ROB Q&A!! Read this before asking questions...ALL OF IT!

[RyNo 86]

Hey Overswarm, I have a question about the gyro, if you want to use it to take up space, where would be the best place to put it? And aside from his d-tilt what is his most spammable moves.

 

[Sharky]

woo, my independently-developed ROB appears to be turning out well... I already picked up on the **** of Weegi Mansion, although I didn't know about the Orpheon platform trick. ROB has a lot of good stages (JUNGLE JAPES LOLOL). I also like tossing uncharged gyros to eat up space and be annoying.
But I did have a question. I had an idea about tossing a gyro, letting the opponent jump over, then doing a little chain where I ftilt while moving forward to force them back into it. then you pick up the gyro and start hitting them with it, using BEEMS angled up in case they jump. when you reach the edge, fair ****. This came less out of a real strategy than my wish that I find a way to kill someone by holding forward and pressing A.
Here's a real question. I found out that there's 2 levels of angle to the BEEMS, equivalent to a smash motion and a tilt motion, sorta. Are there any other angles or is that each?

Depending on the time gap between initiating the move and angling the shot with the other stick you can get a greater or lesser angle.

 

[JCaesar]

Yeah the laser isn't smash/tilt dependent, it's purely based on the time the stick is held beforehand, and thus you can shoot it at essentially any angle you want up to the max.

Thanks for the pika advice Overswarm, I'll be waiting for your anti-MK guide.

 

[Dastrn]

Can you critique my R.O.B.? http://youtube.com/watch?v=zhflAC7xeB0&fmt=18

Much <3

squee, seems like you are a good smasher, but you don't quite get what ROB's game is. In this matchup, you should probably play WAY more campy. Marth can't hurt you from far away, but you can hurt him. take advantage of that. Make him approach you. Your dash attack got shield-grabbed almost every time. you basically let marth camp you...
your off the ledge game was solid.
also, you barely shielded, and you didn't use ROB's grab game, which is rather good.

overall not bad, man.

 

[game_tip]

Another cool tactic I use is toss the gyro right down on the edge of the stage
the bounce is nasty!

 

[Ishoku]

boolossus, do you happen to go by any other sn? just wondering, i think i saw a name very similar to yours but not exactly... i think i saw it on gamefaqs..?

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

OverSwarm is a good looking man.

What type of shampoo doust thou use on ye divine hair...

 

[mossdog]

what's the best way to handle the angel ring?

 

[Rang Flash]

Is it advisable to spam his spot-dodge?

 

[Overswarm]

Hey Overswarm, I have a question about the gyro, if you want to use it to take up space, where would be the best place to put it? And aside from his d-tilt what is his most spammable moves.

His f-tilt and d-tilt are both fairly spammable. There is little lag, and they can be used frequently to start harassing your opponent. Even better is that they have low knockback, so using them to recharge your stronger moves is a great idea.

For the gyro, you generally want to either hit the opponent or use it to prevent some mode of movement. If you set it in front of them, they have to dash attack, jump, or roll over it. If you set it above them on a platform, they can't jump unless they air dodge. If you sit in right in front of the ledge when they are on it, they will have to jump, roll, or simply wait on the ledge.

Limiting your opponents options in this way allows you to have a much easier time punishing them. Just keep in mind what would work best. Setting a gyro in front of a character that has a great aerial game won't do very much; they're going in the air anyway. Might be better off shooting that gyro above them and forcing them to stay on the ground for a moment or two!

What type of shampoo doust thou use on ye divine hair...

I'm out right now, so whatever my roomates have. Normally something in a green bottle. Pert or something, I think. I dunno. I don't pay attention.

what's the best way to handle the angel ring?

If the angel ring is Pit's over-b, I'd say to hit him out of it? If you hear him start to scream and throw that thing out, you should be able to get out of range with one initial dash animation unless you are really up in his grill (which you shouldn't be). After you are out of range, you can wait and punish the lag or just smash him out of it with your f-smash.

Is it advisable to spam his spot-dodge?

It isn't really advisable to spam anything, but on an approaching opponent... the spot dodge isn't a bad thing to use. You can actually spot dodge through all of Fox's lasers if you time it correctly.

Problem being, we're human; ROB isn't, but we are. So we can't get it perfect, and thus should rely on things we CAN perfect, such as NOT being in a location that will get us hit.

