[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Big-Cat]

Just lookin' to see what's going on.

 

[majora_787]

Just lookin' to see what's going on.

Odds are, you'll never miss much. It goes somewhere, then someone brings it back to characters.

I think the SSE should be taken out, or at least not unlock everyone. I mean seriously? That's ridiculous. But honestly, it was pretty cool to see that much work done on the game.

And the smash balls need to go, for a better system for final smashes. Like at a relative high damage, say 200% for bowser and 150% for toon link or something.


I'm just going to go a little off topic here because nobody seems to no about this, do any of you guys know anything about a Wii action replay? I asked about that and looked all sorts of things up, but they all said it would be out today or something.

Just thought I'd ask.

Anyway, back to SSB4... Uhm... I really hope that they make characters better. Falcon, Link, Samus, Jiggs, Ganondorf, they're just horrific. Bowser actually seems better than he was in melee. Maybe it's just me, but I find him more useable now.

Maybe SSB4, if we're lucky, will have all useable characters. That'd be great.

 

[Big-Cat]

Odds are, you'll never miss much. It goes somewhere, then someone brings it back to characters.

Considering that we have our share of people who are more into who's in and not how the game is played, I'm not surprised.

I think the SSE should be taken out, or at least not unlock everyone. I mean seriously? That's ridiculous. But honestly, it was pretty cool to see that much work done on the game.

The SSE had good intentions, but I can only imagine how difficult it is to put 39 characters into a 10 hour storyline. You can tell they put a lot of work into it, but, as I've mentioned before, the game suffered as a whole.

And the smash balls need to go, for a better system for final smashes. Like at a relative high damage, say 200% for bowser and 150% for toon link or something.

That's pretty much the Ultra Combo system in SFIV in a nut shell. However, for SSB4, I'd rather see where you obtain your final smash primarily by dealing and taking damage.

I think why I primarily prefer a meter for a final smash, as someone mentioned earlier, is that the meter does not interrupt the pace of the game as drastically as fighting over an item.

 

[majora_787]

Considering that we have our share of people who are more into who's in and not how the game is played, I'm not surprised.

The SSE had good intentions, but I can only imagine how difficult it is to put 39 characters into a 10 hour storyline. You can tell they put a lot of work into it, but, as I've mentioned before, the game suffered as a whole.

That's pretty much the Ultra Combo system in SFIV in a nut shell. However, for SSB4, I'd rather see where you obtain your final smash primarily by dealing and taking damage.

I think why I primarily prefer a meter for a final smash, as someone mentioned earlier, is that the meter does not interrupt the pace of the game as drastically as fighting over an item.

Well, I personally consider the roster to be important myself. But gameplay is a big deal too, just not all of the specifics. All I know about gameplay is, it needs to compromise between Melee and Brawl speeds, falling speeds need to drop, characters need buffs, smash balls need to go, a new final smash thing needs to go in, and the adventure mode should probably go as well.

It was a good thing on its own, but it did take away from unlocking characters in-game. Among other things. I also hate trying to get 700 stickers JUST for use in the SSE.

Who needs 700 stickers in the SSE??

And just saying, ANYTHING would be less disruptive than fighting over an item.

Just going back to it again, I hope an action replay is really coming out. I've been looking forward to hacking brawl since I've gotten 99% of it done. =P

 

[Arcadenik]

Medusa has a shot now, since Pit is a veteran and has a recent game after like 20 years. xD

Mewtwo and K. Rool are must-haves, as well as Ridley, and possibly Bowser Jr.

More villains are must-haves, they're understocked. Even if you count Meta Knight, there's only five.

Don't forget Palutena. She has a shot now, too. Not just Medusa... and not only that but Palutena actually has a 3D model in Brawl (she is the only NPC in Adventure Mode) so I think Sakurai might want to reuse and update Palutena's Brawl model for SSB4.

Also, the reason why villains are understocked is because most Nintendo series have more heroes and few villains. Interestingly enough, females are also understocked because most Nintendo series don't have female main characters.

Right now, the only villain I could really see added in SSB4 for sure is Medusa, but I think King K. Rool (after Sakurai adds Dixie Kong) and Mewtwo (due to fan demand) are very likely.

