Roster Discussion Thread (Closed)

[Deleted member]

It's usually due to popularity from what I can tell. From this backlash, I can't see why he wouldn't bring back cut characters. Not doing so, would likely cause more backlash, especially if more characters are cut.

Well, he's the lead developer and it's his game he can do what he wants with his game, after all death threats are just that... threats. If we wants to explore new character rather than tread on old faces he very well can, and the fans will simply have to suck it up and deal with it. You didn't see Windwaker get cancelled despite the backlash it received when unveiled now did it?

Proof? How can you say that? That neither are getting in? I remember way back when I was a confused speculator for Brawl, I kept saying Olimar and Toon Link, would never be in smash, and that Bowser Jr., Krystal, and Ridley were definately going to be in Brawl. I was so very wrong. Without proof it can't really be said that a character will definately not be in, especially among a very likely choice(Roy), and a decent replacement if the former does not make it in(Lyn).

Well, keep in mind this is my opinion, not a guarantee. But I'm very sure we'll get only 3 Fire Emblem reps. Why? The roster will be around 44-45 slots imo. With Zelda perdicted to have Toon Link cut and not replaced, I doubt FE will have more reps than Zelda.

So now we look at choices... Well, Marth ain't leaving. Period. Chrom is guaranteed a spot. Now between Ike, Lyn and Roy, tell me who has the best chance of getting in. Especially when Roy would play a lot like Chrom. Ike can be made a heavy-weight and be given axes. Lyn can be made a counter-gimmick fast Rushdown character. Roy... Well, he has "Teh Fyer," yeah, he's not too interesting. However, he bests Lyn in popularity. Still, Ike bests both of them in popularity. I seriously doubt Ike would ever be replaced with Roy. Using your "backlash" argument, there would be a lot of backlash, and not just from the fans, but from many. They replaced a good original character with Cloney McFire.


@Dragonsniper

That sounds like a very bad fanfic...

@MoonMonkey

PacMan is boring when in contrast to Lloyd. I have yet to see a good original moveset for him that convinces me to support him. Also, Tales team is working on Smash, Lloyd could very well get in over PacMan and imo has a better chance.

 

[3Bismyname]

Boring doesn't mean bad

 

[Arcadenik]

Fox/Falco have the most boring movesets. Wolf is where it's at.

 

[Deleted member]

Boring doesn't mean bad

Uhm... yes it does. Give me an example of a good "boring" character. No one wants to play as Plain McSimpleton.

Unless you mean bad from a competitive aspect in which case you're partially right, but most top-tier characters tend to be unique. Likewise, PacMan has NOTHING to bring from a competitive aspect.

EDIT:
Also the whole thing about boring or not, good or bad are entirely subjective and that's really a stupid argument. The only time good and bad can be objective is from a competitive standpoint, where I still stand to be corrected.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Uhm... yes it does. Give me an example of a good "boring" character.

Marth.

Do I win money or what?

 

[3Bismyname]

Mario, And Marth have movests that can be seen as "boring" but they are still well rounded and good characters

 

[Arcadenik]

I think Pac-Man should be more like a hit-and-run type of fighter. That's how the arcade game was like... eat ghosts while they are blue and get out of the way when they get their bodies back.

 

[Deleted member]

Marth.

Do I win money or what?

Marth is NOT boring though... His entire tip sweetspot and his graceful movements are far from it. Anyway, the whole boring or not as I said is a bad argument. To ME, PacMan is boring.

Now can he be made an interesting competitive character? I've yet to see a moveset like that.

@3B
Marth is far from well rounded. He has terrible defenses, if he gets caught on an offensive loop, he's in deep trouble.

 

[Moon Monkey]

Pacman has a way bigger chance of representing Capcom NAMCO Lol! on a whole. Llyod wasn't in SFXTekken was he??? Plus Pacman will be more popular once his TV show drops on Disney XD.

He has 3 platformer games, where he gains different abilites. Plus Pacman has a hell of a lot more history/culture than llyod.

 

[Arcadenik]

Marth is NOT boring though... His entire tip sweetspot and his graceful movements are far from it. Anyway, the whole boring or not as I said is a bad argument. To ME, PacMan is boring.

Now can he be made an interesting competitive character? I've yet to see a moveset like that.

I guess you will have to be force-fed if/when Pac-Man actually gets in the game.

