[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[KingSora]

I hope Sora will be the new one!

 

[Lord Viper]

Yay, someone else mention Panel De Pon. ^o^

Lip or Furil is the only chracters that I would like to see in the game due to Lip being my second favorite Nintendo chracter. They are getting more and more closer to being more know in Smash Bros though.

 

[BKupa666]

Although Lip and Ray would both be awesome, think about this:

Many of the newcomers in Brawl were the characters that everyone thought were shoe-ins for Melee based on its poll(Wario, Dedede, Diddy, Pit, etc.). Most of the highly popular characters on Sakurai's Brawl poll were added. However, if Sakurai were to add the most popular obscure characters from the current poll for SSB4, I think that Takumaru would be the one he'd choose over Ray and Lip.

 

[ChronoBound]

I don't mean to offend but I am sure the reason a lot of people like Lip simply because she is loli. There's a reason why NOA went out of there way to remove the unlockable Lip stage in Planet Puzzle League (I know it can still be accessed via Action Replay).

Sakurai himself said that he thought of Panel de Pon as a masterpiece and Lip ranked as the second-most wanted character in the Other category (the only one being higher was Sukapon) prior to Melee. However, despite all this being in her favor, all her series got in Melee was Kirby being able to turn into a junk block and her flower baton becoming an item. In Brawl, the series got five stickers and a remix of Lip's theme. Obviously, the reason why she has not even been a trophy is due to her design. If she is ever to get in Smash Bros., changes to her design will have to be made.

 

[Big-Cat]

I don't mean to offend but I am sure the reason a lot of people like Lip simply because she is loli. There's a reason why NOA went out of there way to remove the unlockable Lip stage in Planet Puzzle League (I know it can still be accessed via Action Replay).

Sakurai himself said that he thought of Panel de Pon as a masterpiece and Lip ranked as the second-most wanted character in the Other category (the only one being higher was Sukapon) prior to Melee. However, despite all this being in her favor, all her series got in Melee was Kirby being able to turn into a junk block and her flower baton becoming an item. In Brawl, the series got five stickers and a remix of Lip's theme. Obviously, the reason why she has not even been a trophy is due to her design. If she is ever to get in Smash Bros., changes to her design will have to be made.

I doubt she was rejected due to loli issues and I also doubt she wasn't brought here because of it as well. I think NOA didn't bring her here back then was because anime wasn't all that well receiving back then. Now, it could be brought over.

 

[LUVTOY77-ROGUE WIREFRAME]

I'm guessing this is Lip? Her design isn't tht bad..

 

[Steelia]

Hmm.

If SSB4 DOES keep a similar adventure mode to Smash Bros. Brawl, I'd be thrilled. I just enjoy seeing the scenematics of the game (cutscenes) where characters from totally different realms interact for seemingly the first time. It's almost like watching a movie... a movie that progresses as you interact with it. I just find that totally awesome (though it does have some flaws here and there that could use a bit of polishing).
And since there will definitely be more characters in SSB4... the more, the merrier in the adventure mode. (I would HOPE they add Mewtwo in this time... as he's really the closest to an "evil" Pokemon rep we'll get, next to Darkrai.)

...That's my take on it.

 

[metaXzero]

I'm guessing this is Lip? Her design isn't tht bad..

Why do I see Nintendo giving her the Pit treatment? If she gets in of course

 

[darkserenade]

Why do I see Nintendo giving her the Pit treatment? If she gets in of course

Could someone explain the 'Pit treatment'?

 

[ChronoBound]

Could someone explain the 'Pit treatment'?

Meaning she will get a design overhaul. Compare Pit's trophy in Melee to to his Brawl design. I think if Lip ever gets in, she will get a design overhaul. I outline the changes that would need to be made in my Lip reasoning and moveset section for my Smash 4 project.

 

[darkserenade]

Meaning she will get a design overhaul. Compare Pit's trophy in Melee to to his Brawl design. I think if Lip ever gets in, she will get a design overhaul. I outline the changes that would need to be made in my Lip reasoning and moveset section for my Smash 4 project.

Thank you. I agree, she needs a big design change, height being my biggest concern.

 

[ChronoBound]

Thank you. I agree, she needs a big design change, height being my biggest concern.

Not to mention age and her short skirt.

 

[darkserenade]

Not to mention age and her short skirt.

True. It's normal when she's short, but if she does become taller, they need to enlarge that skirt. Hopefully, she doesn't go the same way Zero Suit Samus did. How old is she, 10?

