Project M Social Thread

[EpixAura]

If this really is LD... then what does Melee have over Project M now? HMMM?

...Well, some sound effects, to be honest. Anyway, I can now use Falco to his full potential!

 

[Flynn360]

If this really is LD... then what does Melee have over Project M now? HMMM?

...Well, some sound effects, to be honest. Anyway, I can now use Falco to his full potential!

BTW don't worry, snake's bair doesn't have him sink into the ground with the landing detection. He is just fine and doesn't look weird at all.

yea i agree Aura, Project M may be the better game after all :O and thats good to hear monk lol

 

[Onomanic]

Is this some sort of late April Fool's joke?

/cynicism

If not, HYPE.

 

[standardtoaster]

Is this some sort of late April Fool's joke?

/cynicism

If not, HYPE.

This is not a joke in any way. Trust me, this is fantastic progress. I've played it myself!

 

[Sneak8288]

This is not a joke in any way. Trust me, this is fantastic progress. I've played it myself!

Me too, wavelanding feels great, falco's lasers are back to normal ganon's fair is great, its good to be PMBR

 

[Onomanic]

This is not a joke in any way. Trust me, this is fantastic progress. I've played it myself!

MY NAAAAAAAAAAAAIIIIIIIIIRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!


Thank god for this. Next patch is going to be AMAZING. Better gameplay, more wifi people (hopefully) and generally just AMAZING. I assume all the wavedash timings are going to be back to normal? Link's is funny.

 

[hotdogturtle]

Is this some sort of late April Fool's joke?

/cynicism

If not, HYPE.

But there are pictures! :O

This means that I can start Ganonstomping people through platforms again. I played P:M for the first time in a while 2 days ago, and I kept trying to do that because I always do it in Melee on BF and YS.

 

[Evilagram]

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/416986/temp/Accurate portrayal of this awesomeness.mp3

Truth in every way.

I am SO GODDAMN HYPED!

 

[NeoZ]

LD being fixed is great news.
With the amount of stuff you guys have shown lately it makes me wonder if the patch will deal with every major gameplay issue, leaving only character changes and balance left for the final release.

 

[Zef]

are you guys seriously saying project:m is better than melee
wow

 

[NeoZ]

are you guys seriously saying project:m is better than melee
wow

Well, if gameplay mechanics are as good, and character balance is better, it kinda makes sense.

 

[ETWIST51294]

Me too, wavelanding feels great, falco's lasers are back to normal ganon's fair is great, its good to be PMBR

I hate you.

 

[Alex 615]

Is dat sum landing detection I see in the blog post?

 

[Slashy]

If this really is LD... then what does Melee have over Project M now? HMMM?

...Well, some sound effects, to be honest. Anyway, I can now use Falco to his full potential!

It's an official Nintendo game, that's why Melee>Project:M no matter what they do.

 

[MonkUnit]

Is dat sum landing detection I see in the blog post?

Yes.

are you guys seriously saying project:m is better than melee
wow

Opinions, bro

 

[ETWIST51294]

It's an official Nintendo game, that's why Melee>Project:M no matter what they do.

Don't do that. I don't wanna see the hype ruined by some gay *** arguement.


Anyways, Melee will still have some things the P:M still won't have but they'll most likely get fixed (I honestly think these guys can do anything at this point)

 

[Slashy]

Don't do that. I don't wanna see the hype ruined by some gay *** arguement.


Anyways, Melee will still have some things the P:M still won't have but they'll most likely get fixed (I honestly think these guys can do anything at this point)

I like Project M more, I'm just explaining why it won't be played as much as Melee despite being superior.

P:Ms status as an accompaniment to Melee has very little to do with features and more to do with attitude.

 

[MK26]

wow wtf
landing detection
magus2good

 

[Rikana]

I like Project M more, I'm just explaining why it won't be played as much as Melee despite being superior.

P:Ms status as an accompaniment to Melee has very little to do with features and more to do with attitude.

I agree with your post for once. Its true, just because its not official, there will be melee purists.

@etwist: same here. Because of this LD fix, I pretty much have a feeling they can bring back all melee mechanics.. this includes wall grappling.

 

[ETWIST51294]

I like melee more atm, until P:M is perfect (you know what I mean by perfect) I probably always will.

I've always said "if P:M is MELEE with balance and more viable stages WHY THE **** WOULD WE STILL PLAY MELEE???". Idk, I've seen a lot of melee purists say they would play it if it was like that, ex. Eggm.

 

[Slashy]

I like melee more atm, until P:M is perfect (you know what I mean by perfect) I probably always will.

I've always said "if P:M is MELEE with balance and more viable stages WHY THE **** WOULD WE STILL PLAY MELEE???". Idk, I've seen a lot of melee purists say they would play it if it was like that, ex. Eggm.

