Pogeymafia: Red and Green - OVER! Who lived happily ever after in Kanto?

[#HBC | ZoZo]

How about an accusation first?

 

[CT Chia]

Then why did you respond to him in the first place lol

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Was asking his opinion on the matters at hand and asked if he had anything to add to the conversation.
English fail.

FAAAAARfetch'd? Pika pikaaa, pikachuuuuu. Dude, geo geo.

Beside that, do you have anything to say, Ronike?

 

[CT Chia]

I read it as you replying in poke'speak and asking Ronike if he had anything to say to it.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

I know. English fail. Who would you rather lynch, Mew2 or a trainer?

 

[Tom]

Route 1-1
Ryker (2) KevinM, McFox
Ronike (2) Ryker, Kirbyoshi
McFox (2) Summoner, Xonar
SummonerAU (2) frozenflame, SwordsR
frozenflame (1) Gheb
Xonar (1) Ronike

Not voting (5) MetaKirby, Omis, Hando, Chibo, Chaco

With 15 players alive, it takes 8 to lynch!
A deadline has been set for Sunday, March 21st, Noon EST.

 

[KevinM]

I hate games of this matter because I'm not sure if things are scumtells or just people being dumb.

 

[CT Chia]

I know. English fail. Who would you rather lynch, Mew2 or a trainer?

While both are inherently bad for Wild Pokemon, I'm inclined to believe that trainers recruit and Mewtwo kills (we know that killing and recruiting are both night actions and that trainers do recruit, which means that Mewtwo can't recruit and likely kills. Trainers then recruit, and maybe kill, but I would say it's less likely for them to be able to do both). If you're recruited though, you can still win the game, if you're killed though, you're done (unless your faction wins). I would say Mewtwo is a greater immediate threat then.

 

[Handorin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nK1iPO7-VwA&feature=related

Suuup guys...
Honestly I think the main target should be...
the trainers......
They dwindle our numbers faster...than Mewtwo can...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLfoFYOzmjA
(assuming he can kill....)
And killing the trainer puts in a better number posi...
Vote: Xona.....

I'll just...
go over here and.........
*falls down*

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Btw guys, I just reread the flavor. The trainers get 3 balls, that mean that if they recruit, recruits are limited. While it's probably also possible to find a new ball, it's highly doubtful that an actual trainer does so.
So, assuming recruits are limited, what do you guys think about trainers? Independent from each other? @some, still a greater threat then mewtwo?

 

[CT Chia]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nK1iPO7-VwA&feature=related

Suuup guys...
Honestly I think the main target should be...
the trainers......
They dwindle our numbers faster...than Mewtwo can...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLfoFYOzmjA
(assuming he can kill....)
And killing the trainer puts in a better number posi...
Vote: Xona.....

I'll just...
go over here and.........
*falls down*

how do they dwindle the numbers faster?

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

I bet pokemon have PR's too, looking at the sample role PM

unvote vote: xonar

Hes not a pokemon

FAAAAARfetch'd? Pika pikaaa, pikachuuuuu. Dude, geo geo.

Ronike, anything to say?

How about an accusation first?

Was asking his opinion on the matters at hand and asked if he had anything to add to the conversation.
English fail.

I know. English fail. Who would you rather lynch, Mew2 or a trainer?

Btw guys, I just reread the flavor. The trainers get 3 balls, that mean that if they recruit, recruits are limited. While it's probably also possible to find a new ball, it's highly doubtful that an actual trainer does so.
So, assuming recruits are limited, what do you guys think about trainers? Independent from each other? @some, still a greater threat then mewtwo?

lol @ accusation dodging. Ronike has a legit callout here on a potential freudian slip and Xonar literally just acts ******** in response and then attempts on multiple occasions to redirect attention back to previous topics without even attempting to dismiss Ronike's call out.

I mean, I guess I'm willing to buy the "english fail thing" but once you understood that your original post didnt make sense, don't you think you should have revised it and re-posted ACTUALLY addressing what Ronike had already said, as opposed to asking him to post something else? Especially when his previous post directly pertains to you...

But yeah, not liking attempts to re-direct focus to faction speculation and "what do you guys think about the trainers" in particular makes me more sympathetic to Ronike's suggestion that you've got trainers on a higher attention pedestal than others because you are one.