 

[Steelia]

True. It's normal when she's short, but if she does become taller, they need to enlarge that skirt. Hopefully, she doesn't go the same way Zero Suit Samus did. How old is she, 10?

Heh, indeed, especially considering she'll be flying around in the air when hit by stronger attacks... Ack. I can already picture people taking advantage of those situations.

If you keep up with Pokemon... you'd probably know who Dawn is from Pokemon Diamond/Pearl. Yeeeeah. 10 year old with THAT short of a skirt? Come on now... TEN years old... For Pete's sake.

I'll just end it there.

Lip should either get a longer skirt, or those short jean-pants or something to match her style.

 

[SmashChu]

but since Kirby is already a character, and has no need of Rick for his own moveset, Rick's another unlikely addition, if you ask me.

Anyway, as far as this Adventure Mode discussion goes. I think/hope they will keep it essentially the same. More backstory and plot development is all I'd really like. I think it needs to stay as a sidescroller. This is Smash, it's not going to go 3D, and the Adventure Mode should play like the multiplayer. I'd like to see more puzzles to solve in it, though, rather than just going through a level beating enemies until you're done. More bosses would also be nice, and maybe some more alternate paths, more than just which princess did you rescue. Perhaps the story could differ depending on which character you select as your starting one. You'd possibly be given a choice between a few characters (maybe the original 8 or something) and you could play any of their stories, which would involve different characters at different points, but would perhaps all converge at the end. Better yet, they could be completely different stories for each of those starting characters. In any case, I liked the general layout. I know a lot of people didn't, but I found it fitting for Smash.

Agreed. In that vein, I would like to see the Great Maze be more then just "Here is all the levels over again". Make it feel more like a Metroid type level. Go exploring.

Kirby has enough characters. All the rest are too minor to warrant giving a playable spot to.

To play Devil's Advocate, Kirby is one of Nintendo's bigger franchise in terms of number of games and sales. When compared to FE, a franchise that has a lot of games, Kirby beats it as most of the games sold over a million copies.

I think Kirby has all the necessary characters though.

Also, my question to the people in this topic is who would you rather see get a playable spot in the next Smash Bros.; Lip (from Panel de Pon) or Ray (from Custom Robo)?

Lip, all the way. For me though, it's more of a rock and a hard place as I don't think either are that amazing for Brawl. Of course, a piece of me wants Lip.

Although Lip and Ray would both be awesome, think about this:

Many of the newcomers in Brawl were the characters that everyone thought were shoe-ins for Melee based on its poll(Wario, Dedede, Diddy, Pit, etc.). Most of the highly popular characters on Sakurai's Brawl poll were added. However, if Sakurai were to add the most popular obscure characters from the current poll for SSB4, I think that Takumaru would be the one he'd choose over Ray and Lip.

Agreed. Of course, this is how Smash Bros works. The characters who don't get in in that installment will be in the next. I wouldn't be surprised if Krystal, Ridley, Geno and K. Rool were in Brawl.

I don't mean to offend but I am sure the reason a lot of people like Lip simply because she is loli. There's a reason why NOA went out of there way to remove the unlockable Lip stage in Planet Puzzle League (I know it can still be accessed via Action Replay).

Sakurai himself said that he thought of Panel de Pon as a masterpiece and Lip ranked as the second-most wanted character in the Other category (the only one being higher was Sukapon) prior to Melee. However, despite all this being in her favor, all her series got in Melee was Kirby being able to turn into a junk block and her flower baton becoming an item. In Brawl, the series got five stickers and a remix of Lip's theme. Obviously, the reason why she has not even been a trophy is due to her design. If she is ever to get in Smash Bros., changes to her design will have to be made.

I think there is more too it then that. Firstly, numero uno, Sukapon, didn't get in either. Not even in Brawl. It may be more that he doesn't want to add the character.

Also, as far as trophies go, Melee didn't have everyone (Little Mac was suppose to have one but didn't) and Brawl's was just what ever NGC model they could put in.

Lastly, people like lolis and furries will always find an outlet. Sonic has a lot of furry porn to but he's still in the game. I don't think it's a matter of trying to avoid the creepy people, but he just doesn't want to add the character.

 

[Big-Cat]

Meaning she will get a design overhaul. Compare Pit's trophy in Melee to to his Brawl design. I think if Lip ever gets in, she will get a design overhaul. I outline the changes that would need to be made in my Lip reasoning and moveset section for my Smash 4 project.

