Shantae, the Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town! (A Switch To A New WayForward)

[SharkLord]

Lol yeah.

It's funny everyone's gone quiet on the thread today. Too much partying for shantae yesterday ;p

Well, the 1000-page milestone was what everyone was talking about. Now that it's been reached, we'll just have to wait for something else to talk about.

 

[Paragon-Yoshi]

Well, the 1000-page milestone was what everyone was talking about. Now that it's been reached, we'll just have to wait for something else to talk about.

Well we were talking about a potential Shantae Fighting Game.
But that conversation died out quickly.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

So guys, do you think we can surpass the Issac thread if we keep the discussion going like we have in the past few days? We just got 69 pages to go as of right now. Let's make Shantae the queen of Smashboards as if we surpass Isaac's thread and Geno get's in she will be the queen.

 

[Teeb147]

So guys, do you think we can surpass the Issac thread if we keep the discussion going like we have in the past few days? We just got 69 pages to go as of right now. Let's make Shantae the queen of Smashboards as if we surpass Isaac's thread and Geno get's in she will be the queen.

Sure, it'll take a while since they still post in it a little, but I think we'll catch up eventually. Some people think that assist trophies have a chance too, but I think it's a long shot.

 

[WingedSupernova]

So guys, do you think we can surpass the Issac thread if we keep the discussion going like we have in the past few days? We just got 69 pages to go as of right now. Let's make Shantae the queen of Smashboards as if we surpass Isaac's thread and Geno get's in she will be the queen.

I don't think Isaac has much of a chance personally, so if Geno gets in first, Shantae will be the queen even without surpassing Isaac.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Sure, it'll take a while since they still post in it a little, but I think we'll catch up eventually. Some people think that assist trophies have a chance too, but I think it's a long shot.

I think Assist Trophies will get promoted in the same game eventually. I think it will happen since a Spirit got promoted.

 

[Teeb147]

I think Assist Trophies will get promoted in the same game eventually. I think it will happen since a Spirit got promoted.

Lol. Nah. There's a big difference between an assist trophy and a spirit. I wouldn't mind because it'd mean Krystal and Ashley would have a chance, but yeah not, I think it's really not a thought that's likely, and on top of if this is the last dlc batch, it would most likely only be something for another game.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Lol. Nah. There's a big difference between an assist trophy and a spirit. I wouldn't mind because it'd mean Krystal and Ashley would have a chance, but yeah not, I think it's really not a thought that's likely, and on top of if this is the last dlc batch, it would most likely only be something for another game.

It still could happen though. They can just turn their Assist Trophies off when someone is playing as them.

 

[Teeb147]

It still could happen though. They can just turn their Assist Trophies off when someone is playing as them.

Sure. I'm not gonna say it can't happen, because I think sakurai (or nintendo) could just be like ah you know what I want this character as a fighter, and then go with a way to make it work. But still more likely that if they decided to put them as assist trophies, they have their place in the game already.

If there would be one assist trophy they'd promote, I wonder who'd they go with. Of course I want krystal, but unless they release a new star fox with her in it, I don't see it likely happening, so Ashley would have more chance (that I'd root for). There's plenty of other assist trophies that'd make great characters tho. They have freakin bomberman, like.. to me that's an icon that'd deserve to be a fighter.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Sure. I'm not gonna say it can't happen, because I think sakurai (or nintendo) could just be like ah you know what I want this character as a fighter, and then go with a way to make it work. But still more likely that if they decided to put them as assist trophies, they have their place in the game already.

If there would be one assist trophy they'd promote, I wonder who'd they go with. Of course I want krystal, but unless they release a new star fox with her in it, I don't see it likely happening, so Ashley would have more chance (that I'd root for). There's plenty of other assist trophies that'd make great characters tho. They have freakin bomberman, like.. to me that's an icon that'd deserve to be a fighter.

If any Assist Trophy get's promoted in this game it will surely be Waluigi. But I would really want Krystal though.

 

[SharkLord]

Sure. I'm not gonna say it can't happen, because I think sakurai (or nintendo) could just be like ah you know what I want this character as a fighter, and then go with a way to make it work. But still more likely that if they decided to put them as assist trophies, they have their place in the game already.

If there would be one assist trophy they'd promote, I wonder who'd they go with. Of course I want krystal, but unless they release a new star fox with her in it, I don't see it likely happening, so Ashley would have more chance (that I'd root for). There's plenty of other assist trophies that'd make great characters tho. They have freakin bomberman, like.. to me that's an icon that'd deserve to be a fighter.

