Shantae, the Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town! (A Switch To A New WayForward)

[KoopaSaki]

If anything guys, I’m just holding out for next week for any new news regarding the game. If not November’s going to be quite the event. I’m still gunning hard for shantae, but I wonder if she’s more likely for dlc then base roster.
On a side note, when smash ultimate releases, I’ve got this theory that if a character has their own trophy in the game (like Rayman did in smash 4) but is not on the playable roster, does that deconfirm their chances for dlc?

 

[Mental Surge]

how dare you put down Wii Fit Trainer and Duck Hunt
She's been in three games Wii Fit, Wii Fit Plus, and Wii Fit U

TBF she has much more right to be in the game over DH. I honestly still can;t believe that DH is a character in smash 4. The first time I saw that I said, "really? Not Shantae, not King K. Rool, not Geno... but the dog... from Duck Hunt for the NES. And it's not a joke? K. "

 

[Shinuto]

TBF she has much more right to be in the game over DH. I honestly still can;t believe that DH is a character in smash 4. The first time I saw that I said, "really? Not Shantae, not King K. Rool, not Geno... but the dog... from Duck Hunt for the NES. And it's not a joke? K. "

Someone didnt grow up with a NESin their room. Im a 90s kidbut even I Know of that damn dog and how ingrained the game is nintendo fans' minds,

 

[Mental Surge]

Someone didnt grow up with a NESin their room. Im a 90s kidbut even I Know of that damn dog and how ingrained the game is nintendo fans' minds,

Oh believe me I did. And I still hated it. That does not mean the dog from the game should have been a character. The zapper should have been the character if anything lol.

and I grew up in the 90's too, and it doesnt change my opinion. Like I said before, why not make a biker from Excite Bike a character? It would be marginally less stupid.

Another thing that's unfortunate about DH being int he game is that he plays likely very similar to how Banjo Kazooie, a real character, would play and fills the same role of a character with a bird on their back that gives them extra abilities.

 

[GoldLiger]

Someone didnt grow up with a NESin their room. Im a 90s kidbut even I Know of that damn dog and how ingrained the game is nintendo fans' minds,

Yeah I am 80's kid, Duck Hunt was the second game I played. First being Super Mario Bros.

 

[Deleted member]

I have an AT theory in a good way....

Sk could be the only indie to fill the AT portion
And alucard could fill the transforming AT portion just like sable prince from smash4

No Hollywoodrok12 this dose not mean sable prince is coming as a fighter. it’s actually shantae

 

[Pit93]

How is that questionable? There are very few female characters in the game as we have established, so immediately shantae is already adding something whether you personally care about that or not is irrelevant. And the fact that that somehow degrades my argument is kind of laughable to me. You would have to be so fixated on that one point I made that it would overshadow everything else that I said. It's kind of funny to me also because you can;t seem to counter anything else I said about why she deserves to be in smash, all you can do is cherry pick that one point. Your argument does not seem to have much of a foundation.

I told you before that I didn't try to "counter" your other points because I didn't think they deserved to be countered, simple as that. I agree with most of it. I just don't think her being female makes her anymore deserving than any other character, that's all. You're also free to disagree, like I told you.

Second, I completely disagree, there are indeed many objective ways of looking at this and I proved it. If by your logic, every character is equally deserving of being in smash, then why are Mario, Smaus, Fox, Kirby, etc. in the game instead of a goomba, a waddle dee, a metroid, etc. ? The character's importance in the franchise alone is a factor otherwise Mario would not be in the game. You can sit here and pretend that there isnt a way of quantifying how deserving a character is but even Sakurai clearly follows SOMETHING because again, none of the major character like Mario, Samus, Link, etc. would be in the game instead of other random characters from their franchises, or other franchise for that matter. And no **** sakurai gets the final say, that doesnt change the fact that some 'characters' really don't deserve to be in the game.

You proved nothing. You stated a lot of criteria and then whined about the inclusion of characters that didn't fit the criteria you yourself made up. Either you're unwilling to expand your "objective" criteria to include the characters that obviously got included (like WFT, Villager, etc.) or you can't justifiably call your criteria objective. That's all.
I even agree with some of the criteria (like importance for a franchise, etc.) but using those to discredit the inclusion of characters that already made it in, just doesn't make sense, because apparently there are other criteria than the ones you mentioned because if they were actually true, characters like WFT wouldn't be in Smash.

You seem like the type of person that thinks everything is subjective.

