Official Stage Legality Discussion

[x After Dawn x]

wats up with that level with the tree's

Thank you for being ever so specific.

 

[Machiavelli.CF]

wadda bout skyworld and wegees mansion?
they are kinda temple'ish... but the blockages can be destroyed...but thenagain it is rather large...
sw? cp against tether?

 

[NinjaFoxX]

skyworld is banned because it gimps pretty much everybody
luigi's mansion,cp,wall inf. are not even possible

 

[x After Dawn x]

skyworld is banned because it gimps pretty much everybody
luigi's mansion,cp,wall inf. are not even possible

Skyworld was banned long ago, yes.

And Luigi's Mansion is also cp because the stage breaks down. Just break it if you don't like it. You can also attack the stage with random attacks you'll never use. It'll recharge some of your good moves that were degraded from stale move negation.

 

[haasehero]

Now, for stage bans, how does this sound?

Neutral:

Battlefield
Castle Siege
Delfino Plaza
Final Destination
Lylat Cruise
Smashville
Yoshi's Island

Counterpick:

Bridge of Eldin
Brinstar
Corneria
Distant Planet
Flat Zone 2
Great Sea/Pirate Ship
Green Greens
Halberd
Hanenbow
Jungle Japes
Luigi's Mansion
Onett
Pokémon Stadium
Pokémon Stadium 2
Rainbow Cruise
Yoshi's Island (Melee)

Banned:

75m
Big Blue
Flat Zone
Green Hill Zone
Mario Bros.
Mushroomy Kingdom
New Pork City
Norfair
PictoChat
Port Town Aero Dive
Rumble Falls
Shadow Moses Island
Skyworld
Spear Pillar
WarioWare, Inc.

in my opinaion rumble falls is fair even if it scrolls skyworld is decent luigis mansion is good. how is shadow moses unfiar is it the metal gears but wiat you siad the walk off ground makes it unfiar only a total noob would run off the stage and there is no need to remove these stages

 

[ROOOOY!]

At Serris' list above :

I don't think Pictochat is that bad a stage. The hazards are not that big an issue.

Flatzone 2 and Hanenbow aren't CP worthy in my opinion. They're both horrible stages.

 

[Machiavelli.CF]

corneria as cp? i think its a verry bad stage!
meta knight gliding stalling...
BIG ****ING WALL...
death hazard! and just ****ing anoing hazzards...

 

[Brahma]

Originally Posted by Serris
Now, for stage bans, how does this sound?

Neutral:

Battlefield
Castle Siege
Delfino Plaza
Final Destination
Lylat Cruise
Smashville
Yoshi's Island

Counterpick:

Bridge of Eldin
Brinstar
Corneria
Distant Planet
Flat Zone 2
Great Sea/Pirate Ship
Green Greens
Halberd
Hanenbow
Jungle Japes
Luigi's Mansion
Onett
Pokémon Stadium
Pokémon Stadium 2
Rainbow Cruise
Yoshi's Island (Melee)

Banned:

75m
Big Blue
Flat Zone
Green Hill Zone
Mario Bros.
Mushroomy Kingdom
New Pork City
Norfair
PictoChat
Port Town Aero Dive
Rumble Falls
Shadow Moses Island
Skyworld
Spear Pillar
WarioWare, Inc.

I don't know about Flatzone and Yoshi's Island in CP. Flatzone has way too much going on in the stage, to the point where it promotes match stalling when the middle of the screen is occupied, as it becomes dangerous to approach.

Yoshi's island has easy walk off chain throw kills for Dedede and Falco, other characters like DK,Kirby, and Ness can easily push people up the side as well.

Norfair and Pictochat IMO are viable counters. In Norfair the lava doesn't affect the match that much, it's very avoidable whether it comes from below, in spurts, or the giant wave, which you can avoid with shielding, edgehogging, or going into the chamber.

Picto has hazards, but nothing that is completely unavoidable or broken IMO. What are specific problems with it.

I also think Rumble Falls is a decent stage. It's not like Icicle Mountain where it goes up and down while it changes speeds. It's a set course, there are hazards, but they are easily avoidable and can work in your favor as well as your opponents. When it changes speeds it's not so fast that you have to concentrate 100% on moving like Ice mountain. All in all I think it's hard to justify allowing Rainbow Cruise but not Rumble Falls.

 

[x After Dawn x]

We need to stop the extra stage lists or this thread isn't going to go anywhere.

