Panda's 2nd Tier List (10.14.08)

[cutter]

And remember, the list does NOT reflect character potential. It reflects how I believe the character is currently performing in the metagame.

If that's the case, why did you stick Luigi in the mid tier? Last time I checked he did not have great tournament results from Ankoku's former rankings list, and his awful matchups against characters like Meta, D3, Marth, and G&W certainly don't help his case.

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

hmmm, I like this tier list, very good going panda, the only thing im wondering is wario or falco, and samus's low placement,
for this would you consider for tiers
Broken: Meta.....Only....xD
Top: GaW's tier which I fully support
High/Medium: Wario's tier
Medium/Low: Kirby's tier
Low/Bottom: Yoshi's tier?

 

[Mr. Rogu]

finally a brawl list that has bottom tiers. i love how metanight is in his own tier. its so true

 

[ssbbFICTION]

PT is at least high mid

 

[infernovia]

I don't see a lot of Trainers in the placing lists either.

I see more PT placings than jiggs. He was in the C rank as far as I remember in tourney points. And I am definitely sure thats more than jiggs.

Edit: Looking at tournament placings, 13 PTs and 4 jiggs.

 

[themrskills]

Can someone tell me why lucas is so low on the list? I must be missing something(not the recovery there are many other options)

 

[Justblaze647]

Cuz he's predictable, and lame, and gimpable...

And his u-smash was created by

Spoiler

Satan

 

[Yonder]

Hmm, so glad you place Luigi where he deserves to be :D.

Game and Watch's placement makes me smile, but him and Snake are for sure fighting for that spot, but Snake may have it by a VERY little margin.

Wario seems pretty high, I though he wasn't all that great, but i've played him more, fun and a good character, although as much as I hate to say it, Marth should be there instead I guess.

Mario seems depressingly low, I on't think the gap between him and Luigi's THAT big, even though they are different characters.

PT I think is just plain underused like Luigi, he's good, but has some horrid flaws on him.

 

[AgentJGV]

I really don't think you're giving Ganon and Falcon a chance here but...o well. good new list. also i noticed how you put MK in a space of his own. nice.

 

[themrskills]

@Justblaze: Which one of Lucas' four recovery options are we talking about gimping here? PK2 can be gimped, but not if the player has already zap jumped, magnet pulled, and tether grabbed(from ridiculously long distances) back to the ledge. At that point, gimping has been pretty much avoided. Kudos to satan for the up smash, btw.

 

[Demenise]

The list is definitely getting better. Though I'm not entirely sure if Pikachu deserves his spot, it's definitely improving.

Also, we seriously need more Pokemon Trainer rep. He's a good character, but no one is good enough yet to place with him.

 

[Justblaze647]

@Justblaze: Which one of Lucas' four recovery options are we talking about gimping here? PK2 can be gimped, but not if the player has already zap jumped, magnet pulled, and tether grabbed(from ridiculously long distances) back to the ledge. At that point, gimping has been pretty much avoided. Kudos to satan for the up smash, btw.

lol @ zap jump being a form of recovery...

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

*blinks*

g&w that high? really?

i full heartedly disagree.

his smashes have too much start up, his game against MK is failing fast... theres really only so much you can do with him before you git a wall

 

[Neb]

*blinks*

g&w that high? really?

i full heartedly disagree.

his smashes have too much start up, his game against MK is failing fast... theres really only so much you can do with him before you git a wall

If only everyone thought like this, we could go back to the melee days where hardly anyone played Game & Watch, .

And whoever says G&W is easy to pick-up, I say who isn't easy to get good with in Brawl, seriously?

 

[Mmac]

And whoever says G&W is easy to pick-up, I say who isn't easy to get good with in Brawl, seriously?

Yoshi, Pokemon Trainer, Sonic, Diddy, Ice Climbers, Ganondorf. Do I need to list more?

 

[Justblaze647]

Yoshi, Pokemon Trainer, Sonic, Diddy, Ice Climbers, Ganondorf. Do I need to list more?

oh... the IC's are SO not easy to "pick up"

 

[Neb]

The learning curve of those characters are larger because they're lower tiers, they require more effort to be able to compete with other characters. But I was referring to the higher tiers, some people were saying G&W is where he's at because he's easy to learn, well the majority of the upper tiers are easy to get a hang of. But just because you get them down, doesn't mean your going to automatically dominate, that is unless your MK.

