Shantae, the Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town! (A Switch To A New WayForward)

[Wademan94]

It could work depending on how they go about doing it. Monkey could have the combo potential of Sheik's fair with great speed and a tiny hitbox, Elephant causes heavy shield damage with a Bowser Bomb ground pound, Spider's great at long distance projectile pestering, and Harpy's got fantastic edgeguarding skills. I kinda agree on the Spider Web criticizm though, how about instead of simply grabbing onto platforms above it's a Brawl ZSS up B type attack that pulls opponents down from straight above?

So here’s what the Spider web double jump could potentially do:

-latch onto solid platforms and crawl on them for a bit (wouldn’t stay on infinitely, especially if the transformations are timed)
-latch onto the edge of platforms
-latch onto soft platforms and pull her onto the top of them
-latch onto opponents that are above and bring them down/jump off them

Would it be overpowered to have this Spider web double jump doing all of the above?

 

[EarlTamm]

Mario RPG was way ahead of its time and redefined how so many things could be in RPGs (and other games). It doesn't matter if some people don't look into it, it has an important part in gaming history, and having it played it myself back then, it was crazy good (even if on the short side), and some great stuff in it still doesn't show up that often in games these days, it's definitely a legendary game, at least historically. It's just too bad it was just 1 game, and that's probably what makes it less known for people.
And, not to mention that it and Chrono Trigger had amazing attention to detail and lots was hand-made and hand-picked, unlike all the generic stuff we see elsewhere. Also, not many rpgs were funny (& didn't take themselves fully seriously), I think just Earthbound besides smrpg, that I know of.

Shantae on the other hand is going strong to this day, so that's one thing the franchise has going

I guess it's just my view on what legendary means. SMRPG seems to get passed up so often in discussion for the Paper Mario series or the M&L series outside of Smash Bros. How can something be a legend if you are bareley discussed. SMRPG is quality, but it's hard to be a legend if no one passes it along. The game is not as appreciated as it should be, and it really should be legendary in my eyes. And Geno being Smash could certainly help with that.

Shantae being a long standing series is what sets her apart from 95% of indies, so yeah, it's certainly an advantage.

 

[Teeb147]

I guess it's just my view on what legendary means. SMRPG seems to get passed up so often in discussion for the Paper Mario series or the M&L series outside of Smash Bros. How can something be a legend if you are bareley discussed. SMRPG is quality, but it's hard to be a legend if no one passes it along. The game is not as appreciated as it should be, and it really should be legendary in my eyes. And Geno being Smash could certainly help with that.

Shantae being a long standing series is what sets her apart from 95% of indies, so yeah, it's certainly an advantage.

Yeah, I think that you're right on both fronts. But just because it got lost out of view doesn't mean it's not legendary, imo. I think papa genos did a decent job explaining why it is that Geno popularity has kept so strong, and it has to do with how strong of an impression it left on people at the time. It kept that legacy, but with the people it left that impression mostly, I guess. It's a bit strange that by contrast Chrono Trigger is more reknowned. I love both.

Shantae started out slow, but it's like a snowball, getting bigger, and can you imagine how it'll be if she gets in smash? :D

 

[EarlTamm]

Yeah, I think that you're right on both fronts. But just because it got lost out of view doesn't mean it's not legendary, imo. I think papa genos did a decent job explaining why it is that Geno popularity has kept so strong, and it has to do with how strong of an impression it left on people at the time. It kept that legacy, but with the people it left that impression mostly, I guess. It's a bit strange that by contrast Chrono Trigger is more reknowned. I love both.

Shantae started out slow, but it's like a snowball, getting bigger, and can you imagine how it'll be if she gets in smash? :D

Yeah, and I love that video, but the definition of legendary is still "remarkable enough to be famous; very well known." I mean, how popular is SMRPG outside of our little groups? Heck, that video was made to educate people on why Geno is so popular and SMRPG is so important. If SMRPG was truly legendary, that video would have never needed to exist, since the game's importance would have been well known. Now, it has the makings of a legend, it just needs a push to have the general public look back at it and realize it's status. Also, SM64 kinda c*** blocked it because of it's release not to long after and it likely taking up a lot of attention.