I doubt that she will get a design overhaul that's as major as Pit's. Just by looking at her, you might think that she's a character from the present and not the 90's. Then again, the Crash series has gone through one and a half redesigns.

 

[ChronoBound]

I doubt that she will get a design overhaul that's as major as Pit's. Just by looking at her, you might think that she's a character from the present and not the 90's. Then again, the Crash series has gone through one and a half redesigns.

No. Lip WILL need a design change. Would you rather have an updated less-loli Lip or no Lip at all? I think the choice is clear.

Please understand that it is the only way I can see her getting in Smash.

 

[LUVTOY77-ROGUE WIREFRAME]

I went to the pokecenter to see what a good place for a pokemon level would be.
one replied:
Originally Posted by MarthFanatique
For me, I'm gunna say offhand it is Lavender Town (specifically the Pokémon Tower). The fact that the creators had a huge cemetary in the form of a skyscraper w/ ghosts that later turned out to be ghastly, haunter, and marowak; and also the possessed chancellors was freaky. The most memorable thing, persay, that happened to Pokémon was the 2v2 play

I think that woud be a nice level, and would be great for a 'haunted' world of the game..?

 

[Knyaguy]

I went to the pokecenter to see what a good place for a pokemon level would be.
one replied:
Originally Posted by MarthFanatique
For me, I'm gunna say offhand it is Lavender Town (specifically the Pokémon Tower). The fact that the creators had a huge cemetary in the form of a skyscraper w/ ghosts that later turned out to be ghastly, haunter, and marowak; and also the possessed chancellors was freaky. The most memorable thing, persay, that happened to Pokémon was the 2v2 play

I think that woud be a nice level, and would be great for a 'haunted' world of the game..?

Ohhh, if they had pokemon like Dusknoir, Gengar and Dusclops!

 

[Chief Mendez]

Heh, indeed, especially considering she'll be flying around in the air when hit by stronger attacks... Ack. I can already picture people taking advantage of those situations.

What? Nonsense. Every single Smash Bros. player is a perfect, stand-up example of gentlemanly values and ethics. They would do no such thing.


Anyway, on this topic: I do think Lip would look different, but not as different as Pit does from his Melee trophy.

To be honest, I really don't see the issue with THIS model, but if Nintendo's so terribly scared of being called, as a collective, pedophiles for making a game with one character out of around fifty, with a frilly, short skirt, then I suppose they could make Lip a few years older or something.

Spoiler

I realize the sarcasm was laid on a bit thick, so in case somebody didn't catch it: I think Lip's fine as she is. In Pit's case, he hadn't been in a game for the better part of two decades, and his series is a rather more serious action game, as opposed to the cutesy puzzler that is Panel de Pon. If Lip shows up wearing pants, I will be angry.

 

[ChronoBound]

What? Nonsense. Every single Smash Bros. player is a perfect, stand-up example of gentlemanly values and ethics. They would do no such thing.


Anyway, on this topic: I do think Lip would look different, but not as different as Pit does from his Melee trophy.

To be honest, I really don't see the issue with THIS model, but if Nintendo's so terribly scared of being called, as a collective, pedophiles for making a game with one character out of around fifty, with a frilly, short skirt, then I suppose they could make Lip a few years older or something.

Spoiler

I realize the sarcasm was laid on a bit thick, so in case somebody didn't catch it: I think Lip's fine as she is. In Pit's case, he hadn't been in a game for the better part of two decades, and his series is a rather more serious action game, as opposed to the cutesy puzzler that is Panel de Pon. If Lip shows up wearing pants, I will be angry.

No, Lip is not fine. Definite changes to the design will have to be made. If Lip fans continue to give me some Lip about proposing to make some changes to her design, then I will no longer support her for Smash Bros. 4.

 

[Knyaguy]

No, Lip is not fine. Definite changes to the design will have to be made. If Lip fans continue to give me some Lip about proposing to make some changes to her design, then I will no longer support her for Smash Bros. 4.

Did you read the spoiler tag?!?

 

[SkylerOcon]

God dammit. Lip is not loli. She's just a video game character wearing a skirt. Get the hell over it. That's like saying Nintendo is perverts for allowing you to be able to angle the camera to be able to see Peach's bloomers. Get over it.

A girl in short skirt does not make Nintendo perverts.

 

[ChronoBound]

Did you read the spoiler tag?!?