This goes to say, the learning curve is not everything that makes up the tiers.

 

[Justblaze647]

The learning curve of those characters are larger because they're lower tiers, they require more effort to be able to compete with other characters. But I was referring to the higher tiers, some people were saying G&W is where he's at because he's easy to learn, well the majority of the upper tiers are easy to get a hang of. But just because you get them down, doesn't mean your going to automatically dominate, that is unless your MK.

This goes to say, the learning curve is not everything that makes up the tiers.

Might just be my opinion... but Snake isn't easy to "get a hang of"

 

[Neb]

Might just be my opinion... but Snake isn't easy to "get a hang of"

Actually, whether you accept it or not, Snake isn't very hard to learn, or not as hard as people make it seem.
And your missing the point.

 

[OK'Ssuka?]

I'm sort of somewhat mildly surprised that Ness actually went up relative to SamuraiPanda's last tier list. I wonder what made SamuraiPanda decide that Ness goes up.

 

[Boofy!]

I disagree with character X here..
Character Y is top tier are you kidding me?
The SBR doesn't realize character Z kicks soo much ***!!

Save your breath people.. srsly

 

[HeroMystic]

Mario seems depressingly low, I on't think the gap between him and Luigi's THAT big, even though they are different characters.

It's justified, seeing as how SP made the tier list.

Mario mains are so far and few that there is barely any tournament attendance from them, and only a few (for instance, Boss, who also mains Luigi) have gotten to the top 3.

If there isn't more dedicated Mario mains, I wouldn't be surprised if people start placing him over Ganondorf.

 

[Justblaze647]

I disagree with character X here..
Character Y is top tier are you kidding me?
The SBR doesn't realize character Z kicks soo much ***!!

Save your breath people.. srsly

Hey... Shut Up

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Actually, whether you accept it or not, Snake isn't very hard to learn, or not as hard as people make it seem.
And your missing the point.

Marth is quite hard to play well with at a high level.

 

[Nicole]

i'm surprised game & watch is so high. i just recently picked him up as a secondary. he's good, no doubt about it, but number 2 in the game seems incredible. he's easy to learn, but he's very straightforward - not alot of tricks up his sleeve. basically, he plays something like marth, pretty offensive, good approaches, good matchups, excellent ko potential, great priority. but number 2 in the game? seems both DDD and Snake should be above him (at least Snake).

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I ... don't like that list

Are you from MW, Panda to have GnW as 2nd? I mean this a joke, frankly. His 4th place on the "official" tier list is already a bit too much. Call me hat you want but Falco is a better character than GnW but him higher than Snake and KingDedede? I'd like to hear some good reasons for this one.

I like Warios position (although him > Falco???) but Marth > ROB? I think Marth is good (I consider him top tier) but he still gets more credit than he deserves. He just doesn't have many weaknesses but overall ROB is the better character.

Mid Tier seems kinda random to me...Wolf and especially DK are too low, while Peach and Olimar are a bit too high. Also Toon Link, Luigi > Wolf?

Nah, that doesn't look so good :/

 

[Neb]

I ... don't like that list

Are you from MW, Panda to have GnW as 2nd? I mean this a joke, frankly. His 4th place on the "official" tier list is already a bit too much. Call me hat you want but Falco is a better character than GnW but him higher than Snake and KingDedede? I'd like to hear some good reasons for this one.

I don't agree with the list either, but Falco a better character than G&W?
Care to explain why? The only reason he is as high on the tier list as he is, is because of his CG.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I think he has a lot more ... depth in him. I don't see GnW improving at all. I mean, he's easy to play and very strong but I think he lacks the finesse. I don't see much more potential in him. All his amazing moves have bees discovered how amazing they are. "Bair has always your Shield +1 hit lolololol". That's great but ther isn't much more. Just a bunch of awesome moves and overpowered finsihers.
Falco on the other hand still has some "technical" stuff to be used or improved. You know...Sliding-Pivot-Reverse-Canceled-Usmash-BS kind of stuff, that has some potential use in it. I don't see this in GnW.
His Metagame has come to a standstill. Nothing happens...Falco on the other hand is still getting better (imo). I can't see GnW in the top4 in the future...