Anyway, when it comes to Shantae's moveset, I always figured it would be a mix of both Pirate Weapons and transformations, with the transformations being like Shulk's Manado arts this game. Though that does being into question where you would map the pistol, since that would have been logically in the middle.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Also, SM64 kinda c*** blocked it because of it's release not to long after and it likely taking up a lot of attention.

SM64 overshadowed DKC3 as well, it was like they were saying "never mind that prerendered CGI, polygons are the new hotness!". Basically, a repeat of the SNES arrival days.

Shantae being a long standing series is what sets her apart from 95% of indies, so yeah, it's certainly an advantage.

Few indies can claim to have staying power like she does. Aside from having more games, rereleases and ports are the only way for them to leave an impression on the public for more than a year.

 

[EarlTamm]

SM64 overshadowed DKC3 as well, it was like they were saying "never mind that prerendered CGI, polygons are the new hotness!". Basically, a repeat of the SNES arrival days.



Few indies can claim to have staying power like she does. Aside from having more games, rereleases and ports are the only way for them to leave an impression on the public for more than a year.

Shame. SMRPG did actually take inspiration from DKC's CGI style, as Square wanted to make an RPG based off that rather than there normal top down pixel style.

Honestly, who actually does match up to her staying power? The only one I can think of is Cave Story, but that's only ever been one game and it's many re releases.

 

[Teeb147]

Yeah, and I love that video, but the definition of legendary is still "remarkable enough to be famous; very well known." I mean, how popular is SMRPG outside of our little groups? Heck, that video was made to educate people on why Geno is so popular and SMRPG is so important. If SMRPG was truly legendary, that video would have never needed to exist, since the game's importance would have been well known. Now, it has the makings of a legend, it just needs a push to have the general public look back at it and realize it's status. Also, SM64 kinda c*** blocked it because of it's release not to long after and it likely taking up a lot of attention.

Anyway, when it comes to Shantae's moveset, I always figured it would be a mix of both Pirate Weapons and transformations, with the transformations being like Shulk's Manado arts this game. Though that does being into question where you would map the pistol, since that would have been logically in the middle.

Good point. Can we say it's at least quasi-legendary?
I think that other games, including chrono trigger, kept having releases (on ps, and on ds, etc), but mario rpg only made it to virtual console much later. It's a shame that Nintendo didn't push it more, but it's possible that there were issues with rights, and also that they've been content with paper mario and mario&luigi sagas taking its place.

But Geno is really popular in general, but it's still maybe niche in one sense, dunno.

As for Shantae, personally I'd prefer her to use more magic than pirate gear. I'm more for the harpy transformation for up-b and fireball instead of a gun. But that's my preference, I guess.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Honestly, who actually does match up to her staying power? The only one I can think of is Cave Story, but that's only ever been one game and it's many re releases.

Exactly. Granted, you could technically count Toki Tori as well, that's been around since the GBC days (coincidentally) and up to Two Tribes' eventual folding/resurrection, as well as Umihara Kawase, which has been there for a long time, but hadn't gotten any Western exposure until Sayonara.

As much as Shovel Knight and Undertale are hot right now, their popularity may die off into cinders in a few years.

 

[EarlTamm]

You know, I hope Shantae's curry animation is sorta like her carrying Rottytops animation, where she is just sorta dancing in a panic.

 

[WingedSupernova]

I dare you to do it with Rayman, Doomguy, and Crash Bandicoot.

Why do people want Rayman? He's just an albino Sukapon with hair.
Why do people want Doomguy? He's the personification of a discount Master Chief action figure I'd find in the clearance bin at Dollar General.
Why do people want Crash Bandicoot? He's just an overtly crude and inappropriate Tazmanian Devil.

