[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[DekuBoy]

Japan must've loved Goldeneye. Maybe that's why we got the Proximity Mine.
The lack of Ridley upsets me.

 

[Flame Hyenard]

Japan must've loved Goldeneye.

They did.

 

[Big-Cat]

They really loved Goldeneye.

 

[DekuBoy]

I was aware of it's overseas success but I never knew Japan was so taken with it. Interesting...

But anyway I believe that the polls don't mean that much. Sakurai's word is final, or so he says.

 

[Shorts]

@Toise, Oh, your reply looked much more rude at six this morning, sorry about that.

Geno is unlikely, but I guess five votes is still impressive for such a minor character. I know polls aren't the final say, heck Im SURE Sakurai isn't even the final say. I mean he knew the most wanted character in the polls was Sonic yet he decided not to add him till the last second? I think Nintendo gave a nudge there. Not that I expect them to give nudges over any character, just major inclusions and buisness oppertunities like Sonic.

If a character is owned by a second party studio, does this make them a second party character? I've been looking at nintendo's Studios and games like Earthbound and Pokemon are second party studios. Lasty, Glory of Heracles and Proffesor Layton, where do they stand party wise?

Edit: Pikmin 3 "indeed in developement" Is this news to anyone else?

 

[i8pie]

Not really. Heard about it some time ago, I think around E3 last year or later than that. For the 2nd and 3rd party stuff, I'm not sure. I'll just say yes and Layton + Heracles are 3rd party, because they aren't owned by Nintendo or develop solely for Nintendo (well at least not Layton's developers).

 

[UberMario]

Square-Enix has made three games in recent years with Mario characters in them, none of them had Mallow or Geno in any form. These games include Itadaki Street DS, Mario Hoops 3-on-3, and Mario Sports Mix. Heck, some of these games even included music and locations from Super Mario RPG which shows that Square did not forget they developed the game.

Geno was basically a fad. Before Geno became popular on various Smash forums, it was Fawful who was the popular Mario RPG character choice.

I know this was a few days ago, but I just want to mention something ironic, Geno made a cameo in the first game Fawful was in: Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga.


Proof
Credits

 

[SmashChu]

@Toise, Oh, your reply looked much more rude at six this morning, sorry about that.

Geno is unlikely, but I guess five votes is still impressive for such a minor character. I know polls aren't the final say, heck Im SURE Sakurai isn't even the final say. I mean he knew the most wanted character in the polls was Sonic yet he decided not to add him till the last second? I think Nintendo gave a nudge there. Not that I expect them to give nudges over any character, just major inclusions and buisness oppertunities like Sonic.

If a character is owned by a second party studio, does this make them a second party character? I've been looking at nintendo's Studios and games like Earthbound and Pokemon are second party studios. Lasty, Glory of Heracles and Proffesor Layton, where do they stand party wise?

Edit: Pikmin 3 "indeed in developement" Is this news to anyone else?

As far as I can tell (by a quick search), second parties are affiliated with Nintendo, but not owned by them. They likely have significant influence on them (i.e. they own 20% or more of their stock). I would say second party games would be those made in conjunction with Nintendo, but they were not made by a first party. Second party series can be in Smash Brothers as Nintendo usually owns the rights to those games.

Glory of Heracles and Proffesor Layton are owned by Paon and Level 5 respectively.

 

[libertyernie]

Would Pulseman be a second party character (Game Freak) as well?

 

[Flame Hyenard]

Pulseman has good chances, since Pikachu's Final Smash effect is inspired from Pulseman.

 

[asia_catdog_blue]

Would Pulseman be a second party character (Game Freak) as well?

you mean he's not owned by SEGA?

 

[i8pie]

Paon is 2nd party and Level 5 is 3rd party. I just checked. As for Pulseman; if he's property of Game Freak then he would be a 2nd party character if put in Brawl. If he's Sega's though, he would be 3rd party.

 

[SmashChu]

Sega published Pulseman, so no.

 

[Big-Cat]

Publishing =/= Owning

So long as Gamefreak holds the right to Pulseman, he avoids the 3rd party barrier. But if Sega owns the rights, then we have a problem.

