"Revival of DGames" Mafia

[#HBC | Ryker]

Interesting exercise. Alex, who IS scum on a Ruy scum flip?

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

Interesting exercise. Alex, who IS scum on a Ruy scum flip?

Hilariously, I did consider J just a moment ago as this whole "Yeh Ruy's weirding me out with the buddying" thing could just be an extended distancing attempt but I honestly think that's unlikely.

Outside of that, I would've had Gheb and Rake fairly high on that list before today. Both were pretty instrumental in the Ruy lynch going nowhere yesterday. Now I think it's next to impossible that Rake is scum with Ruy (unless similar shenanigans I just outlined are occurring in that scenario) and Gheb flipped town. The Ruy lynch not happening would probably be my first place to look.

Like I said, I've put little thought into this. I don't see the point in drawing an extended map of who could be scum with who before I have a scumflip in hand. That's putting the cart before the horse in my eyes.

Do you agree on Rake not being a partner for Ruy in the event that Ruy flips scum?

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

Okay, being quick.

At least one of Ruy and Rake is town.

One of them is probably scum.

However, IF both of them are town, then we are absolutely ****ed if we lynch wrong on both of them. Assuming three mafia, that means we'd be down 6/13 players (given no correct protects or roleblocked nkills or any other such shenanigans). That leaves us with a best case scenario 4 vs 3 LyLo on Day 4. No thanks.

At the moment, I definitely want to lynch within Ruy and Rake. However, I do NOT want to be wrong. Right now I'm leaning on Rake because his entrance today is opportunistic and I think Ruy looks a lot better than apparently anyone else in the thread does.

Nvm you answered me and I missed it due to the new page.

Legitimately, I don't want to answer this before Rake shows up. I want to see what information he has first before I say which is more likely to be scum, but I'm legitimately scared to lynch in this direction right now as I do think there's a high enough chance of both flipping town that we shouldn't just automatically do it.

Let me ask you something completely unrelated. What do you think of Kantrip as I have seen nothing from him.

Honestly I gave him a pass when he first showed up in the thread but his extended absences are starting to worry me.

 

[Maven89]

I think the last full game I was in Rake tried to NK Gheb, it didn't work, so when the day started Rake role claimed and said since Gheb survived Gheb must be scum or indi and voted him.

I guess now that I'm typing it out there's not much similarities except that they both involve Rake coming in to full on push someone based on minor points that occur during the night, but that alone made me read it normally from him.

I actually think scum lies between J and Ryu, and that they're not partners.

 

[Maven89]

@#HBC | Ryker is your Rake read based solely on today or are there other points you have?

 

[Fandangox]

Honestly I put him very low on the priority list and stopped giving his posts more than a cursory glance since the early stages of the game. I had him as a townlean then but I do think between you and Ryker there's enough to make me believe that he's worth a second look.

He just sort of reminds me of that one dude from Fire vs Lighting 2 that no one had in their radar, pretty much spent all game unnoticed, and ended up winning the game for mafia as the last scum. Forgot his name, but he had a korra avatar.

I am just looking at SPAK's play all game, and aside from the confession about him explaining his maven vote after being pressured, there's nothing else I like there.

I mean we are all essentially either giving the slot a pass or town leaning on him entirely on gut. i do agree he is probably not priority right now.

Probably not. I think there's enough WIFOM involved to say that it's not 100% clear (as this could be a steady dose of distancing right from the start) but their alignment at this point is based moreso on individual play, not connections. I'm not too worried about those before I have a scumflip in my hand anyway.

That's the thing though, Ryu didn't distance from J, as I said before, he was the only one to actually like J's content D1, everyone else either just shrugged it off as J's usual meta, or disliked it outright. It was then that WATT pointed out Ryu's lack of "backbone" and him defending J day 1 would mean that if one is scum, the other isn't, and Gheb agreed. Although I ultimately agree its their play that matters, I just think its worth hearing everyone's opinion on this matter.

 

[Maven89]

I think the last full game I was in Rake tried to NK Gheb, it didn't work, so when the day started Rake role claimed and said since Gheb survived Gheb must be scum or indi and voted him.

I guess now that I'm typing it out there's not much similarities except that they both involve Rake coming in to full on push someone based on minor points that occur during the night, but that alone made me read it normally from him.

I actually think scum lies between J and Ryu, and that they're not partners.