Focus on this list, guys. Discuss what you think should be changed.

Singles:
Battlefield Recommended: Random Starter
Final Destination Recommended: Random Starter
Lylat Cruise Recommended: Random Starter
Smashville Recommended: Random Starter
Yoshi's Island Brawl Recommended: Random Starter

Brinstar Recommended: Counterpick
Castle Siege Recommended: Counterpick
Delfino Plaza Recommended: Counterpick
Distant Planet Recommended: Counterpick
Frigate Orpheon Recommended: Counterpick
Green Greens Recommended: Counterpick
Halberd Recommended: Counterpick
Luigi's Mansion Recommended: Counterpick
Onett Recommended: Counterpick
PictoChat Recommended: Counterpick
Pokemon Stadium Recommended: Counterpick
Rainbow Cruise Recommended: Counterpick

Jungle Japes Recommended: Counterpick Optional: Banned

Hanenbow Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Norfair Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Pirate Ship Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Pokemon Stadium 2 Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Yoshi's Island Melee Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick

75 m Recommended: Banned
Big Blue Recommended: Banned
Bridge of Eldin Recommended: Banned
Corneria Recommended: Banned
Flat Zone 2 Recommended: Banned
Green Hill Zone Recommended: Banned
Rumble Falls Recommended: Banned
Mario Bros. Recommended: Banned
Mario Circuit Recommended: Banned
Mushroomy Kingdom 1-1 Recommended: Banned
Mushroomy Kingdom 1-2 Recommended: Banned
New Pork City Recommended: Banned
Port Town Aero Dive Recommended: Banned
Shadow Moses Island Recommended: Banned
Skyworld Recommended: Banned
Spear Pillar Recommended: Banned
Summit Recommended: Banned
Temple Recommended: Banned
WarioWare, Inc. Recommended: Banned

Doubles:
Battlefield Recommended: Random Starter
Final Destination Recommended: Random Starter
Lylat Cruise Recommended: Random Starter
Smashville Recommended: Random Starter
Yoshi's Island Brawl Recommended: Random Starter

Brinstar Recommended: Counterpick
Castle Siege Recommended: Counterpick
Corneria Recommended: Counterpick
Delfino Plaza Recommended: Counterpick
Distant Planet Recommended: Counterpick
Frigate Orpheon Recommended: Counterpick
Green Greens Recommended: Counterpick
Halberd Recommended: Counterpick
Luigi's Mansion Recommended: Counterpick
Norfair Recommended: Counterpick
Onett Recommended: Counterpick
PictoChat Recommended: Counterpick
Pokemon Stadium Recommended: Counterpick
Rainbow Cruise Recommended: Counterpick

Jungle Japes Recommended: Counterpick Optional: Banned

Hanenbow Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Pirate Ship Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Pokemon Stadium 2 Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Yoshi's Island Melee Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick

75 m Recommended: Banned
Big Blue Recommended: Banned
Bridge of Eldin Recommended: Banned
Flat Zone 2 Recommended: Banned
Green Hill Zone Recommended: Banned
Rumble Falls Recommended: Banned
Mario Bros. Recommended: Banned
Mario Circuit Recommended: Banned
Mushroomy Kingdom 1-1 Recommended: Banned
Mushroomy Kingdom 1-2 Recommended: Banned
New Pork City Recommended: Banned
Port Town Aero Dive Recommended: Banned
Shadow Moses Island Recommended: Banned
Skyworld Recommended: Banned
Spear Pillar Recommended: Banned
Summit Recommended: Banned
Temple Recommended: Banned
WarioWare, Inc. Recommended: Banned

 

[haasehero]

I dont like this idea of stage banning do to what it did to melee.
remember the melee tourny rules made by "tourny tards" .
it was NO ITEMS FOX ONLY FINAL DESTIONATION how is that fun
no items is reasonable but limeting the stages used in tournys is just dumb
and i just pry they dont make a tier list for brawl.
to me nothing is wrong with weegees mansion skyworld rumble falls and poke stadiom 2.
i do agree about cornaria, spear piller and flat zone 2
also how do i get a better rank then smash nOOB

 

[x After Dawn x]

You are a smash n00b. A big one, at that.