 

[SmashChu]

Publishing =/= Owning

In the video game industry, it usually does. Very rarely will someone hold rights over a property rather than the publisher. This is why you see the same series published by the same company.

 

[Big-Cat]

You have a point, but as you said, someone else can hold the property rights instead of the publisher. Otherwise, we wouldn't have different publishers for the same game in different countries.

Outside of Japan FF 4-6 on the GBA were published by Nintendo and Tales of Symphonia was published in Australia by Nintendo. Yet, characters in these games have appeared on other consoles since then such as Final Fantasy Dissidia and that Tales fighter both on the PSP.

 

[SmashChu]

You have a point, but as you said, someone else can hold the property rights instead of the publisher. Otherwise, we wouldn't have different publishers for the same game in different countries.

Outside of Japan FF 4-6 on the GBA were published by Nintendo and Tales of Symphonia was published in Australia by Nintendo. Yet, characters in these games have appeared on other consoles since then such as Final Fantasy Dissidia and that Tales fighter both on the PSP.

This tends to happen when a publisher doesn't want to (or can't) publish a game in another region. Nintendo picked up a lot of games that other publishers did not what to do.

 

[UberMario]

Pulseman has good chances, since Pikachu's Final Smash effect is inspired from Pulseman.

It's not just inspired, in Japan, Volt Tackle has the same name as one of Pulseman's attacks, Volteccer, so technically there was a Pulseman reference in Brawl.

I'd love to see Pulseman get into SSB, he already has several usable attacks just from one game:


Special Ability: Running Charge (Running improves the power of his attacks, but after he uses an electric-based attack, he'll need to run to get his electric power back up to maximum again)

Special: Spark Arrow (Pulseman throws a ball of sparks)
Side Special: Quick Dash (Pulseman shoots forward, charging up to max instantly, it can't do damage, but it can let the player get past solid objects and avoid triggering bombs)
Up Special: Volteccer (Moves upward diagonally. It lasts for a fixed time, but if you bounce against a wall, your momentum becomes reflected and the timer resets, just like the original)

Forward Tilt: Zap Slap ( typical punch)
Up Smash: Front flip (Flips up into the air, kicking anyone above him)
Down Smash: Breakdance (It looks vaguely similar to Mario's DSmash)

Neutral Air: Same as FTilt

Not to mention, he has an amazing soundtrack, here are a few favorites of mine:
Pulseman: Neo Tokyo
Pulseman: Blank Structure
Pulseman: Stereo Protect
Pulseman: Remounting
Pulseman: Metamorphoser
Pulseman: Technology
Pulseman: Accelerator
Pulseman: Run Command

 

[asia_catdog_blue]

You know, I have been wondering...

What would be the basic steps for a character to get in the series as a playable fighter(or at least, a supporting striker)?

Neutral Air: Same as FTilt

Tilt? (sigh) They're called STRONG ATTACKS, people!

Standard A: Weak Attack

Tilting A: Strong Attack

Tapping A: SMASH Attack

 

[i8pie]

We aren't denying they're called strong attacks, but we say ftilt and dtilt because it's far faster to type up.

Anyway, the requirements I think seem to be whether they have their own games (or are important enough in the game they are from) whether putting them in will work (if they are too big, they may not be included as a character) and if they are generally popular. There are some exceptions though (like Pit, Ice Climbers and other Retro characters).

I said if they are important because Luigi, Peach and Bowser would only fit in this category when they were first introduced in SSB (Luigi was in SSB but only got Luigi's Mansion with Gamecube, Peach only got Super Princess Peach after Melee and Bowser only got Bowser's Inside Story a fair while ago).

 

[Fatmanonice]

You know, I have been wondering...

What would be the basic steps for a character to get in the series as a playable fighter(or at least, a supporting striker)?

From what we've gathered from past inverviews, two things that strongly help a character are popularity and current relevance in their franchise. Of course, this still gives Sakurai the power to throw curveballs or simply go with his own wants but most of the characters that have become playable don't stray too far from these two things and have at least one of the two going for them.

