Rate And Discuss Their Chances: Closed

[jigglover]

Pac-Man World 1, 2, & 3 (punching, ground pound, pseudo spin dash also, and he also had a lightning bolt ability)

He had a slingshot in a game also.

I've never even heard of that series.
You've just made his 4 specials and a final smash (in no particular order), you should be Sakurai!

 

[Onyx Oblivian]

I would quote Spyder Enzo's argument like others have done on this page but I'm afraid others trying to read this page would get frustrated

But these [Spyder's post] are basically my thoughts and sentiments exactly. He basically summed up about everything I could say to defend BF. haha

Has it been added to the thread? It should be added.

 

[Deleted member]

Honestly, the main problem I have in believing Balloon Fighter has a big shot is not the idea that Sakurai can't figure how to make him work, since he clearly CAN (given Olimar). It's that he had to make up an excuse. That tells me he doesn't seriously care about making him playable.
Balloon Fighter is "useless when balloons pop"? He can use a pump. Also Olimar is useless without his Pikmin.
Bubbles "doesn't know how to fight"? She shoots shockwaves and rams into people. Also, R.O.B. was just a peripheral and was made a fighter.
Excitebiker would require "ramps to be built on every stage"? So what, that implies he can't jump? And this is the same guy that made the Wheelie and later the Roader, who can jump?
Urban Champion "doesn't put out much"? This would be somewhat legitimate reasoning, given that all he is is a typical street brawler, which would be uninteresting, but then again, Sakurai turned a future racecar driver into a flaming Kamen Rider. Something could, theoretically, be done for the Urban Champion as well.

Seriously, these excuses obviously show he doesn't care for them, and just had to give reasonings for why he didn't choose them over the Ice Climbers over the true reasonings such as "I wanted a unique two-in-one gimmick these characters couldn't offer" or "I don't care for them".

And no, it's not hypocritical to believe Ridley has a shot in this case, because Sakurai didn't give reasons WHY Ridley would have been "pretty impossible" for Brawl, half-***** or otherwise, and quickly backtracked into saying that Ridley could work, but would be slow. If anything it was probably that he didn't even THINK about Ridley being playable until it was brought up.

 

[jigglover]

To me, it sounds like Sakurai was just making up a reason for Ridley in brawl, but in actual fact he doesn't care for him.

 

[Deleted member]

Now you're just being a smartass about what I said.

 

[jigglover]

Pretty much, although it did the job and made the comment redundant (or the last paragraph at least).

 

[Deleted member]

No, it didn't, as the situation is completely different.

Sakurai didn't make up an excuse for Ridley, just that he felt he would have been "pretty impossible", while backtracking his statement by saying it can work.
He did not do so with the four I mentioned. He gave a flawed excuse for each as to why the Ice Climbers were better suited.

Next time you try to be a smartass, actually think about what you're saying, or it makes you a ******* instead.

 

[---]

The fact that he backtracked on what he was saying means that he himself wasn't sure (which doesn't mean that he could work, nor that he's been ruled out), obviously meaning that Ridley was a fan-favorite character who's popularity he was obvious to. Either way, as Oasis would say on the Ridley thread, the important thing is that he's now been brought to Sakurai's direct attention.

BTW with Balloon Fighter, as to what Golden was saying, he's a link to where he said it.

 

[Deleted member]

Nothing against Ridley... I'm expecting him. I just hate when Ridley supporters bash the Balloon fighter because of a dumb comment that Sakurai made. Pretty hypocritical if you ask me.

Well, you're not dealing with a Ridley supporter anyway. I think he has a good chance, but I don't think he's the shoe-in many people think he is (inb4 Ridley debate).

Don't forget that Sakurai also dismissed Ridley... and yet look at his massive support. People may say "Well, at least Sakurai acknowledged that Ridley could work if they really wanted him to", but how exactly do you know they want him too? People use that argument against Balloon Fighter all the time. "How do you know Sakurai changed his mind?" I could ask you the same question about Ridley. Furthermore, the "reasons" for Sakurai dismissing Balloon Fighter seemed more like a reason to pick Ice Climbers over them, not a reason to completely dismiss the character, making sure he will never EVER be playable EVER.

Ridley and Balloon Fighter are both in different situation primarily for how Sakurai commented to them:

The way Sakurai approached commenting on Ridley seems to indicate that he didn't put much thought into Ridley being playable (especially given that Sakurai back tracked on Ridley being "impossible"). With him likely now aware of Ridley's massive popularity, Sakurai will be putting much more thought into Ridley being playable. Which is why I feel Ridley's chances are now.

I would say that Balloon Fighter had more consideration for inclusion than did Ridley, given that he was one of the retros considered. Given this, I would say that the fact they were dumped despite being considered already puts him in a worse situation than Ridley.