 

[Charizard92]

I dont like this idea of stage banning do to what it did to melee.
remember the melee tourny rules made by "tourny tards" .
it was NO ITEMS FOX ONLY FINAL DESTIONATION how is that fun
no items is reasonable but limeting the stages used in tournys is just dumb
and i just pry they dont make a tier list for brawl.
to me nothing is wrong with weegees mansion skyworld rumble falls and poke stadiom 2.
i do agree about cornaria, spear piller and flat zone 2
also how do i get a better rank then smash nOOB

-Tough luck pal!
- again, tough luck pal!
- look at New Pork city, and Mushroomy Kingdom, and Temple...
- As a mainer of a low tier character (PT), I don't either
-on all you don't agree with banning:
Luigi's Mansion (I don't use the term Luigi):
Luigi's mansion has a couple of things that keep it from being neutral
1: the ceiling of the first floor (aka, the second floor) is solid, which means cave of life potential.
2: destructible stage means different tactics.

Skyworld:
This is the stage with two faces. On one hand, the entire stage is solid, which translates to cave of life, which we hate. Once you destroy the floor, you can meteor someone straight into death.

PS2:
Most people hate this stage for being annoying. "The Flying stage gives advantages to these characters and the electric stage promotes camping and the Ice stage promotes tripping" is essentially the entire argument against it. The Flying stage is the worst, and could be banned on it's own. The electric stage is a nuissance, but where the camping comes from I don't know. The Ice stage is just slippery, tripping is not likely to always play a factor, due to how weird it is.

Rumble Falls:
You are blind aren't you? note the spikes, the walk offs, and the movement. I won't say more

-We all agree on that

-Post a lot, that is how my rank shot up. To avoid looking as a Noob among us, please, be intelligent instead of just spamming.

 

[Oracle]

haasehero- you obviously don't know very much about competetive smash. Go learn, and then come back here.

 

[AlexX]

Rumble Falls:
You are blind aren't you? note the spikes, the walk offs, and the movement. I won't say more

To be fair, Rumble Falls doesn't have any walkoffs (although even if it did, the movement prevents people from using them... try to camp near them and the stage leaves you behind), the movement is actually a reasonable pace and warns you for some time before speeding up, and the spikes are easy to avoid since they're in the same place every time.

I'd like to argue Rumble Falls as a counter-pick, but thanks to the fact everyone keeps thinking it's the exact same as Icicle Mountain in Melee, it's pretty much a futile effort. That stupid stage has forever caused people to hate moving stages regardless of how fair or unfair they may be.

 

[Serris]

I can't believe people are quoting my stage list from that long ago.

I've since revised my opinion on Flat Zone 2. Lion Tamer makes it ban-worthy. As for Yoshi's Island, walk-offs aren't that big of an issue (don't try using this to refute my ban of Shadow Moses Island because of my saying this). Sure, the boundaries are a bit cramped, but it's do-able.

Shadow Moses needs to be banned because anyone with a reliable wall chain and/or good vertical kill moves has too great of an advantage here.

 

[Charizard92]

A: it does
B: it still increases KO potential, as smashing someone into the boundary is easier
C: not with cheap throws/smashes
D: for good reason we hate it

 

[Serris]

A: it does
B: it still increases KO potential, as smashing someone into the boundary is easier
C: not with cheap throws/smashes
D: for good reason we hate it

Can you maybe make it a little clearer as to who you're directing that at?

 

[Charizard92]

That was directed at alexX

 

[Micahc]

-Post a lot, that is how my rank shot up. To avoid looking as a Noob among us, please, be intelligent instead of just spamming.

I <3 Irony.

Oh, and can someone remind me of Norfairs status? I thought it was in limbo of being banned or not. In case it's still in limbo, I'm gonna say banned because you end upfighting the stage and not your opponent.

 

[Charizard92]

it's still in limbo, namely in singles. Reasons why I hate it:

1: lava, comes from four locations this time, each with potential to be abused (like by Squirtle's Dthrow)
2: how things boil down, which is either focusing on the stage rather than the opponent, or abusing it
3: stalling, V design allows for stalling (and turns Meta Knight Uber Uber)

Counteractions made by people:

1: lava is avoidable
2: why would you be focusing on the stage in the first place.
3: most videos of stalling have one guy that sucks.
(I believe these arguments are more along the lines of ****)

 

[Machiavelli.CF]

Norfair Recommended: Banned
Green Hill Zone Recommended: Banned
Port Town Aero Dive Recommended: Banned

ok...these are the ones i feel ppl can deal with...they aren't that bad...CP

 

[Machiavelli.CF]

aw...man...i love norfair! great level...but it has too many **** faults...even if they are little ones...
im able to play matcheds without even touching the hazards...
the whole stalling issue isn't that bad either.

sry...about the dble post...the site decided not to put up my above post untill after this one!

