Roster Discussion Thread (Closed)

[Swamp Sensei]

I'm dead serious. Ridley isn't really that big of a character outside of Metroid and Smash4 spec. He's no Mewtwo, and he's definitely not Megaman.

And K.Rool is?

Heck. Little Mac is?!?

 

[FlareHabanero]

Tailwhip Mewtwo is still better than no Mewtwo in my book.

No Mewtwo is better then **** Mewtwo, unless you like to see your favorite characters get embarrassed.

 

[Fastblade5035]

Your reaction: Mewtwo get's confirmed at E3.

 

[ChronoBound]

I'm dead serious. Ridley isn't really that big of a character outside of Metroid and Smash4 spec. He's no Mewtwo, and he's definitely not Megaman.

Ridley is bigger than every Nintendo character not already playable in Smash Bros. that is not part of the Mario universe. That much you should at the very least give him.

 

[Shorts]

And K.Rool is?

Heck. Little Mac is?!?

No, but moreso than Ridley definitely.

 

[Shorts]

Ridley is bigger than every Nintendo character not already playable in Smash Bros. that is not part of the Mario universe. That much you should at the very least give him.

I'll give him that *troll*

Double post like a chump.

 

[---]

No Mewtwo is better then **** Mewtwo, unless you like to see your favorite characters get embarrassed.

You're talking to a guy who wants Mewtwo to wield a giant spoon shaped sword. >_>

 

[BKupa666]

Yes, people overrate how well-known Ridley/Metroid is (as they do with virtually every SSB4 hopeful), but the fact that he fits the popular archetype of fiery dragon and is a cinematic villain to boot makes him a great utility character to put in any trailer.

 

[ChronoBound]

No, but moreso than Ridley definitely.

Ridley is certainly a more major character than K. Rool and Little Mac (especially K. Rool). K. Rool's last major game appearance was in 1999 for crying out loud.

 

[Dark Phazon]

Ridley is ''Bigger'' xD than K.Rool now but if Ninty kept it going with Rool then who knows...

Yh this shouldnt even be a debate/argument...

Ofc Ridley is more known than K.Rool expecially being a boss Twice in brawl... its not like K.Rool was in DKCR...atleast that woulda been...you know...good...(+_-)

 

[Deleted member]

As awesome as Ridley is, shortie's got a point.
Outside of Metroid fandom and Smash speculation, Ridley isn't that famous of a face.

But as a Devil's Advocate, do you really need a famous face when you're a purple space dragon that can rip people to shreds?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Personally I think K.Rool and Ridley are about as famous as each other.

Little Mac come slightly behind.

 

[FlareHabanero]

But as a Devil's Advocate, do you really need a famous face when you're a purple space dragon that can rip people to shreds?

You could say something similar with several characters actually. Even if you don't know the character, the first impressions can make a world of difference.

 

[Dark Phazon]

As awesome as Ridley is, shortie's got a point.
Outside of Metroid fandom and Smash speculation, Ridley isn't that famous of a face.

But as a Devil's Advocate, do you really need a famous face when you're a purple space dragon that can rip people to shreds?

I dont think Ridley cares... I love them both reguardless.


I want

Mewtwo's original form (melee)
K.Rool's DKC (SNES) Appearence
Ridley's Super metroid Appearence

Im asking for too much arent i...

 

[Shorts]

Ridley is certainly a more major character than K. Rool and Little Mac (especially K. Rool). K. Rool's last major game appearance was in 1999 for crying out loud.

"Major" I don't know about. But well known within' the general population of people, no. Like, just, no.

But, it doesn't actually matter, really. He's still a good candidate even if he isn't the most well known. Because outside of Megaman, (Mario choice), Mewtwo, and the Miis. None of the characters are going to be "Well known" within' the general population.

We're working with a group of lesser known characters, so it's okay to not be Mario/Link/Pika status.

 

[BKupa666]

Honestly, you could a case for Little Mac, or at least his series, being more iconic as a whole than either villain. As far as they go, consistent villain of a more minor series vs. (currently) sporadic villain of a significantly larger series balances out IMO.

 

[---]

Reminds me of when I went onto a forum discussion about Metroid's 25th and why Nintendo hasn't done anything yet. Mentioned to them that Metroid wasn't a major franchise in Japan and that it wasn't one of the Big 3/5 in terms of sales, there was several pages of nonstop flaming because of it.


But yeah, I gotta agree with Shortie and BKupa on this one. Ignoring the minor Mario character pile and Mewtwo, Ridley is definitely under K.Rool, MAYBE Little Mac (still kinda iffy, but those POWii Commercials and Mike Tyson say otherwise).

 

[Dark Phazon]

Its just because Ridley lacks personality...if he had some he would be mentioned alongside bowser and ganondorf alot more.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Its just because Ridley lacks personality...if he had some he would be mentioned alongside bowser and ganondorf alot more.