Also, if it was a matter of Ice Climbers getting priority over Balloon Fighter, then explain why Mr. Game & Watch, Pit, and R.O.B. got in over Balloon Fighter.

These people think that Sakurai had contemplated the thought for endless nights before coming to the conclusion that the Balloon Fighter is a completely and totally unfeasible character that will never ever EVER be playable or even considered... EVER.

Perhaps not to that extreme, but we both know Sakurai takes character selection very seriously. As far as I'm concern, when a character is dumped, it is much harder to be able to prove itself worthy of a spot in Sakurai's eyes. I highly doubt Sakurai gave all the reasons he rejected Balloon Fighter with that one comment and I do think he did put in some serious thought into adding him before opting for Ice Climbers and Mr. Game & Watch instead.

I think Balloon Fighter has more going for him than any other retro character. He's pretty dang popular by retro character standards, he was at least considered by Sakurai at one point, and Sakurai has acknowledged his popularity before, mentioning that he tied with the Ice Climbers in the Melee poll.

Popularity pre-Melee should be taken very lightly. The only way that pre-Melee popularity should be taken seriously is if the character has been relatively popularly requested for a very long time (Toad, Mega Man) and still hasn't gotten in. Balloon Fighter has never been a really popular request and for SSB4, Lip and Takamaru has him beat if we're going by Shortie's 2011 and early 2012 polls (the late 2012 poll did not get nearly enough results to form an accurate opinion).

We'll continue this in the Roster General Discussion thread. No need to clog up this thread with Balloon fights (pun intended).

This day is long overdue for a new one. Ending day now.

 

[Deleted member]

Flavor later (still need to do one for the previous day as well, I'll try to get to it tomorrow afternoon).

Balloon Fighter gets a 2.23 in likelihood and a 3.32 in want. Sol Diviner wins five extra nominations.

Day Fifty-Five has began! Today, you will rate Sonic and predict what Snake gets tomorrow. Bowser Jr. is eligible for re-nominations.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

Sonic (Want) - 5
Sonic (Likelihood) - 4.25

I think Sonic should stay, despite the fact that he is a third party character. This is because he has had quite a fair amount of games on Nintendo consoles, and also because he is one of the most well-known video game mascots ever, and deserves a playable spot in a game that's all about video game all-stars battling it out (even if the focus is primarily Nintendo all-stars).

As far as likelihood goes, I'd say Sonic has a far better chance of staying than he does of being cut. His popularity helps, and so does the fact that he is already an established character within the Smash series. The only reason he didn't get a full 5 is because third parties are really tricky... we have no idea if Sakurai plans on keeping them, or cutting them to make room for NINTENDO newcomers.


Snake (Prediction) - 4.05

 

[Claire Diviner]

Sonic...

Want: 4.0 - Sonic's inclusion was a pleasant surprise, and let's face it, who wouldn't want to see Sonic vs. Mario again? At this point, Nintendo should keep Sonic in, simply because of the significance Sonic has had on Nintendo; he may not be a Nintendo character, but he has helped shaped Nintendo during the 16-bit wars. Suffice it to say, I want Sonic to stay. My reason for not giving a 5 for want is because there are a couple of other Sega characters I wouldn't mind seeing either.

Likelihood: 4.0 - Assuming 3rd parties are a returning trend for Smash 4, it's rather likely Sega would want their flagship character to duke it out with Nintendo's flagship character (Mario). My reason for not giving a full 5 is because we don't know for absolute certainty that 3rd parties will make appearances in Smash 4, and with the advent of Bayonetta 2, Sega just might (and I stress the word, "might") opt to try and rep Bayonetta over their blue hedgehog, as unlikely as that sounds.

Prediction for Snake: 3.87

I nominate KOS-MOS x5

 

[DMurr]

I personally feel that the guest characters should only be in for one game to make way for other guest characters. I don't really mind either way though. I've never been a big Donic fan but I recognize his popularity. I like Snake also even if I haven't played any of his games. It seems like Sakurai liked them, according to that quote. So we will probably see him and Snake back.

So, Sonic:
Want: 1.5
Likeliness: 3.75

Nominate:
Idk. Tetra x5?

 

[Deleted member]

Sonic:
Want: 5
I don't want any cuts, especially not my most anticipated character after Wario.

Likelihood: 4.5
I really doubt Sonic is going anywhere. People have to realize this isn't Soul Calibur, and guests in other games have reasoning for their absence in later titles that typically involve either liscensing or platform issues. As long as Sonic remains in the spotlight, as long as Mario & Sonic keep churning out Olympics, and as long as Sega loves money, Sonic will stay.

 

[Ember Reaper]

Want: 5
Likelihood: 4.75

I don't want cuts.
There's no reason to take him out, and people (for the most part) enjoyed having him there.


