Project M Social Thread

[Link40]

hot.

No seriously.

I'm normally against replacing the default textures, but I've contemplated it so many times for Ganondorf/Link, and now obviously, Zelda.

Maybe it just goes to show how bad of a game Twilight Princess was, or how much better the old designs were? Or maybe both?

Can't wait to see the finished product GameWatching.

Really impressive work like always GameWatching.

 

[jahkzheng]

Is it because dolphin slash can't kill? If not, what do you think it is he's missing? He looks pretty good to me.

I was just about to say that I was surprised how weak dolphin slash was and how strong DB's third stoke was. And does Dolphin slash have a smaller hitbox now. Falco getting that dsmash off at the end seemed pretty crazy - maybe dsmash is just bigger, but I think its more Dolphin Slash.



Edit:
After a second look, it seems it's more of a difference in Dolphin Slash's duration that prevented it hitting at the end... Falco was quite close and well within dsmash's range. I suppose this Dolphin Slash is more like it was in Melee though.

 

[ynnek123]

Also, why do marths always use side b so much? I think you should give it more endlag to make it more punishable, but it might just be me..

 

[Stevo]

Marth's side b is better without CC. Also, that player didn't seem like a Marth veteran from melee to me (wait for a good marth player to test things)

 

[JCaesar]

Someone call for a Marth veteran?

 

[BEES]

Looked like he was trying to play Roy, with all the side b's and neutral b off the stage edgeguard attempts

 

[ValTroX]

Marth doesn't seem like Marth because his DB is too good, so the players seem to rely on it too much. but overall, the animations are looking great and the gameplay is fast

 

[Revven]

His Side B isn't "too good", it's slower than it was in vBrawl which means it isn't as safe on shield as it was in vBrawl. It's Melee Side B, which is about as good as ... I don't even know what to compare it to. The point is, it's not too good and you shouldn't be claiming that especially when you haven't played the game yet.

 

[curry9186]

Marth doesn't seem like Marth because his DB is too good, so the players seem to rely on it too much. but overall, the animations are looking great and the gameplay is fast

Dancing blade is STRONG. i know hits three and four were strong in melee but that video showed the third hit being a competent kill move. It surprised me when I saw it. Plus the speed is freaking addictive and I haven't even played this yet.

 

[Archangel]

Someone call for a Marth veteran?

Still doesn't seem like Marth to me.

here's an example of the same match http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76RLlv5mVY4#t=0m12s

It seems like his CG's don't exist on spacies anymore as well. He's the only top tier character that I find way off right now. I'm sick of seeing fox/falco tbh. I'm even sick of seeing sonic and snake. They are great new additions and all but I'm just tired of seeing them now. I want to see a little bit more...Also don't rub the you haven't played the game in people's faces...as if they haven't played it by choice. That just makes you seem like a ****.

 

[Revven]

Spam_arrows, we have said a million times over that throws as a whole are off, this includes EVERY character. Let's not forget that a lot of the Marth related things that involve aerials (like SH Double Fair) are harder to do because of landing detection.

 

[curry9186]

Still doesn't seem like Marth to me.

here's an example of the same match http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76RLlv5mVY4#t=0m12s

After watching both videos, brawl marth has slightly more end lag on fair and bair. And DB not flashing colors threw me for a sec.

EDIT: Ah nevermind, falco addressed it already.

 

[abcool]

I think what spam_arrows mean is Marth's movements on stage. If you watch any good marth mains, you will notice they put alot of emphasis on dash dancing around the stage to get in and out. Marth is perfect in terms of aerials and animations, probably besides dancing blade without the colors, but his dash animation looks weird compared to melee. He doesn't stay in the animation as long. I also think he was lower to the ground when he went into it aswell in melee. He just seemed cooler when dashing around the stage in melee tbh.

 

[genkaku]

The devs have data down to the frame. They made marth the way he is so far. I'm pretty sure that they're more than capable of recognizing exactly what is off by exactly how much without relying on the opinions you feel compelled to throw out after watching a youtube video.

 

[Revven]

If he's complaining about aesthetics (which I hope he's not) then that's a terrible excuse to use to ignore all the other work we did on Marth.

 

[Deleted member]

Oh you guys started porting his Melee hitboxes and fixed his animations? Cool.

Ganon's up tilt should be Falcon's Up Smash from Smash 64. That'd **** hard. So hard.

 

[Revven]

Too bad Ganondorf doesn't need a useful uptilt to be good. (Yes though that would be ******).

 

[GP&B]

Ganondorf may be good, but he's not zetta good.

Needs moar Falcon64 USmash for his UTilt to be teh zetta good.

 

[Archangel]

Spam_arrows, we have said a million times over that throws as a whole are off, this includes EVERY character. Let's not forget that a lot of the Marth related things that involve aerials (like SH Double Fair) are harder to do because of landing detection.

I know throws are off but that's just 1 thing i mentioned...read post below he pretty much explains it.