Spirits were intended for the same purpose. About two years later, Min Min happened. It might be a bigger gameplay change, but it's the same general idea. And besides, even if Sakurai's still intent of keeping ATs the way they are, I doubt Nintendo's going to care much if a character's an Assist Trophy.

As for who would be promoted, I'm fairly confident Isaac's going to be the Banjo of this pass. Waluigi would be ahead of him, but there's not much he could bring. He's most likely going to be a Piranha Plant-esque solo fighter, if anything.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Spirits were intended for the same purpose. About two years later, Min Min happened. It might be a bigger gameplay change, but it's the same general idea. And besides, even if Sakurai's still intent of keeping ATs the way they are, I doubt Nintendo's going to care much if a character's an Assist Trophy.

As for who would be promoted, I'm fairly confident Isaac's going to be the Banjo of this pass. Waluigi would be ahead of him, but there's not much he could bring. He's most likely going to be a Piranha Plant-esque solo fighter, if anything.

I think both Waluigi and Isaac could get promoted honestly. They're both so popular it's hard for Nintendo to ignore if choosing popular Assist Trophies to promote. As for the Banjo of FP2 I think that's going to be Geno.

 

[Teeb147]

Spirits were intended for the same purpose. About two years later, Min Min happened. It might be a bigger gameplay change, but it's the same general idea. And besides, even if Sakurai's still intent of keeping ATs the way they are, I doubt Nintendo's going to care much if a character's an Assist Trophy.

As for who would be promoted, I'm fairly confident Isaac's going to be the Banjo of this pass. Waluigi would be ahead of him, but there's not much he could bring. He's most likely going to be a Piranha Plant-esque solo fighter, if anything.

Spirits were never supposed to take a fighter's place. It was a dumb idea that some people had, that it would deconfirm someone. For a lot of us we were glad to see min min not because it showed they could be promoted, but instead that people would finally shut up about the stupid idea that spirits meant they couldnt be fighters, lol.

Isaac did do high on some polls I saw, so who knows, but yeah I dont think ATs will be fighters in this game.

 

[SharkLord]

Spirits were never supposed to take a fighter's place. It was a dumb idea that some people had, that it would deconfirm someone. For a lot of us we were glad to see min min not because it showed they could be promoted, but instead that people would finally shut up about the stupid idea that spirits meant they couldnt be fighters, lol.

Isaac did do high on some polls I saw, so who knows, but yeah I dont think ATs will be fighters in this game.

Their entire point was to be representing characters and expanding the crossover for those who weren't fighters, while still serving some purpose in gameplay. Skip to FP2, either Sakurai noticed nobody used Spirits in PvP or Nintendo just didn't care, so Min Min was a thing. Still, they were intended to be consolation prizes to characters who didn't-Or couldn't-Make the cut, just like Assist Trophies.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I can't wait until the Assist Trophy fan rule dies as all detractors using almost anything in the game against characters chances will be btfo.

 

[Teeb147]

Their entire point was to be representing characters and expanding the crossover for those who weren't fighters, while still serving some purpose in gameplay. Skip to FP2, either Sakurai noticed nobody used Spirits in PvP or Nintendo just didn't care, so Min Min was a thing. Still, they were intended to be consolation prizes to characters who didn't-Or couldn't-Make the cut, just like Assist Trophies.

I don't agree with that perspective. They weren't consolation prizes at all. Just because some images help represent some characters doesn't mean they close the doors for them as fighters. ATs on the other hand are that, they're part of the gameplay and I'm sure for quite a few of them they considered whether to put them as fighters, like Isaac and Ashley, but then they decided to commit to just an AT.

Note: Still not saying it's impossible for it to happen, just unlikely.

 

[SharkLord]

I can't wait until the Assist Trophy fan rule dies as all detractors using almost anything in the game against characters chances will be btfo.

I'm interested in how that would affect this thread, considering how Shovel Knight will be back on the table. The fanbases seem to be pretty friendly, but it would put Shantae's general placement as "Most likely indie rep" into question.

I don't agree with that perspective. They weren't consolation prizes at all. Just because some images help represent some characters doesn't mean they close the doors for them as fighters. ATs on the other hand are that, they're part of the gameplay and I'm sure for quite a few of them they considered whether to put them as fighters, like Isaac and Ashley, but then they decided to commit to just an AT.