Edit: Forgot to nominate
Nom: Meta Knight X5

 

[SmashShadow]

want:5 my main
likelihood: 4.45
Could be another Mewtwo situation, maybe worse if he was cut.

5x Vaati

Snake: 4.25

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Sonic, I give a likelihood of 4. As of now, it remains uncertain that 3rd parties will be used again, but if they do come back, Sonic would easily be the most considered, especially when taking into account the Mario & Sonic crossovers.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Personally, I would prefer Sonic to not re-appear as well as Snake. I know that sounds crazy since most people are against cuts. However, I see the two as guest characters and shouldn't be given continuous veteran status since they are only guests. A lot of people liked SSBB because of Snake and Sonic (or hated them) hence why they should remain in SSBB. If you want to play as Mewtwo, Roy, or the Doc, play Melee. If you want to play as Sonic or Snake, play Brawl. It gives a reason for Brawl to stand out. However, will Sonic re-appear? Most likely. He has a good chance since Nintendo and Sega has been working together as of late so Sonic make a return appearance wouldn't be too unlikely. It depends entirely on what Sakurai, Nintendo, and Sega feel like doing. He definitely has the demand though. I wouldn't call him a lock though. However, I believe he has a better chance than Snake does.

For Sonic;

Want: 3.80 - Yes I am that guy.
Likeliness: 4.2

Snake's Prediction: 4.1

Noms:

M. Bison x5

 

[---]

Want: 5
Likeliness: 2.75

Normally I'd give the higher ranking 3rd parties 2.5, but since they're vets I'll give them 2.75. Why? Because they're 3rd party, who knows what the heck will happen. I'll probably end up giving Snake this same score too.

 

[Pichu4SSB4]

Want: 5
No cuts, please.

Likelihood: 4.50

Tough Sonic is a 3rd party, Sega still has a good connection with Nintendo so i doubt he's going anywhere.

Snake Prediction: 3.99

There's talk about that he might be a character in PS All Stars, but then again there is a possibility that he might star in both games.

Noms: ichu: x2 Toon Zelda x2 Bayonetta x1

 

[Onyx Oblivian]

Want: 5
I was one of those overly excited people when he was announced. Haha before my N64, I had a Sega Genesis so Sonic was my childhood. I always clumped him along with Nintendo characters in my mind. So I don't view him as a "guest". I hope hes here to stay.

Likelihood: 4.8
He fits in way too well to be considered a "guest" character. I think if licensing isn't an issue, Sonic will definitely be back.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Want: 5
My most wanted character for Brawl, and one of my favorite video game characters in general. He fits in well and was the most popular choice for Brawl. Oh, and no cuts either.

Likelihood: 4
I'm not entirely convinced that he will return, but I thought of that article in which Sakurai acknowledges the positive feedback to both Sonic and Snake, and said that they are not going to include as many this time. This makes me think that Snake and Sonic shall return, along with maybe one 3rd party rep. But those are probably just my thoughts.

Prediction for Snake: 4.25

 

[N3ON]

Want: 5
Oh gawd I wanted him so much for Brawl, and when he got in... I stopped caring as much.
Still, I'd hate to see him go, he really feels like he "belongs" in Smash, even though he's 3rd party. Also, no cuts.

Likelihood: 4.5
Considering the amount of hype and popularity he contributed to Brawl, along with the fact that Nintendo and Sega still seem to be getting along well and collaborating, I'd say his chances (for a 3rd party) were very good, bar some decision from Sakurai not to include him and Snake again, though I doubt that will happen.

Nomz:
x5 Lip

 

[BKupa666]

Want and Likelihood: 5

People seem to obligatorily vote down third parties because they're third parties. Now, I could see this as valid reasoning for Snake, or even Mega Man in a stretch, but there is literally no chance Sonic does not come back. This is the character that was so popular, he bumped out two veterans so he could be developed, and who very possibly resulted in the game being delayed. Couple that with Sakurai going out of his way to declare Snake and Sonic's addition a success, in addition to Sega's continued partnership with Nintendo, and we have a third-party shoo-in.

Predicting 4.12 for Snake
Nominate Hades x3, Groose x2

 

[Opossum]

Sawnik

Want: 5

No cuts

Likelihood: 4.12

Third party, so who knows. However, due to his connections, I think he'll likely stay.

Predicting a 4.3 for Snake.

x5 Meta Knight.

 

[Jhonnykiller45]

SANIC HEGEHOG:
Want- 3
Likelihood- 4.5

What everyone has said, yadda yadda.

Prediction for Snake- 4.5

 

[Deleted member]

I feel as though I have to defend Snake a little here, as it seems people think he's more likely to be cut since he didn't "fit" as well as Sonic.

