Project M Social Thread

[Krack]

I just showed the Demo to my room mate. Even as a causal brawl player, he had plenty of respect for what has been done with this hack. Even though he thought somethings were cheap, like Zelda's new Dins(so he has a problem with it being useful lol). He was overall pretty impressed.

I'm personally really excited about these new developments. Having Melee landing Detection is going to make ariels so much better. I do have a question though. With LD now possible are you going to have to go back to the drawing board with alot of the adjustments you have made to characters, Or did you have an idea oh how this was going to play into the characters who received major changes?

 

[SuperGuzzi]

Hi people, i donwloaded P:M one week ago, and i fall in love with it, but i have some questions:

1) Where is hanebow, pokemon stadium, and (the most important) Green hill zone?, because, i have mods for this stages to make mor competitive , and i just miss them

2) is'nt the Jiggly's up special too effective? i mean, i can use it, taun, and charge a smash before my oponent wake up, and that get on my friends's nerves xD

3) how i can cancel de fox/falco foward especial? I did it some times, but i'm not sure how.

4)isn't Lucas a little broken? My friend who main Lucas thinks that.

and there are some things in the stages that i don't really like, for example, in port town aero dirve, the changes are great, but why you didn't put edges like PTAD+?
But still, the changes in the stages are great, and i really like the new size of Battlefield.

Oh, and i have two stages i anyone likes them
i don't know i someone already did this, but here i hace a Brawl's FD sized to the P:M collsions, so the replays wont desync:

And here is a Battlefield, with the intro lights, and again, sized to P:M's BF

I'm sorry if this questions were already answered, and sorry for my bad english.
PD: Thanks

 

[Seikishidan Soru]

Actually, I wouldn't agree. If it's presented right and they still knock the "Demo" for not having all the characters, that's a degree of bias and stupidity that Project M will never be able to win over. Full release or not.

I'd say that goes for people telling us to "go play Melee" as well, because that's beyond stupidity. When someone is presented with a detailed view of Project M, whether it's a demo or not, there is absolutely no way that they can actually believe that new characters and stages are being removed. Not to mention, those very stages and characters that were a huge selling point when moving from Melee to Brawl suddenly become irrelevant when Project M comes into play? Come on. "Go play Melee", coming from anyone having read a detailed OP such as this thread's or the overwiew on NeoGAF is just not worth a response. It's not a matter of different views, it's just that being deliberately obtuse makes arguing and even informing useless.

 

[MonkUnit]

Hi people, i donwloaded P:M one week ago, and i fall in love with it, but i have some questions:

1) Where is hanebow, pokemon stadium, and (the most important) Green hill zone?, because, i have mods for this stages to make mor competitive , and i just miss them

2) is'nt the Jiggly's up special too effective? i mean, i can use it, taun, and charge a smash before my oponent wake up, and that get on my friends's nerves xD

3) how i can cancel de fox/falco foward especial? I did it some times, but i'm not sure how.

4)isn't Lucas a little broken? My friend who main Lucas thinks that.

and there are some things in the stages that i don't really like, for example, in port town aero dirve, the changes are great, but why you didn't put edges like PTAD+?
But still, the changes in the stages are great, and i really like the new size of Battlefield.

1) Those stages will be in the final version. PS1 isn't in the demo because we have not been able to make it have melee's windmill.

2) That is fixed in the patch.

3) Mash B.

4. Practice against Lucas. He has good combos, just try to avoid the pressure.

Nice stages BTW. Are they on your BrawlVault?

 

[Evilagram]

Again, Project M isn't a product. It's a fanmod. The way we approach promoting it is still important, but ultimately people will take to it or won't. Or be open to the concept or not. That's not an excuse, it's a reality.

Those who grasp at whatever straws they can to insult it without playing it (ie: Project M sux look they took out characters! It's not by Nintendo therefore it sux, etc) won't change their mind. Us trying to talk them into it over a forum won't work, period. Basically, we can't convert the trolls, and it's dumb to try.

Those with misconceptions they can own up to if corrected, perhaps. But trolls, no. That kind of bias should be regarded as pretty much irreconciable, given the outlets we have to work with.

Product M is something that nearly all players can find something good in. I believe that anyone can be persuaded to like it as long as their goals are in some way consistent with ours. Unless someone literally does not want a balanced competitive game, Product M is something that anyone can enjoy.

