Roster Discussion Thread (Closed)

[ChronoBound]

I do a agree that a Melee HD remake would be GLORIOUS. **** WW HD, give me Smash Melee HD and F-Zero GX HD, with a good Netcode and online play like they did for Guilty Gear with #R.

F-Zero GX is my favorite racing game of all time, so I would be down for that. I unlocked everything in that game, and I even have snaking in that game down pat.

The GameCube in general had so many of my favorite games of all time. Melee, Metroid Prime, Prime 2, Wind Waker, F-Zero GX, RE4, and Animal Crossing are amongst my favorite games ever. It also had a lot of other great games like FE9, Paper Mario 2, Pikmin, Pikmin 2, Twilight Princess, Four Swords Adventures, Wario Mega Party Games, Double Dash, Sunshine, and Luigi's Mansion.

 

[SmashChu]

SmashChu, calm down. Seriously, from where do you get the time and patience to write so much? lol.

I actually came back to edit it. Might have been a little rude in some areas, so I'm sorry about that N3ON.

I wrote a lot due to the topic. It's something I know a lot about. It's also the weekend so I can be lazy and post on here.

It almost feels surreal that I have to argue over whether having Mario in a game helps sell that game...

What I'm saying is that if Mario is on the box, shouldn't all the games sell about the same. There is a lot of inconsistency. If Mario is the main driver of sales [for Mario games] then why did we see such a dip. How did we get from SMB and SMB3 and then go to 64 and then Sunshine, and back again with the NSMB series? This is despite the fact that Mario is on the box.

One day, I will actually write why Smash sold well.

 

[FalKoopa]

I don't understand how people could like the clones in Melee personally, considering it's lazy character design.

What if they are their favourite characters? Love for a character does not necessarily come from their playstyle, you know.

 

[Big-Cat]

That's ****ing bull****! Who thought that up? Recovering Health? Really?

Can't believe you're just finding out about this. Though you should've seen anchor Dark Phoenix on lvl 3 X Factor in Vanilla Marvel.

Picture this as a mirror match and much faster. Characters in X Factor move like they're on speed or something.

 

[ChronoBound]

I don't understand how people could like the clones in Melee personally, considering it's lazy character design.

Its not lazy. They played pretty differently from their original counterparts. Falco, Roy, and Ganondorf were among the most popular newcomers in Melee as well, so you're in the minority on that.

The only clones that did not go over well were the ones that were "alter egos" (Dr. Mario, Pichu, and Young Link), however, Toon Link was pretty much a Melee-style clone that was an "alterego", but he was received pretty well (though that could be because he was pretty aesthetically different from regular Link, as well as a different person altogether).

 

[Moon Monkey]

@Yani I saw that game grumps episode it got me pumped and depressed all at the same time. He's not the only one wanting to continue BK in some shape or form.

remember this: http://www.joystiq.com/2012/09/28/ex-rare-staff-want-to-make-spiritual-successor-to-banjo-tooie/

 

[Baskerville]

Hahahaha!!

Did they really make an article talking about a Game Grumps episode?

Anyway, I watched that last week, it was a pretty good show. Grant's a cool guy. Anyway, I'm not sure if this is news for any of you, but some of the Ex-Rare staff, Grant included are getting together to work on the spiritual successor to Banjo. That's why Grant made that comment on Game Grumps. I was actually curious as to why Jon and Ego didn't ask about that...




That's ****ing bull****! Who thought that up? Recovering Health? Really?

Yeah, now imagine having to deal with Magneto's mixups, rushdown with assists & X-FACTOR.Just put the controller down and **** everything.

@Kuma How could I forget about Dark Phoenix

 

[lobotheduck21]

lvl 3 x factor dark phoenix, haunts me to this day

plz nintendo, get rare and their ips away from m$ and their grubby, kinect sports making hands

 

[SmashChu]

Its not lazy. They played pretty differently from their original counterparts. Falco, Roy, and Ganondorf were among the most popular newcomers in Melee as well, so you're in the minority on that.

The only clones that did not go over well were the ones that were "alter egos" (Dr. Mario, Pichu, and Young Link), however, Toon Link was pretty much a Melee-style clone that was an "alterego", but he was received pretty well (though that could be because he was pretty aesthetically different from regular Link, as well as a different person altogether).

Actually, I think Young Link was popular. People liked Doc but he was overall mixed. No one liked Pichu.

 

[Metal Overlord]

clones in Melee were the ****

better than all of these new characters people suggest on here for the sake of "representation"

i'd take doc and pichu over zoroark and chrom any day of the week

 

[ChronoBound]

clones in Melee were the ****

better than all of these new characters people suggest on here for the sake of "representation"

i'd take doc and pichu over zoroark and chrom any day of the week

My man.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Its not lazy. They played pretty differently from their original counterparts. Falco, Roy, and Ganondorf were among the most popular newcomers in Melee as well, so you're in the minority on that.