You are all aware that Snake was a creator request, right? And it worked because the creator is friends with Sakurai? So why would Sakurai keep Sonic for the fans, but remove Snake? It'd be sticking a middle finger to Kojima, who tried to get Snake in Smash since Melee.
So it's a package deal. Either they will both stay, or they will both be removed.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

I personally feel that the guest characters should only be in for one game to make way for other guest characters, especially Mega Man. As much as I love Sonic, I would rather want to see him in a whole Sonic new game instead of yet another crossover. The whole Mario vs. Sonic charade is the main driving point to those who want his return and its really up to Sega to decide whether he should return or not.

Want: 1.5
Likeliness: 2.5

Nominate:
Medusa x5

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I give sonic a 5/5

He's comin' back

There ARE some returning characters I'd give less than a 5 to, just not Ness, ROB or Sonic

 

[Deleted member]

I'm giving Sonic a 5 in want. He is after all, my main.

For quite awhile I was in doubt of his return mainly because of his third-party status and their history of not coming back. However, Sakurai seems to view the experience as a positive one and I don't think he would want Sonic and Snake to go. That's not to say they don't have a chance of being cut, but odds are he'll be back. He gets a 4 in likelihood.

 

[shrooby]

Want: 5
Honestly, I really don't like Sonic, but I'd be going against my "philosophy" so to speak, if I said that I want a completely unique character to be cut, which I don't. That and I know his inclusion made a lot of fans happy, so I'm not gonna be a jerk and say that he shouldn't be in.
I'm still a little shaky on the 3rd parties. I do see both Snake and Sonic returning to be more likely than not, but there's still that chance with them in my opinion. Likeliness: 4.8

Prediction: 4.17

Nominations:
Tingle x2
Pac Man x2
Dr Mario (alt costume) x1

 

[deuxhero]

Want: 4.5: While I was a PC player in my youth, I still respect that Mario and Sonic were still rivals and emblematic of the console wars.
Likeyhood: 4: Sonic is on the short list of vets not guaranteed (because he is a third party), but he was such a popular choice I doubt he will vanish

Nominate: Lucina x5

 

[Sqid]

Sonic.
Want: 5
Gotta go fast!
Likelihood: 4.5
Looks like Sonic and Snake + 1 for 4. Cool.

Prediction for Snake: 4.19

Nominations: 5x Isaac (Revote)

 

[SmasherMaster]

Sonic
Want: 5
NO CUTS
Likelihood: 5

Snake Predictions: 4.87

Nominations:
Bandana Dee (x5)

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Nominate dry bowser costume x3

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Want: 5

Geez, I think my head went totally asplode when he was announced. It perfected Brawl for me. Sadly when I got to try him, he didn't feel as cool as I thought him to be. Luckily Project M fixed him up.

Likeliness: 4.8

He's bound to return, since Nintendo and Sega's still getting quite well along (I mean, Mario even himself stated lately that Sonic's not his enemy, his just an archrival). Besides I'd want to see the blue blur being made better than his Brawl incarnation. (-l<>l-);;

Predicting Snake to get 3.9

Noms:

x5 Lip

 

[Deleted member]

I have got to try to end this day before I go to work this afternoon...

 

[jigglover]

Oh wow, I'm late for this day, but I find it interesting that there is not one prediction for the other third-party in brawl with a bigger score than what they give sonic. God, tomorrow's gonna be interesting. Anyway...
Want: 3.5 Personally, I don't like how Nintendo and Sega are friends now. They were by far the biggest rivals back in the days and now Sega isn't even producing any consoles, only games, most of which on their used-to-be arch-nemesis' console.
Likelihood: 4.14 Most probably low in priority for SSB4 and I think is the most likely cut for brawl, but I could be wrong.
Prediction: 4.26

 

[Genericmartini]

I've stated numorous amounts of times, no cuts.
Want:5

Sonic I feel is one whose a syntch to be in, hell I think he will be a starter this year. but there's that bit of me that thinks that Sakurai doesn't feel the same.
Likelihood: 4.91

Edit: Forgot nominations(as usual)
Travis Touchdown x2
Adam Malkovich x3

 

[Spydr Enzo]

Personally, I don't like how Nintendo and Sega are friends now. They were by far the biggest rivals back in the days and now Sega isn't even producing any consoles, only games, most of which on their used-to-be arch-nemesis' console.

Why don't you like it? Most of Sega's best-selling games sell best on Nintendo consoles, so they kind of rely on that friendship to make sales. It's good for Sega that they have that "friendship" with a company that publishes their games and helps them makes money. They don't make consoles anymore not because they don't want to, but because of the intense competition. So if you can't bet 'em, join 'em, as Sega learned when it dropped from the console race to work solely on games.