Furthermore, I don't think you should just give up on people because you think they're hopeless. They just have a different point of view for one reason or another, and with calm rational debate even they can be persuaded. Hell, I've argued with /v/ on 4ch before, and even they were persuaded by my arguments in favor of Product M and smash as a whole and you know how those people are.

Sure, some people out there are total trolls, like that one guy who showed up in the Neogaf thread more recently, just said to go back to melee and left, but if someone is willing to stick around so you can talk to them, then they an definitely find something of worth across the board of things this product does.

The fact of the matter is, trolls can be converted, it's all a matter of approach. Remember, it's NOT about disproving their arguments, it's persuasion.



(Kidding about product M, but srsly, if we get wide enough acceptance we could seriously change things. It's just a matter of knowing how to deal with trolls in a way that works.)

 

[Deleted member]

I'm just going to assume landing detection has been fixed by the looks of blogpost 3.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Evilagram]

I'm just going to assume landing detection has been fixed by the looks of blogpost 3.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

You are quite correct.

 

[jalued]

Are there going to be any videos showing the new LD or is it still secret?

 

[DarkDragoon]

You can't convert trolls. Trolls will say things just to start problems, regardless if they actually feel that way or not.

I don't see what the big deal is about having a huge casual fan base for P:M anyways. I guess the more casuals you have the greater potential for new competitive players increases...but that number is still relatively small compared to already competitive players who just pick up another game.

-DD

 

[SuperGuzzi]

1) Those stages will be in the final version. PS1 isn't in the demo because we have not been able to make it have melee's windmill.

2) That is fixed in the patch.

3) Mash B.

4. Practice against Lucas. He has good combos, just try to avoid the pressure.

Nice stages BTW. Are they on your BrawlVault?

I just uploaded them, and can try to explain a little better the foward smash cancel with fox and falcon? what exactly mean Mash B? Sorry if is a noob quesiton.

 

[MonkUnit]

Are there going to be any videos showing the new LD or is it still secret?

Not yet.

@Guzzi: Just mash B. I think it is a small window, so just mash B.

 

[Strong Badam]

Press B on frame 20, 21, or 22 of Fox/Falco's forward b to cancel.
"Mashing B" means to press B quickly and repeatedly. It won't be consistent, though.

 

[ETWIST51294]

Well, it's not really mashing, there's a timing to it. There's two timings to it actually. One where you go no where and one where you go half way. Just figure out the timing.

 

[SuperGuzzi]

Got it, thanks, now i'm going to practice in 1/4 speed

 

[Evilagram]

You can't convert trolls. Trolls will say things just to start problems, regardless if they actually feel that way or not.

I don't see what the big deal is about having a huge casual fan base for P:M anyways. I guess the more casuals you have the greater potential for new competitive players increases...but that number is still relatively small compared to already competitive players who just pick up another game.

-DD

Depends how troll they are. Trolls can be reasoned with, same as anyone. I say this because I can and have.

Anyway, the original topic wasn't even trolls, it was just people who were skeptical or otherwise distrusting of the mod, which is a lot of people.

Not to mention that casual players still have a lot to enjoy with this mod, even if they don't plan to go to tournaments. Just because they're opposed to some of the ideology this was born from does not mean that they would not benefit from playing this.

 

[Akuma2120]

I'm willing to wait for a patch with dynamic landing detection. Even if it means waiting till june or july.

LOL you think it will be out that early? I remember when people thought Project M was going to be FINISHED by last fall/winter. Too optimistic.

No I'm gonna guess fall-winter of this year for the patch, I don't think I'll be far off from my initial 2 year guess for the finished product.

 

[Strong Badam]

I can see the patch being out by Genesis 2.
Don't quote me on it, though.

 

[ETWIST51294]

LOL you think it will be out that early? I remember when people thought Project M was going to be FINISHED by last fall/winter. Too optimistic.

No I'm gonna guess fall-winter of this year for the patch, I don't think I'll be far off from my initial 2 year guess for the finished product.

What? Why would it take that long? They aren't even adding more characters.

 

[Deleted member]

Since landing detection will make wavedashing normalized on par with Melee, won't Link and Zelda now have awful wavedashes?

What are the plans with the PM backroom vis a vis their wavedashes?