 

[EarlTamm]

Why do people want Rayman? He's just an albino Sukapon with hair.
Why do people want Doomguy? He's the personification of a discount Master Chief action figure I'd find in the clearance bin at Dollar General.
Why do people want Crash Bandicoot? He's just an overtly crude and inappropriate Tazmanian Devil.

That Doomguy one is pretty hilarious, I will not lie. Good roast.

 

[WingedSupernova]

That Doomguy one is pretty hilarious, I will not lie. Good roast.

I tried my best lol

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I tried my best lol

I love the Crash one myself.

 

[Shinuto]

So if Shantae got announced, has anyone in here made bets with someone and would thus win said bet? I've made a heh "bet" on Gamefaqs of all places, I don't expect the user to uphold their end of the bet if I win but...i already have this game preordered so either I get nothing and have the satisfaction of winning the bet (an Shantae in Smash) or I get 60 bucks.

 

[Wademan94]

By the way, I found her Screen KO:

 

[Isaac: Venus Adept]

Ah so that 1 picture was proven fake. Some of the choices seemed solid but Agnis seemed like an odd choice when Sakurai knows how big Geno is. Only way I see Geno not making it in is if SE says no.

I know I am late on this, but I honestly cannot see Bandana Dee as playable... it just... I don't know, he feels too boring. He's a minion with a spear. Yeah he's popular, but I don't seem him as a base roster kinda guy. DLC i see it more likely, but when you are hyping the original release of the game he just doesn't seem like a great fit. As for Skull kid I feel like while he is popular, he was only a villain in 1 game. I can see him being a boss in story mode, but not playable in the base roster. Isaac I think has a lot of popularity, and could make it in, its just if Nintendo and Camelot want to bring back the series. Its possible they can use Smash as a gauge.

Isaac: Venus Adept Cool sig pictute you got there, All seem like Nice choices... Man I have pretty much given up on ever see Jill from Drill dozer again... that was such a good game. Would be amazing to see her in as a playable, but at this point her returning as an AT would be nice.

Well guys, its basically the waiting game again.

Ah yeah, Jill from Drill Dozer is one of those characters that I'd be so hype for but she is incredibly unlikely at this point. Most of my requests are from IPs without playable characters that would fit really well in Smash and would have amazing potential movesets

 

[zferolie]

By the way, I found her Screen KO:

View attachment 160687

Man, Shantae is nice and THICC in all the right places *is shot by her gun*

I love how they made glass KO screen for all the enemies.

Ah yeah, Jill from Drill Dozer is one of those characters that I'd be so hype for but she is incredibly unlikely at this point. Most of my requests are from IPs without playable characters that would fit really well in Smash and would have amazing potential movesets

I wish Gamefreak was allowed to make more non pokemon games. the few they have made have been quite good. Jill was such a cool character and with her Drill she could be very unique.

 

[meleebrawler]

We can't expect transformations to have elaborte movesets. 2 or 3 specialties would be fine and it could even automateicall revert back to shantae after using an attack. It doesn't have to, and it could be manual, and if it's fast like pokemon trainer switches, then there's no problem.

Obviously that's how it would work, but I still don't think it's a good idea. Why would you ever NOT be a small, fast monkey to move around? Why ever be a slow, clunky elephant? Maybe I could see a compromise where the transformation special result in an instant attack, and nothing more. Because I ask you, when have you ever transformed in a Shantae battle other than to avoid an attack or exploit a very specific weakness? Just goes to show how the mobility-focused ones would simply dominate in a Smash environment, and all others might as well not even be there.

It could work depending on how they go about doing it. Monkey could have the combo potential of Sheik's fair with great speed and a tiny hitbox, Elephant causes heavy shield damage with a Bowser Bomb ground pound, Spider's great at long distance projectile pestering, and Harpy's got fantastic edgeguarding skills. I kinda agree on the Spider Web criticizm though, how about instead of simply grabbing onto platforms above it's a Brawl ZSS up B type attack that pulls opponents down from straight above?