To clarify, Rake was a one-shot vig and town

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

@ Fandangox

Give me a full explanation as to why you dislike Spak. I'll fact-check it later.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

@#HBC | Ryker is your Rake read based solely on today or are there other points you have?

That and, in conjunction with it, the hammer seems extremely convenient.

The major thing I have to add from yesterday is that, even where I am in my reread, I see a whole bunch of people calling Rake town for no reason. He's posting a lot, but it's Rake, so the most you can extract from that is that his heart is still beating. His posts and lines of pursuit all looked bad to me. I don't like the early Wot push from any angle and other than that, he wasn't accomplishing anything with his badgering. However, all that is simply pointing out that I had him at null before this instead of town.

 

[Fandangox]

@ Fandangox

Give me a full explanation as to why you dislike Spak. I'll fact-check it later.

Mainly this, which I said past page:

If you look at SPAK's content you will see there's NOTHING valuable there, a lot of "me too!", generating content and trying to look active, while voicing some opinions that generally don't seem to move the game anywhere. Unlike J though I am still not sure what to make of the slot, can't tell if he is geninuily trying to play the game and help, but its just new to this, or if he is somehow taking advantage if people looking at him like that. I also really dislike him starting D2 basically saying he was going to push the now dead slot, that is a pretty good summary of his entire play this game.

That and the fact that his prodding of Maven D1 looked like him trying to get the attention off him, not to mention he has no push against anyone yet, except claiming that he was going to push Gheb this phase, but doesn't have to since he is dead now.

 

[#HBC | J]

Heya there, just wanted to let ya'll know I'm gonna be V/LA today and tomorrow. I'll be back on Wednesday maybe tomorrow night.

 

[Fandangox]

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Alright, I am probably gonna take a mafia break for a little bit and come back around tomorrow. On Tuesday I probably won't be here because I flying back to CO and will be drained af.

I'm going to keep playing with some reads currently in my mind. I'm almost to the end of D1.

Lookin like ya boy Ryker.

 

[Maven89]

Heya there, just wanted to let ya'll know I'm gonna be V/LA today and tomorrow. I'll be back on Wednesday maybe tomorrow night.

 

[#HBC | J]

*shrug*

I wanna spend my last day in MD with family and friends and not to a computer screen.

 

[Kantrip]

Inversely, I am here now. Just on my phone from work, should be able to post later this evening.

 

[Kantrip]

People are blowing the Ryu Rake thing way out of proportion. I think it's pretty clear what happened based on Rake hammering Rosalina and what Rosalina flipped but I'll let Maven continue his inquiry and Rake answer to questions hanging around.

 

[Spak]

Mainly this, which I said past page:



That and the fact that his prodding of Maven D1 looked like him trying to get the attention off him, not to mention he has no push against anyone yet, except claiming that he was going to push Gheb this phase, but doesn't have to since he is dead now.

I admitted trying to avert attention from myself early-game and the reason I would have questioned Gheb was because of the Rosie flip. He was the main reason the Rosie lynch happened, and since she flipped town, I thought that he deserved some pusing. Being quite honest, I went about that mentality (listing the people who joined the Rosie wagon) until J poined out that everyone could get away with the exact same reasoning.

 

[Fandangox]

I admitted trying to avert attention from myself early-game and the reason I would have questioned Gheb was because of the Rosie flip. He was the main reason the Rosie lynch happened, and since she flipped town, I thought that he deserved some pusing. Being quite honest, I went about that mentality (listing the people who joined the Rosie wagon) until J poined out that everyone could get away with the exact same reasoning.

Admitting it doesn't give you a free pass. Secondly you are looking at it wrong, just because someone flips town it doesn't mean whoever started the wagon is scum, you were right in trying to question him, but after what Gheb said it looked to me like he was trying to set up a bait with an "easy lynch" to see what justifications people had for getting on a easy wagon.

That said, he is dead now, so you can't question him, I brought that up because you haven't pushed anybody so I found it pretty convenient that the person you said you would push is someone who got NK.

Who do you think is scum and why Spak?

 

[Spak]

Admitting it doesn't give you a free pass. Secondly you are looking at it wrong, just because someone flips town it doesn't mean whoever started the wagon is scum, you were right in trying to question him, but after what Gheb said it looked to me like he was trying to set up a bait with an "easy lynch" to see what justifications people had for getting on a easy wagon.