As for females, I can really see only Medusa, Palutena, and Dixie Kong added. Sakurai is working on Kid Icarus: Uprising where most of the main characters are females so Palutena and Medusa are very likely. Sakurai planned to add Dixie Kong in Brawl but she was cut not because of time constraints, but because of technical issues with the Diddy/Dixie team mechanics... so I think Sakurai might want to retry that or make Dixie into a separate character.

 

[Rychu]

Does Mew2 even count as a villian?

 

[majora_787]

And Ridley, also do to fan demand and lack of an excuse not to add him. But in all seriousness, if we have Medusa, Ridley, K. Rool, and Mewtwo, we will have plenty of villains. And that's great. Plus, with adding Palutena and Medusa, we have more female characters, and that solves that issue too. =P

And Mewtwo could be considered a villain depending on your point of view.

Legendary pokemon are like bosses in the pokemon games, and one could consider Deoxys, Mewtwo, Celebi, and Arceus to be the "endgame boss".

But, some people don't see them as bosses, instead they see trainers exclusively as bosses. In which case, remember, Mewtwo was the bad guy in a movie. =P So he has that on his record.

Besides that, do Wario, Meta Knight, and Dedede really count as villains? I thought they were two antiheroes and a jerk. <_<

Ot: Apparently smash wiki lied about the action replay. I see nothing anywhere about it having been released or sold.

EDIT: Okay, I went and looked at this. How about we talk stages? In SSB64, we had 9 stages. Three returned for SSBM. Technically there were three more, that for some reason were never even playable-- Metal Cave, Final Destination 64, and Battlefield 64.

In Melee, we got what-- 26 stages, not counting the three returning from smash 64? We got 10 of them back in Brawl.

In Brawl, we got 31 stages not counting the 10 from melee. Alright... So in total, we have gotten 69 stages. 66 if you don't count those three 64 stages.

Now, here's what I think: I would like it if stages were not just thrown out myself. I mean, I liked Kingdom from 64. I liked Hyrule Castle. I liked Congo Jungle. And yet, we lost them in Brawl. Then we lost other ones like Fountain of Dreams, Venom, Mute City, Fourside...

Bleh. And now, when SSB4 comes out, my favorite stage, the Temple, is going to be gone forever. Then we'll get what, 12 stages from Brawl returning as past stages? We could lose ones like Lylat Cruise, Stadium 2.. Probably not Castle Siege, but... Yeah.

 

[Big-Cat]

Well, I personally consider the roster to be important myself. But gameplay is a big deal too, just not all of the specifics. All I know about gameplay is, it needs to compromise between Melee and Brawl speeds, falling speeds need to drop, characters need buffs, smash balls need to go, a new final smash thing needs to go in, and the adventure mode should probably go as well.

It was a good thing on its own, but it did take away from unlocking characters in-game. Among other things. I also hate trying to get 700 stickers JUST for use in the SSE.

Who needs 700 stickers in the SSE??

And just saying, ANYTHING would be less disruptive than fighting over an item.

Just going back to it again, I hope an action replay is really coming out. I've been looking forward to hacking brawl since I've gotten 99% of it done. =P

I consider the roster important as well. You need to have all sorts of playstyles to satisfy different types of people. In fact, after seeing her in action, I think I finally found my main in BlazBlue with Makoto because she fits my style: Rushdown, mixups, and mindgames. In fact, I'd like to see a character with this style in SSB4.

Disregarding playstyles, the characters add to the fanservice to the game. Like anyone else, I have characters that I want to see in. Unfortunately, the added characters don't mean anything if the engine is crap. Sure, it'll likely sell a lot regardless, but licensed games sell a lot too.

As for the stickers, I don't even need the stickers in the SSE. The stickers are a nice idea overall though because you get to see all the game art for Nintendo games (and 3rd party characters) from the last 30 years. I just don't see the point in giving the stickers RPG elements for an Adventure Mode you're likely not going to play all that often once you beat it.

 

[Bynine]

Playable Caterpie.

Down B turns you into Metapod, and Down B again turns you into Butterfree.

Caterpie can use String Shot to stun foes and recover. Butterfree is light and quick, and has almost infinite recovery.

Speaking of recovery, it should be lessened for most characters. Because Brawl's recovery is ridiculous.