I think what spam_arrows mean is Marth's movements on stage. If you watch any good marth mains, you will notice they put alot of emphasis on dash dancing around the stage to get in and out. Marth is perfect in terms of aerials and animations, probably besides dancing blade without the colors, but his dash animation looks weird compared to melee. He doesn't stay in the animation as long. I also think he was lower to the ground when he went into it aswell in melee. He just seemed cooler when dashing around the stage in melee tbh.

The devs have data down to the frame. They made marth the way he is so far. I'm pretty sure that they're more than capable of recognizing exactly what is off by exactly how much without relying on the opinions you feel compelled to throw out after watching a youtube video.

I posted a vid in response to another vid just to compare. It's the same characters on the same stage. So I figured you could get a good look at the vids and maybe see what I see.

Also I've felt this way since I test played this at Apex. His animations seem next to perfect but when you hit someone with aerials it doesn't feel like they get knocked to where they should be. All I'm saying is as a Marth main I'm always hyped when I FINALLYS see Marth and I'm always left underwelmed. I'm sure sheiks are happy to see sheik, Falco's and Fox's definitely are hyped but I've seen nothing Melee-ish about high level Marths yet in a PM video yet. I think landing detection, friction, and throws may help but God knows when the 3 of them will be fixed. Especially when everyones busy working on Pichu....

 

[ValTroX]

His Side B isn't "too good", it's slower than it was in vBrawl which means it isn't as safe on shield as it was in vBrawl. It's Melee Side B, which is about as good as ... I don't even know what to compare it to. The point is, it's not too good and you shouldn't be claiming that especially when you haven't played the game yet.

There no need to get offended for a comment, I jst express what I saw, and in my opinion, the move is better than in melee and don't give me the "you haven't played the game" crap 'cause as far as I'mm concerned, I have eyes, and I'm able to see the videos. Also, I'm not complaining, I love the way Marth is playing and I appreicate all the work you guys did on him

 

[shanus]

I think the main issue here is that individuals (*cough spam arrows cough*) expect a 100% carbon copy of melee. We have made it clear that a 100% carbon copy is simply not possible.

Marth feels and plays extremely well right now, and we acknowledge his throw game and refinement is not at the level of say, falco yet in terms of progress. So when we do that, why bother comparing a marth played by a non-marth main with a vid of M2K v magus? Kind of a pointless argument right there.

Be patient or learn to animate/code extremely well, otherwise we will continue to go at the same pace we do (this is a hobby and not a job for the PMBR dev team, remember!)

 

[ValTroX]

we know Shanus, but there's no need to get butthurt over some trivial comments
EDIT: Not directed to any particulars
EDIT2: Also Bombsoldier seems to love P:M, I would like to hear some of his thoughts, I'm pretty sure all he has is thumbs ups

 

[kaizo13]

spam arrows i can relate to what you speak about, honestly i believe that it's simply Brawl's D.I that makes P:M look so sloppy when compared to Melee. and friction ofcourse, Melee gives you that satisfactory feeling of having full control over your character. Also, Brawl animations weren't meant to be moving at the awesome speed of Melee. Melee is fast yet looks so fluent, and when you speed up brawl animations they make the characters look like they are tweaking out *cough fox* (just my opinion haha)

 

[Archangel]

I think the main issue here is that individuals (*cough spam arrows cough*) expect a 100% carbon copy of melee. We have made it clear that a 100% carbon copy is simply not possible.

Marth feels and plays extremely well right now, and we acknowledge his throw game and refinement is not at the level of say, falco yet in terms of progress. So when we do that, why bother comparing a marth played by a non-marth main with a vid of M2K v magus? Kind of a pointless argument right there.

Be patient or learn to animate/code extremely well, otherwise we will continue to go at the same pace we do (this is a hobby and not a job for the PMBR dev team, remember!)

So you have time to respond to call me out but not time to respond to pm's? I'm not sure I have anything else to say to you on smashboards then.

For the record I've never stated anything about expecting or even wanting an exact copy of Marth. Simple acknowledging the fact that Marth isn't at the level of Falco would've been enough. I obviously don't know how to code or animate. I'm not knocking the job done so far. It's just that as the blind fanboyish hype fades it becomes easier notice the negatives is all.

My favorite characters aren't Fox, Falco, Falcon, Sonic, Snake, Sheik, Mario, Link, Toonlink, young link, old link, big link, tall link....I don't care about any of them tbh. But it's good to see them play well. It would be nice if concerns about other characters were not dismissed as if you don't give a **** about them. Naturally that makes the people who play those characters uneasy.


here's TheNewb playing Marth in tournament: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFhITlyj1Dc

not bad imo.

 

[Anth0ny]

OMG DANT DID IT

 

[shanus]

If that came off as hostile, then I apologize. I'm more or less saying that it can be frustrating on our end to see day after day small nitpicks on things that are notably work-in-progress (since marth has been acknowledged to be worked on the past few weeks its pretty obvious that he is far from perfection).