Also, any time someone is spamming spot dodge, all the opponent has to do is just use a multi-hit attack. Not things like G&W's turtle (which can be easily spot dodged), but things more like Fox's dair or Falco's fair. The hitbox stays out and then immediately after the spot dodge ends, you get hit before another begins.

Some characters, like Ganon, don't really have moves that work well against those spamming spot dodge and have to time it; even so, it can still be done.

So no, don't spam it. At best, you win a few games if your opponent doesn't know what to do, and then eventually he figures it out and you have to stop. At worst, you train yourself to do something stupid and then lose horribly against someone that is really good.

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

LoL..

Mr. Swarm.. being a Midwesterner yourself you must truely see the advantageous nature of spamming SideSteps by watching the SS master Drephen play ;p



/buys Pert

 

[Overswarm]

LoL..

Mr. Swarm.. being a Midwesterner yourself you must truely see the advantageous nature of spamming SideSteps by watching the SS master Drephen play ;p



/buys Pert

It didn't even work in Melee against characters that could do something about it. Problem was, there weren't many because it was so fast. Fox could maybe drill kick, Jiggs could pound... but that'd be it.

That said, I still throw out 3-4 spot dodges in a row often. I just know it isn't a fool-proof tactic, nor is it a good idea. I get hit out of it randomly, and it is totally out of my control; it might win me games, but it won't win me tournaments.

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

Your smile stops trains and cures Hepatitis.


...

Who needs to win tournaments

 

[Overswarm]

Your smile stops trains and cures Hepatitis.


...

Who needs to win tournaments

You have a man crush, don't you

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

tehehe

on a side note...

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=161448

these people actually believe me to be serious... LMAO.

 

[Rang Flash]

Thanks for your swift response overswarm. I kind of miswrote the question, it should be something like, "Is Rob's spot-dodge good?"

Sometimes I use it 2 or 3 times in a row because I'm looking for an opening to attack. I hardly ever get punished for it, but I just didn't know if it was bad to do or not. I guess I didn't really mean spamming.

 

[Cobra]

Transform into Zelda.

But really, it's going to be a long hard road for you. You can rack up damage with your tilts easily, but you're going to have to eventually kill ROB with an f-smash, u-smash, or possibly an up-air.

You can combo ROB out of your d-tilt easily, and since he has a laggy d-air you can juggle with u-air.

It's a hard matchup for Sheik. You have to constnatly keep up the pressure, get those grabs in, then get ROB above you. When he's at higher %, try to kill him with an f-smash or u-smash. That's about all I got.

Thanks Overswarm! I know I'm fighting an uphill battle, but that makes it all the more interesting. Thanks for the advice! I really appreciate it!

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

In all seriousness though.. I am seeing ALOT of ROB players use Dthrow when i myself find that Uthrow causes less knockback, and is better for Uair comboing...

Your thoughts?

 

[Drephen]

ROB is by far the gayest character in brawl

 

[Overswarm]

ROB is by far the gayest character in brawl

I'm pretty sure that award is going to go to Pit. I'm pretty sure Pit is a lesbian. Haircut and all




Here's the thing about ROB's throws:


His f-throw and b-throw are great at low % since you can chain unsuspecting opponents. My favorite starting combo is grab, b-throw, grab, b-throw, grab, d-throw, u-air. It does well above 50% and you're going to be able to hit with a laser or gyro afterwards, and then it's only a u-air or two away from KO percentage. That's all without using your KO moves!

Other than that, f-throw and b-throw are great for what they are but aren't KO moves unless your opponent doesn't DI. If they do, it's even worse than Peach's f-throw from Melee. So, to combo or set up for a KO, you almost always have to d-throw or u-throw.

However...

u-throw can be DIed much greater than d-throw can (meaning you can't follow up a u-throw if your opponent is DIing)

and

u-throw is a KO move at high % if you don't use it.


So use your d-throw all day and you can combo with u-air (make sure to double jump to u-air immediately at higher %, and at even higher % just double jump then up+B for a rising u-air and chase them out of the last hit). It's also important to note that out of a u-throw at low %, your opponent can air dodge once and reach the ground easily. Out of a d-throw, a smart ROB can space his u-air so that even if his opponent air dodges, ROB is right on top of him and can do any aerial he wants.