 

[ryuu seika]

Tilt? (sigh) They're called STRONG ATTACKS, people!

So you're saying that just because Brawl introduced new terminology, we should all suddenly start doing FStrongs?

That's stupid. A tilt move is a tilt. If any move should be a "strong" it's a smash move.

 

[asia_catdog_blue]

So you're saying that just because Brawl introduced new terminology, we should all suddenly start doing FStrongs?

That's stupid. A tilt move is a tilt. If any move should be a "strong" it's a smash move.

I mean, they have been called that since the very first game for the N64.

It was from the Instruction Booklet.

 

[ryuu seika]

I got my games second hand so I never knew that. It still doesn't change my stance on things though. "FStrong" is a stupid move name.

 

[UberMario]

I mean, they have been called that since the very first game for the N64.

It was from the Instruction Booklet.

Tilt runs off the tongue better. Tilt and Smash are verbs, while strong is not, so it looks completely wrong to say that I "Forward Stronged" you, whereas "Forward Tilted" sounds more natural. Smash is already a verb so it doesn't have that problem. "I smashed you" sounds fine, and the word "strong" is a bit of an exaggeration, as it takes almost no effort to get it in, whereas you smash your finger forward to do, well, a smash, which is also why "tilt" caught on faster than "strong". For similar reasons, "jab" is used more often than "weak".

On the topic of specific characters and why they got in:

Super Smash Bros
---------------------
Mario: Most popular video game character of all-time
Luigi: 2nd most well known character in the Mario series

Donkey Kong: Antagonist of Nintendo's first major hit, protagonist of his own popular series

Yoshi: Highly positive responses to several of the games he was in, one of the most popular "sidekicks" Mario has.

Link: Main character of another famous franchise

Pikachu: Most popular character in the runaway hit series, Pokemon. The anime may have also been a big influence
Jigglypuff: 2nd most popular Pokemon at the time, the anime was probably a HEAVY influence on the inclussion of this character

Kirby: Another popular character, it doesn't hurt that his creator made the SSB series either.

Fox: Popular series, and they probably wanted to have a character that had a "gun without bullets" [to keep a low age rating on the game], and needed to find a character.

Ness: Star of the "hugely" popular and hard to find Earthbound game series.

Captain Falcon: So they wouldn't throw away the original moveset they used when SSB was going to have unique fighters, he was the closest build-wise and just had a series revival the year before

Samus: She counts as a retro character, as her series was all but dead by the time SSB came out, as the last game for the Metroid series came out in 1994, 5 years prior.

Super Smash Bros Melee
----------------------------

Bowser: Main antagonist of the most popular Nintendo series, I think he was intended for SSB, but dropped due to his size
Peach: Most likely emitted from SSB due to violence reasons, as the only female human in SSB was wearing a full suit of armor
Dr. Mario: Filler material

Zelda: Probably included to balance out the cast against the Mario series (Protagonist, clone of the Protagonist, Princess, Antagonist, alternate alias of a major character)
Shiek: Increase Zelda's uniquness
Young Link: Protagonist of one of the most famous games of all-time, filler . . . . .
Ganondorf: Main antagonist of LoZ. Since Melee was rushed, he was one of many characters to suffer being cloned, though it is most likely that he'd be the first to be "decloned" if they had more time.

Mewtwo: Originally intended for SSB, he's one of the most popular legendaries
Pichu: Deseprate, filler

Falco: Filler, 2nd most popular Star Fox character

Ice Climbers: Retro, a desire by the creators to have a "dual character" probably led them to this pair

Mr. Game & Watch: Oldest unique Nintendo character, coming out a year before Donkey Kong hit arcades, an obvious retro

Marth: The first protagonist star in the series, he was the star of 2 of the 5 then-released Fire Emblem games
Roy: Promotional material to boost sales of the first GBA Fire Emblem game [the 6th in the series]

Super Smash Bros Brawl
===============
Wario: A major Mario character who has two, totally different series of his own aswell as a 3-D platformer.