No better way to find out how the trainers work than to lynch on and see the flip.

Unvote: Summoner Vote: Xonar

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nK1iPO7-VwA&feature=related

Suuup guys...
Honestly I think the main target should be...
the trainers......
They dwindle our numbers faster...than Mewtwo can...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLfoFYOzmjA
(assuming he can kill....)
And killing the trainer puts in a better number posi...
Vote: Xona.....

I'll just...
go over here and.........
*falls down*

lol at ridiculous [fake?]posting restriction. Not sure what to think of this.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

FF, you probably should've realised when I asked him for a real accusation that I didn't know what the **** he was talking about because he only posted
'Hes not a pokemon'

My 'slip' about the sample role PM was merely because I figured some Pokemon (whom can possibly include myself) DON'T have a power, so that if someone who doesn't have a power asked me about it, I wouldn't have to reference to the sample role PM.
So FF, what do you suggest I could've discussed back then? I could've also just done nothing instead of create discussion.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Personally, I don't care what faction Red and Green are currently. I'm not interested in getting recruited and then killed because I'm tied to someone else. Not to mention that I was told to eliminate threats to wild Pokemon. It was my assumption that this included the trainers, considering once you're caught, you AREN'T a wild Pokemon anymore.

The way I figure it, Red and Green are two opposing recruiting factions, and Mewtwo is probably an imdepedent. That's the assumption I was going off of, given the flavor setup, that's what made sense to me.

This is a very reasonable response.

A trainer's ability to catch a wild Pokémon and to make it his own is a direct threat to them. By getting caught they're slowly decimating in number unless a trainer is lynched. It seems like a trainer has 3 Pokéballs in his custody to recruit wild Pokémon, which makes them take the trainer's allignment (at least that's what I'm getting from the posts I've read so far although I don't remeber seeing it in the OP).

If this is the case then it also seems likely that Red and Green are the only members of their respective faction toDay because number wise it would probably be the most balanced way to handle this mechanic. As a consequence however, it seems unlikely that Mewto is also a recruiter. First of all Mewto doesn't use Pokéballs to catch other Pokémon and second of all I highly doubt the presence of three recruiting factions.

McFox, I'm not catching your drift. You say we need to make sure Red/Green don't recruit us and that you think Mewtwo is likely an independant. What kind of independant do you think? A killing one like an SK? If Red/Green are recruiters as you believe then would that mean they have a night kill? If not then Mewtwo would.

And yet your gunning for Red/Green over Mewtwo. Not saying I believe your explanation of everything, I'm still trying to figure things out for this game exactly, but you would rather dispose of recruiters that still let you win the game compared to a faction that can outright kill you?

There is no way to know if Mewto is the only character in the game that has a night kill ability. Two opposing recruiters, who can recruit three times make this seem more likely though. You should keep in mind that there are still other ways to kill players in mafia games.

- If there is a Vigilante he can probably be recruited
- Witch / Interceptor are conditional killing roles
- PGOs exist and M3D used a similar role in HP Mafia
- There might be an ability or an item that allows players to perform a night kill

These are just some examples of alternative ways to kill players. If you read through HP Mafia you'll see that there were almost always 2 or 3 kills in each night. So saying that Mewto is the only character who can kill people is a bit too early - in fact we don't know if he can kill at all.

Would everyone stop rolefishing and scumhunt now? As far as i'm concerned, this what role is red/green/mewtwo thing is getting us nowhere.

Too early to make such a statement. I like Frozen's case against Xonar and it's directly rooted in the discussion we had so far. No need to dismiss it yet.

Speculating about possible roles is only bad if somebody hints at a particular thing too hard. If we speculate about anti-town factions we don't make knowledge to the mafia available that they can't already have themselves.

FF, you probably should've realised when I asked him for a real accusation that I didn't know what the **** he was talking about because he only posted
'Hes not a pokemon'

I bet pokemon have PR's too, looking at the sample role PM

Unvote Vote Xonar

My 'slip' about the sample role PM was merely because I figured some Pokemon (whom can possibly include myself) DON'T have a power, so that if someone who doesn't have a power asked me about it, I wouldn't have to reference to the sample role PM.
So FF, what do you suggest I could've discussed back then? I could've also just done nothing instead of create discussion.