I do, because that's how it is, but that doesn't mean I'm hung up on that. I still want to argue within system that follows a set of rules and logic. That's the thing about your argument about "objective ways to determine who's how deserving of being in Smash". If your criteria actually were objective, you wouldn't start ranting about WFT, Villager etc., but you would try adapt your criteria to include them, because the fact of the matter is that they're in Smash. I don't say that your criteria are wrong, but they're lacking.

If for example I am writing the ending to a story, I have a million different ways I could make the story end, and there are objectively bad ways I could make it end. Like ignoring the established lore, retconning characters, dues ex machina devices, not providing any closure, changing the tone, etc. But because I am the writer, I can't make any mistakes, right? I can't write something that's bad, right? because I get the final say, that means I can't possibly do anything that's not perfect, right?

See, here's something I disagree with. Whether the ending of your story is bad will be determined by every reader on their own. You can quantify it by looking for an average opinion but there's no universally objective bad or good way to end your story.
That's also why I don't give a crap about review-scores. There's some reviewers that I know share my own tastes and that's why I can rely on their judgment. When I say something is good or bad I always state it as my point of view. I for example think Metroid Other M is a really bad game, but there's a lot of people who don't think so and that's ok.
You can of course evaluate a certain product according to a predetermined set of rules/criteria, but then you have an evaluation of good or bad that's linked to these rules that have at some point been decided by someone.

But please note that I'm just saying this in the context of entertainment media and not in the context of science and measurements with scientific instruments. Of course, even there you can't completely eliminate the element of subjectivity, but it's by far not as bad as when trying to "objectively" evaluate something like a story, a game, a movie, etc.

There ARE objective ways of looking at what characters that should or should not be added to the roster. Like it or not.

Nope, there are not or at least not ONLY the ones you mentioned. If there were, they wouldn't be in, but they are.

EDIT:
This is also where I end this. I've made my point and I still have to prepare dinner.
And just to be clear, no hard feelings. It's not like I've got anything against you. ^^

 

[SoupCanMafia]

what the hell kind of storm did I miss when I was in bed? It's like you guys went to war over something trivial.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

what the hell kind of storm did I miss when I was in bed? It's like you guys went to war over something trivial.

Ah, yes, that.

Umm... I don't know how to explain it really. Also, good morning Soup! You well?

 

[SoupCanMafia]

Ah, yes, that.

Umm... I don't know how to explain it really. Also, good morning Soup! You well?

Chewing gum, thinking about brewing some Montana Tea & Spice Trading Company tea, so I'm doing alright in the relative sense. Though the presence of bickering and the source thereof is quite off-putting to me, because we're supposed to be united through our ideology and yet we're divided by text leaks.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Chewing gum, thinking about brewing some Montana Tea & Spice Trading Company tea, so I'm doing alright in the relative sense. Though the presence of bickering and the source thereof is quite off-putting to me.

It is quite irritating, yes, but I try to ignore these squabbles to the best of my ability.

 

[Dukefire]

We are starting make each other targets and that does include the other fanbases as well.

I know 50 Days are left before we arrive to Smash Ultimate, but at least try to keep yourself occupied with something else to pass the time. Its easier said then done, but eventually we will get there.

 

[KoopaSaki]

We are starting make each other targets and that does include the other fanbases as well.

I know 50 Days are left before we arrive to Smash Ultimate, but at least try to keep yourself occupied with something else to pass the time. Its easier said then done, but eventually we will get there.


View attachment 170547

Agreed man. I'm going to get back to my 1st playthrough of Shantae and the Pirates Curse. I'm really enjoying it so far!

 

[Luigifan18]

I pray to God that that leak claiming she's an Assist is fake. I don't know if I can handle that kind of disappointment again in the same hype cycle (I lost Shovel Knight and that hurt like heck).

I know how you feel. I got my two most wanted deconfirmed at E3 and August, and my third most-wanted is unlikely to get any recognition whatsoever.

EDIT: Yes, my signature says that Vaati (who will be lucky to get a mere collectible trophy) is my second-most-wanted and Krystal (who got deconfirmed as playable in the August Assist Trophy massacre) is my third-most-wanted, but honestly, I'm currently not sure which one goes where on my list. Vaati has more moveset potential and can fill a very narrowly-explored niche in the roster, namely reliance on a large array of windboxes; only about a third of the characters currently in the game have any windboxes at all, and barely any of them have more than one attack with windboxes or windboxes that are good for anything more than a panic-button get-off-me quick-spacing whiff-coverage tool, so a character with several windbox moves with enough range and power to reliably score kills at a variety of angles and range-power-frame-data ratios is something that hasn't been seen before and could be very intriguing both to play as and to play against. On the other hand, Krystal is a bit more well-rounded and likable on her own merits as a character, and while her moveset potential is nowhere near as unique or noteworthy as Vaati, it's at least distinct from the currently-featured Star Fox characters — that series really needs some more diversity in its Smash representation. Also, to be honest, all the characters on my most-wanted list beyond my top 5 are arranged in a rather loose and haphazard fashion.