Yeah, I read it. Its what I am objecting to.

God dammit. Lip is not loli. She's just a video game character wearing a skirt. Get the hell over it. That's like saying Nintendo is perverts for allowing you to be able to angle the camera to be able to see Peach's bloomers. Get over it.

A girl in short skirt does not make Nintendo perverts.

Then no Lip in Smash Bros. then. Even Sakurai is irked by the perverts in the Smash community.

Please understand its the only way for Lip to get in the game.

Edit: Maybe I should post the paragraph from my project that explains the design changes I would make for Lip in order for Sakurai and NOA to not object to her.

 

[metaXzero]

Out of curiosity Chronobound, do you have proof of that, or are you presuming? Because I think Sakurai couldn't care less about perverts in the Smash community (Peach upskirts and ZSS's in general). <.<

 

[ChronoBound]

Out of curiosity Chronobound, do you have proof of that, or are you presuming? Because I think Sakurai couldn't care less about perverts in the Smash community (Peach upskirts and ZSS's in general). <.<

Sakurai mentions it on the Dojo and he says he wishes that less people took those kind of pictures and said he wouldn't place them on the Dojo (though one upskirt ironically did).

Here is what he said:

Please understand that snapshots depicting inappropriate content or containing inappropriate comments will not be eligible for selection.

To this point, I’ve received a great number of screenshots that focus on peeking at the undergarments of certain Brawl combatants. So let me just say it again—shots like these will never be posted to the Dojo or sent out to users via the Smash Service.

 

[Firus]

No, Lip is not fine. Definite changes to the design will have to be made. If Lip fans continue to give me some Lip about proposing to make some changes to her design, then I will no longer support her for Smash Bros. 4.

Good, then don't support her. What, you think threatening people by saying "If you don't think my way I won't agree with you at all" is going to make people scared and bow to your demands?

I really am not for or against Lip for SSB4, but honestly, they don't need to do anything to change her design. You can look up Peach's skirt, and both Zamus and Snake are wearing skin-tight clothing. Don't tell me that, with a skirt, she won't be able to get in. You can say Sakurai is irked, but the fact that he said he wouldn't post pictures of Peach's undergarments on the Dojo doesn't mean he's irked by it. You honestly think he can get away with posting those pictures or supporting them? He's got to say he's against them, etc.

 

[ChronoBound]

Good, then don't support her. What, you think threatening people by saying "If you don't think my way I won't agree with you at all" is going to make people scared and bow to your demands?

I really am not for or against Lip for SSB4, but honestly, they don't need to do anything to change her design. You can look up Peach's skirt, and both Zamus and Snake are wearing skin-tight clothing. Don't tell me that, with a skirt, she won't be able to get in. You can say Sakurai is irked, but the fact that he said he wouldn't post pictures of Peach's undergarments on the Dojo doesn't mean he's irked by it. You honestly think he can get away with posting those pictures or supporting them? He's got to say he's against them, etc.

Pedophilia is a whole different ballgame. If you are not disturbed by pedophiles there is something wrong.

 

[metaXzero]

Quotes?

Anyway, I only see Lip getting an overhaul just for modernization purposes. I doubt it would be because a small, mostly nonvocal, and negligible group might have new fapping material.

 

[Firus]

Pedophilia is a whole different ballgame. If you are not disturbed by pedophiles there is something wrong.

Do you make a habit of putting words in people's mouths?

 

[SkylerOcon]

Quotes?

Anyway, I only see Lip getting an overhaul just for modernization purposes. I doubt it would be because a small, mostly nonvocal, and negligible group might have fapping material.

Yeah. Seconded.

 

[ChronoBound]

Do you make a habit of putting words in people's mouths?

No.

If Lip does not get a design change she will not be in Smash, or NOA will remove her entirely. End of discussion.

 

[SmashChu]

God dammit. Lip is not loli. She's just a video game character wearing a skirt. Get the hell over it. That's like saying Nintendo is perverts for allowing you to be able to angle the camera to be able to see Peach's bloomers. Get over it.

She is a loli. It's just a term for a young girl (from 6-10)

Also, Chrono, I see no reason why this design is problematic. If they were so worried about pervertedness, then they wouldn't allow you to see up Peach and Zelda's dresses (also said by the quote), nor would they have designed ZSS the way they did.

Is there any evidence or assertion to back this up?

 

[metaXzero]

Chronobound. How do you know that NOA would see Lip as a lolicon material based only on the skirt?