No bull.
Even the sample role PM does have a PR (50% of blocking night actions).

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Like I said, Gheb, I referenced to the Sample Role PM because IT HAS A PR. Exactly like you said. I was clarifying for people without a special power.

Besides, let's pull it back into context now:
Chibo said:

Pretty much, we're not dealing with Town PR's like in most mafia games, and we don't have to worry about exposing them.

Then I replied

I bet pokemon have PR's too, looking at the sample role PM

 

[~ Gheb ~]

All players have PRs in M3D's games. It's been like this in HP Mafia and Tom also told me it's been like this in every game he hosted in the BRoom.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Gheb, it's still a power. I didn't notice what Ronike was saying until Frozen posted all those quotes. Don't think it's legitimate.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

God**** ninjas. Every god**** game. I can't take my time and think.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

All players have PRs in M3D's games. It's been like this in HP Mafia and Tom also told me it's been like this in every game he hosted in the BRoom.

Look in my game history, I never played a game hosted by M3D.
I didn't realise what Ronike's accusation was, and I'll be honest, it was stupid to only reference to the role PM as everyone has a 'power' tab in his role PM, but apperantly Chibo was the one who didn't realise that (as seen in my quote) or am I misreading your post Chibo?
I'm referencing to this part of 34:

FoS: Swords - For trying to keep the more powerful roles a complete secret. Unless there are other wild pokemon out there that are considerably more powerful (which idk if that would work since then that would/could make the trainer that owns them (if recruited) OP'd). Pretty much, we're not dealing with Town PR's like in most mafia games, and we don't have to worry about exposing them. The only time you should be worried about the "PRs" in this game (meaning Red Green and Mewtwo) being exposed is when you are aligned under one of them, and atm, no one is recruited yet (since you cant recruit on night 0), then no wild pokemon should be worried about PRs being exposed or not.

Could you elaborate on the post or reconstruct it in such a way that I'll understand better?

FF, what is wrong about continuing discussing like I did?

 

[Ronike]

Gheb, it's still a power. I didn't notice what Ronike was saying until Frozen posted all those quotes. Don't think it's legitimate.

Then you are a moron. Xonars done nothing bu try to cover his slip so far. Fact of the matter is, he didn't say SOME pokes might have prs, he said pokemon might have prs also. Plus he's talkin about the mechanic like he has inside info, specially the three recruit thing. That may be in the opening flavor, but I didn't see it anywhere (anf can't check cause I'm on my phone). But xonar trainer Lynch is legit, let's just hang back fo a bit before we get this trainer scum outta here

 

[CT Chia]

lol @ accusation dodging. Ronike has a legit callout here on a potential freudian slip and Xonar literally just acts ******** in response and then attempts on multiple occasions to redirect attention back to previous topics without even attempting to dismiss Ronike's call out.

I mean, I guess I'm willing to buy the "english fail thing" but once you understood that your original post didnt make sense, don't you think you should have revised it and re-posted ACTUALLY addressing what Ronike had already said, as opposed to asking him to post something else? Especially when his previous post directly pertains to you...

But yeah, not liking attempts to re-direct focus to faction speculation and "what do you guys think about the trainers" in particular makes me more sympathetic to Ronike's suggestion that you've got trainers on a higher attention pedestal than others because you are one.

No better way to find out how the trainers work than to lynch on and see the flip.

Unvote: Summoner Vote: Xonar

lol at ridiculous [fake?]posting restriction. Not sure what to think of this.

The accusation dodging was obvious, but reading over the posts you quoted again makes me think that it is a slip. The fact that he said "I bet Pokemon have PR's too" really feels like a slip suggesting that he's either a powerless (vanilla?) pokemon or not a wild pokemon. Wild pokemon can have both attributes and powers, do you think there are some wilds that don't have either?

Vote: Xonar

 

[CT Chia]

Look in my game history, I never played a game hosted by M3D.
I didn't realise what Ronike's accusation was, and I'll be honest, it was stupid to only reference to the role PM as everyone has a 'power' tab in his role PM, but apperantly Chibo was the one who didn't realise that (as seen in my quote) or am I misreading your post Chibo?
I'm referencing to this part of 34:

Could you elaborate on the post or reconstruct it in such a way that I'll understand better?

