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Ok, who got their money from Pound 5 (Winners)

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Pierce7d

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"Stealing" isn't the best word. He didn't go and grab people's wallets. All money he had was to run the tournament, which included payouts and venue fee. He just prioritized paying off the large corporation first before paying off individual people first. People generally don't hire debt collectors.
I'm sorry, but I can't agree with this train of thought. When I purchased my pass for Pound 5, there were separate purchases where I specified what I was buying.

I paid the venue fee. I payed this to Plank. This is money that I am directly giving to Plank in exchange for letting me enter the venue he rented. That's me paying Plank money for a service. What he does with that money is up to him. Naturally, it's in his best interest to use it to pay off the debt he acquired from renting the venue in the first place. My point is, that money is his.

However, when I purchased my entry into the tournament, it's already widely agreed by everyone that this money does not belong to Plank. This money belongs to the Tournament Victors. As the Tournament Director, he is responsible for collecting the money and giving it to it's rightful owners once the victors are decided, but that money was never his. No one would purchase entry fee into the tournament if they were aware that the entry was not going into the pot. If Plank wanted to include an additional charge as a fee to enter the tournament, he could've chose to done that. More tactfully, he could've just increased the venue fee. But to take entry fee? That money is not his, and for him to take it is stealing.

Also, I would not be mad if Plank said there would be a delay in paying out the tourney, but Plank clearly stated that there would be no payouts for Pound V. Since individuals are less likely to send debt collectors after him, he has decided to steal from them to solve his problems. That is wrong.
 

CT Chia

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I completely agree with everything Pierce just said, and I do consider it to be more or less stealing.

And everyone keep in mind what was being stolen here. I feel that just saying prize money or w/e over and over you can lose sight of how serious this actually is. This is stealing from 22 different players, and is approximately $9,716. That is an absolute ridiculous amount of money, for real. In fact, now that I'm laying the numbers out there like that, it almost makes me doubt the entire situation. Plank already had thousands from venue fees and such, even after taking away various fees and such. He obviously paid the venue something already. Is there any way he could be short over 9 g's in paying the venue? idk... That I just doubt. Even if he still had 25% of that left over I'm sure the players would love to see that, it's better than nothing atm.

So to reiterate, 22 different players are missing money and there was approximately $9,716 that was unpaid.

Yea... bout that...
 

DJRome

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think of it this way:

if he expected 150 more people, that's about 30-35 more rooms. 35*200 = 7000, which is sort of reasonable, but not really. i mean, when ur doing the numbers, do you really want to err on the side of caution or just expect another 7k to roll in?

i know plank is not stupid enough to misplan this poorly. which makes it all the more suspicious
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

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I'm sorry, but I can't agree with this train of thought. When I purchased my pass for Pound 5, there were separate purchases where I specified what I was buying.

I paid the venue fee. I payed this to Plank. This is money that I am directly giving to Plank in exchange for letting me enter the venue he rented. That's me paying Plank money for a service. What he does with that money is up to him. Naturally, it's in his best interest to use it to pay off the debt he acquired from renting the venue in the first place. My point is, that money is his.

However, when I purchased my entry into the tournament, it's already widely agreed by everyone that this money does not belong to Plank. This money belongs to the Tournament Victors. As the Tournament Director, he is responsible for collecting the money and giving it to it's rightful owners once the victors are decided, but that money was never his. No one would purchase entry fee into the tournament if they were aware that the entry was not going into the pot. If Plank wanted to include an additional charge as a fee to enter the tournament, he could've chose to done that. More tactfully, he could've just increased the venue fee. But to take entry fee? That money is not his, and for him to take it is stealing.

Also, I would not be mad if Plank said there would be a delay in paying out the tourney, but Plank clearly stated that there would be no payouts for Pound V. Since individuals are less likely to send debt collectors after him, he has decided to steal from them to solve his problems. That is wrong.
I do forgive more than hold a grudge, but I gotta agree with this.
 

황미영

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I think everyone should be like Mango. The kid is handicapping himself, he could have easily taken first place, if he wanted and yet he didn't. He didn't even place to earn money. :I

Wat?
 

HolyNightmare

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We don't even know if what Plank said is truth, it could be possible Plank planned all of this months before he decided to announce Pound 5. Think about it, Plank is not a wealthy man. Maybe he had financial problems and needed a way to make money quick, so he decided to make a tournament using his T.O expertise. Than the only thing he needed to do was make an excuse on smashboard about how he can't pay anyone, quit the scene and disappear with the money. He knew people couldn't sue him, smashers were easy prey for him. His plan was perfect.