 

[NinjaFoxX]

so i just recently did a nice,friendly match on norfair,and heres how it goes:
the lava is....no problem,even when im focousing my opponet near the side ones the battle would end up going in another direction,at least until the capsule comes out,even if youre the first to get in,someones gonna end up taking about 30+ damage just trying to stay in,and if you have about 90% or more,the wave will more than likely kill you if you dont sidestep at the right time(i was using IC so....)

as for stalling,um,idk...in short,im starting to say norfair is CP but its not solid as of yet

 

[x After Dawn x]

ok...these are the ones i feel ppl can deal with...they aren't that bad...CP

No. Port Town has random KOs at 50 %. Green Hill Zone has glitches, checkpoint marker, walk-offs, and random holes. Norfair is debatable, but it's not a for-sure CP because of stalling.

 

[Machiavelli.CF]

if you have about 90% or more,the wave will more than likely kill you if you dont sidestep at the right time(i was using IC so....)

as for stalling,um,idk...in short,im starting to say norfair is CP but its not solid as of yet

i almost never sidestep it...i find it much more effective to grab a ledge...and roll onto the stage from the ledge...

 

[MysticKenji]

Green Hill Zone = Green Dedede Zone

Set knockback throws FTL

 

[RPGsFTW]

I would like to express some of my opinions about the stage list, but I don't know if what I'm about to say will have much of an effect.

Distant Planet's 2 ledges are close enough together that 1 person could swap between them multiples times (by dropping down then jumping) over and over, thus promoting stalling. A person could hide under the bottom of the vines right at the bottom of the hill and camp with projectiles, as the above person cannot drop-through the main platform. IMO Chain-throwing is still a nasty downside to picking this stage. Otherwise, besides what I mentioned, I think that this stage is decent.

I don't know if I just completely missed out on discussing Brinstar, but have any of its nasty stage effects changed its neutrality postition? Or do it's effects not matter so much that they can leave it as a counterpick?

 

[AlexX]

A: it does
B: it still increases KO potential, as smashing someone into the boundary is easier
C: not with cheap throws/smashes
D: for good reason we hate it

Is this a response to my post? If so, could you please tell me which argument in that list is countering which of mine? The only one I know for sure is that you're insisting it does have walk-offs, but I know it doesn't, it just looks like it does.

 

[Guilhe]

Singles:

Final Destination Recommended: COUNTERPICK
The absence of platforms gives projectile users a slight advantage.

Delfino Plaza Recommended: NEUTRAL
I recognize that the scenario changes a lot, there are walk off sections and edge guard is harder when the stage is moving, providing advantage to some characters in some specific sections. But there are no potential hazards and the stage is always changing, so everybody can perform well in this stage.

Jungle Japes Recommended: BANNED
The water is too high and the crocodiles can gimp characters who rely on their vertical recoveries.

EDIT: Nice list x After Dawn x my comments where based on it. Please respost it soon so we don't lose our focus on the official list.

 

[x After Dawn x]

I would like to express some of my opinions about the stage list, but I don't know if what I'm about to say will have much of an effect.

Distant Planet's 2 ledges are close enough together that 1 person could swap between them multiples times (by dropping down then jumping) over and over, thus promoting stalling. A person could hide under the bottom of the vines right at the bottom of the hill and camp with projectiles, as the above person cannot drop-through the main platform. IMO Chain-throwing is still a nasty downside to picking this stage. Otherwise, besides what I mentioned, I think that this stage is decent.

I don't know if I just completely missed out on discussing Brinstar, but have any of its nasty stage effects changed its neutrality postition? Or do it's effects not matter so much that they can leave it as a counterpick?

Distant Planet's ledges aren't really a problem for "stalling." You can easily (and might I add, very easily) hit them when they're going between the ledges back and forth, and there is such a huge time gap in between the invincibility frames that it's impossible to stall with them. True, the chaingrabbing on the left of the stage is close to giving it a ban, but the entire stage is not connected to this section, and it's just one small part of the whole stage, so it doesn't really deserve a ban. As mic said a few dozen pages back, a walk-off does not mean a stage is automatically banned, but rather, it just contributes to a ban.

