Persona 4 Arena Ultimax: Out in NA, It's Time You Burn That Dread

[Crusayer]

Unblockable is setting up the high (the spinny attack coming from above) from the persona and going in with a low at the same time. There some pretty nasty fire break setups too I think.

 

[sakuraZaKi]

I only know of two.

Agi B -> Maragidyne D -> Fire Break -> SB Agi

and the other in corner BnB->Agi A(hold)->Agidyne D->Fire Break->release A->Maragi(unblockable).

I think its something like that, but I'm reading up on that DL post atm, too.

It's pretty meter-y, lol.

And does anyone know if Teddie's Circus Ball thing can be avoided with Dia's projectile invulnerability?

 

[LivewiresXe]

CAUTION: LIKELY POTENTIAL WALL OF TEXT AS I DON'T KNOW HOW LONG THIS WILL GET.

Yes I am not Sion lol. My PSN is my forum name.

Lwx, you should REALLY keep the replays of your games. You're claiming you're doing things you're not doing a lot of the time. While we don't know what's going on in your head, we're experiencing against you something totally opposite of what you're saying a lot of the time.

I did luckily save a few of the games I played from the lobby, but most of them were ones that were at least semi-close. I didn't really save any that involved me getting my butt handed to me on account of frustration johns and me being all "wtf, just hit X through everything to get back to the room". I haven't watched them yet, so I can certainly do that sometime. Lol, I should probably make a shorter version of those sheet things that I do for Narukami though if I'm legit serious about picking him up (which reminds me to finish the Juri one, which is being kept notably brief on account of "I'm not printing out 50 pages on it when there could result in 500 pages of info and stuff on her", but that's off topic).

You should learn to accept Sion's advice. I remember your matches. I didn't see blue or green exclamations a lot.
You were just caught not blocking or getting CHed.

I keep telling people that in matches, I'll deliberately stay in blockstun to understand an opponent's blockstring or even IB things to help my defense.

I but...I wasn't trying to not accept his advice. Like...when I was playing I really DID 100% think I was blocking...

Snip and such.

You bring up a number of good points, and when it comes to what kind of player I am, I think it's probably easier to pinpoint what kind of player I'm NOT. For instance, I'm NOT one for the slower moving or grapple type characters because having access to mobility is something that I always like to have available to me so it counts out tank-style characters. I'm also not one to be full on all offense all the time, or a full on turtle either. I seem to like characters that have a bit of each and while I sometimes like a bit of gimmicks thrown in here and there, I don't like my characters to be based purely on gimmicks and to be like...gimmicks only to where they can't be that well without it. I also don't particularly like to be having to do a bunch of charges in rapid succession, which is odd since Charlie was an Alpha secondary.

When it comes to things and info and all that, I'm normally much better at the practical theory of what should be done than I am at the application of said theory and not letting my nerves get to me. Like, I can sometimes be oddly textbook in my thought processes, but completely unorthodox with my practices and when you try to do textbook stuff in a non-textbook way, it never works. I also often am the type that when I see something work, or hear about it being like commonly accepted as the best way of dealing with something, best use of meter, or best optimal combo, I have trouble allowing myself to drift from that. I know that sounds hilariously odd considering some of my playstyle habits over the past few days but I would likely chalk that up to not knowing/feeling comfortable with what the optimal things are, and in that case since the combos I was going for/getting off/attempting were the only ones I knew, and ones that had occasionally worked, it was difficult for me to drift from.

I kinda hate to go back to the BB example (even though I feel it's the most relatable example for you guys) but when I'm playing that, I typically stick to like 2-3 midscreen combos and 3-4 corner combos because I knew the ins and outs of them, could tell how far to backdash after the corner Assault Through, and knew that if you were going for an extended combo and were going to go 4D>Bloom Trigger to like go for more meter and stuff, you had to slightly delay before getting Bloom off or it'd whiff entirely. Like, I stuck to what I knew and it wasn't often I changed it up. Of course, I know there's probably someone scratching there head thinking "wait, what?" but to me, that's how things came across.