 

[KoopaSaki]

I think to pass the time I'm going to go re watch the anime school rumble. I watched that show so much when the Funimation channel was still around back in 8th grade. It's been almost a decade since then!

 

[Dukefire]

Do you think that shantae can fight against this creature in Smash?

Made by TheGreatEdgyCat

Hint: she can't.

 

[Deleted member]

I have an AT theory in a good way....

Sk could be the only indie to fill the AT portion
And alucard could fill the transforming AT portion just like sable prince from smash4

No Hollywoodrok12 this dose not mean sable prince is coming as a fighter. it’s actually shantae

Anyone agree with my theory?

 

[SoupCanMafia]

Do you think that shantae can fight against this creature in Smash?

Hint: she can't.

The worst she can do to it is to whip the button to the off position and run like Hell.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

I think to pass the time I'm going to go re watch the anime school rumble. I watched that show so much when the Funimation channel was still around back in 8th grade. It's been almost a decade since then!

Is there a character called Tenma in it? I just remember that name from somewhere lol.

Do you think that shantae can fight against this creature in Smash?

Made by TheGreatEdgyCat

Hint: she can't.

No chances.

 

[Mango The Magician]

So not looking to trudge anything up, but as much as I want Shantae to be in Smash, when it comes to "deserving" to be in Smash,

First Party Nintendo Characters >>>>>> Anything else. Similarly, Shantae isn't deserving just because she's a girl, that makes me want her in more because I like female characters a lot, but it has no bearing on who's "deserving" to be in Smash.


...Anyways, I don't think we're getting a direct this month. I think we'll likely get one the day before the bundle launches or the day/several days after the bundle launches, and since that'll be one month before the game comes out, this'll be the last chance for the base roster, so if she's not there then yeah.

 

[Deleted member]

Guys I can clearly see shantae and ken get revealed as fighters next week because well.....

Looking at the Japanese #Nintendo release schedule, I see that #Shantae and the Pirate's Curse and #StreetFighter 30th Anniversary Collection are both launching on the #NintendoSwitch on the 25th of October. 🤔https://t.co/hCXA2i9Cuv #NintendoDirect #SmashBrosUltimate #Nindies pic.twitter.com/U2S5GI4LIY

— Ayoungspirit (@Ayoungspirit1) October 17, 2018

 

[GoldLiger]

Man that newest episode of Sun and Moon anime really shows how expressive a character Incineroar is.
Also #Burnettcannotseetheobvious

Anyway how are things on the Shantae front from the last time I asked?

EDIT: Wow so not only is Shantae and the Pirate Curse launching in Japan next week but Street Fighter 30th Anniversary Collection. I think this needs to go in our wall of weir...oops sorry wrong series. I meant the evidence site.

 

[NukeA6]

Guys I can clearly see shantae and ken get revealed as fighters next week because well.....

Looking at the Japanese #Nintendo release schedule, I see that #Shantae and the Pirate's Curse and #StreetFighter 30th Anniversary Collection are both launching on the #NintendoSwitch on the 25th of October. 🤔https://t.co/hCXA2i9Cuv #NintendoDirect #SmashBrosUltimate #Nindies pic.twitter.com/U2S5GI4LIY

— Ayoungspirit (@Ayoungspirit1) October 17, 2018

That's assuming Ken isn't an assist trophy. Besides, it doesn't make sense that Capcom would allow him to regress being a blonde Ryu when SF5 fixed that.

 

[Stephano]

Guys I can clearly see shantae and ken get revealed as fighters next week because well.....

Looking at the Japanese #Nintendo release schedule, I see that #Shantae and the Pirate's Curse and #StreetFighter 30th Anniversary Collection are both launching on the #NintendoSwitch on the 25th of October. 🤔https://t.co/hCXA2i9Cuv #NintendoDirect #SmashBrosUltimate #Nindies pic.twitter.com/U2S5GI4LIY

— Ayoungspirit (@Ayoungspirit1) October 17, 2018

Interesting Coincidence but I don't think it means everything.

I want it to tho ;-;

 

[GoldLiger]

That's assuming Ken isn't an assist trophy. Besides, it doesn't make sense that Capcom would allow him to regress being a blonde Ryu when SF5 fixed that.

I don't thing they care after all. Since Ken is the original Echo fighter lol.

Interesting Coincidence but I don't think it means everything.

