Pizza Mafia - Over! Who lived happily ever after in the land of Tito's refrigerator?

[Dooms]

I see.

JTB.

 

[#HBC | J]

Thank you for clarifying.

Yeah I know, I just checked back and more than 3/4ths of his posts are RVS or getting out of RVS banter. I will talk about his post on J though

I actually have to disagree on this. Not saying it's particularly false in this case, but you can reaction test people to see if they react how you want them to, and with that reaction get a read on them. That being said though do you still think that J's 180 wasn't looking for a reaction?

Who are you considering newbies in this game though?


...OP based on what? Link to his role plzkthnx.

Assume the rest of the stuff you posted I agree with.

@JTB: I'm glad you're here posting, but you're not making much sense atm.

If J's claim is to be believed, he dies if he targets scum, but lives if he targets town. While there is a lot to be said for dying to reveal scum, I don't think it was a terrible decision to aim to clear town instead. His early claim also aligns with this, since town needs to know why if he dies in the middle of the day. I don't see how this role could be considered OP either.

I'll ask you the same question I asked Gheb. If J were to flip town, would you be okay with a scum spotlight being shone on you?

@J: Did you say your power is one-shot, or am I making that up?

Why specifically do you disagree with these two posts since you said you agree with JTB's points minus the WoT one?

 

[#HBC | J]

Comment on me saying you haven't scum-hunted.

Is this statement true or false?

 

[Dooms]

Why would you waste your claim trying to clear a townie instead of trying to find a scummy? That's a waste of a 1-use PR.

I can't see what you did being a reaction test, especially you clearing him through specifically meta afterwards.

I was trying to scum hunt in the beginning, yes. False.

 

[#HBC | J]

Oh in the beginning? What about now and in the middle?

Can you give examples of you scum-hunting? Also be specific on who and why you were doing what you were doing.

Also i didn't clear him(Asdioh) on meta. Good effort though.

And it wasn't a waste of a PR. Nice try again though.

 

[#HBC | J]

Declaring V/LA pri much all day tomorrow. (4/21/11)

 

[Dooms]

It was a waste of a PR hahahahahaha.

You're right about Asdioh. You said you put him under townasdioh or something, but afterwards you explained it. mahbad.

Mostly the questions I asked early game directed to smarg, and the first question to asdioh. That's when I remember trying to scum hunt, anyways.

Not scum hunting now. Saving that for tomorrow :3.

 

[#HBC | J]

It wasn't a waste. Lol, but *pat* keep thinking that.

Wait, didn't I start the smargy scum-hunting followed by AM? Which question to Asdioh?

That's it?

So you admit that you haven't scum-hunted at all toDay for the most part and don't plan on it even though you maintain active enough to actively defend yourself when heat comes your way?

And people seriously think I am scummier over this guy? -_-" Honestly.

 

[#HBC | J]

Another question, is my PR OP?

 

[#HBC | J]

July you been viewing for quite the time girl. o_o

I bet it's gonna be a really long one this time.

 

[July]

I will not base my read on Zen based on Smarg's play. Personal choice.

Pretty much. GJ.

I'm not a big fan of this, no one is asking you to base your read on Zen completely on Smarg's play but it should be considered, I can't see how considering Smarg's play could at all hurt your read on the player slot.

I do. Zen was easy to read because he hasn't read the game yet, so it was an obvious null to me.

JTB: Townie. Gave great reasons for voting you, completely honest with not believing your BS claim, stuff like that.

Gheb: I agree with his points, and he's been trying to help the town through lynching you, so I think he's town~

ES: I have mixed views on this one.

Scummy: He was tunneling on you hard core and pressing for your lynch when we were 9 days away from deadline

Townie: Beginning of the game led me to believe that he was nothing but townie. The way he tried to direct my pressure on Smarg away from her was what made me really think the hydra was town.

Townie-null, really.

So basically,

Your reads are admittingly crap.

Your refusal to consider anything smargy did is crap.

Your reasoning for your reads are crap.

Yes?

This last one is rhetorical because it is already true and you have even said so yourself. ^_^

Die Scum.