Toon Link: Most used form of Link outside of his "realistic" form, filler.

Diddy Kong: Donkey Kong needed an additional representative

DeDeDe: He was long overdue, especially considering that HAL payed almost no attention to their own Kirby series in Melee (other than some items and adventure-related shenanigans) and that he had been in the series since the 1st game
Meta-Knight: Same as DeDeDe, Kirby needed more repesentatives and MK, has been a major character since the 2nd Kirby platformer, Kirby's Adventure.

Zero Suit Samus: Moveset potential

Pokemon Trainer: Moveset potential, protagonist of Pokemon's first games (well, technically their remakes)
Lucario: 4th gen hype, anime, was probably filler at first, but he eventually replaced the character he is a pseudo-clone of due to time constraints

Ike: Most recent FE protagonist, and the only one to be the star of multiple games other than Marth.

Olimar: Protagonist of Nintendo's most recent, independent universe series, Pikmin

Lucas: Mother-series hype, as Mother 3 and Lucas were originally part of a cancelled Nintendo 64 game of the same name and successfully managed to defy the fate that most cancelled games face

Pit: Retro

ROB: A retro, iconic character that has made cameos in the Mario and Kirby series aswell as a reference in the Star Fox series

Snake: Personal request from the creator of Metal Gear.

Sonic: Heavy demand by the fans, the Melee rumor may have been a considerable factor aswell. The Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games series didn't exactly hurt either.

 

[Shorts]

Pulseman, equals done....man? Not funny?

Anyways, isn't he Japan-Only? I was bored and glanced at an article on him. Again, I didn't quite get if Layton was a third party or not. I love the games style, so I support him.

 

[Big-Cat]

Wrote this earlier today, kinda SSB4 related. Just my critique on Smash.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=295102

 

[Arcadenik]

On the topic of specific characters and why they got in:

Very good. As far as SSB4 potential newcomers go, these are the characters I really believe have the highest chances of becoming playable in the next Smash game (in alphabetic order):

Caeda (Fire Emblem series) - according to Sakurai in this Iwata Asks interview, Caeda is the heroine of Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon; ergo in Sakurai's eyes, Caeda must be important enough (or stood out from the crowd) in Marth's remake game for Sakurai to make that claim

Dixie Kong (Donkey Kong series) - she was one of the scrapped characters in Brawl so I think she might finally get added in the next game... Sakurai has a history of scrapping ideas for one game, only to add them in the next game (ex. Mewtwo and Bowser being planned for Smash 64 and added in Melee; Smash Balls being planned for Smash 64 and added in Brawl, etc.)... it would be interesting to see Diddy Kong get a tag team partner a la Donkey Kong Country 2 (though personally, I am warming up to the idea of a Dixie / Kiddy team but Dixie going solo is fine with me, too)

Isa (Sin & Punishment series) - Sakurai added Saki from the original Sin & Punishment in Brawl as an Assist Trophy; Sakurai said that Saki had no problems fitting in the game on the Dojo, which I took that to mean that Sakurai is able to make Saki fit in the game if he wanted to add Saki in Smash... at the time, Sin & Punishment was a Japan-only N64 game but now the sequel is an international Wii game with the new protagonist, Isa, who plays just like Saki (he is Saki's son, just so you know) and Sakurai tends to update characters from the same series sometimes (Roy and Ike, Young Link and Toon Link, Mewtwo and Lucario), so it makes sense to add Isa, not Saki, to represent the Sin & Punishment series

Little Mac (Punch-Out!! series) - Sakurai added Little Mac in Brawl as an Assist Trophy; in my opinion, I think he wasn't added in Brawl because Sakurai probably limited himself to two retro newcomers per game (Ice Climbers and Mr. Game & Watch in Melee, Pit and R.O.B. in Brawl) but now that Little Mac had a new Wii game and he is now not a retro character and Punch-Out!! was heavily promoted by Nintendo so it makes more sense to add Little Mac in Smash 4 already

Matthew (Golden Sun series) - Sakurai added Isaac in Brawl as an Assist Trophy; that at least proves that Sakurai knows the Golden Sun series exists; the new protagonist, Matthew, is basically the Isaac of the DS sequel (by the way, he is Isaac's son), and Nintendo promoted Dark Dawn with Matthew doing the same pose as Isaac's Brawl trophy. If Nintendo is using Isaac's association with the Smash series to promote the new Golden Sun game, wouldn't it make more sense to add Matthew in Smash 4 to give more attention to the Golden Sun series?

