucario

 

[Browny]

lol... ONE player placing high with a character doesn't mean that character has changed at all.

 

[mew1000]

that is so true

 

[TheOgbot]

You're too slow! You were only faster with the bloody platform arrangement!

lol that and being able to go under the stage helps a lot

I gotta say though, if the Wario is playing patient in general and punishing correctly, it's a rough matchup for Lucario. Some of his moves are just slow enough/laggy to get punished fairly hard by a Wario on his game.

It can work the other way though if the Wario is approaching rather hazardously.

I'm not entirely speaking from experience though. I kind of stopped caring after I timed Disciple out since I've never done that to anyone in a set that mattered until now XD

Also, not having much for the grab release kind of sucks against Wario, I honestly hate playing characters like Ganondorf more than playing Lucario just because Ganondorf can basically get a guaranteed kill off a grab release.

I'll maybe stop in later for some more in depth discussion. I don't know how far I'll get you though considering I'm rather new to the character and Lucario isn't a common MU for me. (lol first time playing Disciple was GnG Championship)

 

[culexus・wau]

We don't have a guranteed GR, but I'm preeeeeeeeeeeetty sure if you mash you'll jump break o.o


if you don't mash, we have lots of time to pummel you.

 

[mew1000]

that is helpfull but not much

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

Did you guys save that match, TheOgBot and Dark Disciple?

Hmmm, how many seconds does it take for Wario to be able to pull out his bike again after he discards it somehow?

Fighting Wario near the middle of a stage is very annoying as he has so many options to do whatever he wants. If we force him to the side his options seem a bit more limited...

 

[mew1000]

a few seconds I think

 

[culexus・wau]

like 5 or 7 seconds I think.

someone look it up in PSA

 

[Zucco]

Talk about ZSS. She's a *****.

 

[culexus・wau]

Aurasphere dat hoe.

for reals.

charged AS beats like a loooooot of her moves.


learning to powershield sideB helps tremendously as it means they cannot use it for spacing out in the open anymore.

 

[mew1000]

ya aurasphere goooo *_*

 

[TheOgbot]

We don't have a guranteed GR, but I'm preeeeeeeeeeeetty sure if you mash you'll jump break o.o


if you don't mash, we have lots of time to pummel you.

Yeah, Marshall did show me that if you don't do any up/jump inputs when you're mashing, you'll ground break though.

As for bike, I know it comes out after you whiffing it like once.

I think the 5 second rule sound pretty close just from a guess off the top of my head.

Also I'm not sure if that match was saved, the recording setup froze during our set :/

 

[mew1000]

5 seconds rule what

 

[Braxton2011]

Watch. There will be a flood of ZSS soon... Just wait and see.

 

[D. Disciple]

Did you guys save that match, TheOgBot and Dark Disciple?

Hmmm, how many seconds does it take for Wario to be able to pull out his bike again after he discards it somehow?

Fighting Wario near the middle of a stage is very annoying as he has so many options to do whatever he wants. If we force him to the side his options seem a bit more limited...

Depends on how long Nappy takes uploading the vids.

 

[phi1ny3]

lol that and being able to go under the stage helps a lot

I gotta say though, if the Wario is playing patient in general and punishing correctly, it's a rough matchup for Lucario. Some of his moves are just slow enough/laggy to get punished fairly hard by a Wario on his game.

It can work the other way though if the Wario is approaching rather hazardously.

I'm not entirely speaking from experience though. I kind of stopped caring after I timed Disciple out since I've never done that to anyone in a set that mattered until now XD

Also, not having much for the grab release kind of sucks against Wario, I honestly hate playing characters like Ganondorf more than playing Lucario just because Ganondorf can basically get a guaranteed kill off a grab release.

I'll maybe stop in later for some more in depth discussion. I don't know how far I'll get you though considering I'm rather new to the character and Lucario isn't a common MU for me. (lol first time playing Disciple was GnG Championship)

How does Ganon go about grabbing wario?

You're talking about one of the worst shield grabs (seriously, unless you powershield, this character can't seem to punish w/ shield grab oos lol) w/ one of the slowest characters and possibly the most punishable moveset combined with the hardest character to grab + some of the best punish/poking capabilities.

Not trolling/being a flamer, but I while I can see Wario getting hugely humiliated by a lol grab by ganon, I honestly can't see how that's going to happen except maybe once.

back on topic, I don't have anyone that has attempted to time me out as wario, but from what I've seen, lucario can very easily get screwed over especially if lucario gets knocked offstage while Wario has that killer waft. Lucario can wall out well, so you have to make sure you keep the status quo and keep him tying w/ you first stock onward, you really need this character to approach for you to win lol.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

If Wario was trying to Time out Lucario all the time, he would be in big trouble no joke.

Another think that makes this MU annoying his is long list of CP stages he can take us to. Seriously I can name 2-3 that work with Lucario and 6-7 that help Wario out.

Edit:
Lucario love:
FD
Smashville
Yoshi Island Brawl

Wario love:
Pictochat
Lylat cruise
Battlefield
Rainbow Cruise

Lucario: "Please time me out":
Brinstar

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

How does Wario do better than us on Lylat?

 

[Tony T]

How does Wario do better than us on Lylat?

hmm Wario I faced that SOB on Lylat um apparently the only thing I know is he can shield pressure us more on lylat with his u-airs and f-airs if we stay on the mid platforms and if it works he can cause some wicked damage with his CF (Charged Fart) when we get knocked off the mid stage platform due to shield pressure also when it comes to our AS he can just use his bike to cancel them out so Aiming for the head is critical in this case but its harder for us because of the tilting platform that's all I know its not much but I'm trying to contribute.

 

[culexus・wau]

Anything with platforms is lolbad for us vs wario.

HOP HOP HOP HOP HOP HOP HOP.

****ing hate wario on medium-> big stages.

lylat is pretty big and it the stage tilting affects us a great deal more then it affects him.


the ****er can bring us to rainbow too.

 

[Tony T]

Anything with platforms is lolbad for us vs wario.

HOP HOP HOP HOP HOP HOP HOP.

****ing hate wario on medium-> big stages.

lylat is pretty big and it the stage tilting affects us a great deal more then it affects him.


the ****er can bring us to rainbow too.

That's true.

 

[hichez50]

With ware you simply need to get damage on him before he gets damage on you.

 

[Steam]

With ware you simply need to get damage on him before he gets damage on you.

I did not know this concept was specific to the wario matchup

 

[hichez50]

Well some wario's will camp no matter what.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Anything with platforms is lolbad for us vs wario.

HOP HOP HOP HOP HOP HOP HOP.

****ing hate wario on medium-> big stages.

lylat is pretty big and it the stage tilting affects us a great deal more then it affects him.


the ****er can bring us to rainbow too.

Pretty much this.

Wario can run circles around us and work his fat magic if we're not careful. Still this is a very momentum based match-up, don't let it shift to him.

I've heard our bair is very good against him, this true?

 

[Pitbuller26]

Not really, you're better off using fair and ftilt against Wario.

 

[phi1ny3]

bair is good in some situations (like knocking wario when he bike jumps), but usually since fair outranges most of his pokes/aerials, you might as well wall with that since it has less startup/end lag.