He showed us no proof, I don't believe his bs story. I think he simply stole the money for him and knew no one could do **** about it.
 

황미영

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M2K come down for CEO2011 Jebailey is a legit mother****er, so you can expect money from him.

Even Jwong is coming. ;D

Nice observation, perhaps the hotel was the financial problem, hence why he had to use it. :I
 

Mew2King

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I agree with HolyNightmare

also Japanese guy umm if you can help me get there then sure... I'm too scared to travel anymore financially. I've lost money by traveling to and winning various nationals lately, especially in Florida Winterfest didn't pay me 1.5k I'm owed and Christine Ortiz owes me 150 still
 

Albert.

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"Stealing" isn't the best word. He didn't go and grab people's wallets. All money he had was to run the tournament, which included payouts and venue fee. He just prioritized paying off the large corporation first before paying off individual people first. People generally don't hire debt collectors.
Sad truth right there^^^^

I'm sorry, but I can't agree with this train of thought. When I purchased my pass for Pound 5, there were separate purchases where I specified what I was buying.

I paid the venue fee. I payed this to Plank. This is money that I am directly giving to Plank in exchange for letting me enter the venue he rented. That's me paying Plank money for a service. What he does with that money is up to him. Naturally, it's in his best interest to use it to pay off the debt he acquired from renting the venue in the first place. My point is, that money is his.

However, when I purchased my entry into the tournament, it's already widely agreed by everyone that this money does not belong to Plank. This money belongs to the Tournament Victors. As the Tournament Director, he is responsible for collecting the money and giving it to it's rightful owners once the victors are decided, but that money was never his. No one would purchase entry fee into the tournament if they were aware that the entry was not going into the pot. If Plank wanted to include an additional charge as a fee to enter the tournament, he could've chose to done that. More tactfully, he could've just increased the venue fee. But to take entry fee? That money is not his, and for him to take it is stealing.

Also, I would not be mad if Plank said there would be a delay in paying out the tourney, but Plank clearly stated that there would be no payouts for Pound V. Since individuals are less likely to send debt collectors after him, he has decided to steal from them to solve his problems. That is wrong.

Plank said "no payouts at this time"

I'm pretty sure that he is BROKE at the moment from this hotel fiasco.

I know that this will NOT be popular to hear but...would you guys have rather he had payed out all of the money, and then have had his entire life screwed over by the hotel? I mean, I know this isn't easy to think about, but what would you have done in that situation? They surely would have taken legal action to SUE HIS DUMB, IRRESPONSIBLE ***. For whatever reason, he promised X amount of hotel rooms to be bought and payed for by smashers (keep in mind, at a reduced rate. He signed contracts and everything IIRC. If he did not pay off the hotel for the money rightfully owed to them, They would have nailed his *** to the ground, legally, and probably ruined his credit rating/the rest of his financial life.

If you were Plank would you

A) Pay off smashers but have major hotel chain ready to metaphorically shank the S*** out of you

B) Pay off hotel, but not pay off smashers.Be able to work off debt, maybe get in the green, maybe get back to the smash community, get a loan, something or another, and then pay the smashers back in the forseeable future.

Take a harder look at yourself and ask what you would have done.

I also do not want to hear "well I would not have been so irresponsible in the first place!" That is USELESS at the moment, what's done is done.

Now I'm trying NOT to defend Plank too much but as far as "shady tournament dealings" go this is probably the least-shady. Yes he should have been more upfront about the situation in the days/weeks after the tourney. Yes he should have been more transparent about the deal with the hotel, etc. Maybe he should have gotten a cheaper venue, ETC ETC ETC.

But that's all done and gone yo, there is unforutnately nothing anybody can do about Planks mistakes.

But I think Plank can come back from this. He can work off the debt to the smashers... As long as he has some sort of income from which he can save small amounts of money from, He MIGHT be able to pay the smashers back. I would suggest a 1st place, first, With interest, pay out scheme over the next year or so.

It's better than nothing, right?


but yeah guys, Don't trust plank anymore, But don't throw him under the bus because he got himself into a horrible situation. I'm sorry but the guy ran too many great tourneys in the past to be entirely blackballed by the community like the other scumbags (who, do I need to say, deserved it)
 

Albert.