 

[Rychu]

Stages? I'd Like EVERY stage to return, plus extra. If SSB4 is coming out on the Wii2(i think thats what their calling it), then they should have more than enough space on the disks to have 50+ chars and 100+ stages

Also, what about Downloadable Content?

 

[Jaklub]

Wii2

There are several reasons I think Nintendo would not call next console "Wii 2".
- NES2 and SNES2 were only updated models of console, like PS2 Slim.
- No psychological advantage over PS4 (but the reason above makes more sense).
But it's still me being picky.

I really hope SSB4 will keep third parties. 2 player Classic would be cool as well. Increasing number of combatants in VS would be very nice too, but I don't think it will happen.

 

[majora_787]

I would LOVE if they didn't just throw out every stage they make. They don't even have to improve on any of them, how easy does that make it to just give us every stage? =\ It's as easy as a little copypasta.

But it does take up space, we'd end up getting menus on stage selection like, "64 Stages", "Melee Stages", "Brawl Stages", and "Normal Stages".

I know Stage Builder tries this, but it's lacking. They need to add more stuff and let you put more stuff in the stages. A couple more backgrounds would help, but not needed. =\

But still, I want the stages I know and love, like Metal Cave, Temple, Sector Z, Kingdom, and Fourside.

=\ And yeah, fanservice is important, for sure. If we have a bad engine though, the fanservice becomes less powerful.

So, I've been wondering one thing: Does this mean Kid Icarus isn't retro anymore? xD

EDIT: Just thought I'd ask... Does anyone miss Single Button Mode? Or is it just me?

 

[libertyernie]

I never got used to Single Button Mode because I always used Y to jump. But it is kinda fun.

 

[Big-Cat]

I would LOVE if they didn't just throw out every stage they make. They don't even have to improve on any of them, how easy does that make it to just give us every stage? =\ It's as easy as a little copypasta.

But it does take up space, we'd end up getting menus on stage selection like, "64 Stages", "Melee Stages", "Brawl Stages", and "Normal Stages".

I think it's more than just copy pasta. Assuming we're going to be playing SSB4 on a HD console (it's bound to happen by this point), the stages of old will be too small for the higher resolution (meaning bigger models) of the characters so they have to be rescaled. Not only that, but they would have to enhance the graphics on at least the N64 stages. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see stages from every SSB game to date, but it's more than pulling a MvC2.

I know Stage Builder tries this, but it's lacking. They need to add more stuff and let you put more stuff in the stages. A couple more backgrounds would help, but not needed. =\

It would be nice if you could upload backgrounds via SD card and perhaps customize the the texture of the stage parts (might be asking for too much with that one).

So, I've been wondering one thing: Does this mean Kid Icarus isn't retro anymore? xD

EDIT: Just thought I'd ask... Does anyone miss Single Button Mode? Or is it just me?

Why are we using these labels again? I swear, it's like we're dealing with quotas here. Anyway, Little Mac and Pit aren't really retro anymore.

I never touched SBM.

 

[majora_787]

I think it's more than just copy pasta. Assuming we're going to be playing SSB4 on a HD console (it's bound to happen by this point), the stages of old will be too small for the higher resolution (meaning bigger models) of the characters so they have to be rescaled. Not only that, but they would have to enhance the graphics on at least the N64 stages. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see stages from every SSB game to date, but it's more than pulling a MvC2.

It would be nice if you could upload backgrounds via SD card and perhaps customize the the texture of the stage parts (might be asking for too much with that one).


Why are we using these labels again? I swear, it's like we're dealing with quotas here. Anyway, Little Mac and Pit aren't really retro anymore.

I never touched SBM.

=\ I guess I never noticed, past stages always looked almost exactly the same as always to me. <_< I guess there could be resolution differences. But why would they need to enhance the ones on n64 stages? If they changed them too much they wouldn't be the same. =P

Can't we change the textures of everything already with homebrew or whatever it is?

That label comes up when referring to ROB, G&W, ICs, and Pit. The last three are even all grouped together if I remember right. I didn't mean it THAT way, but Pit's having his first real game in 20 years. =P That sounds like it's bringing him into a situation where he could become a 1-or-2 character series now. Maybe.

OT: I swear, that AR situation is confusing the hell out of me. I don't even know.