As for character types, I think I normally tend to go for ones that I feel I can harass a bit with, or do the get in>do damage>get out string while being able to keep people back a bit. I mean, when it came to Soul Calibur 1-4 I used Xianghua and Kilik, with Alpha 3 it was Sakura, AE2012 it's Juri and a bit Ibuki, MK9 it's Smoke, and this game Narukami's seemed to "feel the most right" so far as Yukiko's too defensive, Kanji's too slow and a grappler, Brosuke doesn't sit right at all even though I thought he would, Liz doesn't appeal to me, and Naoto just seems odd. I'm not sure what it is with Chie though, to be honest. I COULD see Labrys potentially being an option if Narukami doesn't work out, but having a defeatest attitude solves nothing. So yeah, I hesitate to call it "hit and run", but sometimes it's just a simple matter of "being able to do stuff when close, but having a semi-decent shot at keeping people out too.

That was kinda...a lot longer than I was planning on writing, but I figured giving as much insight on things and thought processes and that as I could think of at the time would probably give a better picture and stuff. Of course, with it being pretty long, I don't really expect everyone to read all that, lol.

 

[sakuraZaKi]

I'll read the lot of it later, but for that first part, I would save every replay you can. While you may have gotten your butt handed to you, you will most likely find things in the opponents play that you may learn to take advantage of if it arises again. Get a notepad and write them down if you have to. It's what I do for competitive Starcraft, lol.

If you have a list of things you want to improve, take one or two and apply them to any match you go through until you get the feel.

Also, just study about one or two good and simple combos (maybe 3) for: standing, crouching, and air. The situational stuff can come later after you get comfortable. If you look at replays you might find that a lot of us use a limited number of combos and just adjust accordingly depending on how well we know our character and yours.

And when you watch your replays, take note of those "!", so you'll know when you're blocking (or lack of).

 

[Umby]

Hm... that was pretty informative. A lot of the setups I knew, but that really helped me get a better idea on how to maximize damage off of this. Thanks.

I still can't get that fuzzy guard set up to land properly. A friend told me that I have to hit the j.B deep into the character, then buffer the j.A afterwards? I've been trying to land j.B as low as possible, but I either jump too soon and fly over the other character's head or too late and end up getting j.B > land > j.A.

 

[Teczer0]

Man, I wish I had my ps3 in my dorm room so I can hit the lab.

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[Rutger]

Oh man, Pokemon in a week, I better get in as many P4A matches as I can before that becomes the only game I play for a long time.

Man, I wish I had my ps3 in my dorm room so I can hit the lab.

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Why is there a Etrian Odyssey medic with the Persona characters?

Gunner would make more sense. :/
[COLLAPSE="Jack Frost hat pin"]

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No wait, why is Yukari labeled P4?


No wait, what even is that?

 

[Teczer0]

I actually got back from meeting my professor and found out I don't have too much work to do! Meaning for me, that I can hopefully go home early in the week so I can play you guys, if anyone is available later this week :3

I also want to main Naoto with Rise assist navigator now

[collapse=For this reason pretty much]

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[Sion]

yoo gunner <3

maybe atlus is doing this on purpose

 

[Minato]

I still can't get that fuzzy guard set up to land properly. A friend told me that I have to hit the j.B deep into the character, then buffer the j.A afterwards? I've been trying to land j.B as low as possible, but I either jump too soon and fly over the other character's head or too late and end up getting j.B > land > j.A.

First, make sure that the enemy is set to standing and blocking. Otherwise it won't work on a lot of characters. 2nd, make sure it's not Labrys, Shabrys, or Teddie since it doesn't work on them. It's easiest to do it on Yu, Yosuke, and Mitsuru. The rest are kind of difficult but manageable. Your friend is right though on how to do it, it just takes practice.

You can't jump cancel the deep j.B too early or too late. Too early and your j.A goes too high, too late and you'll end up landing before the jump cancel kicks in.

