Project M Social Thread

[Shadic]

Wolf is good. Silent Wolf likes him.

 

[Kink-Link5]

What is the full list of replaced stages? If I'm going to be adding in BRSTMs I want to make sure they're the right ones.

I can only remember that FoD goes over Mario Bros.

 

[9Kplus1]

FoD --> Mario Bros
Jungle:M --> Distant Planet
Castlevania -- Luigi's Mansion
Yoshi's Story (Melee) --> Yoshi's Island
Dreamland --> Green Greens
Better Final Destination --> Final Destination
Saffron City --> Spear Pillar
Cavern --> Mushroomy Kingdom (I and II)
Hyrule Castle 64 -- Bridge of Eldin
Fourside:M --> New Pork City

• Temple:M and Hyrule Temple use the same BRSTMs

Feels like I'm forgetting something, but that should be most of them.

 

[GHNeko]

Really? You can do that on every other stage. There is a reason we have multiple starters and not just one neutral stage. Which character are you getting camped/cg'd by that makes it that bad for you?

Cp YI for favoring close quarters.

Cp dreamland for its large size and blastzone.

Cp Smashville for platform camping.

Really now you guys lol

Except the strengths of other stages are no where near as extreme as FD, and the ones that are, are already typically CPs, like dreamland 64.

Except dreamland 64's boundaries don't directly impact MUs.

FD does.

and YI doesn't favor close quarters wtf. you can play a long range game on that stage easily.

And platform camping smashville is a ****ty strat and anyone who lets people get away with that is doing it wrong.

Like wtf.

 

[MonkUnit]

I am 100% Sure new dreamland haves the size and the blastzones of the 64 dreamland.

the demo(IIRC) and the current version both have ported melee boundaries, collisions, etc

 

[felipe_9595]

Yeah demo haves melee boundaries. But i dont know why it seemed like 64 dreamland in the streams (It was more smaller)

Or am i high XD?

 

[9Kplus1]

You're delusional

stop downing so many shrooms or you'll think that you can challenge a turtle 38902 times your height. mario's just been lucky

 

[iLink]

You are kidding yourself if you dont think YI favors close quarters. You have to be bad to think you just get camped out on FD. And did you admit that you have a typical cp as a starter?

Jeez i cant beleive you if you dont think blastzones effect matchups.

 

[Mattnumbers]

That's a straw man argument, he said that blastzones don't directly affect matchups, which they don't. They only affect matchups indirectly by aiding characters with long range recoveries since they can make it back potentially instead of dying outright.

 

[9Kplus1]

You are kidding yourself if you dont think YI favors close quarters.

=|...

Marth gets free tippers on YS

Unless you're talking about Yoshi's Island (Brawl), which is ****ing huge.

 

[Kink-Link5]

The only characters which benefit directly from FD are ones who rely extensively on ground approaches- Luigi, Ice Climbers, Mewtwo, and to a lesser extent, Sheik- and those who can use its walls to aid in recovery- Everyone bar Zelda and Mewtwo. Nothing about the stage favours projectiles, and it can be argued that 3Plat stages benefit projectiles more than FD anyway. It does allow for juggle chain throws, but most characters who have them can use platforms to achieve different, but equally desirable, effects that chain grabbing does.

 

[GHNeko]

You are kidding yourself if you dont think YI favors close quarters. You have to be bad to think you just get camped out on FD. And did you admit that you have a typical cp as a starter?

Jeez i cant beleive you if you dont think blastzones effect matchups.

You're kidding yourself if you think that YI cant be camped. It really doesn't favor close quarters. Project camping on YI is very much possible. ****. Regular non-projectile camping is very much possible on YI. Especially when they get occasional room on randall jr.

And you're telling me you cant camp until your fingers bleed on FD? Get out of here.

And yeah, I admitted to having dreamland as a stater, because it's a better starter than FD. It will always be.

And apparently, you can't read because I said that Blastzones do not directly affect Matchups. The layout is the same as BF meaning a lot of things done on BF happen on DL64. The reason why people CP this stage is for the blast zones alone. But other than the blast zone you play on this stage almost identically to BF. The only difference in how MUs will be played on the stage are as a result of the plats being slightly higher, so some mid platform specific things may/may not work. If anything, this stage is worse for platform shenanigans because of the slightly raised platforms.

 

[iLink]

Thats irrelavent.