FF, what is wrong about continuing discussing like I did?

I realized this, but you can't deny the possibility of some pokemon having stronger powers/attributes than others.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Then you are a moron. Xonars done nothing bu try to cover his slip so far. Fact of the matter is, he didn't say SOME pokes might have prs, he said pokemon might have prs also. Plus he's talkin about the mechanic like he has inside info, specially the three recruit thing. That may be in the opening flavor, but I didn't see it anywhere (anf can't check cause I'm on my phone). But xonar trainer Lynch is legit, let's just hang back fo a bit before we get this trainer scum outta here

Wrong.

Stop twisting my words.

"I bet pokemon have PR's too..."

Obviously, I said "pokemon might have pr's" I don't get the bad thing about saying 'some' or not? where are you going with this?

The 3 recruit thing was speculation, just like every other set-up speculation I've done. This accusation is just wrong. Besides, the trainer got 3 POKEBALLS. 3 balls = 3 recruits, don't you agree?

What is 'that' exactly? the three recruit thing? The trainers got 3 balls.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

The accusation dodging was obvious, but reading over the posts you quoted again makes me think that it is a slip. The fact that he said "I bet Pokemon have PR's too" really feels like a slip suggesting that he's either a powerless (vanilla?) pokemon or not a wild pokemon. Wild pokemon can have both attributes and powers, do you think there are some wilds that don't have either?

Vote: Xonar

Gheb said everyone has a PR in M3D's games. I bet all wilds have a power.

I realized this, but you can't deny the possibility of some pokemon having stronger powers/attributes than others.

You're dodging my question. I asked you to elaborate or at least reconstruct the post so I can understand better.


I can't dodge an accusation if I don't know what the accusation is.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Rofl. I agree with Xonar that you guys are shooting blanks.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Inb4 obvious buddying

 

[Ronike]

Ryker, slips are easily one of the best ways to hit scum d1. Worked in bwm and other games (none of which immediately come to mind but I know they exist)

xonar, you were talking about pokemon like you weren't one. The fact that you had to speculate on whether pokes have prs is also telling. The prs? They are a pokemons ability in the game. Every single poke has one, therefore, it's almost certain that every poke has an ability. The fact that you don't realize this, and on top of that you claim to be vanilla, screams not poke to me. Know who's not a poke? Trainers. Know who's a trainer? Xonar. That being said I'm inviting cause I don't want the day to end fast and think we should take our time and let everyone talk.

unvote

 

[M.K]

The accusation dodging was obvious, but reading over the posts you quoted again makes me think that it is a slip. The fact that he said "I bet Pokemon have PR's too" really feels like a slip suggesting that he's either a powerless (vanilla?) pokemon or not a wild pokemon. Wild pokemon can have both attributes and powers, do you think there are some wilds that don't have either?

Vote: Xonar

I'm really going to have to agree with this. Pretty much sums up what I was going to say in regard's to Xonar's word slip. Vote: Xonar
I agree that his slip indicates that he's not a wild pokemon, but I disagree about him being a wild pokemon with NO powers. I mean, the SamplePM in the first post is Paras. He's got to be the most worthless piece of bug **** you've ever seen, yet he still has a power. The only powerless WP I could think of is Magikarp.

Oh, and Hando sounds like SNOORRLAXXX.

^Hando?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

FoS Meta-Kirby

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

FF, you probably should've realised when I asked him for a real accusation that I didn't know what the **** he was talking about because he only posted
'Hes not a pokemon'

My 'slip' about the sample role PM was merely because I figured some Pokemon (whom can possibly include myself) DON'T have a power, so that if someone who doesn't have a power asked me about it, I wouldn't have to reference to the sample role PM.
So FF, what do you suggest I could've discussed back then? I could've also just done nothing instead of create discussion.

Right, I do realize that you probably didn't understand what he meant considering other people seemed to have missed it as well, and english isn't your native language. That's fine, and I completely buy that you didn't understand what we was accusing you of.

There are still two major problems though, one being the way you phrased your initial post, and the other being the way you reacted to it when you didn't understand what he was saying. I'll go into these in greater detail:

Like I said, Gheb, I referenced to the Sample Role PM because IT HAS A PR. Exactly like you said. I was clarifying for people without a special power.