If you're only transforming for a move, why not just set it to a button and skip the tranformation step entirely?

Look at Inkling. Everyone thought they'd have a far more complex moveset than what they actually got. And with that in mind, as well as Shantae being far more basic in control, I just think it's better to temper expectations in moveset complexity.

 

[Veodok]

temper expectations

Not specifically about your post (because it makes sense there), but I don't like how often this phrase is used in regards to Shantae. Sounds so self-defeating.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Look at Inkling. Everyone thought they'd have a far more complex moveset than what they actually got. And with that in mind, as well as Shantae being far more basic in control, I just think it's better to temper expectations in moveset complexity.

Either that, or simply wait and see what Sakurai will do. At the end of the day, any moves the fans come up with seldom line up with what he thinks might work best and decides to use.

 

[loozer2]

Hmmm...I'm sure it means nothing, but I noticed on their Twitter that the image they used to give thanks for 60k followers was the art they created at the end of the ballot to thank people for voting for her in smash.

https://twitter.com/wayforward/status/650384876886102016

 

[Captain Hazama]

Hmmm...I'm sure it means nothing, but I noticed on their Twitter that the image they used to give thanks for 60k followers was the art they created at the end of the ballot to thank people for voting for her in smash.

https://twitter.com/wayforward/status/650384876886102016

You son of a ***** lol. Made my heart race a little.

 

[EarlTamm]

Hmmm...I'm sure it means nothing, but I noticed on their Twitter that the image they used to give thanks for 60k followers was the art they created at the end of the ballot to thank people for voting for her in smash.

https://twitter.com/wayforward/status/650384876886102016

Okay, that is unbelievably suspicious. Why would you re use that art when you could very easily draw a quick sketch? And I doubt Wayforward were to lazy to do so.

 

[Teeb147]

Hmmm...I'm sure it means nothing, but I noticed on their Twitter that the image they used to give thanks for 60k followers was the art they created at the end of the ballot to thank people for voting for her in smash.

https://twitter.com/wayforward/status/650384876886102016

Really nice find. That's a nice lil tidbit
Maybe that's their 'thanks' shantae, or maybe it's a covert hint :O

 

[AngrySun88]

Hmmm...I'm sure it means nothing, but I noticed on their Twitter that the image they used to give thanks for 60k followers was the art they created at the end of the ballot to thank people for voting for her in smash.

https://twitter.com/wayforward/status/650384876886102016

More suspicious WayForward behavior. Something is up with them.

 

[Teeb147]

What I like about that tweet too is that it's a throwback to those days, just in 2015, as an example of how they had no trouble talking about smash and hashtagging shantae for smash. It's a nice look back.

 

[WreckitRyan]

Hmmm...I'm sure it means nothing, but I noticed on their Twitter that the image they used to give thanks for 60k followers was the art they created at the end of the ballot to thank people for voting for her in smash.

https://twitter.com/wayforward/status/650384876886102016

Thank you for posting this. Now THIS is interesting. Especially after all the off topic stuff I had to read through lately ;P

 

[EarlTamm]

Okay, first, we need to find out if that Shantae sketch has been used for anything else. If that is just some standard image they do for celebration, it means nothing. If it has only been used for Smash and now this, something's up.

 

[Teeb147]

Okay, first, we need to find out if that Shantae sketch has been used for anything else. If that is just some standard image they do for celebration, it means nothing. If it has only been used for Smash and now this, something's up.

