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It may have looked like that on Jcaesar's stream but that was probably just a coincidence. The stars only indicate how many kills you have gotten.
my understanding (FOREWARNING: I AM NOT AFFILIATED WITH PMBR) is that, they originally wanted everyone to be fox/falco level, then realized that you would have to make an entire cast of ridonculous characters for that. the new focus is to aim for melee marth/falcon/peach/dorf levels.What -is- the balance goal here anyways?
Thanks to both of you for clarifying things for me.
I'm pretty sure they've never stated that they decided against balancing around the top three. Nor that you need ridiculous characters for that, since you don't. Ridiculous characters are what you see in brawl-, fox and Falco are just well designed characters who happen to be better than the others. Their level isn't by any means impossible for e other characters to achieve without being ridiculous.
*grabs flame shield* In that case, will Fox & Falco be brought down to the level of everyone else? No, I don't care if they're at their Melee level now. If you're not going to design everyone to match with the best, then the best need to be brought down to the level you're designing everyone for. It's called balance, and you can't arbitrarily exempt characters from it, no matter HOW good they are.
It's called game balance. I don't need to be part of the staff nor a competitive player to recognize that having characters that are inherently better than the entire rest of the staff is bad game design. You can't balance different characters to different levels and still call it balanced, especially for a game as technical and competitive as this.
The spacies, while very good, aren't inherently better than the rest of the cast. They have a set of exploitable weaknesses that many other characters have been given specific tools to exploit. The spacies will still probably be on top, but other characters will be able to compete, which is the idea.
I don't mean to say that every matchup will be 50:50. What I'm saying is that if there are characters that naturally excel over the rest, and you aren't aiming to balance the other characters to that level of gameplay in some way, then you're doing balance wrong.
Balance isn't as cut and dry as you are making it out to be. Say you buff every other character to be on spacies level(something pretty arbitrary in the first place). Suddenly, because you made links fsmash come out on frame 3 so he can deal with spacie pressure(completely random examples) his match-up with wario which was slightly in his favor suddenly becomes 90-10 in his favor. Well, we can't have that so lets change wario to make him super fast, well now suddenly wario destroys pit so lets etc etc etc. You have to be very careful with balance changes it's not really as simple as "putting all the other characters on the same level".
Hylian with the winning post. Especially with the whole bit, "it takes time."
well, the mindset currently is (afaik), keep the top tier as close to melee as possible. then make everyone else. they want to use the top tier as a sort of litmus, even if they don't necessarily want to set the rest of the roster to their level.The thinking that I find a bit off (and I'm guessing leaf as well) is that everyone has it in the back of their mind that the spacies "should" still be on top. Is that not similar to saying that the cast is being balanced around X level, but there will still be characters (intentionally) a tad above?
On that note, once all the characters are in, will there be an inevitable balance patch like 8-12 months later to iron out MUs to like a 40/60 range?
Kinda late now, I guess, but who/what was on the stream that was mentioned here? I can't currently watch the stream.
Or Ike lmfaoThere will always be a best character. If you nerf spacies, someone is just going to take their place.
Better it be them that takes some decent technical skill to be succesful with, compared to MK who isnt hard to use by any stretch.
You underestimate the range on Fox's shine. IIRC, Fox's shine's range reaches out farther than the animation does (although only by a tiny bit). Probably has more range than a lot of neutral aerials do (at least with disjointedness, if not reach). Falco's shine's range is pretty small, though, so it's less ridiculous.
Do you feel that would be better for balance, though?