Yes, it's pretty lazy from a game design standpoint. Hell, the reason why we got the clones to begin with was because the developers had some spare time and Sakurai thought there wasn't enough newcomers.

Also it shouldn't be that surprising when Falco and Ganondorf were popular (even though people didn't like Captain Ganon). Never understood why Roy was popular though.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

An apparently it'll be the same this generation as well.

It seems Unreal 4 and Frostbite 3 won't be on the WiiU. No matter how you look at it, this is bad news for Nintendo as they don't have the same install base as with the Wii. Imo, expect another Gamecube scenario but with less multiplats.

http://www.joystiq.com/2013/03/30/unreal-engine-4-not-designed-to-work-on-wii-u/
http://www.polygon.com/2013/3/29/4162584/frostbite-3-engine-doesnt-support-wii-u

Actually, it turns out the UE4 will work with the Wii U, just with what sounds like lesser visuals than what would be available on the PS4/Xbox720.

http://www.engadget.com/2013/03/29/mark-rein-interview-gdc-2013/

 

[ChronoBound]

Never understood why Roy was popular though.

Sakurai: Because of his "charm" (and t3h ph1r3).

 

[FlareHabanero]

Sakurai: Because of his "charm" (and t3h ph1r3).

Being a clunky Marth knockoff and promotional fodder is charming?

 

[ChronoBound]

Being a clunky Marth knockoff and promotional fodder is charming?

To each their own. As I said before, Melee needed better balance. However, amongst casual fans, Roy was considered just as good as Marth (perhaps even better because his sweet spot was easier to hit with, especially among the casual playstyle).

Also, Sakurai put in Roy to promote the series as a whole as well. Sakurai pretty much thought Roy worked better as a Marth clone than any other FE character at the time.

 

[~automatic]

3 or 4 latest posts.

This is why Neon's the best poster in this thread.

I'm awarding you the ~automatic seal of approval (design pending).

 

[FlareHabanero]

Also, Sakurai put in Roy to promote the series as a whole as well.

You know, I find this statement to be very ironic considering that Roy didn't return in Brawl and in the Fire Emblem games he's just another lord. In context Marth makes more sense with that title considering he was the original lord and the most recurring. Maybe Anna too considering she appears in every game barring Gaiden and is a mascot for the Japanese fan base.

 

[Metal Overlord]

who cares why someone likes something, if they like it then they like it, and that's all that matters

i liked the clones in melee, and there isn't a thing any of you can say to me that will make me think otherwise

call me shallow, say i have bad taste, i don't give a **** because i can't help who and what i like, and thats all i gotta say

 

[Baskerville]

^
Real Talk right here

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Actually, it turns out the UE4 will work with the Wii U, just with what sounds like lesser visuals than what would be available on the PS4/Xbox720.

http://www.engadget.com/2013/03/29/mark-rein-interview-gdc-2013/

Interesting. So maybe the Wii U isn't as weak as we thought.

 

[IAm2Sarcastic4U]

clones in Melee were the ****

better than all of these new characters people suggest on here for the sake of "representation"

i'd take doc and pichu over zoroark and chrom any day of the week

...

Edit: Those dots were only directed to "pichu over zoroark"

 

[FalKoopa]

What I am thinking about Habanero: (Look at ~automatic's location)

 

[ChronoBound]

You know, I find this statement to be very ironic considering that Roy didn't return in Brawl and in the Fire Emblem games he's just another lord.

You do know Roy is amongst the most popular lords in Japan right? You also know that Roy being in Melee was what helped bring many people to the FE series (in not just the West, but Japan too) right? You also know that Roy probably would have made it in Brawl had it not been for Sonic being added in so late right?

Roy is not just another lord in the FE series, but rather amongst the most iconic and popular. Heck, Roy is considered the premier lord of the GBA trilogy (just look at the Red vs. Blue DLC arc for FE13).

As for Anna, people only started to throw her around as a character idea when she had her first combat role in FE13. Before then, she was she was just a secret shop keeper or "would you like to suspend your game" gal.

 

[Moon Monkey]

The WiiU is stuck in this limbo state because it is noticeably better than ps3/xbox360.

but not on the same level as the ps4/nextbox

 

[Deleted member]

To each their own. As I said before, Melee needed better balance. However, amongst casual fans, Roy was considered just as good as Marth (perhaps even better because his sweet spot was easier to hit with, especially among the casual playstyle).

Also, Sakurai put in Roy to promote the series as a whole as well. Sakurai pretty much thought Roy worked better as a Marth clone than any other FE character at the time.

I'll agree with the other things, but there is NO WAY Roy was better than Marth.