Spirits are part of the gameplay. They serve as collectables, they alter your stats, they give you items, etc. Sure, they're not to the same level as Assists, but they were meant to be a part of the gameplay while still expanding the crossover and being easy to make, unlike Trophies. Fighters didn't get collectable Spirits, only Fighter Spirits. Min Min ended up giving that dilemma the boot by having two Spirits, and Assists aren't that much of a difference.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I don't agree with that perspective. They weren't consolation prizes at all. Just because some images help represent some characters doesn't mean they close the doors for them as fighters. ATs on the other hand are that, they're part of the gameplay and I'm sure for quite a few of them they considered whether to put them as fighters, like Isaac and Ashley, but then they decided to commit to just an AT.

Assist Trophies and Mii costumes are definitely both consulation prizes. Just look at the new Assist Trophy section in Ultimate, it has Isaac, Krystal, Bomberman, and Shovel Knight characters who all did really well in the Smash Ballot. This was Sakurai and co's message to their fans saying "We didn't ignore you so here is something you will enjoy."

I'm interested in how that would affect this thread, considering how Shovel Knight will be back on the table. The fanbases seem to be pretty friendly, but it would put Shantae's general placement as "Most likely indie rep" into question.

I think Shantae will still be the most likely Indie to become playable even if Assist Trophies and Shovel Knight are back on the table. Shovel Knight only has one game while Shantae has 5. While Shovel Knight's one game is more popular then Shantae's games, she has seniority and history over Shovel Knight.

 

[Shinuto]

I'm interested in how that would affect this thread, considering how Shovel Knight will be back on the table. The fanbases seem to be pretty friendly, but it would put Shantae's general placement as "Most likely indie rep" into question.

I will start murdering in the streets if Shantae's status as most likely indie is put into question by a filthy Assist Trophy being made playable.

 

[Teeb147]

Assist Trophies and Mii costumes are definitely both consulation prizes. Just look at the new Assist Trophy section in Ultimate, it has Isaac, Krystal, Bomberman, and Shovel Knight characters who all did really well in the Smash Ballot. This was Sakurai and co's message to their fans saying "We didn't ignore you so here is something you will enjoy."

Yeah pretty much. They wanted to give them decent representation even though they weren't gonna go all the way to fighters.

For mii costumes, I'm a little more on the idea that it has more chance, especially that quite a few fighters have mii costume parts of them. I will say, that seeing no mii costume of geno and chocobo make me think there could be another SE character coming (maybe geno himself).

 

[MattX20]

As far as AT upgrades go, Isaac is by far the strongest contender. Spirits have Geno, Shantae, Rayman, and Bandana Dee among others to pick from

 

[zferolie]

wow... last I checked we were 97... and that was yesterday I thought. how did we blow past 1000 so hard?! did I miss something?

 

[SharkLord]

I will start murdering in the streets if Shantae's status as most likely indie is put into question by a filthy Assist Trophy being made playable.

Imma stop you right there

 

[Teeb147]

wow... last I checked we were 97... and that was yesterday I thought. how did we blow past 1000 so hard?! did I miss something?

We might've .. posted a bit more to speed it along XD

We're in the big boy girl league now.

 

[zferolie]

We might've .. posted a bit more to speed it along XD

We're in the big boy girl league now.

Haha. just not used to this speed...

But did I miss anything important other then congradulations? any more smash or wayforward speculation?

 

[SharkLord]

Haha. just not used to this speed...

But did I miss anything important other then congradulations? any more smash or wayforward speculation?

Not much, beyond occasional WayForward Milestones (Which you may have seen anyways). At the moment there was a brief debate over if Ats deconfirm or not, and I threw out the idea of how this thread would take Shovel Knight being 100% put back on the table by Isaac an AT being promoted.

 

[LaBeteNoire]

Here's some art found on the Shantae reddit for my good friend Dyllybirdy.

Spoiler: Sleepy Rotty

 

[Teeb147]

Haha. just not used to this speed...

But did I miss anything important other then congradulations? any more smash or wayforward speculation?

We didn't cover anything big. Just little things around shantae, the speculation itself, and a little bit of dreaming about a shantae fighting game ;p

Oh, and a bit of shantae art. And the new art book pre-order came out but it's kinda expensive. Might be interesting though.

 

[zferolie]

We didn't cover anything big. Just little things around shantae, the speculation itself, and a little bit of dreaming about a shantae fighting game ;p

Oh, and a bit of shantae art. And the new art book pre-order came out but it's kinda expensive. Might be interesting though.

Heard about the artbook, but gonna wait on it a bit. A shantae fighting game would be cool.

 

[MeteoRain]

As far as AT upgrades go, Isaac is by far the strongest contender. Spirits have Geno, Shantae, Rayman, and Bandana Dee among others to pick from

He's the underdog of ATs, but I wouldn't say he's uncontested if an AT gets promoted. Waluigi and Bomberman both have fairly strong reasons to be upgraded.