Alright, so at first the reads being crap thing I believed because Joey's reads on Gheb, JTB, and to a large extent Soup are built around a their interactions with J. However, looking back on it pretty much all of JTB's interactions outside of RVS were with J and Gheb's focus as of recently has been J as well. With that considered I would say it is harsh to say those reads are crap, even though I disagree on the Evil Soup read.

AM: Scummy because of not backing up his statements with evidence and reasons. Gave a really bad response to it as well. "Kick reason to the curb" made me feel he was nothing but scum. Never explained his huge flip-flop on you, and is being really vague.

Actually I forgot AM when I listed the people not pushing Jscum. Anyways, I have a town read on AM and think after the he tested out the whole Jscum thing he has been quite a bit more clear on his reads which is really helpful.

Okay, I'm caught up again.



Not really feeling the Joey lynch anymore. I said Joey or J in my post partly because Joey was leaning scum for me, but partly because I wanted to see how J would react to a "i want to lynch someone or j" scenario where that someone isn't Asdioh. Everyone can decide for themselves whether J's behaviour following this post is related to this at all, but I think it's something to note for sure.

This is what I saw - I will try to stick to relaying events as objectively as possible for this paragraph. J asks me about Joey, saying some of his posts were "weird". He places an FoS here - no vote. JTB posts with a vote on J, and J drops the Joey topic for a while. JTB wagon does not pick up... Gheb and July say there's not much scummy about it, and I don't dwell much on it at all. Joey's only significant post in the meantime is a vote on AM. After JTB pressure dies, J asks AM what he thinks of Joey's vote on him. At this point, J is town's top lynch candidate, and he cannot pressure Asdioh because he has said he has a town read on him. I say "J or Joey for me". J asks me to elaborate on the Joey pick. I do not respond. J and Joey proceed to have a conversation, and at the end J says "Die scum".

Now, here's my analysis:



Joey makes posts 611, 617, 630, 635. 630 is really the only significant post in my eyes. 611 and 617 were both responded to directly by J, and he didn't seem to see much scumminess in them. 630 contains the vote on AM. 635 is nothing. Then he makes post 702, which sparks this conversation between Joey and J. With post 630, and the conversation, J changes his opinion of Joey from "FoS weird" to "Die scum".

The conversation is odd, and seems to contain some strange leaps on logic. This post is ridiculous:



When reading this, I did a double take and thought "whoa where'd that come from". The way he is applying pressure is unproductive as well in my opinion, and doesn't feel very townie.

Does this have anything to do with the fact that I said "J or Joey"? Maybe... maybe not. What does everyone else think?

@J: Can you explain the post I quoted above? How did you arrive at those conclusions?

@AM: Can we get a solid statement of your stance on J? You said he was scummy earlier, but you seem to be treating him a town at the moment.

T-Block, I do find this conversation significant and J makes some leaps in this conversation that are above and beyond what he would need to make a case on Joey. Calling Joey's reads crap really didn't achieve much but just kept the convo going and added fuel to the fire. Really the interactions between J and Joey that have gone on have devolved away from scumhunting and seem too nitpicky on J's side and...well Joey admits he isn't planning to scumhunt toDay so just defense from Joey. I think your suggestion is a possibility if J is scum, which I'm still not honestly sold on but is a possibility.

T-Block, do you feel that the J/Joey interactions are most likely T v. T, T v. S, or S v. S?

This isn't as long as I wanted, but I really need to sleep. It's difficult playing catchup while others are going to be doing so. Sorry.

J: I don't even. Let's see. Pushed for early claims on people, then claimed a what I'm going to refer to very kindly as a ******** role which has absolutely zero chance of being actually accurate. Not to mention, J was nowhere near hammer range when the claim occurred. Buddying of T-Block, distancing of Asdioh have been noted. I guess in the end, I’m looking at J as Mafia, but that isn’t something I’m fully believing quite yet. While I appreciate the effort you’re putting in to raise activity, I don’t really like specifics (such as pointing towards previous metagame).