People know full well that it is possible to remove infinite dimensional cape, tripping, chainjacketing, planking, and infinite chain throws from Brawl. Show them any smash mod and they may still look in disgust or even mock you for picking the wimpier route.

There are still inherent problems with P:M...

A. You need to have a Wii to play it with a copy of Brawl
B. Because it is a mod, sponsored tournaments won't have it (some people play for the money)
C. People don't want to go through the enforceability issues
D. Some people are so diehard Melee fans, that they may come with any refusal to not accept that it may be superior
E. People may not like it simply because it is not a Nintendo official game, and will assume that it is crap like other mods or fangames

 

[GaretHax]

@ Slashy, eh pre-conceived or fabricated nuances between games will always exist simply because it has a different name, much less all the actual differences melee and PM will inherently have. I see your points, but it isn't really a tradition "mod" and there is nothing illegal about it, and with enough support maybe one day "official" and sponsored tourny's will host it, nadmittedly not very likely unless there are no more smash games. But as a modder and mod player of Elderscrolls games I'm going to say your assumtion that all user created content is crap is, in and of itself, crap.

 

[ETWIST51294]

A. You need to have a Wii to play it with a copy of Brawl
B. Because it is a mod, sponsored tournaments won't have it (some people play for the money)
C. People don't want to go through the enforceability issues
D. Some people are so diehard Melee fans, that they may come with any refusal to not accept that it may be superior
E. People may not like it simply because it is not a Nintendo official game, and will assume that it is crap like other mods or fangames

A. That won't be a problem, believe me.
B. Sponsored tourneys? This is Melee son, we in the past.
C. Idk what you're saying here.
D. I'm a diehard melee fan, I'll still play it when this is out, as would everybody else.
E. Only scrubs think that way.

The only things i hate about P:M is when things are nerfed, when things are made easier *cough* Gentlemen *cough*, and largely changed characters (like Wario, I wants mah bike).

 

[Slashy]

@ Slashy, eh pre-conceived or fabricated nuances between games will always exist simply because it has a different name, much less all the actual differences melee and PM will inherently have. I see your points, but it isn't really a tradition "mod" and there is nothing illegal about it, and with enough support maybe one day "official" and sponsored tourny's will host it, nadmittedly not very likely unless there are no more smash games. But as a modder and mod player of Elderscrolls games I'm going to say your assumtion that all user created content is crap is, in and of itself, crap.

I never said that user made content is crap, I love user made content, I love finding user made extensions for Firefox and mods for UT2004.

There are differences here, this is a console mod, aimed towards competitive play, based around a fighting game. You have to also consider that this is the Smash Bros. community, and perhaps it could be the group think within our userbase that will prevent Smash Mods from being major games.

Remember, throughout Brawl+'s entire lifecycle it got nothing but the constant hate of "You guys are destroying what made Brawl so great" or "Go play Street Fighter if you want a competitive game."

 

[Gust14]

So landing detection is fixed? Awesome, I was afraid that it would take many months, even after the patch, or even a year, if ever, before we saw that obstacle fixed, but you guys are amazing. Gongrats on this and keep the excelent work. HYPE!!

 

[Slashy]

A. That won't be a problem, believe me.
B. Sponsored tourneys? This is Melee son, we in the past.
C. Idk what you're saying here.
D. I'm a diehard melee fan, I'll still play it when this is out, as would everybody else.
E. Only scrubs think that way.

The only things i hate about P:M is when things are nerfed, when things are made easier *cough* Gentlemen *cough*, and largely changed characters (like Wario, I wants mah bike).

I would like to hear your take on one question.

Let's understand that Project M is not designed to replace Melee.

So now lets ask, how would Project M be designed if it was supposed to replace Melee?

 

[Evilagram]

It's an official Nintendo game, that's why Melee>Project:M no matter what they do.

Slashy, just shut up right there. A game's worth is determined by its mechanics, not who arbitrarily happened to develop it. A good dev does not guarantee a good game.

This will be better than melee when it does all that melee did right, and more. It is not yet, but it is getting there.

I just got info on how landing detection was implemented. It's a really ****ty implementation that does the job, but will need a lot more polishing before it is ready, and it will need to be rewritten completely before the final version (It's good enough for the patch though).

I submitted a proposal for how to fix it, but I am not a brawl hacker, so I have no idea if my idea is possible at all, and neither does the dev I proposed it to, him not knowing ASM.

 

[mugwhump]

Wow, that's really impressive. I wasn't expecting that for the patch at all.

 

[metroid1117]

The demo is already great, but this is just amazing. Magus is god-like indeed.

By the way... I've been following this thread for a while, but I don't think I've seen this be addressed - in Melee, you only airdodged if you pressed R or L until it clicks, but in P:M, you airdodge if you press R or L all the way down to the trigger (right before it clicks). This makes the timing for wavedashing slightly different; is this going to be changed in the patch or final version?