Not to mention that mini gold mine of Zelda characters that, unfortunately, always get thrown under a bus.

Still, I wouldn't be that surprised if Isaac was at least considered. The only logical reasoning against him effectively flew out the window when Banjo & Kazooie were revealed.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

So do you guys think WayForward will ever evolve into a 3rd party developer? They seem to operate more like a 3rd party now than a Indie one with all the games they're producing all at once and advertising and selling merchandise of Shantae. I definitely think if we ever get a Indie rep it's going to be our girl.

 

[WingedSupernova]

So do you guys think WayForward will ever evolve into a 3rd party developer? They seem to operate more like a 3rd party now than a Indie one with all the games they're producing all at once and advertising and selling merchandise of Shantae. I definitely think if we ever get a Indie rep it's going to be our girl.

That's really difficult to do if I must be honest, and I can't see it happening anytime soon for WayForward. They'd need each of their own IPs to become astronomically more popular, and then they would have to expand their size to allow for more developers and begin to self-publish. Third parties like NIS and Spike Chunsoft are not too far removed from Wayforward at first glance, but when it comes down to it you realize those companies publish instead of create the majority of their titles, on top of having an international presence. So I think to be considered a 3rd party developer Wayforward needs to get more popular, earn more money, expand overseas, and publish games themselves.

 

[SoupCanMafia]

That's really difficult to do if I must be honest, and I can't see it happening anytime soon for WayForward. They'd need each of their own IPs to become astronomically more popular, and then they would have to expand their size to allow for more developers and begin to self-publish. Third parties like NIS and Spike Chunsoft are not too far removed from Wayforward at first glance, but when it comes down to it you realize those companies publish instead of create the majority of their titles, on top of having an international presence. So I think to be considered a 3rd party developer Wayforward needs to get more popular, earn more money, expand overseas, and publish games themselves.

And in that aspect, I believe that steps one and three are underway. They've finally gotten up to around 3M units of all Shantae sold a couple months back during Seven Siren's release onto the consoles, though I dunno how much money they've made on the Shantae IP alone. And I wouldn't necessarily say that the "publish games themselves" clause works as well, since if need be, they can self-publish with Risky's Revenge and technically YCG has self-published Shovel Knight. It'd be more accurate to say that they're large enough that other companies publish under them, like with Inti Creates, or more generically, Activision.

 

[Dukefire]

It has been repeated many times before, but I'll do it again. For Shantae's moveset, it can go like this. (You can change it if you want)
Ground
Standard A: Hair whip where it is spamable like Megaman's pellets with little flinching.
Forward A: using the roundhouse kick technique
Down A: crouch and hair whip
Up A: using the boot equipment to kick up overhead.
Dash attack: using the cuff equipemt to perform a charge attack like Wario's shoulder bash.
Aerials
Nair: Tiara equipment where shantae spins in the air
Uair: overhead kick with the boot equipment
Fair: forward two leg kick like King K Rool
Bair: using one leg for kicking like Sonic would
Dair: Sash equipment where Shantae drill down or diagonally down. Maybe act like corrin's Dair.
Smash attacks
Forward: more powered up version of the roundhouse kick technique
Up: powered up version of the boots equipment and can launch shantae upward if held down
Down: from SSBC, summon 2 storm puffs on each side to crash lighting down
Specials
Neutral: transform into four animals based on input. Press again to transform back. It can't be done immediately and will leave you vulnerable for the first moments after morphing
Forward: fire spells. Tapping will shoot one fireball. Holding will make a flamethrower
Down: pike ball and it's level depends on how long. Their duration may last for 5 secs like Megaman's leaf blade, but cannot be launched
Tapping: 1 pike ball
Some time held: super pike ball
Full charge: scimitars
Up: using risky boots cannon to go up three times. After that, duds once all three cannonballs are used.
Animal Transformations Pros and Cons
Monkey (Right): Small, fast with the monkey claw for damage build. Easier to launch with more receiving damage
Elephant (Left): Heavy, powerful and can use the Elephant charge and stomp to launch players. Jumping is very low with slower movement.
Harpy (Up): Can allow shantae 4 more jumps and can fire with Harpy Talons. Easier to launch and has a hard time with stop traction like Luigi.
Spider (Down): shoot poison from a distance for overtime damage and pressure. Slow attack speed.
Idle animations
1. Correcting her hair
2. Looking around and rest a bit before back alert
3. Dances for a moment
Taunts
1. Item get
2. Dance command as a nod to the original shantae game
3. Drinking a potion (not to heal like how young link drinks lon lon milk)
Victory Animations
1.
2.
3.
Idk at this point, but here is my updated thoughts on her moveset.