Medusa and Palutena (Kid Icarus series) - both goddesses are in Kid Icarus: Uprising, a game that Sakurai is currently working on... I think that Sakurai would become interested with the idea of adding these goddesses in Smash 4, I figure I would chalk it up to Sakurai's bias even if Sakurai tries to use the "we need more females" to justify them like he did with Zero Suit Samus, but at least they deserve to be in since they are actually the only important characters of the Kid Icarus series after Pit (oh, and Zero Suit Samus is just as important as regular Samus is in the Metroid series, sorry Ridley lovers)

Starfy (Starfy series) - Sakurai added Stafy as an Assist Trophy in Brawl when he was Japan-only at the time but now he finally had an international DS game (the fifth game in his series) so he is not Japan-only and his popularity is rising in the west (I am now 100% supporting Starfy since I finally got to play The Legendary Starfy) and he is already popular in Japan (he has to be if he has five games out already)

Takamaru (The Mysterious Murasame Castle) - Nintendo gave permission to Tecmo Koei to use their Japan-only Famicom-era hero Takamaru from The Mysterious Murasame Castle in Samurai Warriors 3 (proof that Nintendo remembers Takamaru and still holds the rights to him) so I am sure Takamaru is gaining new fans in the west by now; Takamaru's guest appearance in Samurai Warriors 3 is the same as Little Mac's guest appearance in the Gamecube version of Fight Night Round 2 (they both appeared in Captain Rainbow, too) and Sakurai loves to add retro characters in Smash and I think Takamaru fills the "popular retro newcomer" quota like Ice Climbers and Pit. Oh, and Little Mac is not retro anymore so he doesn't count!

Toad (Mario series) - he has to be in Smash 4 already! New Super Mario Bros. Wii had two playable Toads and Toad is the only Mario newcomer in Mario Sports Mix (not that it matters much anyway) and he is playable in Super Mario All-Stars... adding Toad as a playable character would be a smart marketing strategy on Nintendo's part as that is capitalizing on the Mario 25th anniversary and the popularity of New Super Mario Bros. Wii (imagine fans playing "Mario Bros. vs. Toads" and "SMB2 Death Match") and he runs a less risk of becoming a clone like Bowser Jr. would have

Zoroark (Pokemon series) - Mewtwo out, Lucario in... Lucario out, Zoroark in... Zoroark is currently the mascot of the 5th gen games much like Lucario was for the 4th gen... enjoy your stay, Zoroark, it will be a while before you get booted for a 6th or a 7th gen Pokemon.

As for the others who I think don't have the highest chances of getting in, personally I would love to see the following as playable characters: Dog (Duck Hunt, he would fill the "WTF retro newcomer" quota like Mr. Game & Watch and R.O.B.), King K. Rool, Mega Man (classic version), Meowth, Mewtwo, Mii (I would rather have Mii get a sports-based moveset and not Waluigi nor Daisy), Muddy (Mole Mania), Pac-Man (he got arms and legs, deal with it), Simon Belmont (the NES/SNES version, not the PS1 version), and Tingle (he would be the new Jigglypuff if I had my way!)

 

[UberMario]

Pulseman, equals done....man? Not funny?

Well, I at least got the pun . . . . I don't think his series is dead quite yet, look at Kid Icarus and how it's been around 20 years since the last [2nd] game in that series, yet he's getting a new one.

Anyways, isn't he Japan-Only? I was bored and glanced at an article on him. Again, I didn't quite get if Layton was a third party or not. I love the games style, so I support him.

Yes and no. You can get the game as an "import" on the Wii Virtual Console in NA and PAL regions too, though the original, Sega Mega Drive/Genesis release was only in Japan.