Sometimes you pick a stage because its good for you. Sometimes you pick it because its bad for the opponent. Thats what the cp system is. You are going to use a strike for one reason or the other.

@9k+1: Marth kind of has to be close to you as he doesnt have a projectile. i very much know marth loves that stage. Considering the stage is small and he has such a wide attack range, you are always in close quarters of his attacks.

@neko: lol i cant take you seriously. I dont mean to come off as a jerk and i hate sounding like an ***, and I mean this as respectfully as possible, but you are not the person to be saying how stuff works in melee. You just got into it when p:m sprung about and even then you are average at best.

 

[foshio]

I gotta say... how often do you see people choose FD to camp in tournament (In melee)?? I honestly cannot think of any instances where they are able to just stay away, and now with people advancing in power shielding and catching projectiles that kind of camping is much less relevant. Project M also apparently has ways to limit chain grabs so really FD shouldn't be that bad as a starter...

 

[9Kplus1]

@9k+1: marth kind of has to be close to you as he doesnt have a projectile. i very much know marth loves that stage.

... huh? Say that again...

marth kind of has to be close to you as he doesnt have a projectile.

...Wait you went too far back

as he doesnt have a projectile

ALMOST THERE

projectile

You just killed your own argument. If Marth needs a projectile in order to get into Fsmash range, then YS does not "encourage close quarters combat".

@neko: I dont mean to come off as a jerk and i hate sounding like an *** but you are not the person to be saying how stuff works in melee. You just got into it when p:m sprung about and even then you are average at best.

omg Neko should sig this. It's like Leffen and Jebus had a baby.

btw, FD is great for any character that can run away and / or **** up at least 90% of the cast with grabs. Mewtwo is only good on that stage because he can BSB camp all day.

 

[Mattnumbers]

And what makes YOU a person to be saying how stuff works in Melee?

Skill doesn't matter anyways in theorysmash, what matters is reason and logic, which you have failed to use in order to prove why FD is as neutral as a stage like Battlefield or PS2.

 

[GHNeko]

Thats irrelavent.

Sometimes you pick a stage because its good for you. Sometimes you pick it because its bad for the opponent. Thats what the cp system is. You are going to use a strike for one reason or the other.

@neko: lol i cant take you seriously. I dont mean to come off as a jerk and i hate sounding like an ***, and I mean this as respectfully as possible, but you are not the person to be saying how stuff works in melee. You just got into it when p:m sprung about and even then you are average at best.

what does the 1st part of your post have to do with anything.

You keep saying FD is a starter but you don't give reasons as to why it should be a starter, and not a CP. There are stages more deserving of the starter position. There are more reasons for FD being a CP then there are reasons for it being a starter.

FD is a stage benefits certain styles of play far more than all the real starters.

Also.

I'm talking strictly P:M. I'm not talking Melee. And my skill level is not a real indicator of how knowledgeable because many many players know much more than what their skill level reflects.

I like how you say you can't take me seriously when you, yourself cant even give reasons for your claims and start bringing other people's skill level into the debate as if that's supposed to be some sort of reason to invalidate what I have to say, and on top of such use Melee as part of your statements when P:M has much more viable camping/projectile options due to new characters and far more viable veterans.

I gotta say... how often do you see people choose FD to camp in tournament (In melee)?? I honestly cannot think of any instances where they are able to just stay away, and now with people advancing in power shielding and catching projectiles that kind of camping is much less relevant. Project M also apparently has ways to limit chain grabs so really FD shouldn't be that bad as a starter...

And you have to realize that in melee there are far less characters who are viable and have plethora of projectile options available.

There are more characters in P:M who heavily rely or can heavily rely on projectiles and runaway in P:M.

P:M will only limit CGs that are absolutely ridiculous (see shiek dthrow)

There are more CGs in P:M then there are in Melee. And ICs dont even work right now.

 

[iLink]

@9K+1: What? I said he doesn't have a projectile so he can't just sit back throwing stuff at you the whole match and actually has to get in range of you lol.

@Matt: Admittedly I'm not well known but I have more experience. My logic is, there isn't a single character that straight up turns FD into a full on CP without already having the MU be bad on other stages. Which character can camp so hard on FD that it turns into a CP?


In fact that argument is directed at neko as well,

Which character turns FD into a CP?

 

[9Kplus1]

Strawmanning isn't so fun when you're the target, now is it?

 

[iLink]

I fail to see how I was strawmanning at all when I was making multiple points and not just one to reinforce the main argument.