 

[Umby]

First, make sure that the enemy is set to standing and blocking. Otherwise it won't work on a lot of characters. 2nd, make sure it's not Labrys, Shabrys, or Teddie since it doesn't work on them. It's easiest to do it on Yu, Yosuke, and Mitsuru. The rest are kind of difficult but manageable. Your friend is right though on how to do it, it just takes practice.

You can't jump cancel the deep j.B too early or too late. Too early and your j.A goes too high, too late and you'll end up landing before the jump cancel kicks in.

Ah, makes sense. I didn't start with him blocking.

Also, I'm going to set up a lobby a around 9pm EST, in case anyone would like an invite.

 

[Sion]

i'll be on

 

[Rutger]

I'll play Umby, I don't think I have you on my friend list so I'll send a friend request.

 

[Jam Stunna]

Shoot me an invite, I'll come in a little later

 

[Rutger]

I am way too autopilot right now. :/



*sigh*
I'll try working on my connection tomorrow.

GGs to everyone.

 

[Jam Stunna]

Wow, that last one was sloppy as hell lol. Good games everyone.

Now I can't jump in on you Sion

 

[Umby]

ggs guys. I'm finding out quickly how bad my defense is.

 

[Sion]

ggs everyone

you now know my pain, jam stunna

umby, i felt you didn't go in hard enough. maybe it was netplay? baiting dp?

 

[LivewiresXe]

Man, I didn't even notice anybody come on. Granted, I was working out from 8-9, and playing Mass Effect 3 to take a break for a bit so I probably was focused elsewhere. Still, feel kinda "d'oh" for missing it. If people are on tomorrow night I'll probably start something. And uh, I'll try to be more accepting of help this time.

 

[sakuraZaKi]

We're a community dude. We can help each other. You know, you're free to talk about our plays as well, lol.

I don't have that much class on Tuesdays, so I miiight be able to play :]

Hopefully looking forward to it.

 

[Zankoku]

I can give Yukiko advice as long as it has nothing to do with any of her technical combos.

Easy high/low unblockable setup in the corner for 2D/j.D is 2D 2A. One that requires a bit more fear from your opponent but works from far away is 236C 2D. You can also airthrow j.4D for a setup that forces a high block on their wakeup, and then freestyle where to go from there.

Yukiko has great keep-away options, but like I originally mentioned in my nutshell advice to Sakurazaki, the fans and stuff are only to give her enough space to get her REAL pressure game going.

Also, I don't really hide Fire Breaks, I just C Maragidyne Fire Break and then decide from there whether I want to D Maragidyne or wait for something else. For example, after Fire Break you can end your BnB with 236 (unblockable) D Maragidyne (release Agi) for a silly reset. You can blow up attempts at safejumps and aerial mixups that don't involve backdashing away from you with unblockable D Agidyne too, though that's rather disrespectful of an option. And of course, get someone cornered and unblockable SB Maragi for very respectable damage plus air combo setup (5c 5bb 5c 5bb 236[a] works). Just be creative with how you want to get your Fire Break (usually during C Maragidyne or if your opponent is trying to wait out your zoning and you're not feeling any pressure).

 

[Crusayer]

I kept losing to your back airdash fan -_____-.

Someone teach me to how to play patiently lol.

 

[Zankoku]

oh yeah, j.44 j.6b is always fun to do and is pretty strong at both creating distance and stopping approaches.

btw I'm not that good, I'm just okay and I happen to be better at doing stuff than the only other Yukiko players around here. I'm sure someone with better execution than I can get in some practice and get more comfortable with the system and become stronger than I am pretty easily.

 

[Umby]

I kept losing to your back airdash fan -_____-.

Someone teach me to how to play patiently lol.

Play a few matches where you attempt to time out Ice Climbers.

 

[LivewiresXe]

I can give Yukiko advice as long as it has nothing to do with any of her technical combos.

Easy high/low unblockable setup in the corner for 2D/j.D is 2D 2A. One that requires a bit more fear from your opponent but works from far away is 236C 2D. You can also airthrow j.4D for a setup that forces a high block on their wakeup, and then freestyle where to go from there.

Yukiko has great keep-away options, but like I originally mentioned in my nutshell advice to Sakurazaki, the fans and stuff are only to give her enough space to get her REAL pressure game going.