I want it to tho ;-;

*Insert "Coincidence I think not" meme here*

 

[Stephano]

*Insert "Coincidence I think not" meme here*

I gotcha fam

 

[SoupCanMafia]

Guys I can clearly see shantae and ken get revealed as fighters next week because well.....

Looking at the Japanese #Nintendo release schedule, I see that #Shantae and the Pirate's Curse and #StreetFighter 30th Anniversary Collection are both launching on the #NintendoSwitch on the 25th of October. 🤔https://t.co/hCXA2i9Cuv #NintendoDirect #SmashBrosUltimate #Nindies pic.twitter.com/U2S5GI4LIY

— Ayoungspirit (@Ayoungspirit1) October 17, 2018

Is it truly clear cut, though? We'll see in the future.

 

[zferolie]

Here is my predictions for next weeks smash Direct.

Opens with Shantae reveal.
Show 2 echos, Medusa and Ken
Introduce spirits mode
Go Over some other modes
End with Incineroar Trailer.

 

[GoldLiger]

What's this about a Shantae Conspiracy?

 

[EarlTamm]

What's this about a Shantae Conspiracy?

Glad Billybae10K voiced his thoughts on this. Disagree with him on the possible NCC bit, but that's because we have went through that topic so many times over the months that our perceptions on it are very different. I think we all would be glad to explain the conspiracy a bit more, especially since that pic he looked through is not the best portrayal of our evidence, in my opinion. We have been working on that sheet for a reason, you know. Just glad to see Shantae being talked about more and more in the Smash community.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Hey guys.

What's this about a Shantae Conspiracy?

Billy made a video about Shantae, huh? Unfortunately, that picture's a little outdated now, but it's still nice to see Shantae popping up in more discussions about Smash speculation nowadays.

That's assuming Ken isn't an assist trophy. Besides, it doesn't make sense that Capcom would allow him to regress being a blonde Ryu when SF5 fixed that.

I could still see it happening, most echoes are just that really, regressions.

 

[Deleted member]

Disagree with him on the possible NCC bit,

Are you saying that there is no ncc going on?!?!?

 

[EarlTamm]

Are you saying that there is no ncc going on?!?!?

No, I disagree with his view that an NCC is unlikely, I do think it's still on the table. Don't freak out too much.

 

[Deleted member]

No, I disagree with his view that an NCC is unlikely, I do think it's still on the table. Don't freak out too much.

Sorry I didn’t watch the video

 

[Dyllybirdy]

MajestyIndigo Hello?

 

[EarlTamm]

Sorry I didn’t watch the video

It's okay, though you should watch it. Although there is some things I disagree with in the video, it's still a good watch, and watching high quality video's like his can spark some good discussion.

 

[zferolie]

What's this about a Shantae Conspiracy?

Its cool Billy did a shantae video. watching it now. the comments seem pretty positive about shantae as well.

Sorry I didn’t watch the video

WHy not?

 

[Hollywoodrok12]

@Connorb0t2 Sorry I wasn't able to add the Re-used voice lines theory earlier. I'm doing it now tho.

Edit: Wait maybe not. I'll get it done really soon tho

 

[hassoutobi]

on the NCC topic, someone made an argument in the comments that i agree with: "I disagree with you on the fighting game exclusivity thing. It would make perfect sense. And if Rayman is in the game, it wouldn't matter if he's in Brawlhalla since that is owned by Ubisoft. The same logic works for Ryu. I can't recall any fighting games that included Smash fighters that released within a similar time as their appearance in Smash. (Except in ones that are owned by the same company that owns the character). Basically, there's no examples of a Smash fighter appearing in another company's fighting game. So the lack of Shantae in Indie fighters could be a result of Smash exclusivity."

on top of that, someone else pointed out that snake was absent from PlayStation All-Stars Battle Royale for this very reason.

 

[zferolie]

on the NCC topic, someone made an argument in the comments that i agree with: "I disagree with you on the fighting game exclusivity thing. It would make perfect sense. And if Rayman is in the game, it wouldn't matter if he's in Brawlhalla since that is owned by Ubisoft. The same logic works for Ryu. I can't recall any fighting games that included Smash fighters that released within a similar time as their appearance in Smash. (Except in ones that are owned by the same company that owns the character). Basically, there's no examples of a Smash fighter appearing in another company's fighting game. So the lack of Shantae in Indie fighters could be a result of Smash exclusivity."

on top of that, someone else pointed out that snake was absent from PlayStation All-Stars Battle Royale for this very reason.

Yeah the Snake and PSASBR is one of the best examples of a character missing out on a fighting game due to smash.