 

[3Bismyname]

Pacman has a way bigger chance of representing Capcom on a whole. Llyod wasn't in SFXTekken was he??? Plus Pacman will be more popular once his TV show drops on Disney XD.

U mean namco right lol

 

[Deleted member]

I guess you will have to be force-fed if/when Pac-Man actually gets in the game.

I still don't see it happening. But if it does happen, he better be interesting, because if he's not... well I've got a new Punchbag character.

@3B

--------The Joke


_____Your Head

 

[FlareHabanero]

Pacman has a way bigger chance of representing Capcom on a whole.

What is this...?

 

[N3ON]

@ManlySpirit
If you're going to classify boring/interesting like that, then you have to admit by your standards "boring/interesting" is ultimately subjective.

 

[SmashShadow]

Marth is NOT boring though... His entire tip sweetspot and his graceful movements are far from it.

All of his moves involve a generic sword swipe. Not exactly thrill worthy...

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

That is because that little story was supposed to sound like a bad fanfic

 

[Deleted member]

@ManlySpirit
If you're going to classify boring/interesting like that, then you have to admit by your standards "boring/interesting" is ultimately subjective.

I did though:

Uhm... yes it does. Give me an example of a good "boring" character. No one wants to play as Plain McSimpleton.

Unless you mean bad from a competitive aspect in which case you're partially right, but most top-tier characters tend to be unique. Likewise, PacMan has NOTHING to bring from a competitive aspect.

EDIT:
Also the whole thing about boring or not, good or bad are entirely subjective and that's really a stupid argument. The only time good and bad can be objective is from a competitive standpoint, where I still stand to be corrected.

I realize I opened a whole can of worms by bringing up the whole boring thing... -_-

 

[Ember Reaper]

Well, he's the lead developer and it's his game he can do what he wants with his game, after all death threats are just that... threats. If we wants to explore new character rather than tread on old faces he very well can, and the fans will simply have to suck it up and deal with it. You didn't see Windwaker get cancelled despite the backlash it received when unveiled now did it?

Yes, he should, but his choices are generally the most popular characters for smash at that time.
I'm not saying the game would get cancelled because when we knew the full roster, teh game would be out already, so cancelling wouldn't really be possible at that point...

Now i have the sense when i said Olimar and TL wouldn't get in, that I gave the vibe I didn't like them or their games. I love both Pikmin games so far and teh Toon games along with the characters. I didn't think Olimar could fight, and TL would be a clone... instead he's a better clone of Link... smh

Well, keep in mind this is my opinion, not a guarantee.

There it is, thank you.

But I'm very sure we'll get only 3 Fire Emblem reps. Why? The roster will be around 44-45 slots imo. With Zelda perdicted to have Toon Link cut and not replaced, I doubt FE will have more reps than Zelda.

I agree with number of reps, not a fan of the low character count but thats just me. I agree with the last part, but I'm still not seeing anyone get cut.

So now we look at choices... Well, Marth ain't leaving. Period. Chrom is guaranteed a spot. Now between Ike, Lyn and Roy, tell me who has the best chance of getting in. Especially when Roy would play a lot like Chrom. Ike can be made a heavy-weight and be given axes. Lyn can be made a counter-gimmick fast Rushdown character. Roy... Well, he has "Teh Fyer," yeah, he's not too interesting. However, he bests Lyn in popularity. Still, Ike bests both of them in popularity. I seriously doubt Ike would ever be replaced with Roy. Using your "backlash" argument, there would be a lot of backlash, and not just from the fans, but from many. They replaced a good original character with Cloney McFire.

Marth, check.
Chrom guaranteed? I'm not so sure. He's liked yes, but people still seem to want Roy as the newcomer more and Ike as you said has even higher popularity than Roy. We also don't know what his remade moveset would be like. I doubt Sakurai would remove the Marth clone of Roy just to make a Chrom clone of Roy (assuming both were in). Though in that case, people may see Chrom as a clone of Roy especially if we don't know which moveset was made first in that case. There's going to be backlash regardless becasue everyone wants their special character in the game. (me it's Shulk/Isaac this time around.) For fire emblem Marth and Ike are the msot popular, and then from what I can tell it's Roy or Chrom for popularity and recentness respectively (but both get popularity) and with eitehr one some people will backlash for that character. But if Roy doesn't get back in people will continue to clamor for him to return. For Chrom, he would never have been in it and his game will most likely be passed over. Similarly to Fire Emblem 7 and Sacred Stones.