Doing a quick search with google's technology for images, I couldn't find the art in any other place besides very few random mentions of shantae by random other people, like on a blog and 1 shantae fan on twitter. It's not a common art piece. And I didn't find them using it besides the ones we saw. Unless they colored it and used it, but yeah. (if someone wants to bother looking through their entire twitter history, be my guest, but no gonna do that myself )

I find it interesting that it's about them loving their fans. If they love us, would they really torture us unnecessarily about her inclusion? Just sayin'

 

[EarlTamm]

Doing a quick search with google's technology for images, I couldn't find the art in any other place besides very few random mentions of shantae by random other people, like on a blog and 1 shantae fan on twitter. It's not a common art piece. And I didn't find them using it besides the ones we saw. Unless they colored it and used it, but yeah.

I find it interesting that it's about them loving their fans. If they love us, would they really torture us unnecessarily about her inclusion? Just sayin'

Think about it. If Shantae is in Smash, this could be our reward for following them. The best hint they can legally give us. As if to say "We know what you want, just be patient" sort of thing.

 

[loozer2]

It's also odd that the last time they celebrated a follower milestone was 15k followers on February 26, 2014 without any image attached. They celebrated quite a few milestones before then as well for some random numbers like 13k, 10k, 3k but never with an associated image. 60k followers is a really odd number to celebrate especially considering they did nothing for 50k.

 

[EarlTamm]

So, general thoughts on the image popping up again?

 

[Shinuto]

So, general thoughts on the image popping up again?

I mean, I personally think they just....felt like reusing the image again.

 

[AngrySun88]

It's also odd that the last time they celebrated a follower milestone was 15k followers on February 26, 2014 without any image attached. They celebrated quite a few milestones before then as well for some random numbers like 13k, 10k, 3k but never with an associated image. 60k followers is a really odd number to celebrate especially considering they did nothing for 50k.

That is very odd, and it's just the latest example of their very out of character behavior this year. Why use that picture for a random number like 60K and not a more important number like 50K?

 

[Veodok]

So, general thoughts on the image popping up again?

It's interesting. Just another thing to add to the list of strange circumstantial evidence. It's not a whole lot to go on, but let's look at the possibilities:

A) They were lazy and just grabbed a neutral happy picture.
B) They really, really liked this image. So much that they wanted to use it again.
C) It's a purposeful hint.

Idk, all three are possible. If I had to pick, I'd say A is more likely than B. It's just too hard to tell if this is a hint or something entirely separate.

 

[Biometal]

WF's good a beating around the bush...I'll give 'em that. They're literally replying to everything that doesn't have the word "Smash" in it.

 

[Shadowknight1]

So, general thoughts on the image popping up again?

It's just a really freakin cute picture of Shantae celebrating!

 

[EarlTamm]

And here's the thing, I think this means so much. So far they have tried to distance themselves from Smash discussion, not commenting on any tweet that has Smash. Yet, they just so happening to decide to use an image that has only ever been used for a Smash related purpose, on an event they have not put so much fanfare on, as well as the event having no connection to Shantae at all(To be fair, she is there mascot, but still), and at pretty much the most random number for that sort of event after not celebrating it on more fitting numbers. And again, why use this image specifically if you don't want to bring up Smash. This could very well show that they want to discuss Smash, but an NDA is in the way.

 

[loozer2]

WF's good a beating around the bush...I'll give 'em that. They're literally replying to everything that doesn't have the word "Smash" in it.

Could also be they have the word "Smash" blacklisted, lol.

 

[MoveMan1]

And here's the thing, I think this means so much. So far they have tried to distance themselves from Smash discussion, not commenting on any tweet that has Smash. Yet, they just so happening to decide to use an image that has only ever been used for a Smash related purpose, on an event they have not put so much fanfare on, as well as the event having no connection to Shantae at all(To be fair, she is there mascot, but still), and at pretty much the most random number for that sort of event after not celebrating it on more fitting numbers. And again, why use this image specifically if you don't want to bring up Smash. This could very well show that they want to discuss Smash, but an NDA is in the way.

They probably forgot it was used for that purpose. They might even have been using it as a Wayforward-office exclusive meme.