His personality is cruel, bloodthirsty and violent. Always fighting with everything he has.

Personality isn't the problem.

 

[ChronoBound]

"Major" I don't know about. But well known within' the general population of people, no. Like, just, no.

I would certainly bet Ridley is more than known than K. Rool among the general population. K. Rool in every DK game except DK64, only made his appearance at the very end of the game. Many casual players did not even beat any of the DKC trilogy despite playing them.

For contrast, Ridley made his appearance very early on in Prime 1, Prime 3, and Super Metroid (which were the highest selling games for the series outside the original installment). And for Fusion and Zero Mission, those games are so short (can be beaten under two hours), that most people who have played them have probably encountered Ridley there as well.

You also have Ridley making prominent appearances in other media such as having two boss fights in Brawl, and being featured as a boss in the pack-in game Nintendo Land.

 

[Dark Phazon]

His personality is cruel, bloodthirsty and violent. Always fighting with everything he has.

Personality isn't the problem.

Then what is?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Like this post please I don't wanna have 666 likes lol

 

[BKupa666]

The fact that many potential newcomers are virtual nobodies compared to Brawl's pool makes me confident that the developers will be far more conscious with their marketing and hyping of this game, since, as Golden implied, the newcomers will need to make strong first impressions on the masses. This would begin with the "even bigger" trailer Sakurai has hawked on Twitter, followed by a compelling DOJO equivalent.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Well, making an first impression is not hard when you think about it. Obviously a ferocious space dragon like Ridley is going to win over hearts by concept alone, but with something that hardly anyone knows like Takamaru, you got to be creative and try to win over new fans.

 

[Dark Phazon]

The fact that many potential newcomers are virtual nobodies compared to Brawl's pool makes me confident that the developers will be far more conscious with their marketing and hyping of this game, since, as Golden implied, the newcomers will need to make strong first impressions on the masses. This would begin with the "even bigger" trailer Sakurai has hawked on Twitter, followed by a compelling DOJO equivalent.

Please stop your compelling way of words is getting me excited...(no sarcasm)

 

[---]

Probably has to do with coattails more than anything, you'd be lying to yourself if you thought Samus was a more well-known household name than Donkey Kong.

But anyway both are equally good bets in my book so whatever, even if it is entertaining to watch two giant lizards duke it out.

 

[ChronoBound]

Probably has to do with coattails more than anything, you'd be lying to yourself if you thought Samus was a more well-known household name than Donkey Kong.t.

DK is certainly more well known than Samus, however, K. Rool basically dropped off the face of the earth for all purposes for most people who played the DK games after DK64.

For people during the GCN/GBA and Wii eras, Ridley had major and early appearances within those Metroid games, and even within pop culture there is an awareness of Ridley being Samus's nemesis:

 

[Bowserlick]

Ridley was featured in the opening of Melee and as a boss in Brawl. I am sure that fans who play the Smash series know about Ridley now, even if they did not before.

 

[Dark Phazon]

What are the chances that they will release a playable demo for the WiiU?

 

[BKupa666]

In the public eye, the entire Donkey Kong franchise dropped off the face of the earth between DK64 and DKCR for all intents and purposes. There's a reason some DK fans label it the "decade of nothing," not the least of which is that, out of its eleven games released between 2001-2009, only two (DKC GBA and Diddy Kong Racing DS) cracked a million sales, and only barely (source, DK Vine). Some, like Barrel Blast, flopped miserably.

Still, the series' comfortable spot as Nintendo's fourth-best seller (fifth behind Wii paraphernalia) is a testament to DKC's popularity in the 90s. As such, though many players may not have beaten the games and seen K. Rool, the number of people who have may be proportionally close to or greater than those familiar with Ridley, based on series sales alone.

Then, of course, the Smash series comes along and laughs heartily at my little counterpoint. But that's a different debate.

 

[---]

DK is certainly more well known than Samus, however, K. Rool basically dropped off the face of the earth for all purposes for most people who played the DK games after DK64.

For people during the GCN/GBA and Wii eras, Ridley had major and early appearances within those Metroid games, and even within pop culture there is an awareness of Ridley being Samus's nemesis:

Sounds like something that a DK fan would be better off arguing. But I'd still have to say that it's a mix the Rare made games, sales, and coattails. Either way if K.Rool isn't above Ridley, then he's certainly at equal odds, like I said I'm done arguing fanboy stuff for series I'm not that interested in.


Not related to the argument, I'm rather proud of my 7 year old nephews for picking out DKC on the Virtual Console and GBA without myself having to do so. May get one nephew Super Metroid due to Club Nintendo, but not sure how my sister-in-law would take it or if they'd be old enough to enjoy it.