-Caeda
-Dixie Kong
-Isa
-Little Mac
-Matthew
-Medusa and Palutena
-Starfy
-Takamaru
-Toad
-Zoroark

The only one of those slots that I'd take out is the Medusa & Palutena team for three reasons: they are [im]mortal enemies, Palutena is now canonically the being that gives Pit his "Wings of Icarus" move, and Palutena is shown to be extremely powerful and thus is unfit for a fighter where most of the characters are your typical "superpowered, but still vulnerable" crew.

*Gets a list of character ideas and why, and tries to make it smaller than I usually make it*

 

[Arcadenik]

Uh... who said anything about making Medusa and Palutena a team? I just lumped them together under one entry, nothing more.

And who cares if Palutena is the reason why Pit can fly? So what? If we can have four Marios fighting each other at the same time, I think it is perfectly fine to have Palutena fighting Pit and giving him the wings at the same time. And so what if Palutena is extremely powerful? If Mewtwo, the world's most powerful Pokemon ever to exist (before Arceus showed up), can be in Smash, Palutena can. This is a video game, not real life physics. Why some people cannot seem to grasp that is beyond me.

 

[HotWings]

I think the best thing they can do is allow players kinda build there own characters. Like have a selection of all of the cast's moves and you pick which ones you want for your character.



Example: I make up my character (hair, face, clothes, weapon, ect. Then my moveset would be fox's utilt, snakes fsmash, jigglypuff's down b, rob's up b, metaknights over b, ect.

I think this would be good for the game because it would bring in a lot of different playstyles and the metagame would constantly be changeing.


How would yal like it if they actually made it possible to build your own character(s) in ssb4?

 

[i8pie]

Yes Mewtwo was put in a game. But Mewtwo isn't a God (or Godess). The power gap between the rest of the characters looks too big. Maybe she could be an Assist Trophy or be limited to Pit's Final Smash. But as a character? If they won't put Ridley in, I don't think they'll put deities in.

Except for Palutena / Medusa, I think that list is pretty accurate.

@yeldarB: Heh. Ganondorf's weight (only the weight) fused with Metaknight... Still, in regards to balance, that would be an awful idea.

 

[UberMario]

*returns after remembering about my post*

Well, it's not as small as yours, but this was a "lite" list of characters that I think have potential:


Recurring Series:

Mario:
-Toad: The only one of the big 8 of the 90s (Mario, Luigi, Peach, Toad, Yoshi, Wario, Donkey Kong, and Bowser), not to get into SSB, I think it's about time he's gotten better treatment than being a mere reflector.
-Paper Mario: One of Mario's more well known RPG series, Paper Mario has a LOT of potential, to the point where making him a Mario clone would require the crew to go out of their way more than they did for Ganon. >_>

Donkey Kong:
-King K. Rool: There needs to be more antagonists, and King K. Rool is one of the most interesting of the ones not used yet.
-Dixie & Kiddy Kong: While the original plan in Brawl was most likely to have Diddy & Dixie paired up (i.e. look at the animation for Diddy's banana attack, it resembles the DKC1 tag-in/tag-out move), I think that the fanbase would be pretty unpleased if Diddy got a radical change from his current moveset (other than changing the Down B), so this would be a close alternative.

Yoshi:
-Kamek: Moveset potential, a recent heavy character revival (three games in 1995-1996, nothing until 2003 [except one cameo in Mario Kart: Super Circuit], and then a storm of nearly 20 appearances or references in the past 7 years), and the lack of a 2nd Yoshi representative make him a good candidate.

Wario:
-Captain Syrup: There need to be more females in SSB, and she's one of the few that's actually one of the bad guys, erm, gals.

Legend of Zelda:
-Vaati: He's most likely the 2nd most well known antagonist [3rd if you count Majora] in the series, I could totally imagine him being in the game.
-Tingle: We need some Zelda characters not named Zelda, Link, or Ganon. He'd be pretty unique and would be a good fighter if done right, though he's still creepy.