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Yes, There is very little proof that the Hotel ***** plank financially

But There is also very little proof that Plank stole the money and ran away.

Aren't there literally dozens of people who would have been adament character witnesses for Planks reliability (before pound 5?
 

HolyNightmare

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Yes, There is very little proof that the Hotel ***** plank financially

But There is also very little proof that Plank stole the money and ran away.

Aren't there literally dozens of people who would have been adament character witnesses for Planks reliability (before pound 5?
But looking at numbers, the theory plank stole the money is pausible. Otherwise why doesn't he show us proof and simply decided to leave the scene? There's some BS behind all of this, someone has to get in contact with the hotel because they probably know.
 

DJRome

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i assure you if plank had any good intentions, he did not show them through saying he would pay people back eventually. instead he just lol'ed on smashers with his sorry story
 

Browny

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Wait a minute... what sort of hotel lets you reserve rooms without paying for it, and then not hitting the person who it was for, with a cancellation fee?

lesson for the future: dont ever let anyone reserve hotel rooms; they have to pay when they register for the tournament.

I mean, what POSSIBLE good benefit could arise from allowing people to not pay when stating they will attend?
 

황미영

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M2K CALL ME KISHIRU DA AZN LOVAH! >:U But yeah it's Korean, AND MIKE G IT AIN'T DA SAME! >:I

Umm I don't think they are going to host this with EVO's name and seeding points and actually **** up. They are pretty much putting more on the line that way. Except I don't think you would be winning anything for EVO 'cause I think they dun have Smash anymore. xD Yo M2K, if I have enough spending money by then for some crazy odd reason. Maybe I can help. >w> (Just don't look for it, let it come to you.)
 

Albert.

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Plank needs to post the legal documents from the hotel, and I agree with m2k/Ally and everybody completely about blackballing him to HELL if he can't at least give more legitimacy to his "hotel was about to **** me" story.
 

HolyNightmare

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Plank needs to post the legal documents from the hotel, and I agree with m2k/Ally and everybody completely about blackballing him to HELL if he can't at least give more legitimacy to his "hotel was about to **** me" story.
Exactly Plank need to show us proof.
There's a huge difference between stealing the money for himself AND having to use that money to pay the hotel for his miscalculations. People seem to overlook this fact and immediately assume Plank is saying the truth.
 

황미영

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Curious but why doesn't anyone try calling the hotel? Maybe with an overwhelming amount of calls for the same reason, it could raise some questions about went on and they could possibly give some info?
 

황미영

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Hyatt Regency Crystal City
2799 Jefferson Davis Highway
Arlington, VA 22202
(703) 418-1234

Call them, and if you know Plank's full name ask about him or what he did there.
 

BBQ°

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Is it true that the Pound 5 tournament thread didn't even mention anything about payouts to the winners?
 

Albert.

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Sorry I meant that he and I were talking on AIM.

btw guys If the 30-room-reservations cancelled thing is legitimate and true,

and plank had indeed made a contract that those rooms would be used/paid for to the hotel or otherwise compensated...

Then that IS a seriously large amount of money that he would need to find to pay the hotel lol
 

BBQ°

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Well, this might be a little extreme, but something to think about.

*Amateur brackets:
-Plank originally planned for an amateur bracket for each round of pool, meaning there would be 3 amateur brackets + the pro bracket
-Each amateur bracket was a $10 entry fee, which was a separate fee from entering pools
-If Plank originally planned to scam people and run with the money, then organizing all these amateur brackets could've been another scheme for him to make more money. I heard that Laijin was supposed to get $200 for winning 1st place in the Round 1 amateur bracket. If there was enough time to do the other amateur brackets, then that's like another easy $1000 in plank's pocket. And if Brawl had the amateur brackets too (but I don't think they did), that would've been like $500 or so.

This is just extreme conspiracy lol but again, something to think about.
 

Albert.

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BBQ your sig is amazing lol.

And yes, Amateur bracket was paid out because they handled the money for that entirely separately. It was all straight cash and it got paid to the winners in cash immediately.
 

Vyse

Faith, Hope, Love, Luck
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You should always expect room cramming because most gamers are poor, young, or both.
you should expect no shows: standby flights, overbooked hotels, etc.
I think this is probably one of the most important points to note for other TOs to take away from this. It's a moral judgement thing, but that's a personal risk those people took against hotel policy. Not Plank's.

Well put SleepyK.

I feel for Plank right now. I can imagine it all going through his head all weekend :/
 
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