Joey: Leaning Mafia. Why have you become so easily swayed? At first you seemed to be playing to win, but then this devolved into "Eh I have a decent Mafia read so if anyone else appears worse I'll focus on them." I don't understand why your playstyle would follow such an ideal. I’ve noted that you’re opinions and being swayed, which is something I’ve seen before. I think you need to start discussing multiple picks rather than a single one. Most notably, is your argument against Asdioh, accusing a weak offensive with…a weak offensive.

T-Block: Town. T-Block has consistently been making solid / valid points that I can understand. Not much else to say, honestly. T-Block will have to make really poor posts to convince my read to turn around.

Aggressive Mediation: Leaning Town. Not because of J’s role, because that would an absurb ground to stand upon. Your recurring posting habits is getting on my nerves, but it’s not against the rules or anything, so. Nyah.

Asdioh: Town. I’ve always liked how Asdioh plays, for whatever strange reasons. No conflicting opinions thus far, and if any, they were pretty minor.

Evil Soup: Town. Reasoning behind distrusting previous metagame is fair. Haven’t paid all too much attention to this hydra to be honest. I’m working on that.

Zen: Neutral. I was satisfied with how Smargaret answered my main question. I'll need to pursue Zen to determine a better read. Hopefully, I'll be more active towards this cause. I do think you should be trying to read through the game on your own, rather than ask opinions from some other player. I also don’t understand why you’re so willing to believe J’s claim.

Glyph / Roxy: We three should work together, and by that I mean post more and stuff.

Overall, some people need to clam the jokes / humor. J, Joey, Gheb, Aggressive Mediation are examples. I’m satisfied with Joey or J’s lynch. Not a huge fan of Zen, either.

Definitely like the effort put into this post and I think that even the parts that I disagree with have really good analysis, and very honest such as with his read on Asdioh. Strongly leaning town with Tery.

@Tery: Same question as to T-Block, do you feel that the J/Joey interactions are most likely T v. T, T v. S, or S v. S?

Does anyone else think Joey is being a bit confident or am I just crazy? Like even just a teency bit.

Cuz I see a truckload of confidence coming from someone who says they have no confidence whatsoever.

Tery, you are 100% right.

Not that it matters much but I'm seeing more a sense of non-caring/sarcasm than straight up confidence. I didn't get a particularly confident feeling from his reads on Zen, JTB, Gheb, and Evil Soup; in his stances against you J I could see some confidence behind there.

I also wanna say something about Joey this game. He is following through with what he has done before as mafia.

He doesn't scum-hunt at all. He only defends himself and hops on each and every bandwagon he can as quick as he can while he can. Can anyone pull up any examples of Joey legitamately trying to find scum or scum-hunt anyone this game besides calling people out on "weak attacks" on himself, hopping on a wagon that has already been made, went against town-flow, or do anything of that sort? All I see from Joey is defense/defense/defense/over-confidence/joking/sarcasm/not-caring.

Basically do get what I'm saying if you don't like paragraphs. (>.>) I have yet to see Joey scum-hunt because he hasn't done any scum-hunting this game.

Considering Tery agrees with that first bolded part, that meta does have some significance, and Joey admitted that he would rather defend himself right now and scumhunt tomorrow while J has at least been looking and analyzing what he has even though it has gotten a little too far stretched at some points. From the J/Joey interactions I'm still leaning scum on Joey more so than J and think this is most likely T v. S type interaction.

@J: I don't think this got too long but I took a break to talk to Ran :3 although it's because I have a random fever that I'm not sure what to do about : (

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

Okay I've put this game off for long enough, time to buckle down and get into it

Is what I'll be saying tomorrow when I'm not getting home from a concert at 1:30 am

 

[Asdioh]

well Joey admits he isn't planning to scumhunt toDay so just defense from Joey.

I could be wrong, but I took that as him saying he's not scumhunting because he's running on very little sleep, and after he gets some sleep he'll get back into it.

I'm still feeling pretty strongly that Joey is scum, but maybe he'll do better after he's rested. >_>



freaking glyph

 

[#HBC | J]

J/AM/Asdioh/July/Tery/T-Block = town reads I am comfortable as sayin town for a looooong time. 2 I know for a fact are town.

Gheb/Joey/JTB/Glyph/ES/Zen/Roxy = those seven hide 3 scum slots.

I wanna say Gheb/Roxy are town but i have two bros telling me otherwise...