 

[Moon Monkey]

U mean namco right lol

Lol, too much stuff running through my head.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Gen 1 of Pokemon is vastly overrated

True story

Old news. Mewtwo transcends the gens though.

 

[N3ON]

@ManlySpirit
Fair enough, I guess I didn't see your edit, but I agree that boring doesn't necessarily and automatically mean bad, either in general or competitively.

And it's a little hard to judge how a character will fare competitively before you even see how they'd play.

 

[FlareHabanero]

It's fair to assume how some characters would hypothetically play out. King K. Rool would be a brute, Takamaru would be fast, and Palutena would be defensive for example. But some are more sketchy to decipher due to varies reasons.

 

[Arcadenik]

@ManlySpirit
Fair enough, I guess I didn't see your edit, but I agree that boring doesn't necessarily and automatically mean bad, either in general or competitively.

And it's a little hard to judge how a character will fare competitively before you even see how they'd play.

This is what I meant when I told him that he would have to be force-fed if/when Pac-Man actually gets in SSB4.

 

[Deleted member]

All of his moves involve a generic sword swipe. Not exactly thrill worthy...

*sigh...

I'm just gonna drop this topic. Look, give me an intriguing PacMan moveset and I might Jump Ship, however, as it stands, I don't like him, and Lloyd who stands an equal chance of getting in, sounds more promising to me based on movesets that have been presented to me (I've never played ToS).

Yes, he should, but his choices are generally the most popular characters for smash at that time.
I'm not saying the game would get cancelled because when we knew the full roster, teh game would be out already, so cancelling wouldn't really be possible at that point...

Now i have the sense when i said Olimar and TL wouldn't get in, that I gave the vibe I didn't like them or their games. I love both Pikmin games so far and teh Toon games along with the characters. I didn't think Olimar could fight, and TL would be a clone... instead he's a better clone of Link... smh


There it is, thank you.


Marth, check.
Chrom guaranteed? I'm not so sure. He's liked yes, but people still seem to want Roy as the newcomer more and Ike as you said has even higher popularity than Roy. We also don't know what his remade moveset would be like. I doubt Sakurai would remove the Marth clone of Roy just to make a Chrom clone of Roy (assuming both were in). Though in that case, people may see Chrom as a clone of Roy especially if we don't know which moveset was made first in that case. There's going to be backlash regardless becasue everyone wants their special character in the game. (me it's Shulk/Isaac this time around.) For fire emblem Marth and Ike are the msot popular, and then from what I can tell it's Roy or Chrom for popularity and recentness respectively (but both get popularity) and with eitehr one some people will backlash for that character. But if Roy doesn't get back in people will continue to clamor for him to return. For Chrom, he would never have been in it and his game will most likely be passed over. Similarly to Fire Emblem 7 and Sacred Stones.

Toon Link IS a clone of Link, and the reason why Link didn't get buffs. Hopefully he gets cut and we get a better Main Link (the Ky/Jin of Smash).

I'm not saying Smash would be cancelled, I gave WW as an example of a game where there was a ton of backlash and developers simply told fans to suck it up and deal with it. The fact that fans sometimes think that they can make better development choices in games sometimes baffles me. Sure, they have a point in cases like Sonic 06 and stuff, but to threaten with "backlash" because [yourfavoritecharacter] didn't get in is absurd.

So you admit that Roy won't be getting in over Marth or Ike, and that we won't be getting more than 3 FE reps.

So all that's left is Chrom. Tell me, do you honestly think Roy is getting in over the latest protagonist from the newest and most successful Fire Emblem game? Really? Even Lucina has a better shot than Roy.

Lol, too much stuff running through my head.

You mean that wasn't a joke?

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

I assume Micaiah would be a long distance fighter, Little Mac an up and close brawler, Isa Jo an all around fighter, Matthew being up close/far away mixed fighter with his sword and Psyenergy, Shulk being more of a up front sword user with defensive abilities, and Ghirahim being a mixed fighter using dark magic and the option for a sword.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Lloyd who stands an equal chance of getting in sounds more promising to me based on movesets that have been presented to me (I've never played ToS).

Wait, weren't you the same person that thought Lloyd didn't sound convincing and bluntly stated ">he's like marth but with faster frames", or something along those lines?

 

[N3ON]

It's fair to assume how some characters would hypothetically play out. King K. Rool would be a brute, Takamaru would be fast, and Palutena would be defensive for example. But some are more sketchy to decipher due to varies reasons.