'Casual Playstyle' or not. I've heard this tossed around before back in the Melee days, some even said Roy was better than Marth because he was stronger and dealt more damage, and as a Marth main I made them eat those words.

Roy's sweetspot is actually harder to use than Marth's because Roy's requires him to get closer and he actually doesn't have the speed for it. Not to mention 'The Tip' was downright lethal back in Melee. Marth's Dair competed with Falco's for best spike in the game (Falco's was always better mind you).

But the Tip is what made Marth's Utilt, Dtilt, FSmash, Fair, Bair, Nair, and Dair very deadly moves. Something Roy flat out doesn't have.

Marth bests Roy simply because he's faster and more maneuverable and 'The Tip' just tops it off and giving the character great synergy. Roy actually suffered a lot for being a clone because he emulated Marth's playstyle, but lacked the character specific "buffs" that made Marth a great character.

 

[Metal Overlord]

hai look guize somebody responded to my post with 3 whole dots!

oh crap, i done ****ed up now

EDIT: nvm saw your edit

 

[FalKoopa]

You do know Roy is amongst the most popular lords in Japan right? You also know that Roy being in Melee was what helped bring many people to the FE series (in not just the West, but Japan too) right? You also know that Roy probably would have made it in Brawl had it not been for Sonic being added in so late right?

You know Habanero will disagree with you right? You have noticed his sarcasm right? Right?

Right.

 

[ChronoBound]

Stuff.

Considering you are a competitive player, of course you would dominate casual players with Marth. Playing extensively amongst casual fans, they have had an easier time hitting with Roy's sweet spot than Marth's.

Also, we are already know Marth is better than Roy on a tier list.

Marth was frankly made to be too overpowered in Melee. (he even had a few nerfs in the European version of the game).

 

[Deleted member]

The WiiU is stuck in this limbo state because it is noticeably better than ps3/xbox360.

but not on the same level as the ps4/nextbox

It's funny though (and kinda Jarring) because we actually DON'T KNOW how powerful those consoles are as they haven't even been made and the specs are still up in the air, IGN hyping it up to hell and back is certainly getting things across.

Looks like I'll be joining the PC Mustard Race this coming gen though.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

Without melee Roy is nothing.

 

[Deleted member]

Considering you are a competitive player, of course you would dominate casual players with Marth. Playing extensively amongst casual fans, they have had an easier time hitting with Roy's sweet spot than Marth's.

Also, we are already know Marth is better than Roy on a tier list.

Marth was frankly made to be too overpowered in Melee. (he even had a few nerfs in the European version of the game).

But then, what do you mean by 'casual players' then? I mean, it doesn't take much to get used to your character's range and moves. If you've played the game enough times to have a preferred character, then I would assume you would have a good enough grasp of the game to be able to understand what your character's strength's and weaknesses are. Unless you mean people who always played FFAs with items on, then yeah I can sort of see where you are coming from, but in order to beat the game you gotta do some 1v1's, and Roy's weaknesses should become apparent then.

It didn't take much for me to realize that Marth was superior to Roy when I first played the game, but then again that might be because I prefer fast characters.

As for Marth being OP in Melee....

T-that's n-not true...

Oh, why did they nerf the mighty tip in Brawl? That was my biggest gripe with Brawl.


EDIT: I should remind you that I don't do any of that wavedash bull****, all I have is a good understanding of the game and my character.

 

[FalKoopa]

Without Roy, melee is nothing.

Fixed for errors.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Considering that to the casual crowd stuff like Kirby, Link, Ike, and Sonic are overpowered and they rely on stage gimmicks and items in order to get their wins, it doesn't surprise me when people foolishly think Roy is a better character the Marth.

 

[Metal Overlord]

apologize in advance if i sound rude btw, i'm not usually this way

haven't exactly had the best day today

 

[Moon Monkey]

It's funny though (and kinda Jarring) because we actually DON'T KNOW how powerful those consoles are as they haven't even been made and the specs are still up in the air, IGN hyping it up to hell and back is certainly getting things across.

Looks like I'll be joining the PC Mustard Race this coming gen though.

well the devs obviously must know the ball park specs for these 8th gen consoles; especially when Mark Rien so confidently shot down wiiu's likihood of seeing support from the engine.

But yeah, you can't go wrong on PC. but specs aren't everything, I have heard not so positve things about the next xbox not being focused on games

 

[ChronoBound]

Fixed for errors.

Quoting FalKoopa for truth.

Roy is not just a game seller. He's a system seller.

 

[Baskerville]

Tipper was nerfed? How?

 

[FlareHabanero]

Tipper was nerfed? How?

In Brawl, the tip hitbox was made smaller. This caused hitting with it to be generally harder.

 

[Frostwraith]

Quoting FalKoopa for truth.

Roy is not just a game seller. He's a system seller.

I could say that Roy makes Smash sell like hotcakes.