 

[Gust14]

Wow slashy, you don't have much faith in the melee comunity. Also do you know Dota, well thats a very succesfull mod of a very popular game. This could be like that

 

[Evilagram]

The demo is already great, but this is just amazing. Magus is god-like indeed.

By the way... I've been following this thread for a while, but I don't think I've seen this be addressed - in Melee, you only airdodged if you pressed R or L until it clicks, but in P:M, you airdodge if you press R or L all the way down to the trigger (right before it clicks). This makes the timing for wavedashing slightly different; is this going to be changed in the patch or final version?

There is a code in place that makes all partial inputs on the L and R buttons register as full inputs. I have no idea if this will be changed. I am personally finding it more convenient for a lot of things.

 

[GaretHax]

Slashy, just shut up right there. A game's worth is determined by its mechanics, not who arbitrarily happened to develop it. A good dev does not guarantee a good game.

Thats not completely true.
Brand names sell, as well as demographics
The dichotomy between Melee and Brawl sales didn't happen for no reason. Brand name + past experiences with the game makes a HUGE difference. Though it isn't insurmountable by any means, it just means it has to be REALLY good. But tbh and IMO PM has already exceeded the quality standards for success.
I don't really feel like going into social pyschology and all that jazz atm though it's rather depressing tbh, anyway I'm not sure why I bothered to post this seeing how far off topic it is... Oh well.

 

[Crispy4001]

B. Because it is a mod, sponsored tournaments won't have it (some people play for the money)
C. People don't want to go through the enforceability issues
E. People may not like it simply because it is not a Nintendo official game, and will assume that it is crap like other mods or fangames

If it's a good game enough people want to play, exceptions can be made.

That, and console gamers are stubborn of their own accord when it comes to mods. Project M arguably takes the biggest steps forward towards changing that mentality of any console game mod yet.

 

[Slashy]

Wow slashy, you don't have much faith in the melee comunity. Also do you know Dota, well thats a very succesfull mod of a very popular game. This could be like that

Again PC game, different genre, different goals, different community.

Slashy, just shut up right there. A game's worth is determined by its mechanics, not who arbitrarily happened to develop it. A good dev does not guarantee a good game.

This will be better than melee when it does all that melee did right, and more. It is not yet, but it is getting there.

I just got info on how landing detection was implemented. It's a really ****ty implementation that does the job, but will need a lot more polishing before it is ready, and it will need to be rewritten completely before the final version (It's good enough for the patch though).

I submitted a proposal for how to fix it, but I am not a brawl hacker, so I have no idea if my idea is possible at all, and neither does the dev I proposed it to, him not knowing ASM.

You can see plenty of topics with people hailing that Project M will never replace Melee, the stigma is already there, people are hating the product before they tried out the final version.

Let me remind you that isn't supposed to replace Melee, so if it really is going to be perceived the same way by all players as being superior to Melee then what do expect their attitude to be.

"It's nice that we have an alternative with better balance, nicer graphics, more characters, and more stages, but we'll stick to the same thing we've been playing for the past 10 years."

 

[ETWIST51294]

I would like to hear your take on one question.

Let's understand that Project M is not designed to replace Melee.

So now lets ask, how would Project M be designed if it was supposed to replace Melee?

Exactly like Melee, more characters, all old characters brought back (because that gives a reason to go back to melee), all viable stages from melee returning, new techs, better balance, more viable stages, and an optional texture pack for nostalgia ***s.

That's my take on that.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

Marth needs fyre on his shield breaker to tribute to Roy until the clone engine is finished.

 

[Slashy]

Exactly like Melee, more characters, all old characters brought back (because that gives a reason to go back to melee), all viable stages from melee returning, new techs, better balance, more viable stages, and an optional texture pack for nostalgia ***s.

That's my take on that.

From what I've read Project M is trying to be extremely close to that viewpoint.

 

[Evilagram]

Thats not completely true.
Brand names sell, as well as demographics
The dichotomy between Melee and Brawl sales didn't happen for no reason. Brand name + past experiences with the game makes a HUGE difference. Though it isn't insurmountable by any means, it just means it has to be REALLY good. But tbh and IMO PM has already exceeded the quality standards for success.
I don't really feel like going into social pyschology and all that jazz atm though it's rather depressing tbh, anyway I'm not sure why I bothered to post this seeing how far off topic it is... Oh well.

I am not talking about a game's success or sales or popularity, I am talking about how good a game is. Social psychology is a topic we will have HELL on when it comes to promoting project M. I've done a lot of personal research into how we will cross that bridge when we get there.

I was talking about a game's worth, which is determined by the game's complexity and depth.

 

[ETWIST51294]

The only one that they aren't doing is bringing back all old characters (of course you would need the clone engine) and i think that's gonna back fire when it's almost done.

 

[Ecks]

PM=Better than Melee
PM=Different than Melee by definition
PM=Different
therefore,
PM=Bad
PM=Worse than Melee

And this is a perfect logic that a lot of people will follow.