As I said, I'm not against a modern update, but the reason you have stated is a bit........weak.

 

[Firus]

No.

If Lip does not get a design change she will not be in Smash, or NOA will remove her entirely. End of discussion.

Well, don't. It's annoying. I never even mentioned the word "pedophilia" in my post, so how can you make any assumptions about my views on it?

Oh, and you get this say and the ability to end the discussion because you work for Nintendo and know this for a fact, right?

You're guessing just as much as the next person. But evidence thus far shows that characters having a skirt doesn't mean they get kicked out. Plus, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Pit a young boy? And in a CUTSCENE, for heaven's sake, you see his undergarments. Just because he's a boy doesn't make it any different. That would still qualify as pedophilia and, what d'you know, he got in and you don't even have to search for it!

 

[Chief Mendez]

If Lip fans continue to give me some Lip about proposing to make some changes to her design, then I will no longer support her for Smash Bros. 4.

I see what you did there.

Also: OH GOD NO, PLEASE DON'T NOT SUPPORT LIP! I couldn't take it if one anonymous person on an internet forum didn't support a character's inclusion in a totally hypothetical videogame.

If Lip does not get a design change she will not be in Smash, or NOA will remove her entirely. End of discussion.

Thanks for telling me. I was going to keep arguing, but I guess the discussion's over now, so nevermind.

---

Look, if this is how you're going to respond to other people's views on things, then you can count me out of this little "beat-test" thing. You're not any better than any of us, so don't act like your word is law.

I should also point out again that this is all just speculation. Seriously. Everything anybody says in this topic is just speculation.

Spoiler

Except that.

 

[SkylerOcon]

Chief Mendez is now the awesomest person on SmashBoards. All bow to him.

 

[Firus]

Chief Mendez is now the awesomest person on SmashBoards. All bow to him.

Seconded.

*Bows*

 

[ChronoBound]

She is a loli. It's just a term for a young girl (from 6-10)

Also, Chrono, I see no reason why this design is problematic. If they were so worried about pervertedness, then they wouldn't allow you to see up Peach and Zelda's dresses (also said by the quote), nor would they have designed ZSS the way they did.

Is there any evidence or assertion to back this up?

*sigh

I am seriously despressed right now. The reason many people are against Lip is due to her design. It seems as though everyone is against me for this.

Here is what I was proposing by the way:
As for the design of Lip, the character was never brought into 3-D. Lip’s design obviously will have a radical departure from original much like Pit’s (compare his trophy in Melee to his Brawl model). As mentioned in my reasoning for Lip, there are several problems with her current design (which is here only one). Lip looks to be only about 10-years old, and she also wears I a skirt that only goes down to her knees. There is a reason why Nintendo of America has gone out their way any game she has appeared in barring Brawl. I was seriously having second thoughts about putting Lip onto my roster due to her design and what a sizable portion of her fanbase probably consists of. As for Lip’s design, I suggest two things. One would be for her to be made older like perhaps a teen I (13-16) at the least (or maybe even an older teen like Zelda), and also given pants or shorts to wear underneath her skirt (like Zelda). I feel if these two changes are not implemented into her design she will never be made into a playable character in Smash Bros., and if she was, she would most certainly be removed outside Japan. So fanboys who have an objection to these changes can shove it with their loli fetish. Anyhow, although Lip would be made older, she would still retain the cuteness and innocence of her original design. So without further ado, here is my Lip moveset and I hope that it captures the essence of the Puzzle League series.

 

[Firus]

*sigh

I am seriously despressed right now. The reason many people are against Lip is due to her design. It seems as though everyone is against me for this.

That's because you're being ridiculous.

Also, I highly expect a lot of Lip’s fans are into loli, something that is disgusting and even worse than furrie fandom. I was seriously having second thoughts about putting Lip onto my roster due to her design and what a sizable portion of her fanbase probably consists of.

Ohh, my bad, you don't make a habit of putting words in other people's mouths, you just make a habit of assuming things.

Seriously, how can you accuse an entire fanbase of being mostly consisted of something based on pure speculation?

So fanboys who have an objection to these changes can shove it with their loli fetish.

Oh yay, I'm not a fanboy, so I'm allowed to have an objection!

But seriously, you need to cut it out with assuming that everyone who is a fan of Lip is interested in prepubescent girls. Honestly, that's a very harsh accusation for something you have nothing to back it up with. Maybe if you were less presumptuous we wouldn't be having this debate.