I dont see a reason not to give Zelda and Link a wavedash on par with say Falco.

 

[MonkUnit]

Wavedash length is based on traction and walk speed. They should still go the same distance as before.

 

[Strong Badam]

Link had a good wavedash... <__< Wavedash is meant for spacing, not distance covering, remember.

[05:29pm] <Strong_Bad> Magus: What's your PayPal? I think we can get people to donate to you for all of the work you've done on this project.
[05:29pm] <Magus> it's saiyajin627@comcast.net
[05:32pm] <MonkUnit> i wonder if someone should post that in the pm thread so ppl can donate to him
[05:33pm] <Magus> please do. i could really use the money if people are willing to donate it >.>

So if anyone's willing to donate to our new Wizard to keep him working and not broke, it'd be very much appreciated! :D

 

[Deleted member]

I would contest Link's wavedash being good in Melee. It moves you far too short to be more useful for spacing imo.

 

[ETWIST51294]

Not everyones wd is meant to be amazing. Some chars should have short ones. Plus links is really good for spaceing. Wd back -> up b all day.

- droid post

 

[felipe_9595]

Yeah, but know he have crazy bomb recovery and mad moonalk so, i dont care about wavedashing

 

[ETWIST51294]

Moonwalking isn't useful.

 

[Cemetery]

Link's wavedash is fine.

Moving along.

 

[N.A.G.A.C.E]

can someone give me a link to the new blogpost

 

[Supreme Dirt]

smashmods.com

 

[Slashy]

Moonwalking isn't useful.

For sonic it is

 

[N.A.G.A.C.E]

^^thanks

also good ****

 

[MonkUnit]

Moonwalking is useful. Such as Falcon moonwalk -> dair -> combo, sonic moonwalk -> uair -> combo, etc.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Moonwalking isn't useful for not-falcon-or-sonic, imo.

 

[Deleted member]

Yeah, moonwalking is overrated as a technique unless you're clever enough like SS or Darkrain.

It's fairly limited in application.

Taj uses moonwalks to condition his opponent to certain responses though.

 

[ETWIST51294]

Falcon's moonwalk is not useful, and please refain from trying to tell me otherwise, believe me, i've been in the argument before in this exact thread. Sonics is pretty good, I'll give you that. And SS hasn't used Moonwalking since 09, Darkrain never uses it, hax$ uses it for flashy ****.

 

[MonkUnit]

Falcon's moonwalk is not useful, and please refain from trying to tell me otherwise, believe me, i've been in the argument before in this exact thread. Sonics is pretty good, I'll give you that. And SS hasn't used Moonwalking since 09, Darkrain never uses it, hax$ uses it for flashy ****.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yxgk2NfqOoM <- Darkrain moonwalking in there.

 

[Anth0ny]

Regarding the random Megaman difficulty discussion... I'm playing through Megaman 1 right now. This **** is ****ing IMPOSSIBLE GOOD LORD.

Definitely the hardest Megaman game ever. Man.

 

[ETWIST51294]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yxgk2NfqOoM <- Darkrain moonwalking in there.

Fine, Darkrain rarely uses it.

 

[MonkUnit]

My question to you is, What exactly is your goal by saying moonwalking isn't useful?

 

[Crispy4001]

Depends how troll they are. Trolls can be reasoned with, same as anyone. I say this because I can and have.

Anyway, the original topic wasn't even trolls, it was just people who were skeptical or otherwise distrusting of the mod, which is a lot of people.

Which includes trolls.

Your idea that Project M can be for every Smash fan is a high minded concept, but something that when taken too literally would get in the way of bringing people around for the long run.

There's a difference between being skeptical and dismissive. Entertaining the dismissive people as if they'll come around eventually is how you derail a discussion and push skeptics towards taking a side or (more likely) distancing themselves while the old farts bicker. Take it from a forum moderator of a well-known gaming site (1up) ... keeping a ****storm from happening allows your message get out clearer.

Trying to your darnedest to 'convert' the dismissive is how you get a ****storm. You may think you can change them, but ultimately its not worth it.

 

[Sneak8288]

Fine, Darkrain rarely uses it.

Just because there other better tools to edge guard with doesn't make the use of moonwalking disappear. Moonwalk bair with falcon is pretty useful but just not the BEST option