 

[FlareHabanero]

That MAD skit kind of reminds me of another one called "Diary of A Wimpy Kid Icarus", where it was basically a reflection of Pit and Kirby going through high school and Mario, Donkey Kong, and Mega Man were school bullies. The skit ends in a Super Smash Bros. parody where the 5 fight in a similar fashion, and (I think) Pit came out victories by the skin of his teeth.

It's weird because I'm not a fan of MAD. But it's odd how Mega Man was the only one that isn't in a Super Smash Bros. game as of yet, but maybe I'm just simply over analyzing things.

 

[Deleted member]

This is the last Smash game Sakurai will oversee. I'm calling it now. So when 2017 rolls around and the Wii USB ultraplus is announced, and shortly after so is Smash5, it won't be him heading the project. For better AND worse.

Also, Mewtwo is a shoe-in in my eyes simply because of his new form. He just became relevent. He's already undinably popular. And Sakurai has an interesting twist he can put on the returning veteran.

TPC will probably push for him, Sakurai already likes him, and he's got this new twist to make him more interesting.

I have to agree with Mewtwo being a shoe-in. Out of all the candidates, Mewtwo is the only one with really no negatives. I would be willing to bet a Wii-U + Smash Bros. 4 on him.

I believe SSBF came up with this E3 prediction first, but I'm forecasting Ridley, Palutena, Little Mac, Takamaru and Megaman until it's confirmed otherwise, with the possible substitutions of K. Rool or Mewtwo for Ridley and of a Namco third party for Megaman.

Pretty much and yes, I am the first one who came up with this. It makes a lot of sense to me and I've been having this feeling that it's what we're going to see for a long time.

If this comes true, remember that I called it. May need to write a post about why I feel this could be our E3 trailer reveal.

Considering the circumstances... Mewtwo wouldn't actually be out of place as a starter, but by tradition I would assume he would be unlockable.

Mewtwo is the only cut veteran I could see returning as a starter if by nothing else, because of how obvious he is.

Little Mac, maybe Shulk, would be the only characters that I'd feel safe making a bet on for a first reveal. Mostly because they're not weighted down like the newcomers from established series, you cannot tell me they're going to reveal K. Rool or Ridley without Samus or DK at the same time.


Personally I don't care if Mewtwo sucks or not, I just want to see him again. Tailwhip Mewtwo is still better than no Mewtwo in my book.

I think we'll be seeing more veterans than we've ever had in a trailer before. I honestly can't picture King K. Rool as a E3 character (although that would be amazing to see) for some reason, but I do think that Samus will return for a trailer. It's what makes me feel that we'll see Ridley at E3.

Ridley is bigger than every Nintendo character not already playable in Smash Bros. that is not part of the Mario universe. That much you should at the very least give him.

Mii?

I don't think we're going to see them, but they are much, much bigger than anything from Nintendo not already in a game and I dare say, bigger than most characters already in Smash.

 

[Dark Phazon]

Thats good though
DK games > (modern) Mario Games...

DK games like actually take skill and effort

Jumping from vine to vine while dodging 10 vingers flying in loops is no joke...

 

[Fastblade5035]

That MAD skit kind of reminds me of another one called "Diary of A Wimpy Kid Icarus", where it was basically a reflection of Pit and Kirby going through high school and Mario, Donkey Kong, and Mega Man were school bullies. The skit ends in a Super Smash Bros. parody where the 5 fight in a similar fashion, and (I think) Pit came out victories by the skin of his teeth.

It's weird because I'm not a fan of MAD. But it's odd how Mega Man was the only one that isn't in a Super Smash Bros. game as of yet, but maybe I'm just simply over analyzing things.

Yeah, I remember that. It was surprisingly well researched, really. (Pit is unpopular, Ganon , Bowser, Wario as bad guys, Pit and Kirby are sakurai's and they are buds, sonic, oikachu, mega man are popular, etc.)

 

[Hoots]

The Donkey Kong franchise in its entirety dropped off the face of the earth between DK64 and DKCR for all intents and purposes. There's a reason some DK fans label it the "decade of nothing," not the least of which is that, out of its eleven games released between 2001-2009, only two (DKC GBA and Diddy Kong Racing DS) cracked a million sales, and only barely (source, DK Vine).

Still, the series' comfortable spot as Nintendo's fourth-best seller (fifth behind Wii paraphernalia) is a testament to DKC's popularity in the 90s. As such, though many players may not have beaten the games and seen K. Rool, the number of people who have may be proportionally close to or greater than those familiar with Ridley, based on series sales alone.

Then, of course, the Smash series comes along and laughs heartily at my little counterpoint. But that's a different debate.