Also, I don't really hide Fire Breaks, I just C Maragidyne Fire Break and then decide from there whether I want to D Maragidyne or wait for something else. For example, after Fire Break you can end your BnB with 236 (unblockable) D Maragidyne (release Agi) for a silly reset. You can blow up attempts at safejumps and aerial mixups that don't involve backdashing away from you with unblockable D Agidyne too, though that's rather disrespectful of an option. And of course, get someone cornered and unblockable SB Maragi for very respectable damage plus air combo setup (5c 5bb 5c 5bb 236[a] works). Just be creative with how you want to get your Fire Break (usually during C Maragidyne or if your opponent is trying to wait out your zoning and you're not feeling any pressure).

In terms of fan combos, if you're close up can't you you do a 5AA>2B>5BB type string on stuff to kinda push them away a bit and get a bit of a high-low string going?

 

[Zankoku]

I'm not sure what you're talking about, seeing as how 5AA, 2B, and 5BB all hit mid, and 5BB will whiff on crouching opponents.

 

[sakuraZaKi]

Yeah, but I tend not to do it because I'm still not used to reacting to crouching confirms. If they're crouching the second 5B it's gonna whiff.

But yeah, if you are close enough, and get them standing while doing 5aa, you can actually do some cool looking fans like:

2b 5bb 3b 5b or 5bb 3b 5bb (as aisight says below)

I dunno if its character-specific though.

I think you can try something like 2b->5b->3b, though. I don't like doing this either because I just tend to start mashing b while holding down the stick XD scared of messing up.

Edit: just tried ^ heck of a timing.

 

[Zankoku]

Standing opponents can get hit by 5bb 3b 5bb, which is actually part of Yukiko's extended combo (the one where you IAD j.aaa in the middle), but I don't usually get confirms on standing opponents as Yukiko, since her overhead options consist of j.a, 2d, j.d, and AoA.

 

[sakuraZaKi]

I can't always get my 2a to hit when I try to set up the 2d unblockable. XD

This timing... Or should I not worry because the computer is a blocking beast?

Standing opponents can get hit by 5bb 3b 5bb, which is actually part of Yukiko's extended combo (the one where you IAD j.aaa in the middle), but I don't usually get confirms on standing opponents as Yukiko, since her overhead options consist of j.a, 2d, j.d, and AoA.

I think this one requires specific placement with the 5aa, like in the middle of it. Otherwise, you just fly over their heads before the third j.a

 

[LivewiresXe]

Standing opponents can get hit by 5bb 3b 5bb, which is actually part of Yukiko's extended combo (the one where you IAD j.aaa in the middle), but I don't usually get confirms on standing opponents as Yukiko, since her overhead options consist of j.a, 2d, j.d, and AoA.

Yeah, that's the one I was thinking of, though but I usually just get j.aa off and mess up after. And I always had a bit of an issue using 2D since there's a bit of a startup on it and that. Even though I probably should/should have.

 

[sakuraZaKi]

I think it's best to use 2D after a knockdown with a held Agi. Before they get up use 2d and detonate the Agi after the Persona makes contact so they don't try to hit it if they're blocking. You shouldn't have any issues using it then, other than stick problems, lol.

 

[LivewiresXe]

I think it's best to use 2D after a knockdown with a held Agi. Before they get up use 2d and detonate the Agi after the Persona makes contact so they don't try to hit it if they're blocking. You shouldn't have any issues using it then, other than stick problems, lol.

Well, I moreso meant I didn't have trouble getting it off, as I meant that I was always skeptical of using it.

 

[sakuraZaKi]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying, though. You shouldn't be skeptical of using it if you can cover it up with Agi after knockdown. You can do something like:

BnB->AgiB(hold)->2d->release b

After the b release you can maybe 5c2c->AgiA to keep up them back. If you want your Persona back, you can return it back to you with Fire Boost/Break or Maragi immediately after the 2c.

I would give it a shot. You should be fine.