Yeah, it isn't too much of a stretch to imagine movesets and playstyles and stuff, I just meant that with absolutely no concrete information about how the character will play, assuming how they'd stack up competitively is still a guess, especially with characters who could really hypothetically go many ways, like Pac-Man.

 

[Deleted member]

@ManlySpirit
Fair enough, I guess I didn't see your edit, but I agree that boring doesn't necessarily and automatically mean bad, either in general or competitively.

And it's a little hard to judge how a character will fare competitively before you even see how they'd play.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=331574

Still, you can look at his games and play the developer's role to think what sort of move set you could give him, and how he could play out. What sort of strategies, what sort of archetype, etc...

When you take Lloyd, and you take PacMan, and put them side by side, move sets and strategies and all, Lloyd wins. I've already expressed my sentiment against PacMan before, and challenged his supporters to give me an interesting moveset, the closest one was something that could easily be added to Sonic, Bouncing and all.

Wait, weren't you the same person that thought Lloyd didn't sound convincing and bluntly stated ">he's like marth but with faster frames", or something along those lines?

It was me, Gahahahaha.

Well, I still think KOS-MOS would be the ideal, but she's got a

Spoiler

Nanobyte of a chance

Spoiler

(eh? eh? No? ok....;_;

)

. So with the remaining choices I always prefered either no one or Lloyd if we HAD to have one.

Still, Kuma's moveset for Lloyd made me change my mind for him. I would be fine with him getting in and I can see how he could be different from other sword users. My biggest previous gripe.

It's not unusual for people to change opinions on things. For example, coming here I was pro-Mewtwo, pro-Roy, now... I'm on the opposite end. My ideas change and evolve with discussion.

 

[Moon Monkey]

Lol I wish; it was a good unintentional joke. Pacman has been given a great deal of spotlight by Nintendo. He was in that mario kart arcade game. Need I mention Nintendo hyped up that GBA/GC Pacman game as a ''big reveal'' at a prevous E3?

You should check out the Pacman character if you want somewhat good movesets. But if sakurai can give someone like fox and c. falcon movesets from little to no source material, Pacman can't be too bad.

 

[Ember Reaper]

The fact that fans sometimes think that they can make better development choices in games sometimes baffles me. Sure, they have a point in cases like Sonic 06 and stuff, but to threaten with "backlash" because [yourfavoritecharacter] didn't get in is absurd.

When I said backlash I meant complain, go on the internet. None of this death threat stuff. That is way too extreme over a game. ITS A GAME. I don;t see why people wpouldnt threaten a life over a game.

So you admit that Roy won't be getting in over Marth or Ike, and that we won't be getting more than 3 FE reps.

If I implied that I apologize. I see that as the likely amount. I would be pleasantly surprised if there are 4 reps. The series is one of the ones who may get 2 newcomers, I'm not against that. But 3 is the likely number this time around.

So all that's left is Chrom. Tell me, do you honestly think Roy is getting in over the latest protagonist from the newest and most successful Fire Emblem game? Really? Even Lucina has a better shot than Roy.

I honestly do. I haven't seen proof of it being the best. Can you show me?
To say Lucina has a better shot isn't exactly true though. From that stance, Elincia should have been the next likely back in Brawl's days, but from the AT status it was Lyn from what we can tell.

 

[Arcadenik]

*sigh...

I'm just gonna drop this topic. Look, give me an intriguing PacMan moveset and I might Jump Ship, however, as it stands, I don't like him, and Lloyd who stands an equal chance of getting in, sounds more promising to me based on movesets that have been presented to me (I've never played ToS).

What's your definition of an intriguing moveset? A moveset that is plainly presented to you? What?

 

[ChronoBound]

Anyone who thinks Lucina has a better chance than Roy is a full on fanboy. Plain and simple.

Also, Chrom and Ike won't both be playable. I keep saying they are too similar, others keep saying they are too similar. I think even Sakurai will realize that Marth, Ike, and Chrom would be too redundant.

Its either going to be Marth and Chrom or Marth, Ike, and Roy.

 

[FlareHabanero]

To me, Pac-man would be a very tricky character to tame.