Star Fox:
-Krystal: Moveset potential and you'll never hear the end of it from the fanbase if she isn't included

Fire Emblem:
-Caeda: Important female character who

Spoiler

Marth marries in Fire Emblem: Heroes of Light and Shadow

, her moveset could be very interesting, especially if she can call upon her Pegasus. Not to mention that she's one of the few major characters Nintendo has that can be both cute and lethal at the same time.

Metroid:
-Ridley: The size of Ridley in the Melee cutscene would be perfect, interestingly, the only other character, to be shown in the Melee cutscene, but not be playable in that game was usable in Brawl. His name? Wolf.

F-Zero:
-Samurai Goroh: Mostly so that F-Zero isn't the only one of the original 8 series to have a single character, we don't have any "heavy" swordsmen either yet.

Mother:
-Ninten: 2 out of 3 protagonists so far, they should at least give us the original too. Even though he looks very similar to Ness, it's already been canonically explained that they are two different kids from different generations, just like how Ness and Lucas are from different times.

New Series:

[Golden Sun]
-Matthew: Son of Isaac, the protagonist of the hit RPG series Golden Sun. They look similar enough where it doesn't really matter who gets in over the other. Heck, they could make it so that both characters take up one slot, but are called different names, something that I hope they do with Peach/Daisy if they continue to give her an alternate costume like in Melee.



Retro Characters:

[Pulseman]
-Pulseman : While not Game Freak's first self-made "series", it's their most well known game behind Pokemon and Drill Dozer. The game is a major influence on the later Pokemon games aswell, even the music sounds like it's from Pokemon, or maybe that's the other way around. I'm hoping this game eventually gets a sequal, too. I'd like to hear about the backstory of Pulseman and Beatrice (who was captured by pirates before Pulseman rescued her, but this was BEFORE the game occurs, so they could do a prequal), Pulseman's rival, Veil, looked like he could be more than just a one-time boss too.

[For the Frog the Bell Tolls]
-Prince Sabure: One of Nintendo's few 1st [not 2nd] party RPG games, he'd make a great retro character with his ability to transform into frogs and snakes.

[Joy Mech Fight]
-Sukapon: JMF is one of the very few [possibly the only] non-generic fighters developed AND published by Nintendo. I think that in itself is a good reason for Sukapon to appear, not mention that he has a very abstract apperance, with none of his main body parts being connected.

[Shin Onigashima]
-Donbe ("True" Human form): The lesser known version of Donbe who kills the dragon and saves the world. While the dwarf-like version of him is more well known, I think that this version does him more justice.

3rd Party:

[Sonic] (Sega)
-Tails: Moveset potential, major ally
-Knuckles: Moveset potential, major rival

[Megaman] (Capcom)
-Megaman: I'd almost bet money that they are considering him, heck, now that Sonic is out of the way, Megaman probably holds the majority of the 3rd party demand by fans.
[Street Fighter] (Capcom)
-Ryu: More-or-less a nod to other fighters, if Megaman gets in I think Ryu has a shot, plus it would be entertaining to see Ryu and Luigi go head-to-head with a battle of the Shurikens. XD

And who cares if Palutena is the reason why Pit can fly? So what? If we can have four Marios fighting each other at the same time, I think it is perfectly fine to have Palutena fighting Pit and giving him the wings at the same time.

If you say so, but there aren't any cases of fighters being dependent on other fighters, so it'd be very awkward, not to mention that common sense would indicate that she'd just stop giving him the power when she fights him.

 

[asia_catdog_blue]

You know, knowing what set's up Nintendo's mood, they might just add 10 Mario and Pokemon character rep for all they give a crap.

But, really, can One-Shot Game Characters really be included?

 

[Arcadenik]

If Palutena is really that powerful like some of you are saying, she wouldn't get kidnapped by Medusa and Orcos and she most certainly wouldn't need Pit to come and save her. If Medusa is that powerful, she wouldn't be cursed/imprisoned by Palutena and she wouldn't be easily defeated by Pit.