Brinstar is, more or less, the same as it was in Melee. There's nothing really wrong with it, it always has been a counterpick. This is not to be confused with Planet Zebes 64, however. These two stages are completely different.

Final Destination Recommended: COUNTERPICK
The absence of platforms gives projectile users a slight advantage.

Delfino Plaza Recommended: NEUTRAL
I recognize that the scenario changes a lot, there are walk off sections and edge guard is harder when the stage is moving, providing advantage to some characters in some specific sections. But there are no potential hazards and the stage is always changing, so everybody can perform well in this stage.

Jungle Japes Recommended: BANNED
The water is too high and the crocodiles can gimp characters who rely on their vertical recoveries.

EDIT: Nice list x After Dawn x my comments where based on it. Please respost it soon so we don't lose our focus on the official list.

Final Destination: That's no reason to make it a counterpick, there are advantages on every stage. Definite neutral.

Delfino Plaza: There's not much to expect when the SBR's stage list comes out. At this point, we can basically say that, if the voters were more conservative than liberal, the stage will be a counterpick, and if the voters were more liberal than conservative, then the stage will be neutral. Based on evidence such as the water, the walk-offs, and the walls, it's safe to say that in a conservative list, it'd be a counterpick, but we're just going to wait and see what the SBR says about it, as it's probably the closest counterpick stage to being neutral (or the closest neutral stage to being counterpick).

Jungle Japes: The water is definitely high, and it gimps recoveries as well. I'll move it into Recommended Ban, Optional Counterpick now.

As by request, I'll report the official list with a movement of Jungle Japes:

Singles:
Battlefield Recommended: Random Starter
Final Destination Recommended: Random Starter
Lylat Cruise Recommended: Random Starter
Smashville Recommended: Random Starter
Yoshi's Island Brawl Recommended: Random Starter

Brinstar Recommended: Counterpick
Castle Siege Recommended: Counterpick
Delfino Plaza Recommended: Counterpick
Distant Planet Recommended: Counterpick
Frigate Orpheon Recommended: Counterpick
Green Greens Recommended: Counterpick
Halberd Recommended: Counterpick
Luigi's Mansion Recommended: Counterpick
Onett Recommended: Counterpick
PictoChat Recommended: Counterpick
Pokemon Stadium Recommended: Counterpick
Rainbow Cruise Recommended: Counterpick

Hanenbow Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Jungle Japes Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Norfair Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Pirate Ship Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Pokemon Stadium 2 Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Yoshi's Island Melee Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick

75 m Recommended: Banned
Big Blue Recommended: Banned
Bridge of Eldin Recommended: Banned
Corneria Recommended: Banned
Flat Zone 2 Recommended: Banned
Green Hill Zone Recommended: Banned
Rumble Falls Recommended: Banned
Mario Bros. Recommended: Banned
Mario Circuit Recommended: Banned
Mushroomy Kingdom 1-1 Recommended: Banned
Mushroomy Kingdom 1-2 Recommended: Banned
New Pork City Recommended: Banned
Port Town Aero Dive Recommended: Banned
Shadow Moses Island Recommended: Banned
Skyworld Recommended: Banned
Spear Pillar Recommended: Banned
Summit Recommended: Banned
Temple Recommended: Banned
WarioWare, Inc. Recommended: Banned

Doubles:
Battlefield Recommended: Random Starter
Final Destination Recommended: Random Starter
Lylat Cruise Recommended: Random Starter
Smashville Recommended: Random Starter
Yoshi's Island Brawl Recommended: Random Starter

Brinstar Recommended: Counterpick
Castle Siege Recommended: Counterpick
Corneria Recommended: Counterpick
Delfino Plaza Recommended: Counterpick
Distant Planet Recommended: Counterpick
Frigate Orpheon Recommended: Counterpick
Green Greens Recommended: Counterpick
Halberd Recommended: Counterpick
Luigi's Mansion Recommended: Counterpick
Norfair Recommended: Counterpick
Onett Recommended: Counterpick
PictoChat Recommended: Counterpick
Pokemon Stadium Recommended: Counterpick
Rainbow Cruise Recommended: Counterpick

Hanenbow Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Jungle Japes Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Pirate Ship Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Pokemon Stadium 2 Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick
Yoshi's Island Melee Recommended: Banned Optional: Counterpick