Edit: her dodge animation is the backdash technique. Though, her spotdodge could be smash original.

 

[Shinuto]

It has been repeated many times before, but I'll do it again. For Shantae's moveset, it can go like this. (You can change it if you want)
Ground
Standard A: Hair whip where it is spamable like Megaman's pellets with little flinching.
Forward A: using the roundhouse kick technique
Down A: crouch and hair whip
Up A: using the boot equipment to kick up overhead.
Dash attack: using the cuff equipemt to perform a charge attack like Wario's shoulder bash.
Aerials
Nair: Tiara equipment where shantae spins in the air
Uair: overhead kick with the boot equipment
Fair: forward two leg kick like King K Rool
Bair: using one leg for kicking like Sonic would
Dair: Sash equipment where Shantae drill down or diagonally down. Maybe act like corrin's Dair.
Smash attacks
Forward: more powered up version of the roundhouse kick technique
Up: powered up version of the boots equipment and can launch shantae upward if held down
Down: from SSBC, summon 2 storm puffs on each side to crash lighting down
Specials
Neutral: transform into four animals based on input. Press again to transform back. It can't be done immediately and will leave you vulnerable for the first moments after morphing
Forward: fire spells. Tapping will shoot one fireball. Holding will make a flamethrower
Down: pike ball and it's level depends on how long. Their duration may last for 5 secs like Megaman's leaf blade, but cannot be launched
Tapping: 1 pike ball
Some time held: super pike ball
Full charge: scimitars
Up: using risky boots cannon to go up three times. After that, duds once all three cannonballs are used.
Animal Transformations Pros and Cons
Monkey (Right): Small, fast with the monkey claw for damage build. Easier to launch with more receiving damage
Elephant (Left): Heavy, powerful and can use the Elephant charge and stomp to launch players. Jumping is very low with slower movement.
Harpy (Up): Can allow shantae 4 more jumps and can fire with Harpy Talons. Easier to launch and has a hard time with stop traction like Luigi.
Spider (Down): shoot poison from a distance for overtime damage and pressure. Slow attack speed.
Idle animations
1. Correcting her hair
2. Looking around and rest a bit before back alert
3. Dances for a moment
Taunts
1. Item get
2. Dance command as a nod to the original shantae game
3. Drinking a potion (not to heal like how young link drinks lon lon milk)
Victory Animations
1.
2.
3.
Idk at this point, but here is my updated thoughts on her moveset.

Edit: her dodge animation is the backdash technique. Though, her spotdodge could be smash original.

I'd really make the smashes different, her side and up smash are literally just the tilts but "stronger" make smash a really strong hair whip and up tilt fire a fireball upwards and dont you ******* dare give Shantae a stall and fall dair. give a hair smashing front spin move that spikes.

 

[WingedSupernova]

I dunno how they'd do it, but the one over the top amazing thing they could do for Shantae is make her dancing animation match the beat of whatever song is playing in the game.

 

[Teeb147]

I dunno how they'd do it, but the one over the top amazing thing they could do for Shantae is make her dancing animation match the beat of whatever song is playing in the game.

Heh, I doubt they'd think to go that far. Would be a nice little touch tho. How would super fast beats treat her tho?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

As far as AT upgrades go, Isaac is by far the strongest contender. Spirits have Geno, Shantae, Rayman, and Bandana Dee among others to pick from

Waluigi: Wah, am I a joke to you? My deconfirmation even caught the attention of the Washington Post.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

First of all, I rather doubt that ATs will be made playable in the same game, let alone Shovel Knight. Last time they had they opportunity to do it, nothing came of it, and they chose to promote trophies instead. History is repeating itself with a spirit having been made playable so far, and those are this game's equivalent to trophies. Old habits die hard.

Second of all, it looks like WF counted their collaboration on Bloodstained as a milestone, so there's 11 left to go:

#WayForward30 Milestone 19: We've long been fans of Koji Igarashi and his distinct brand of Gothic action/adventure/horror, so it was a true honor to lend a hand in the development of his latest endeavor, Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night, published by @505_Games. pic.twitter.com/BKXnN89Wcw

— WayForward (@WayForward) August 6, 2020

Last of all, I will defend Shovel Knight to the death from anyone that speaks badly of him.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

I personally don't expect any Indie reps to make it honestly. If Shovel Knight arguably the most popular Indie only made it as an assist at most. What chances do the others have then?

Not to dash anyone's hopes that is. Believe me I can be wrong given how many so called "rules" and the impossible Sakurai has broken.