His movements would be very erratic from a very potent dash dance to high mobility in the air, moves having abnormally high priority and range, very potent dodges, resilience to combos and chain grabs, and a great utility move in the form of his Munch attack (can eat projectiles, good approach option, has super armor properties etc.). Pac-man as a whole would play a hit and run strategy that is designed to fake out or halt the opponents actions, but his power and weight would be below average.

He's in a sense the opposite of Mega Man. Mega Man would be more like a tank while Pac-man is more like a weasel, if that makes any sense. Mege Man would be slow, heavy, with a reliance of powerful ranged projectile, while Pac-man would be much more light on his feet with a general metagame involving suckering the opponent with varies approach options.

 

[Moon Monkey]

To me, Pac-man would be a very tricky character to tame.

His movements would be very erratic from a very potent dash dance to high mobility in the air, moves having abnormally high priority and range, very potent dodges, resilience to combos and chain grabs, and a great utility move in the form of his Munch attack (can eat projectiles, good approach option, has super armor properties etc.). Pac-man as a whole would play a hit and run strategy that is designed to fake out or halt the opponents actions, but his power, speed, and weight would be fairly moderate otherwise.

He's in a sense the opposite of Mega Man. Mega Man would be more like a tank while Pac-man is more like a weasel, if that makes any sense.

I see him of a mix of Kirby and G&W.

I said in the Pacman thread, but I just want Pacman to have a special move that is similar to Wario's Chomp move, The only difference is that Pacman will eat projectiles and regain life when eaten. He could even make the same sounds from the arcade when he eats fruits when he manages to to eat the projectile.

 

[Big-Cat]

Still, Kuma's moveset for Lloyd made me change my mind for him. I would be fine with him getting in and I can see how he could be different from other sword users. My biggest previous gripe.

It was more of a concept than a moveset. I might have a better illustrated move set later today.

@Habanero
Can you illustrate this play style with a move set?

 

[8-peacock-8]

I see him of a mix of Kirby and G&W.

I said in the Pacman thread, but I just want Pacman to have a special move that is similar to Wario's Chomp move, The only difference is that Pacman will eat projectiles and regain life when eaten. He could even make the same sounds from the arcade when he eats fruits when he manages to to eat the projectile.

It would have to be very specific projectiles also. (Turnip, fire ball, some items)

For example: Explosives would damage instead of heal.

 

[Deleted member]

When I said backlash I meant complain, go on the internet. None of this death threat stuff. That is way too extreme over a game. ITS A GAME. I don;t see why people wpouldnt threaten a life over a game.

You'd be surprised, hahaha. Some fans can be real hardcore. I think I remember reading about certain mangaka (Kubo?) receiving death threats for killing off a character. To the point where they had to be retconed back in.

If I implied that I apologize. I see that as the likely amount. I would be pleasantly surprised if there are 4 reps. The series is one of the ones who may get 2 newcomers, I'm not against that. But 3 is the likely number this time around.

It's not that you implied it, I'm just trying to make sure we're on the same page in regard to the central point so we don't bother discussing asinine facts.

I honestly do. I haven't seen proof of it being the best. Can you show me?
To say Lucina has a better shot isn't exactly true though. From that stance, Elincia should have been the next likely back in Brawl's days, but from the AT status it was Lyn from what we can tell.

Well, Lucina has a better chance than Roy if Chrom doesn't get in. FE13 is getting a new rep. It was the most successful Fire Emblem game in a long time in Japan, and it is very hyped for the West as well. Both heroes, Chrom and Lucina are well-liked by the fanbase and are featured in tons of merchandise. Now give me a good reason as to why FE13 wouldn't get a character in Smash 4? Everyone else expects it.

Why should Roy, a now irrelevant character get in over a brand new well liked character? Also I like how you assume that Roy would get a brand new moveset, if he gets in I find it more likely he'll get the Falco treatment. Chrom on the other hand has more options in regard to moveset than Roy with Lances and the like (though it's unlikely he'll use them), but he has more abilities at his disposal to play with, including certain passive abilities that could translate well into Smash Bros as power up moves. Roy on the other hand, brings nothing new. Not to mention, that withing the Fire Emblem franchise (despite what Chrono says) Roy IS irrelevant. He's from a game early in the GBA era, he never appeared in the West officially and most of his supporters haven't played his game. Also, in contrast to other FE lords, he's among the weakest.

The only reason Roy is hyped is because his fans are very vocal and want him back in from Melee, and his new DLC appearance was well received. But then, what about Lyn? Why should she get in over Chrom? The answer is, she shouldn't. It shouldn't take much to realize why. It's like arguing against Ike back in Brawl days.