75 m Recommended: Banned
Big Blue Recommended: Banned
Bridge of Eldin Recommended: Banned
Flat Zone 2 Recommended: Banned
Green Hill Zone Recommended: Banned
Rumble Falls Recommended: Banned
Mario Bros. Recommended: Banned
Mario Circuit Recommended: Banned
Mushroomy Kingdom 1-1 Recommended: Banned
Mushroomy Kingdom 1-2 Recommended: Banned
New Pork City Recommended: Banned
Port Town Aero Dive Recommended: Banned
Shadow Moses Island Recommended: Banned
Skyworld Recommended: Banned
Spear Pillar Recommended: Banned
Summit Recommended: Banned
Temple Recommended: Banned
WarioWare, Inc. Recommended: Banned

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

How many transformations have hazzards in pictochat I'm jwing

 

[x After Dawn x]

How many transformations have hazzards in pictochat I'm jwing

There's a handful or two of transformations that disturb gameplay in PictoChat, but they only last a few seconds, so the stage is counterpick. I have a heavy bias against the stage, and I personally think it should be banned, but I'm part of a 10 % minority that thinks so. Everybody else believes it's a fair counterpick, so it is.

 

[Chibi-pika]

Well lets see, I know fires, man eating plant, tracks, guy blowing you away, and i think a hand. Thats about all i remember.

 

[x After Dawn x]

In addition to what chibi mentioned, there's spikes on the sides, the layers of vertical walls, the ground spikes that make walls, the weird diagonal-to-horizontal platforms which act as walls, and the springs (ever heard of spring-cancelled moves?). Not all of these are considered "hazards", but they are still disturbances to gameplay.

 

[Serris]

After Dawn, why did you ban Pokémon Stadium 2? There really isn't a reason to in singles.

 

[habaker91]

port town...i thought this was a ban, but after playing on it a while it doesn't seem so bad.
the cars kill ridiculously early, sure, but in my last like 30 matches on the level i haven't even been hit by the cars...they're impossibly easy to avoid, and are very predictable, even if they dont seem so at first.

Just practice the level a few times, and the patterns of the level reveal themselves

EDIT: There is one potential problem with the level, when it moves sometimes it flys away from the track, and instead of being bounced around, you die.
However, this was also true in Mute City melee, and that level was a CP

 

[habaker91]

wadda bout skyworld and wegees mansion?
they are kinda temple'ish... but the blockages can be destroyed...but thenagain it is rather large...
sw? cp against tether?

Mch12 is on /b/

weegee's mansion is ok, b/c the cave of life is smallish, and destructable,
but skyworld is just one big cave of life, and characters like G&W become very hard to beat

EDIT: My bad on the double post

 

[x After Dawn x]

There are plenty of reasons to ban Pokemon Stadium 2, do your research before making such assumptions.

And Port Town Aero Dive is not Mute City. People keep comparing the two, but they are very distinct, despite their elements that seem alike. Mute City stops more often, and the flashing lights and sounds, as well as the slow cars, give more than enough warning to jump. There's also platforms to avoid the cars. And if you get hit? You won't die, unless you're at something ridiculous like 150-200 %. Port Town Aero Dive is completely different from all of this. The cars are way too fast, there is more, often than not, not enough warning, the cars KO at 50 %, and there are times where there are no platforms to avoid the cars. There are also some long times where walk-off zones are apparent, and especially when there are no platforms to avoid them.

 

[Charizard92]

To be fair, Rumble Falls doesn't have any walkoffs (although even if it did, the movement prevents people from using them... try to camp near them and the stage leaves you behind), the movement is actually a reasonable pace and warns you for some time before speeding up, and the spikes are easy to avoid since they're in the same place every time.

I'd like to argue Rumble Falls as a counter-pick, but thanks to the fact everyone keeps thinking it's the exact same as Icicle Mountain in Melee, it's pretty much a futile effort. That stupid stage has forever caused people to hate moving stages regardless of how fair or unfair they may be.

This is what I was countering.

A: rumble falls does have walk offs
B: Walk offs, no matter how long they last, will increase the ability to KO someone, due to the close proximity to the boundary
C: While the spikes are avoidable, any cheap throw or hit into any spike can spell hurt, and the first spike can spell cheap KO
D: We hate it for good reason

 

[MysticKenji]

Rumble Falls has no walk-offs, Charizard.