If anything, it was just you misinterpreting what I said.

 

[MonkUnit]

too many posts to read but what exactly is being discussed about marth on Yoshi's Island: brawl?

also, 9k+1 i dont like your avatar. just thought i'd get that out there.

 

[iLink]

Basically it rooted from Neko saying FD shouldn't be a starter stage because it encourages certain playstyles and I was stating that it can be said the same for other stages that are already starters.

And I'm talking about YI melee not brawl. I thought that was assumed from the fact that YI brawl wasn't considered a starter by anyone lol.

 

[Mattnumbers]

Ice Climbers.

And there doesn't even need to be a ridiculous matchup for certain characters to make a stage a CP anyways. What character makes Delfino Plaza a CP? None, it just has some bad mechanics that favor certain types of characters more than other potential starters do. It's not like a stage has to make a certain character godlike to not be a starter.

 

[MonkUnit]

YI melee? the one with the slanted side and flippy blocks?

lol why would you have that in your stagelist

 

[9Kplus1]

"Yoshi's Story" is the Melee stage.

I fail to see how I was strawmanning at all when I was making multiple points and not just one to reinforce the main argument.

I was stuck on the "blastzones don't directly affect MUs" discussion. I honestly cannot take this argument seriously, especially considering that we don't (... and won't ever) have control over Neko's choices, let alone his (and SoFree's) stage list. Carry on with the stage discussion, by all means.

 

[standardtoaster]

stage discussion

 

[foshio]

... It is much easier to camp on platforms, take last weekends GFs for example. Armada used the platforms on battlefield ect, to camp on Hbox. Armada chose FD as a counter pick once and lost (due to time out). And really FD is not different than melee. If you are so afraid of being chain grabbed just strike it.

 

[Mattnumbers]

That isn't the type of camping we are talking about foshio.

 

[iLink]

**** LOL yea yoshi's story not yoshi's island. I didn't even realize I was typing YI.

Ice Climbers.

And there doesn't even need to be a ridiculous matchup for certain characters to make a stage a CP anyways. What character makes Delfino Plaza a CP? None, it just has some bad mechanics that favor certain types of characters more than other potential starters do. It's not like a stage has to make a certain character godlike to not be a starter.

Please tell me you don't think 1 character warrants that stage to be a CP

 

[Mattnumbers]

**** LOL yea yoshi's story.



Please tell me you don't think 1 character warrants that stage to be a CP

I don't, but you asked for one character so I gave it to you.

Which character turns FD into a CP?

 

[robosteven]

And then we all got mad.

Monk, that gif is perfect.

 

[Mattnumbers]

And Monk, we're having a discussion in a discussion thread. Nothing wrong with it. It's not like we have anything else to talk about.

 

[hotdogturtle]

FD is still very much a viable starter depending on the characters.

That's pretty much why it becomes a CP.

 

[iLink]

Ok for the sake of your argument. Which characters make FD be a CP?

@hotdog: The thing is, if that character has a bad MU on FD, chances are its not any different on most stages.

 

[hotdogturtle]

Hmm, I probably shouldn't have jumped into this conversation from the previous page without reading the last page first.

 

[9Kplus1]

And then we all got mad.

Monk, that gif is perfect.

And Monk, we're having a discussion in a discussion thread. Nothing wrong with it. It's not like we have anything else to talk about.

Yeah, like I've said multiple times already, StandardUnit does indeed exist -- and is a combination of two members.

That's pretty much why it becomes a CP.

This post is so true, but with enough effort, can be argued for any stage. Really, let's just leave FD at "So many characters can run away / camp on this stage". Again, Neko is going to do what he feels is good. No sense in arguing against something as petty as stage viability, and to an extent, legality.

 

[robosteven]

Suggesting the possibility of FD as a CP

I'm done with this thread.

 

[OmegaMuffin]

Why does that guy have gasoline underneath his computer desk?

 

[standardtoaster]

And then we all got mad.

Monk, that gif is perfect.

stop confusing me with him ;_;

 

[Mattnumbers]

IC's, anyone else who ends up having a particularly good chain grab game, any character with decent projectiles (especially if they are a character that can cover ground quickly), characters with excellent ground control. Not going to list many specific characters as most of them are up for revision but a couple very likely ones are Diddy, Samus, and Tink.

I'm done with this thread.

Oh no someone challenged tradition. BURN THE WITCH.