Pushing someone != thinking they're scum. I never said that Gheb was scum (and certainly not because he started the wagon), but pushing a lynch as hard as he did seemed a bit suspicious.

That said, he is dead now, so you can't question him

Duh.

I brought that up because you haven't pushed anybody so I found it pretty convenient that the person you said you would push is someone who got NK.

I haven't had as much reason to question someone. Gheb seemed like one of the first obvious pushes that someone hasn't jumped on before I have.

Who do you think is scum and why Spak?[/quote]
Honestly, after I have reread D1, Maven seems a bit less scummy. I've liked J's D2 play thus far (although it seems like I might not see any for another little while), but not enough to bring him to a town read because of his play on D1. Honestly, I think that Ryu is my biggest consideration for scum now that I've re-read the thread, but honestly it depends upon what Rake has to say about the phone conversation.

 

[Fandangox]

Pushing someone != thinking they're scum. I never said that Gheb was scum (and certainly not because he started the wagon), but pushing a lynch as hard as he did seemed a bit suspicious.

Fair enough.

I haven't had as much reason to question someone. Gheb seemed like one of the first obvious pushes that someone hasn't jumped on before I have.

Who do you think is scum and why Spak?

Honestly, after I have reread D1, Maven seems a bit less scummy. I've liked J's D2 play thus far (although it seems like I might not see any for another little while), but not enough to bring him to a town read because of his play on D1. Honestly, I think that Ryu is my biggest consideration for scum now that I've re-read the thread, but honestly it depends upon what Rake has to say about the phone conversation.[/quote]

Yeah, but why? What did you like so far about J's D2 play? What about Ryu do you think is scummy?

 

[Maven89]

but honestly it depends upon what Rake has to say about the phone conversation.

What specifically are you looking for in Rake's post and how would it effect your read?

 

[Maven89]

oh i didn't realize fandango-ate-my-baby posted again

 

[Fandangox]

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Spak whats your opinion on kantrip and fan?

 

[Spak]

Yeah, but why? What did you like so far about J's D2 play? What about Ryu do you think is scummy?

J seems to have done a lot of scumhunting in the past 6 pages, a considerable amount more than he did during D1 based on the fact that only a day has passed since Rosa and Gheb were killed. This is either the self-proclaimed "not being good at D1" or the self-proclaimed "not being good at D1" is a chance to make amends and for him to re-start with a more believable playstyle D2. Which one of these is true I don't know, but it should be more evident to those of you who have played with J consistently before.

Ryu isn't too much more scummy than he was before (unless Rake's side of the phone story differs from Ryu's), so the main reason that I'm focusing my scum lean read on Ryu more than before is because my other two main scum suspects (J and Maven) have gone back to a near-null read (if the D1-D2 difference is consistent with his playstyle) and a slight town lean. If you want to see my reasoning on Ryu's possible scummyness, go back to one of my earlier posts where I said I was conflicted on Ryu all game.

So @ anyone who has played a good number of games with J before, is the D1-D2 difference as significant as evidenced here?

 

[Spak]

Spak whats your opinion on kantrip and fan?

I haven't seen enough of Kantrip to state a certain read on him yet, and I like Fanny because he seems to be trying to pressure mostly everyone when something odd catches his eye. I haven't seen Fanny give any empty pushes or abandon a lead or give up a push prematurely.

 

[Spak]

*Merge the first and third statements listed in the last sentence. The combination of those is what I mean.

 

[Spak]

Hopefully I can get more of a read on Kantrip tonight since he said he'd be posting.

 

[Fandangox]

J seems to have done a lot of scumhunting in the past 6 pages, a considerable amount more than he did during D1 based on the fact that only a day has passed since Rosa and Gheb were killed. This is either the self-proclaimed "not being good at D1" or the self-proclaimed "not being good at D1" is a chance to make amends and for him to re-start with a more believable playstyle D2. Which one of these is true I don't know, but it should be more evident to those of you who have played with J consistently before.

Ryu isn't too much more scummy than he was before (unless Rake's side of the phone story differs from Ryu's), so the main reason that I'm focusing my scum lean read on Ryu more than before is because my other two main scum suspects (J and Maven) have gone back to a near-null read (if the D1-D2 difference is consistent with his playstyle) and a slight town lean. If you want to see my reasoning on Ryu's possible scummyness, go back to one of my earlier posts where I said I was conflicted on Ryu all game.