Are you thinking of switching back to Yuki? XD

 

[LivewiresXe]

I feel really dumb for forgetting, but does Raging Lion hit high, middle, or low? I want to say middle but I don't really have anything to back that up. And I was kind of just wondering since if it hit at a different level than Narukami's 5D could you not use it to knock them out of blocking 5D, send them into the air, and air combo off of it?

 

[Crusayer]

Raging lion all hits high lol

Play a few matches where you attempt to time out Ice Climbers.

I almost timed out a samus once with Falco. I resolved to never actively attempt to time someone out. This is melee btw. I strongly dislike Brawl.

 

[Umby]

I feel really dumb for forgetting, but does Raging Lion hit high, middle, or low? I want to say middle but I don't really have anything to back that up. And I was kind of just wondering since if it hit at a different level than Narukami's 5D could you not use it to knock them out of blocking 5D, send them into the air, and air combo off of it?

Raging Lion hits high. Only thing is, 5D hits mid, so it doesn't set up a situation where they *have* to block low before trying to block Raging Lion high. It's probably not a bad option, but since most of his oki set ups use/fake an overhead first, the likely reaction is to start off blocking high. You could probably use Raging Lion A and OMC it into a high-low mixup/combo, but j.B/empty jump 2A already covers that without the meter loss. Since you mentioned air comboing, I assume you're referring to Raging Lion B, which is unlikely to really catch someone if they block. There's a lack of risk of being mixed up at the range where Raging Lion B would hit (except in the corner, maybe) so the opponent could just stand block it. On the bright side, 5DD covers you if they do block, so you can still keep the pressure going. It's just that compared to dash > jump, Raging Lion gives you considerably less options at any given point in time.

 

[Minato]

I feel really dumb for forgetting, but does Raging Lion hit high, middle, or low? I want to say middle but I don't really have anything to back that up. And I was kind of just wondering since if it hit at a different level than Narukami's 5D could you not use it to knock them out of blocking 5D, send them into the air, and air combo off of it?

It's recommended to use A or SB Raging Lion in those instances instead of B. B has too long of a start up.
But yeah, what Umby said. I basically like to implement Raging Lion more when they're cornered. A successful Raging Lion puts them in crouching state which means better combos. So after sweep 5D, I'll have them block 2A 2B, then open them up with 214A 5DD into combo then sweep or whatever. Just remember that 214A can be hit out of start up. So if you're doing 2A and 2B before then, 5D blockstun basically is done.

You should look at the video Umby posted for Narukami. It even covered this as well.

 

[LivewiresXe]

It's recommended to use A or SB Raging Lion in those instances instead of B. B has too long of a start up.
But yeah, what Umby said. I basically like to implement Raging Lion more when they're cornered. A successful Raging Lion puts them in crouching state which means better combos. So after sweep 5D, I'll have them block 2A 2B, then open them up with 214A 5DD into combo then sweep or whatever. Just remember that 214A can be hit out of start up. So if you're doing 2A and 2B before then, 5D blockstun basically is done.

You should look at the video Umby posted for Narukami. It even covered this as well.

Yeah, I looked at it. But I admit that was a completely theoretical thought. Like, if 5D had to be blocked low and Raging Lion high, then you could create good mixups as you could Raging Lion as soon as 5D hit to almost force them to get hit by something. Of course, since that's not the case and both can be blocked standing, all my spec twas for naught, lol.

 

[Minato]

Oh, I just assumed people knew 5D hits mid. Especially since me and other Yu's do sweep 5D into j.B a lot.
I do it a lot in lobby matches. Narukami would be dumb if every oki led to an unblockable, haha.

Even 5D into j.B was in the vid.

 

[LivewiresXe]

Oh, I just assumed people knew 5D hits mid. Especially since me and other Yu's do sweep 5D into j.B a lot.
I do it a lot in lobby matches. Narukami would be dumb if every oki led to an unblockable, haha.

Even 5D into j.B was in the vid.

I like dumb when it benefits meeee.


And was it? I must've missed that. Only saw it once despite having it favourited. Basic string setup is 5A>2B>5B>Sweep>5D right?