Besides, let's pull it back into context now:
Chibo said:

Then I replied

You said "I bet pokemon have PR's too, looking at the sample role PM." This syntax is highly exclusionary of yourself in a passive nature. You didn't actively separate yourself from the group you were describing, but the way you phrased your sentence, it was certainly SUGGESTIVE of the idea that you PERSONALLY have a PR and are NOT a pokemon. Thus, you coming to the realization that pokemon might have PRs AS WELL, when compared to yourself as a non-pokemon with a PR, makes sense. Hence, where Ronike drew his accusation from. I'm not saying this MUST be the case, I'm just saying, this is why he said what he did. Thus, this is the first major issue I have with what you said.

The second issue is with your responses. As I already pointed out in my previous post, you first babbled nonsense and THEN asked Ronike if he had "anything to say" when he had CLEARLY just made a post directed at you. He ALREADY said something. If you were confused about his accusation, you should have asked for clarification THEN, as opposed to trying to play it off like a joke and redirect discussion. The rest of my point ties into your next question:

FF, what is wrong about continuing discussing like I did?

Nothing is wrong with continuing discussion. I'm not attacking you for talking. However, trying to REDIRECT discussion away from a direct accusation ON YOU looks bad, no buts about it. If you were confused, you did a poor job of making that clear and just dug your whole deeper by trying to wiggle into another topic, and then asking for clarification AFTER THE FACT when you come under fire for it.

Wrong.

Stop twisting my words.

Obviously, I said "pokemon might have pr's" I don't get the bad thing about saying 'some' or not? where are you going with this?

The 3 recruit thing was speculation, just like every other set-up speculation I've done. This accusation is just wrong. Besides, the trainer got 3 POKEBALLS. 3 balls = 3 recruits, don't you agree?

I hope I covered this semantic misunderstanding at the beginning of my post. Though what you literally posted is just a suggestion that pokemon might have PRs, the structure of the sentence suggests you unintentionally alluded to MORE than just that, as I hope I clarified.

 

[Ronike]

Frozen we should be pals this game

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Inb4 obvious buddying

Frozen we should be pals this game

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

"it was certainly SUGGESTIVE of the idea that you PERSONALLY have a PR and are NOT a pokemon."

True. Can't defend from this and I agree that up til now I should've worded my posts better. Including that I 'ignored' the accusation.
You see, when people make those kind of posts (marshy etc) it's usually better to ignore them rather then ask for elaboration, at least that's what my experiences tell me. I thought Ronike was copying them and thus ignored him, instead asking him on his view on the situation.

 

[Ronike]

< / 3

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

@chibo

You're dodging my question. I asked you to elaborate or at least reconstruct the post so I can understand better.

@frozenflame.
Look at your first post:
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9791597&postcount=52

Then at your second:
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9792289&postcount=70

Simple question... Did your intention change when writing post 70? What was your intention when typing 52, and what was your intention while typing 70?

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Oh and Unvote for now, wanna hear more people

and Request Votecount please :3

 

[SwordsRbroken]

So far i'm liking FF's case on Xonar. First, Unvote. Secondly, i find myself agreeing with gheb's points. Except for one thing. Has it ever been that one player has been a VT in one of M3D's games with everyone else having a power role? Would like Summoner to post something of substance too.

Yeah, Xonar has dropped major scumslip, he needs to go. Vote: Xonar

Meanwhile, Chibo, i find it fishy that you think the supposed SK should be lynched first. You realize that if one/both the trainers has a full boat of pokemon and is killed, he/they could cause a bunch of townies to go down with them? They're both equally as dangerous, as if this "supposed SK" is even in the game, then if he hit the trainer, then 4 players are gone. I don't like your reasoning. FoS: Chibo

 

[SwordsRbroken]

*sigh* never leave a page up for a few hours after you open it.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

With the information we have so far, it's safest to assume that all three factions are an equal threat. I also don't like how it seems most people are assuming that there are no Vanillas.

Unvote, Vote:Chibo

 

[SwordsRbroken]

Rofl. I agree with Xonar that you guys are shooting blanks.

If xonar is a trainer/mewtwo, i'm coming after you next.