Honestly, I think no one disputes that K. Rool completely deserves to be in Smash due to just how legendary he is as a villain. However, Nintendo's repeated attempts to exterminate the Kremlings does not bode well for his chances. I honestly think they resent the fact that they were invented by Brits instead of Japanese. Diddy Kong only gets a pass because of his massive popularity. He is my number 1 pick for Brawl 4, but the decade of nothing followed by DKCR lacking K. Rool could have already sealed his fate. I certainly hope not.

(Also, what the hell is up with this "liking" stuff? What is this, Facebook?)

 

[Big-Cat]

Sakurai has some big things in mind with connectivity, and has been saying all along that he needs a direction aside from "more characters and stages" for Smash 4. Even after the completion of Brawl, Sakurai mentioned that were was a finite amount of characters he felt were even worthy enough to become playable in Smash Bros.

No, he said that there was a finite amount of characters where balance is a feasible thing. Meaning, at around 50-60 is about as high as you can go for a balanced roster before it comes almost impractical.

Also, Mewtwo is a shoe-in in my eyes simply because of his new form. He just became relevent. He's already undinably popular. And Sakurai has an interesting twist he can put on the returning veteran.

So Mewtwo is now this person:

This explains everything.

 

[BKupa666]

Honestly, I think no one disputes that K. Rool completely deserves to be in Smash due to just how legendary he is as a villain. However, Nintendo's repeated attempts to exterminate the Kremlings does not bode well for his chances. I honestly think they resent the fact that they were invented by Brits instead of Japanese. Diddy Kong only gets a pass because of his massive popularity. He is my number 1 pick for Brawl 4, but the decade of nothing followed by DKCR lacking K. Rool could have already sealed his fate. I certainly hope not.

(Also, what the hell is up with this "liking" stuff? What is this, Facebook?)

It's been theorized that this Japanese resentment extended to the entire Country franchise for quite some time, starting with Miyamoto allegedly calling it mediocre when pressured to give Yoshi's Island similar graphics and continuing with Nintendo Tokyo calling Rare's characters 'not fresh enough' during Jungle Beat's development. Now that DKCR is in the books (by Miyamoto's request, no less), it's safe to say this era is over, though K. Rool's fate is still up in the air to some extent (partially a product of DK not getting as many games as he used to).

 

[Dark Phazon]

Honestly, I think no one disputes that K. Rool completely deserves to be in Smash due to just how legendary he is as a villain. However, Nintendo's repeated attempts to exterminate the Kremlings does not bode well for his chances. I honestly think they resent the fact that they were invented by Brits instead of Japanese. Diddy Kong only gets a pass because of his massive popularity. He is my number 1 pick for Brawl 4, but the decade of nothing followed by DKCR lacking K. Rool could have already sealed his fate. I certainly hope not.

(Also, what the hell is up with this "liking" stuff? What is this, Facebook?)

Thats really ****ing sad/gay/pathetic and all the Bull* 4 letter words under the sun...cant peepz just except greatness no mattee where it comes from...

If Ninty wipe Kremlings outta Existence there ****ing assholes beyond belief Long live Rare still leaving a glorious golden stain on nintendo history that they can try there hardest to scrub of but that stain aint coming off!

K.Rool might be the next Geno...

LONG LIVE RAREWARE 1994 - 2001 MOTHER****ERS !!!!

 

[Oasis_S]

Yes, people overrate how well-known Ridley/Metroid is (as they do with virtually every SSB4 hopeful), but the fact that he fits the popular archetype of fiery dragon and is a cinematic villain to boot makes him a great utility character to put in any trailer.

YOU KNOW, I completely forgot Ridley has that sort of cinematic appeal for a trailer. Though, IF ANYONE REMEMBERS HEX, we had decided Bowser would be the best character to show off the Wii U's graphics, considering his model is made up of so many different "materials." K. Rool, too, would have scaly skin, metallic accessories, and flowing cloth. So I guess there's that going for K. Rool.

I would certainly bet Ridley is more than known than K. Rool among the general population. K. Rool in every DK game except DK64, only made his appearance at the very end of the game. Many casual players did not even beat any of the DKC trilogy despite playing them.

For contrast, Ridley made his appearance very early on in Prime 1, Prime 3, and Super Metroid (which were the highest selling games for the series outside the original installment). And for Fusion and Zero Mission, those games are so short (can be beaten under two hours), that most people who have played them have probably encountered Ridley there as well.

You also have Ridley making prominent appearances in other media such as having two boss fights in Brawl, and being featured as a boss in the pack-in game Nintendo Land.

That first point on K. Rool is definitely true for me. I never got that far in any DKC game.

Going to have to agree Ridley would clearly be more well known than K. Rool, which is why I find it kind of weird how much more popular K. Rool seems to be... Oh well. I think I would also say Little Mac is more well-known than both of them though, lol.