If i take out those two though i have Joey/JTB/Glyph/Zen/ES as the scummies. 3/5 shot.

Joey/ES can be a scum team combo.
Joey/Gheb arnt on the same same team.

Yea that's my standings atm. I like narrowing things down this way.

The only read that would have me facepalming so much is if I am wrong on Asdioh after all that work.

 

[July]

I could be wrong, but I took that as him saying he's not scumhunting because he's running on very little sleep, and after he gets some sleep he'll get back into it.

I'm still feeling pretty strongly that Joey is scum, but maybe he'll do better after he's rested. >_>



freaking glyph

No woops that was my bad, I meant today not ToDay >< Yes I think that he was saying the same thing, my point was only that in the J/Joey convo toDay there was more defense than scumhunting from Joey.

 

[Asdioh]

J/AM/Asdioh/July/Tery/T-Block = town reads I am comfortable as sayin town for a looooong time. 2 I know for a fact are town.

you're confident on Tery town already?

I wanna say Gheb/Roxy are town but i have two bros telling me otherwise...

hm?

Joey/ES can be a scum team combo.
Joey/Gheb arnt on the same same team.

Yea that's my standings atm. I like narrowing things down this way.

I like to do that as well, figure out who can't be scum together. For example, pretty sure you and joey can't be scum together.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

Why would you waste your claim trying to clear a townie instead of trying to find a scummy? That's a waste of a 1-use PR.

Not really?

I can't see what you did being a reaction test, especially you clearing him through specifically meta afterwards.

huh

I was trying to scum hunt in the beginning, yes. False.

How bout n-

>I'm saving it for tomorrow

All my rage. The day is not over, we have not lynched scum (lopl at J being scum), and we're not even close to a lynch. The J wagon is kinda stalling as it is and the only ammo is he "seems fake" while the guy who originated the lynch won't say why and it's too late now for me to accept a genuine answer as he can pull a JTB and just summarize what others have said.

Do things, Joey, the day is not over yet.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

@AM: Can we get a solid statement of your stance on J? You said he was scummy earlier, but you seem to be treating him a town at the moment.

We suspected him because of role-fishing, then li'l bro stepped up.

Who the hell do you think we are?!

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

Whoops.

10char

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Unvote Vote Asdioh

J, why are you playing so awfully, atrociously, terribly terrible? If I didn't pick *it* up I would've been all over you now for your awful stances and your unbearable amount of fluff / dumb questions.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

J/AM/Asdioh/July/Tery/T-Block = town reads I am comfortable as sayin town for a looooong time. 2 I know for a fact are town.

J - OK but I hate you very much now
AM - Since you basically vouch for him. You 3 are all playing bad atm though
Asdioh - You can't be serious
July / T-Block - OK
Tery - lol? How is he more town than Roxy / Glyph? For that one post you like of him? I call BS

Gheb/Joey/JTB/Glyph/ES/Zen/Roxy = those seven hide 3 scum slots.

-dead- @ bold

Gheb - are you high?
Joey - all I've seen is a reaching case on him by you
JTB - you're basically sheeping AM here with little genuine reasoning
Glyph - OK
ES - possibly
Zen - Elaborate?
Roxy - possibly

I wanna say Gheb/Roxy are town but i have two bros telling me otherwise...

Who do you think I am?

J, AM, July, T, Joey, me - town / not mafia, everybody else can die.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

J, I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you I hate you.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Thought I would post.

I have been actively lurking the thread, and have been rereading.

After that awful claim by j, i started to think if the gambit was really that scummy, and I came to the conclusion that its not.

Two reasons:
1. The claim wasn't even at l1, and it was an early game claim, I do not believe scum would pull such a gambit that early.

2. The claim has pro town intentions in itself, but as I stated, its a very shady claim, but I can see it being used as a reaction test, none the less. The fact is, I'm not ready to believe the claim is real, but I'm ready to believe j is town, and I shouldn't revolve around the claim.

Onto the jtb and Joey scuffle, I think Joey and jtb are hella scummy, but I think a Joey flip will give us a lot More to work for, Joey has interactions while jtb just bursted through, only talking about the j claim.