Your u-throw will kill at anywhere from 160-250% depending on the character. Those seem like high numbers, but as anyone that's played ROB knows, dealing damage is never an issue. If I have a Metaknight at 120% and he just won't die, I will happily spam f-tilt, d-tilt, lasers, and gyros until I can get a grab and just u-throw him for the kill.


I'm not sure why u-throw is a KO move while d-throw is not. If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say that u-throw has a greater increase in knockback as % goes up, while d-throw just has a higher initial knockback but doesn't increase as greatly.

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

/signed .

 

[DemonFirebrand]

Overswarm, please bestow onto me the knowledge of how to harrass edge guarders more efficiently! I get that I can fire the laser, fire gyro, or do a rising arial, is there anything I am missing? What do you do when you grab the ledge?

 

[Overswarm]

Overswarm, please bestow onto me the knowledge of how to harrass edge guarders more efficiently! I get that I can fire the laser, fire gyro, or do a rising arial, is there anything I am missing? What do you do when you grab the ledge?

Edgeguarding ROB is tricky, but not impossible.

To make it tricky, ROB has to use everything he has. I suggest shooting a gyro and trying to land it on the stage in front of the ledge; this is a sure way to make it back safely. The only issue comes when your opponent is smart enough to smash it off or run up and shield it, but even then it helps by buying you time.

Keep in mind that you have PLENTY of up+b since you HAVE been using your b-air for extra horizontal distance. That means if someone is grabbing the ledge, you can stall with your up+b and just throw out fair, bair, dair, nair, or u-air to force them to get off the ledge. No one should ever grab the ledge and be able to do anything to ROB ever. At the very least you can fly over them.

Speaking of flying over them, if your opponent doesn't have a very good vertical KO move, just fly with your up+b to the center of the stage and then let yourself fall. Air dodge when you need to, touch the ground, and you are set.

Another trick I do quite often is to go underneath the stage. If done properly, you can turn around while under the stage and go to the other ledge! You might say "well no one will fall for that", and that's true, but your opponent will rarely space themselves properly if you are forcing them to run back and forth across the stage. That's the real trick to it.

The real issue always comes when you grab the ledge. What do you do? ROB has surprisingly few "safe" options even though he has an amazing moveset.

If they are standing near the edge, your options are pretty awesome.

Drop off to jump + double fair (or my personal favorite, fair + bair, which can be followed by a d-smash if they roll towards you)

drop off to jump + u-air (if you space it properly, the last hit of the u-air will teleport ROB onto the stage!)

Simply rolling or getting onto the stage to refuel your up+b enough to allow you to get back to the center of the stage

Jump off ledge to nair (this is surprisingly fast, as jumping off the ledge has the least delay of all "off the ledge" moves; this is the opposite from Melee)

Drop off, jump away, gyro, go back to ledge


They are all good, but obviously not unstoppable. A good spot dodge or well spaced shield combined with a patient opponent leads ROB to be throw back out into the open, and unlike other characters, he doesn't get his up+b back after being hit!

That said, your main goal if you've been knocked back off ONCE is to touch the stage, even if you will take a hit. Otherwise, you'll be dead anyways. So just roll and touch the ground for a moment.

The worst edgeguarders are those that stand just out of reach of your initial fair (which is right in front of where your roll will land. Against these opponents, you have to pressure them to move TOWARDS you. Simply jump off the ledge, laser, and then you will auto grab. You can also do this with a gyro, but it is harder to time so you'll have to up+b a short bit.

If you can't force them to move in close, I suggest just standing up on the ledge and then rolling towards them or spot dodging as quickly as possible; this recharges your up+b and gives you a greater chance of recovering than trying some high risk tactic like reaching out with your nair or fair.

Did I also mention that jumping off ledge to air dodge is great to avoid edgeguarders like Marth that like to short hop fair or f-smash the moment you get off the ledge?

Because it is.

 

[DemonFirebrand]

This is great advice, and will aid my recovery game greatly. A million thanks!

 

[game_tip]

stalling w/ Dair is great while trying to get back to the stage!

 

[Ishoku]

Overswarm, do you know if a Dash Attack Cancelled into Upsmash is possible with ROB?

examples are shown here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7Q2gfVEf0k

i dont think its a DLX (boo stoopid name) cancel because you have to hit the person still right?

but in these vids, it is not required.

it also may not be plausible because i think its the japanese version but eh

im just throwing it out there.