What's your definition of an intriguing moveset? A moveset that is plainly presented to you? What?

Take a look at this thread:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=331574

Look at the comparisons to other fighters and notice how much thought is given to characters when they are added to a game. Look at the move sets some people posted for current cast members or newcomers, I still plan on expanding that thread further. If you have any neat ideas for characters, feel free to post them, I'd love to hear them.

 

[Moon Monkey]

It would have to be very specific projectiles also. (Turnip, fire ball, some items)

For example: Explosives would damage instead of heal.

Definitely, projectiles like Samus' missiles and Link's bombs will stun, like how it stuns Wario and Kirby when eaten.
Things like Fox/Falco's lasers, PK Fire/thunder, fire balls, bananas, peanuts etc...

Pacman World 1 and 2 have all the material he needs for moves

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVAwRG2PuBY

 

[ChronoBound]

A lot of crap to shift through. Oh boy...

Well, Lucina has a better chance than Roy if Chrom doesn't get in. FE13 is getting a new rep. It was the most successful Fire Emblem game in a long time in Japan, and it is very hyped for the West as well. Both heroes, Chrom and Lucina are well-liked by the fanbase and are featured in tons of merchandise.

What tons of merchandise? There is no tons of merchandise for anything pertaining to FE13 aside from an artbook and Nintedo e-shop points cards.

Now give me a good reason as to why FE13 wouldn't get a character in Smash 4? Everyone else expects it.

Not everyone expects. Most people are actually very skeptical. Secondly, most people here acknowledge that a game can be represented without a playable character. The whole Pokemon discussion last night even went over that topic (3rd gen was still represented despite not having a playable character).

Chrom on the other hand has more options in regard to moveset than Roy with Lances and the like (though it's unlikely he'll use them), but he has more abilities at his disposal to play with, including certain passive abilities that could translate well into Smash Bros as power up moves.

What passive abilities that could translate well into Smash Bros? More bs?

Roy on the other hand, brings nothing new. Not to mention, that withing the Fire Emblem franchise (despite what Chrono says) Roy IS irrelevant. He's from a game early in the GBA era, he never appeared in the West officially and most of his supporters haven't played his game. Also, in contrast to other FE lords, he's among the weakest.

Roy is not irrelevant no matter how many times you wish it so. He is the FACE of the entire GBA Fire Emblem trilogy, he is the GBA Fire Emblem games like Ike is to FE9/FE10. Heck, the GBA games at least sold well in Japan in comparison to the FE9/FE10.

Also, on your second point, Roy is not the weakest lord in the series. Leaf and Alm are weaker than him. Roy's problem is his absurdly late promotion, if he promoted at say Chapter 16, he actually would be better than most of the GBA lords not named Hector and Ephraim.

The only reason Roy is hyped is because his fans are very vocal and want him back in from Melee, and his new DLC appearance was well received.

Roy has one of the quietest fanbases within the Smash Bros. fanbase. He is a Top 10 character in terms of support, yet his support is really quiet. If anything its his detractors that are far louder relative to their size. You make up crap as you go along because you have nothing to support your beliefs aside from your own biased mindset.

 

[Deleted member]

Anyone who thinks Lucina has a better chance than Roy is a full on fanboy. Plain and simple.

Also, Chrom and Ike won't both be playable. I keep saying they are too similar, others keep saying they are too similar. I think even Sakurai will realize that Marth, Ike, and Chrom would be too redundant.

Its either going to be Marth and Chrom or Marth, Ike, and Roy.

The argument that Chrom and Ike are too similar is biased and weak.

Ike is a heavyweight and could easily be expanded to further represent the archetype.

For Ike, give him Axes, such as the Tomohawk/Hand Axe as a 5B for some mid/long range zoning. It's a lot like Link's Boomerang but with more of a "slashy" multi-hit ability.

His 2B is now Eruption rather than Counter, it's got strong resistance to hit-stun making it a good defensive move. His 4/6B is modified, giving him less range, but more speed. It also takes much less to charge.