My god, this is insane. Who said deities cannot be playable in Smash? Based on what? You? Well, you aren't making the game. I don't recall Sakurai ever saying that deities cannot be playable. Where did Sakurai ever say that extremely powerful characters cannot be playable in Smash? Or are you guys assuming that "powerful characters = broken", right? Well, here's the thing, any character can be made broken - that's why the characters need to be balanced.

And I don't know why you guys are still bent on avoiding paradoxes in Smash. Do you guys switch to a different character when someone selects the character you originally picked on the character select screen? What's so awful about having a "Mario vs. Mario vs. Mario vs. Mario" match or a "Samus vs. Zero Suit Samus" match or a "Link vs. Young Link" match? Is that why most people are very reluctant on supporting Toad for Smash? Because Peach depends on Toad for one of her moves and it would be awkward to see them fighting? My god, this is a video game, not real life physics with Stephen Hawking - just enjoy the game and don't worry about paradoxes. It is not going to cause a black hole or a gamma ray burst.

One more thing, one-shot Nintendo characters can be included in Smash. We have Ice Climbers, Ness, Lucas, and Sheik, don't we? I'm sure we will get some more one-shot Nintendo characters in SSB4. But I doubt one-shot second- and third-party characters would be added in Smash. Why should an one-shot non-Nintendo character get in over an one-shot Nintendo character? Especially when said character never was on a Nintendo console (not counting Wii's Virtual Console)

 

[BirthNote]

@Uber Mario- Can't we just have Dixie by herself? Is Kiddy really that important? IIRC he was only in one game and hardly mentioned in any others after it. I think Dixie would be better on her own instead of being Diddy's back-up, or having a toddler tag along.

 

[UberMario]

@Uber Mario- Can't we just have Dixie by herself? Is Kiddy really that important? IIRC he was only in one game and hardly mentioned in any others after it. I think Dixie would be better on her own instead of being Diddy's back-up, or having a toddler tag along.

Well, like I said, it was based on how (if I'm remembering an actual article) that a Kong pair was considered, but it's not like I'm running the game, you can make your own ideas too. lol

You know, knowing what set's up Nintendo's mood, they might just add 10 Mario and Pokemon character rep for all they give a crap.

But, really, can One-Shot Game Characters really be included?

Characters that were in only one game at the point of their introduction:
-Ness [Earthbound/Mother 2]
-Lucas [Mother 3]
-Ice Climbers [Ice Climber]
-Roy [Fire Emblem: Sworf of Seals]

Characters that were in only two games at the point of their introduction:
-Captain Falcon [F-Zero, F-Zero X] (technically F-Zero 2 aswell, but that was pretty much a JPN-only prototype)
-Fox, Falco [Star Fox, Star Fox 64] (Star Fox 2 aswell, but that game was cancelled)
-Pit [Kid Icarus, Kid Icarus: Of Myths & Monsters]
-Young Link [Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time, Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask]
-Olimar [Pikmin, Pikmin 2]
-Marth [Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragons and the Blade of Light, Fire Emblem: Mystery of the Emblem]
-Ike [Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance, Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn]
-R.O.B. [Gyromite, Stack-Up]

It's totally possible, in fact, it has already been done several times.

 

[Big-Cat]

Just don't let Cronobound tell you it can't happen. Just because it hasn't happened before doesn't mean it can't happen.

@Arcadenik
I absolutely agree. Considering how Smash is in general, paradoxes are just another thing on the list of weird happenings. Oh, and you forgot to mention how God Tier Mewtwo is near the bottom of the Melee tier list. A character's canon power will have no effect on how they are in Smash, although I wish they took less liberties on character designs.

And I'd lol if Dixie Kong somehow ended up fighting like Milia Rage from Guilty Gear.

 

[ryuu seika]

A stage suggestion:

For those who can't tell, it's Bowser's SM64 arena, complete with minor tilting.
What I like about this concept is the possibility of preventing recovery from the other side of the stage.

EDIT: added the ledges.

 

[Jaklub]

Why the heck did you use the bright eye-eating yellow? I could barely see it.

Anyway, fun concept.