 

[Overswarm]

stalling w/ Dair is great while trying to get back to the stage!

No, it isn't.

Stalling with dair has two good uses:

1. You know your opponent is going to double jump aerial (most snakes do that to hit with a u-air for a KO), and will thus need to land after doing so. Stalling once with dair gives you some more "safe time".

2. You are trying to mindgame your opponent by going straight down, dairing, and then floating to the left or right afterwards. This is especially effective near the ledge, when you can dair and float towards the ledge to auto-grab and is night unpunishable.



As for the dash attack canceled u-smash... from what I can see, ROB cannot do this effectively. I may have the timing wrong, but I can do it with other characters. ROB only gets a slight bit of distance more than a running u-smash, so it seems to be near worthless for him. Sucks, since he could use it more than anyone else! Not having a reliable vertical KO move other than his nair at the top of the stage is a huge disadvantage against smaller characters like Metaknight, G&W, and anyone else that dies off the top easily!

Us ROB players may have to find us a good secondary that has strong aerial KO potential to back him up for those hard matchups.

 

[DRaGZ]

Thanks OS. This thread's been a lot of help.

 

[Overswarm]

Didn't receive question, but will still post answer!

How to use ROB's dash attack:

His dash attack, like most dash attacks, can be shield grabbed. This makes it a poor approach when used improperly, and thus will ALWAYS be a gamble when attacking a grounded opponent (since they can shield).

You can attempt to run through them and dash attack (which still will hit them and make you appear on the other side) or hit them with the very edge of the attack, but you are still vulnerable, albeit at different points.

So how do you know when to use the dash attack?

You use it whenever your opponent is in the air or is teching/rolling!

His dash attack has a great hitbox, and hits a good ways above ROB. Even better is the knockback factor of it! It's so slight at low % that you can often follow it up with u-tilts and u-airs. At high %, you can always pressure your opponent from it and sometimes get off an u-smash.

So when your opponent is landing, dash attack before they hit the ground! It is not advisable to do this against opponents with a good KO aerial, but for those with damage dealing fairs it is a godsend. The dash attack sends them BACK up into the air while you move only slightly, and you can then follow up with another dash attack or aerial.

The reason this strategy is so good goes into the whole "yomi layer" idea.

If you are going to dash attack a landing opponent and he knows it, he can do two things that are effective.

1. Air dodge

2. Attack you before you attack him

Very few aerials come out fast enough with enough range to prevent ROB from at least hitting him as well. At the right %, ROB can take 12% to give out a dash attack and still wind up with more damage being dealt to the opponent due to pressuring.
Besides that, if your opponent gets in the habit of doing an aerial (or countering in some cases), you can simply run up and shield.

If your opponent air dodges, he is a fool! The dash attack has very little lag, and can be followed up with a d-smash easily. This will again launch your opponent into the air.
Pressuing landing opponents with dash attacks (mixed up with grabs + d-throw for combo / pressure potential) is a great way of forcing your opponent to fight a brick wall before he actually fights you.

A "brick wall" is a strategy that has a very specific counter, yet is very specific and simple in how it is done.

Rob has many "brick walls" that are difficult to get around.

Simply spamming his fair or f-tilt properly is a brick wall.

Short hopping towards your opponent and bairing is a brick wall.

Dash attacking / shield grabbing upon landing is a brick wall.

Camping the ledge / running away and shooting lasers / gyros is a brick wall.

Bad players always lose to "brick wall" strategies. Always. That's why you could camp the ledge with Fox and just b-throw to shine against bad players and win in 30 seconds. It was easy for you to do, and the opponent hadn't become used to the idea yet. It was hard for us too at first, but after we learned the game better, we could get around it.

Currently, brick walls will work on 95% of the community hands down. I've won several matches simply by throwing out brick wall after brick wall and never actually having to fight. The advantage to these strategies is that they force your opponent to rely upon past experience, and YOU are in control as to when they stop and start.

I can run away and laser all day, and once I feel my opponent has figured it out I can start camping with fairs or short hopping towards them and bairing. These simple strategies make it easy for me to change my playstyle in enormous ways, and are terrifying to the unexperience opponent. Use these against players in tournaments that seem to be "naturally" better than you, and they may very well fall apart.