All of his defenses are upped so he has less hitstun, takes less damage, and less knockback from hits, thus making him more of a heavyweight, like he should. His running speed is the same, but his fall speed is faster, this is both a buff and a restriction. His jump height is reduced a bit. His attack range stays the same

His tilts and aerials are all given less delay, thus making them faster. His 4/6A is replaced to be an Anti Air attack, it is an angled hit that hits at 45 degrees above him, the range and speed on his 2A is dramatically increased to compensate for the lack of a horizontal poke. Lastly, like all characters, he's given the ability to chain and string moves together, so a standard combo for him would look like this 5A>5A>2A>8A>8Smash. All of his Smash attacks remain the same in speed, range and power, they are meant to be slow killing moves, and the best way to use them is in combos. Well, his 2Smash can be changed to be a faster move with a little less power, horizontal knockback maybe?

Overall Ike is meant to be a slow defensive character, he has deadly range and good pokes a la Sagat, his Anti Air is very fast and very lethal, his 5B Axe makes for a good defensive poke/zoning move. Due to his poor jump, his air game is terrible however, it is only good defensively, however, Aether makes up for it by giving him a good mix up move and a great recovery attack. Some of his A attacks and Aerials have replaced Ragnell with his dad's Axe, giving them different hitboxes. Likewise, his 4/6 Smash is Ragnell in one hand and his Dad's Axe in the other, thus justifying its power. Obviously he gets his FE10 getup.

Also, all of his stupid "I fight for my friends" taunts and attitude, has been changed to make him a more honorable and heroic figure. However, his personality is more Ruthless and Brutal (think Simon in Gurren Lagann), the kinda guy who get's **** done and counts on his will power to do so. Also, his ruthlessness reflect his vindictive, yet respectful demeanor from his games (he fought to avenge his father, yet still had compassion for his rival).

Chrom

4/6B is Aether, since he too has Aether, he gets it as well, but as a SideB, the only similarity with Ike's Aether here is the name. This Aether steals health from foes on impact, not much, but it still does it (a la Ragna in BB, his drive steals health), it is a Two-hit rush move, and a great combo opener.

His 2B is Holy Shield (I think it was you who suggested this), it is a temporary Ability that increases Chroms frail defenses for a while, while also increasing the power of all his SPECIAL attacks. After being used, it must be recharged before her can use it again. It recharges faster the more hits Chrom lands.

Somewhere in his tilts he has a Javelin as a weapon (Fair? or 4/6A), he throws it but it has a chain attached to it so it returns to him, it hits opponents twice. If you hit with the tip (at peak range) it hits once, but has much greater knockback, a decent killing move.

The rest of the moves will have to wait till I play FE13.

Chrom's general playstyle is a nice contrast between Marth's offence and Ike's defense. He's a very well rounded character, with a lot of diverse abilities, his specials have mediocre power, but once he powers them up with Holy Shield they become very powerful (think Tsubaki in BlazBlue with her specials and power up ability). He's got good ground and air attacks, but has less aerial range than Marth, he's also slower than Marth, his defensive game is good as far as defensive moves, unlike Marth, but like Marth, he's in trouble once takes high damage and can be knocked around easily. UNLESS, he has Holy Shield activated which lets him be more reckless (doesn't make him as tough as Ike, but still better than Marth), however, at high damages, Holy Shield lasts less time.

A far as personality, he inherits that "I fight for my friends" attitude Ike had in Brawl.

As for Marth, he's buffed to be more like in Melee, and his 4/6B is improved to be more like the Astral abillity in FE (what it's based off of), in fact I would make Marth's 4/6B like Noel's Drive in BB, where activating it changes his specials and allows combos to be stung more easlily.

With this, I no longer find them being similar at all. All 3 of them have very unique and diverse moves, playstyles and personlities.

To me, Pac-man would be a very tricky character to tame.

His movements would be very erratic from a very potent dash dance to high mobility in the air, moves having abnormally high priority and range, very potent dodges, resilience to combos and chain grabs, and a great utility move in the form of his Munch attack (can eat projectiles, good approach option, has super armor properties etc.). Pac-man as a whole would play a hit and run strategy that is designed to fake out or halt the opponents actions, but his power and weight would be below average.

He's in a sense the opposite of Mega Man. Mega Man would be more like a tank while Pac-man is more like a weasel, if that makes any sense. Mege Man would be slow, heavy, with a reliance of powerful ranged projectile, while Pac-man would be much more light on his feet with a general metagame involving suckering the opponent with varies approach options.

I'd like to see a moveset for this.

So far that Hit-and-Run approach would be ideal for Sonic, who's in dire need of a revamp.

Also, speaking about being able to eat projectiles... What if Yoshi got this?