@ Spam Arrows: I'm terrible at responding at PMs, I really don't spend all that much time on smashboards due to the utter chaos that is work. With that said, we have a few recruits who pursue film for a living and will be providing us services for making future combo videos. I appreciate the offer though.

 

[kaizo13]

OMG DANT DID IT

we've had the clone engine since 2008?! Dam you Dant! no more secrets! D:

 

[shanus]

Also just to credit Shell and Magus (and camelot i think, too), remember for example that every marth animation had to be rebuilt to restore his range. Realize that his dancing blade has (1+3+3+3)*2 animations alone. This stuff takes time!

Also editing dash animations is a pain!

 

[Reaver197]

I do 3D work and motion graphics (animation included), if you're really looking for people to animate/model/make particle effects.

 

[genkaku]

Spam_Arrows, we get it. You want to a part of PMBR but aren't, you want certain things done in a certain order but can't get it because you aren't PMBR. You're certain that bad things will happen at bad times if no one listens to you (self-dubbed The Prophet [although that video with you calling out the stages was pretty cool, I'll admit]) and you're frustrated with a lack of recognition by the devs even in a thread of suggestions. We know. You've told us many, many times.
Please cut back on the drama.

 

[shanus]

I do 3D work and motion graphics (animation included), if you're really looking for people to animate/model/make particle effects.

If your interested in contributing, please apply at:
http://www.smashmods.com/forum/forum-91.html

 

[Revven]

Do note though that it's wise to learn how to use BBox (BrawlBox) before actually applying, because it may be entirely different than what you're used to animating wise.

 

[FireBall Stars]

Not taking in account the issues that need to be fixed(and people are working for that), by the video posted by JCaesar, Marth is pretty much Melee Marth.

I thought of Roy watching momosugar playing, with all of those SideBs.

 

[Archangel]

If that came off as hostile, then I apologize. I'm more or less saying that it can be frustrating on our end to see day after day small nitpicks on things that are notably work-in-progress (since marth has been acknowledged to be worked on the past few weeks its pretty obvious that he is far from perfection).

@ Spam Arrows: I'm terrible at responding at PMs, I really don't spend all that much time on smashboards due to the utter chaos that is work. With that said, we have a few recruits who pursue film for a living and will be providing us services for making future combo videos. I appreciate the offer though.

Well I think part of the problem is egocentricity on EVERYONE'S part. It's a problem on smashboards in general Imo. Everyone is so quick to argue their points and perspective but seem completely incapable of understanding someone else's. I'll admit I've probably been bringing my own bull**** to this thread the past few days. I haven't had a good much sleep the past week or so and things just...don't seem to be going my way lately. that's nobody's problem but my own. If I've been somewhat of a **** lately I apologize.

as for the videos. It's no problem. I'm got plenty of other video's to work on now. I have some old combo video's to complete for some people. As well as the Marth Legacy videos to continue working on. You should go to this btw:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_h4ceukTdUE If If I'm go(hopefully I will) I'll play any member of PMBR for their spot. Best of 5. If I lose I'll never post here again.

Marth's SideB
I'm pretty sure it's just the remaining brawl mechanics that are effecting how this works. I use the move often times with Marth and it seems about the same.

older vid of my scrubby marth using SideB
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yajpRdaOZnw#t=1m11s

 

[FireBall Stars]

Dancing Blade works better, I see no problems with that.

 

[Reaver197]

Ok, I'd imagine. I was actually going to ask what BBox stood for, lol. Sounds good though. If it's similar at all to any of the main 3D programs (e.g. Maya), then I should be able to figure it out pretty fast. But I'll watch through some of the tuts and stuff to see what's up. Same with PSA.

I have some minor experience with assembly coding too, though it's been a while since I've touched it. Wouldn't really trust myself doing anything too complicated with it, at least any time soon, which is probably what you guys need anyway.

 

[Archangel]

nvm not worth it.

 

[genkaku]

Thank you for the retraction, Spam_Arrows. It was considerate of you.

But no thanks for the retraction of the retraction below.

 

[Spelt]

Not sure why anyone would want this to be an exact 100% copy of melee anyways.
surely anyone who doesn't play a low tier would get bored of it after 10 minutes and go back to the original.

It's funny seeing people complain about such minor things like dashes.

 

[ValTroX]

If that came off as hostile, then I apologize. I'm more or less saying that it can be frustrating on our end to see day after day small nitpicks on things that are notably work-in-progress (since marth has been acknowledged to be worked on the past few weeks its pretty obvious that he is far from perfection).

@ Spam Arrows: I'm terrible at responding at PMs, I really don't spend all that much time on smashboards due to the utter chaos that is work. With that said, we have a few recruits who pursue film for a living and will be providing us services for making future combo videos. I appreciate the offer though.

It didn't came out hostile at all, if anything came off great, you always find a way to answer out comments in a respectful way, and it's one of the things that i appreciate the most about you great sir(other than your supreme awesome skills in coding ). Also, the comment was not directed to anyone, but I do admit that we get some hostile responses from some people, many of those times without a valid reason to be attacked