Its scummy, yes, but I don't think he should be todays priority, Joey should.

I already stated we had a scum read on Joey, and his recent play doesn't sit well with me.

unvote vote Joey

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Forget J's claim it's complete BS

 

[JTB]

Should've posted this yesterday, but I'm going to be V/LA until Sunday, I am just completely overwhelmed right now.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Okay Joey, now you're really matching perfectly with previous games. You're choosing not to Mafia hunt, when the Day is not yet over, choosing to be opportunistic and jumping on others people pick on. That's not hunting. That's taking advantage of the situation others are placing right in front of you. Consistently making sarcastic comments is also irritating. If you really are Mafia, I can't believe you've laid out your tactics in front of two other players who understand / analyzed your Mafia playstyle. It's absurd. Call this my softer nature, but I don't want to fully believe this yet. Maybe this is why I'm Teryble at Mafia.

My opinion on J is making a semi-comeback. Maybe only because of the interactions with Joey, and Joey just looks really bad right now. However, J tends to distance himself from his Mafia buddies, so this could just be a neat little plan the entire way, including the ridiculous claim, etc.

Joey vs. J seems Mafia vs. Town. Or Mafia vs. Mafia. Both of them cannot possibly be town.

I dunno what the votes are at the moment, so I'll hold off on voting Joey.
@Mod: Request Votecount

Asdioh, why did you pique interest in asking J about his confidence in my alignment but not July? Both have stated similar alignment feelings. I disagree with you thinking Joey vs. J is Mafia vs. Mafia, which is reference above. What are your opinions?

Gheb, you really dislike J's play that much? Are you sure? Because that same post shows you're voting Asdioh, for whatever strange reasons behind that. Explain yourself, please, along with other opinions on possible Mafia members if Asdioh is or isn't Mafia.

Roxy...Glyph...we need a hero...

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Joey vs. J seems Mafia vs. Town. Or Mafia vs. Mafia. Both of them cannot possibly be town.

This is dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb or scum.

Because that same post shows you're voting Asdioh, for whatever strange reasons behind that. Explain yourself, please, along with other opinions on possible Mafia members if Asdioh is or isn't Mafia.

J, AM, July, T, Joey, me - town / not mafia, everybody else can die.

Asdioh, you/Glyph/Roxy, Soup/JTB, Zen are all possible scumbags ... Zen the least likely because I had a town read on Smarg earlier.
And what's left to explain? Other than people being unable to use their own brains for once and always need somebody to spoonfeed them the ****ing game I think my points are more than clear.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

I really don't see a Joey vs. J (Town vs. Town) situation, as explained from above. I don't see how that's "dumb dumb dumb dumb or scum."

Zen has taken constant buddying with J. This has had zero effect on your reads? I liked Smargaret from earlier as well, but with Zen's introductory posts being less than stellar, I've shifted to neutral.

Just because I'm new doesn't mean you can just ignore my posts and say, "You're crap. Die."

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I really don't see a Joey vs. J (Town vs. Town) situation, as explained from above. I don't see how that's "dumb dumb dumb dumb or scum."

What you said earlier ["Both of them cannot possibly be town."]
=/=
what you're saying now ["I really don't see a Joey vs. J (Town vs. Town) situation"]

If you really try to make people believe that both can't *possibly* be town then you're drawing hasty - quite possibly wrong - conclusions. What are the pro-town implications of suggesting to lynch one and if he flips town lynch the other [which is basically the next logical step in your explanation]?
What you suggest has a much higher chance of tuning out blatantly anti-town than - the best we can get is a vague pro-town implication.

You really don't see why I have issues with that?

Zen has taken constant buddying with J. This has had zero effect on your reads? I liked Smargaret from earlier as well, but with Zen's introductory posts being less than stellar, I've shifted to neutral.

And I'm considering him a possible scumbag now ... how is that not a shift in reads? It's quite a drastic one and I'm more surprised you call me out for not changing my mind [which I have evidently done] than for changing my mind so quickly ... which I actually *have* done.

Just because I'm new doesn't mean you can just ignore my posts and say, "You're crap. Die."

That's nowhere near what I said.