Find one you are good at, and always start off matches agaisnt new opponents with it until they figure it out. When they DO figure it out, you've already noticed and are now playing "for real" and they have to figure you out all over again while you know everything about them.

 

[bajisci]

ah man that is some great advice! thanks so much

 

[DRaGZ]

OS, I would like to play with you and learn from you, but you are so far awayyyy...

 

[clowsui]

OS,

I have not fought any good ROBs yet but I've gotten ***** by one pretty hard >_>;

Advice as Falco vs. ROB? Or should I switch to Marth, TL, Ike or Luigi (the other 4 characters I can play decent)?

 

[Overswarm]

OS,

I have not fought any good ROBs yet but I've gotten ***** by one pretty hard >_>;

Advice as Falco vs. ROB? Or should I switch to Marth, TL, Ike or Luigi (the other 4 characters I can play decent)?

For Falco vs. ROB....

I would suggest using your blaster as often as possible. Get in the habit of throwing out your shine or simply standing blasters after landing; your goal is to rack up a lot of damage on ROB.

It is VERY important to stay away from the edge. ROB will destroy you in this fashion due to your awful recovery; all he has to do is throw you and then hit you with a weak laser and you are forced to up+B! This means he can hit you out of it, and can easily kill you.

Your grab game is going to be pretty good, and your damage dealing is going to be good, so focus on those two aspects.

Your bair has no landing lag, so throw that out when you are in close proximity to ROB until you can hit him and start up your lasers again.

A good ROB will often bide his time, powershielding lasers until he has a full laser. If he attempts this, give him a reason to approach. Start doing standing blasters to make it more difficult for powershielding, or move a bit close then blaster, etc., etc. You want ROB to be aggressive; one powerful laser hitting you at medium % gets you off the edge, and then it is **** time.

Your shine is amazing at messing up ROB's spacing, so don't be afraid to throw it out.

Your main KO move will be your d-smash, your damage dealing moves will be your jab, bair, and blaster. Your forward air will be good to use if he is spamming spot dodge, but it has landing lag to be frugal with it.

Your main goal is to make HIS spam game harder than yours so he has to approach YOU. When in close, you can have the advantage with your superior grab game and excellent bair pressure.

ROB has a lot of ways around your blaster spam, including simply hanging onto the ledge. Every 20 seconds he becomes dangerous at long range if you make the slightest mistake, so if he does that you've got a whole new ball game ahead of you. If this occurs, you have to pressure HIM. You can do this by simply doing standing blasters until he gets up and hopefully hitting him once or twice, or by getting near the edge until you can run off and bair or dair him from the stage.

It's a hard matchup for Falco when ROB won't approach, since Falco doesn't have much of an approach against a ROB that can powershield his lasers.

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

Fear ROB's Utilt...

 

[clowsui]

...regarding your sig, did Sliq give up on G-Dorf or does he main Ike? Also I thought Kel was still maining Marth >_>;

Idk, I'll just see you guys at the next Cincy tournament that I can go to. Which is none of the ones at Gamecity b/c it's on a Tuesday and I have school on Tuesday, given that I go to HS >_>;

 

[Overswarm]

Fear ROB's Utilt...

Especially the "soft hit". You can follow that up with an angled forward tilt against many characters, which can then be followed up by a running u-smash or a grab.

ROB has so many combos when done right.

 

[DRaGZ]

OS: Are you using your c-stick for d-smashes or are you just taking advantage of the buffer system? I just can't seem to get them out fast enough out of a sidestep.

Also, are you using your c-stick for doing airs?

Basically...what are you doing with your c-stick? Lol.

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

Generally it is impossible to do certain "moves" in SSB without using your control stick to jump and your C-stick to perform aerials.. your fingers cannot physically move fast enough without using the C-stick.. its how you do double SH'd aerials n' such...

 

[Overswarm]

OS: Are you using your c-stick for d-smashes or are you just taking advantage of the buffer system? I just can't seem to get them out fast enough out of a sidestep.

Also, are you using your c-stick for doing airs?

Basically...what are you doing with your c-stick? Lol.

I use the c-stick for just about everything. Even tilts, some of the time. o_O

 

[nomnomnom]

How do you do tilts with the cstick?