So @ anyone who has played a good number of games with J before, is the D1-D2 difference as significant as evidenced here?

This still doesn't tell me what you dislike about Ryu. What about his play makes you think its scummy? Also what do you think about J voting Maven yesterday without explaining why, saying D2 he thinks is scummy (without elaborating) and what do you make on his push on Dancer?

 

[Spak]

This still doesn't tell me what you dislike about Ryu. What about his play makes you think its scummy? Also what do you think about J voting Maven yesterday without explaining why, saying D2 he thinks is scummy (without elaborating) and what do you make on his push on Dancer?

Here is a link to the post I was talking about. The whole phone thing popped up and started to be dug into after this post happened, so this was only a summery of D1 Ryu. Other than that, I've gotten a gut feeling on Ryu that he might be scum, but that isn't any real evidence. We can wait until tomorrow and see if the phone being stolen is real (based on either getting an item from hammer (like Ryu did) or Rake calling it tomorrow night and see who picks up) and who stole it, but the whole situation just seems a bit wacky.

I was willing to consider J voting Maven D1 to ensure all lynch pressure was off his back, but I think that he should be questioned on why he thinks Mav is scummy today. To be honest, his push on Dancer seems a bit silly to me because Dancer is a pretty large town lean for me. He seems a bit desperate for content, but we'll see if that push actually yields anything sooner or later.

 

[Fandangox]

But that post doesn't mention anything about Ryu's play, you only mention the phone call with him and Rake.

What about Ryu's play in specific you find scummy? I can agree on the second part, it doesn't seem to me like J's push on Dancer is very genuine.

 

[Spak]

But that post doesn't mention anything about Ryu's play, you only mention the phone call with him and Rake.

What about Ryu's play in specific you find scummy?

Mostly the

"I frankly think that his reasoning of "wanting to talk to me more" was a bit dumb because a majority of his questions I had already answered"

from the post that I linked. He stayed on me a LONG time, but that is either a really dumb scummy thing to do or a guy that didn't read the thread. I don't like it when people ask questions that I need to type out answers to and waste my time because they didn't feel like reading the thread, especially to make it look like they were contributing more content then they actually were. I read that whole situation as scummy, but because Maven and J were at the same level, I wasn't focusing on one of them in particular.

 

[Fandangox]

Mostly the from the post that I linked. He stayed on me a LONG time, but that is either a really dumb scummy thing to do or a guy that didn't read the thread. I don't like it when people ask questions that I need to type out answers to and waste my time because they didn't feel like reading the thread, especially to make it look like they were contributing more content then they actually were. I read that whole situation as scummy, but because Maven and J were at the same level, I wasn't focusing on one of them in particular.

Alright so you think Ryu is scummy because he seemed to be forcing a push and trying to generate content to not get lynched. Are you saying with your last sentence that you find Maven and J scummy for the same reasons?

 

[Spak]

Alright so you think Ryu is scummy because he seemed to be forcing a push and trying to generate content to not get lynched. Are you saying with your last sentence that you find Maven and J scummy for the same reasons?

I think Ryu is scummy because he pushed me for an unneededly long time (presumably to try and pressure me further), didn't read the thread, his appearing to "generate" content by questioning me on things that had mostly been answered, and a gut feeling. He wasn't even in danger of being lynched at the point I was talking about.

I'm saying with my last sentence that at the time this happened, J and Maven were close to the top of my scum list so I didn't push him further because I had three people to spread my focus over. Since then, however, they have gone down on my priority list (but the Dancer push does seem a little fishy, so J may be back in focus relatively soon).

 

[Fandangox]

Why did you find Maven scummy back then?

 

[Spak]

Why did you find Maven scummy back then?

I initially found Maven non-scummy (I think I had him as a town lean in the first list I made), but then by the end of D1, I thought Maven was scum because of falsifying votes (which I ended up getting the count wrong anyways so I didn't hold him on that because it could have been purely by mistake) and lying about what Gheb had said about J in order to push harder. He put J under more pressure than he would have if he hadn't falsified Gheb's intents, and that seemed a bit scummy to me back then. As it turns out he did it by accident (or at least claimed to), but it still left a bad taste in my mouth.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Kaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaantrip.

Raaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaake.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Pri sure rake just went to bed for the night lol

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Pri sure rake just went to bed for the night lol

was about to post a mad lucario pic but for Ryker's sake.

LucarioMad.png instead.