 

[Evil Soup]

Concerning buddying tery, you shouldn't let it really decide town from scum, and don't play the noob card please.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

What you said earlier ["Both of them cannot possibly be town."]
=/=
what you're saying now ["I really don't see a Joey vs. J (Town vs. Town) situation"]

If you really try to make people believe that both can't *possibly* be town then you're drawing hasty - quite possibly wrong - conclusions. What are the pro-town implications of suggesting to lynch one and if he flips town lynch the other [which is basically the next logical step in your explanation]?
What you suggest has a much higher chance of tuning out blatantly anti-town than - the best we can get is a vague pro-town implication.

You really don't see why I have issues with that?

Alright. I understand. That's just my poor choice of wording. Hopefully I can polish my English to make my posts better understandable.

Asdioh, you/Glyph/Roxy, Soup/JTB, Zen are all possible scumbags ... Zen the least likely because I had a town read on Smarg earlier.

I understand where you're coming from, but considering Zen as "least likely" is not a very convincing shift.

Concerning buddying tery, you shouldn't let it really decide town from scum, and don't play the noob card please.

I'm not, I'm merely taking notes. I also wasn't using the new card, I was expressing frustration at people who think they're all that and can just take advantage of / shut down a newer player.

 

[Evil Soup]

Another thing I'd like to add:

If Joey flips scum I'm coming after you asdioh.

If town, ill decide between jtb and j, or an inactive.

 

[Evil Soup]

Gheb isn't really shutting you down though, he just wants you to figure it out yourself, or why you believe gheb has a scum read on asdioh, it helps your read on gheb AND asdioh.

 

[Evil Soup]

Town reads.
T-block
Tery
J (the freaking irony.)
July
Zen/smarg
AM

Null reads.
JTB (leaning town)
Roxy
Gheb
Glyph (post More please.)

Scum reads
Joey
Asdioh

One of those nulls can be put down here later.

 

[Evil Soup]

Changed My mind, put am down null, move JTB up.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

This is dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb or scum.





Asdioh, you/Glyph/Roxy, Soup/JTB, Zen are all possible scumbags ... Zen the least likely because I had a town read on Smarg earlier.
And what's left to explain? Other than people being unable to use their own brains for once and always need somebody to spoonfeed them the ****ing game I think my points are more than clear.

The ever swift Kamina has been beaten to the punch. Good show Gheb. I can support this post.

Who the hell do you think I am?!

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

I really don't see a Joey vs. J (Town vs. Town) situation, as explained from above. I don't see how that's "dumb dumb dumb dumb or scum."

Zen has taken constant buddying with J. This has had zero effect on your reads? I liked Smargaret from earlier as well, but with Zen's introductory posts being less than stellar, I've shifted to neutral.

Just because I'm new doesn't mean you can just ignore my posts and say, "You're crap. Die."

"Oh my god, you're a bully!"

Step it up.

Who the hell do you think I am?!

 

[T-block]

@Hydras: If you post on your non-hydra account, could you be sure to repost the same message on your hydra?

T-Block, I do find this conversation significant and J makes some leaps in this conversation that are above and beyond what he would need to make a case on Joey. Calling Joey's reads crap really didn't achieve much but just kept the convo going and added fuel to the fire. Really the interactions between J and Joey that have gone on have devolved away from scumhunting and seem too nitpicky on J's side and...well Joey admits he isn't planning to scumhunt toDay so just defense from Joey. I think your suggestion is a possibility if J is scum, which I'm still not honestly sold on but is a possibility.

My sentiments exactly.

T-Block, do you feel that the J/Joey interactions are most likely T v. T, T v. S, or S v. S?

I could see this being SvS, since the whole thing seems a little off. I could also see this being TvS, with J as scum, but I need Joey to come in here and do more stuff as he promised.

However, people seem to be thinking J is town now.

@Gheb: Is J now town in your eyes?

@ES: Can you elaborate on your townJ read? If you feel you shouldn't answer that's fine.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

Changed My mind, put am down null, move JTB up.

Score!

 

[~ Gheb ~]

@Gheb: Is J now town in your eyes?

He's so scummy I could cry. I *wish* he was scum for an easy win.

But he's town.