 

[SamuraiPanda]

I think he has a lot more ... depth in him. I don't see GnW improving at all. I mean, he's easy to play and very strong but I think he lacks the finesse. I don't see much more potential in him. All his amazing moves have bees discovered how amazing they are. "Bair has always your Shield +1 hit lolololol". That's great but ther isn't much more. Just a bunch of awesome moves and overpowered finsihers.
Falco on the other hand still has some "technical" stuff to be used or improved. You know...Sliding-Pivot-Reverse-Canceled-Usmash-BS kind of stuff, that has some potential use in it. I don't see this in GnW.
His Metagame has come to a standstill. Nothing happens...Falco on the other hand is still getting better (imo). I can't see GnW in the top4 in the future...

And remember, the list does NOT reflect character potential. It reflects how I believe the character is currently performing in the metagame.

Reading is fun!

 

[~ Gheb ~]

And where exactly - except the MW - is GnW performing better than Falco?

 

[Ori_bro]

is the reason sonic is so high b/c of anther???

 

[Count]

I like the list, even if it was compiled quickly. Any hints as to when the next 'official' list will be out?

 

[Gaussis]

Ness went up?????? This one is a shock to me. I'm curious to know why.

 

[memphischains]

panda, you're still ignorant

 

[Justblaze647]

panda, you're still ignorant

Why..? For posting his opinion... in his blog..?

 

[ROOOOY!]

is the reason sonic is so high b/c of anther???

He's placed like twice using Sonic, so no.

Sonic's been around the mid point of Ankoku's rankings list (I think he's currently 15th) since the very start practically but the SBR and everyone else in general have chosen to be ignorant.
Unlike say...Yoshi, or Pokemon Trainer, Sonic has consistantly had results, and their mains don't bark on about potential or gimicky AT's, which is why he's placed above them.
Although I still think Sonic should be higher if we're going on current performance in the metagame. 15th I think he is at the minute, like I said earlier, and I know a lot of Sonic mains don't actually make their tourney wins known concerning Ankoku's thread '.'

 

[Mmac]

Uh, Roy, Didn't Sonic dropped like a rock in results before Ankoku took down the list? I recall him doing very well in the Summer, but he dropped so much in the Fall. I think he had 32 points before the list was taken down, which a month before he was as low as Falcon.

Also Yoshi has drastically increased in tournament results this Fall.

Another thing, our main basis was Matchups, which are actually GOOD. Sonic's is incomplete, so that everyone assumes that they're terrible, at least to Higher Tiers...

 

[ROOOOY!]

Actually

Meta Knight
Snake
Wario 136.03
Mr. Game & Watch
King Dedede
Marth
Donkey Kong
Lucario
Diddy Kong
Ice Climbers
R.O.B.
Pit
Falco
Zelda/Sheik
Sonic
Zero Suit Samus
Olimar
Kirby
Ike
Peach
Wolf
Pikachu
Lucas
Bowser
Luigi
Fox
Toon Link
Captain Falcon
Link
Mario
Jigglypuff
Yoshi
Pokemon Trainer
Ness
Ganondorf
Samus

Is Shaya's list for October. I know in September Sonic was 3 or 4 places lower, but still. I hope you get my point. There was one point in like August or something where for half a month he was around the bottom of the list, but other than that he's been in the high 20's ish ranking wise, other than like the first month or so of release, where people didn't use Sonic seriously.
Which is ironically where a lot of the haters I've heard say he's got most of his wins from >_>

It just annoys me. Like, the tier list is based on how characters are performing in the metagame at the time. Even when the tier list was made we were I think 22nd, and ended up 5th bottom. Co-incidentally, the person who had the 5th worst results (Bowser) actually got 22nd place I think, and it's not like Bowser's results have improved massively since then to merit his place.
Basically, despite all the facts and figures thrown around about Sonic, the response a la the tier list was basically "lol u soinc mains sux" even though we had better results than every other low tier, and a lot of the mid tiers.
It's just annoying, lol.

 

[Amide]

I really see what you mean. But at the same time, you can't just look at the rankings list to determine a tier list. For example, do you really think Toon Link should be just one spot above CF? Should Pit be over Falco?

 

[Hax]

falco is top 5 and the gayest character in the game, no questions asked.