BoT: I found Single Button mode amusing just because it was different. Plus, I used Marth. Marth in Single-Button is a pretty basic scenario for people to try.

 

[Big-Cat]

=\ I guess I never noticed, past stages always looked almost exactly the same as always to me. <_< I guess there could be resolution differences. But why would they need to enhance the ones on n64 stages? If they changed them too much they wouldn't be the same. =P

Well, guess what? Things have to change whether we like it or not. Anyway, upping the graphics isn't a bad thing really. Look at Throwback Galaxy in SMG 2. They would need to enhance the N64 for a few reasons:

1. Unlike the 8-bit stages, the contrast between the new graphics and the old ones would be way too jarring.
2. Some of the stages, Saffron City and Hyrule Castle in particular, have out of date 2D effects.

I don't know if the returning stages in the past had any changes polygon wise though.

Can't we change the textures of everything already with homebrew or whatever it is?

I was referring to an official way of doing it.

That label comes up when referring to ROB, G&W, ICs, and Pit. The last three are even all grouped together if I remember right. I didn't mean it THAT way, but Pit's having his first real game in 20 years. =P That sounds like it's bringing him into a situation where he could become a 1-or-2 character series now. Maybe.

Only the last two are paired and considering it the retro column (like all the other absurd stuff that Chronobound comes up with) is all from looking at things too deeply and making assumptions.

 

[majora_787]

Well, guess what? Things have to change whether we like it or not. Anyway, upping the graphics isn't a bad thing really. Look at Throwback Galaxy in SMG 2. They would need to enhance the N64 for a few reasons:

1. Unlike the 8-bit stages, the contrast between the new graphics and the old ones would be way too jarring.
2. Some of the stages, Saffron City and Hyrule Castle in particular, have out of date 2D effects.

I don't know if the returning stages in the past had any changes polygon wise though.


I was referring to an official way of doing it.

Only the last two are paired and considering it the retro column (like all the other absurd stuff that Chronobound comes up with) is all from looking at things too deeply and making assumptions.

I guess so.

I haven't played SMG2 yet, I'm trying to keep spoiler-free. xP Just saying.

Yeh, the official way would always look better... And that must have been where that came from. I thought G&W was in that column for some reason...

Well, I just hope there's a stage LIKE the Temple. New Pork was close, but two things:

1. The individual land chunks were a lot smaller but larger in number.
2. There's a chimera teleporting in and out, bounding up and down the arena and killing everything that moves.

So, yeah.

 

[*Z*]

These are my character ideas, Final Smashes, and probabilty's.....

New Characters: Dark Samus, Ridley, Sora, Riku, Knuckles, Bowser Jr., Wolf Link, Louie, Porky, Male Pokemon Trainer(Platinum), Female Pokemon Trainer(Heartgold).

Dark Samus-Would have different moves than Samus so he/she/it won't be a clone.(50%)
FS-Dark Laser?
Ridley-Probably would have to be shrunken down. Depends on how much he's shrunk.(40%)
FS-Would turn into Meta Ridley, go into the background, and then shoot multiple fireballs.
Sora-Of course have his Keyblade with him. Tints should be based on his Drive Forms.(25%)
FS-Final Form.
Riku-He should have different movesets than Sora, which would be pretty easy to do.(20%)
FS-Dark Riku.
Knuckles-I think he should be in the next game, instead of Shadow. Shadow is pretty much a clone of Sonic, but just with slightly different movesets.(40%)
FS-Super Knuckles?
Bowser Jr.-He should have his trusty paintbrush with him.(60%)
FS-Create Shadow Forms of himself, so they could attack other players.
Wolf Link-Maybe he should be an alternate form. Like with Zelda.(30%)
FS-Turn huge, and then starts attacking people.
Louie-Not much to say...(15%)
FS-?
Porky-...(50%)
FS-That spider machine.
Male PK Trainer-Piplup, Grotle, and Infernape.(20%)
FS-Do I even have to say it?
Female PK Trainer-Chikorita, Quilava, and Feraligator.(30%)
FS-Do I REALLY have to say it?!?!

 

[Rychu]

Sora:No Chance
Knuckles:No Chance
Dark Samus:Better for an Alt Costume
Louie:IF he made it(no chance,btw), hed be a clone of Olimar
Porkey:No chance
Rikuim guessing hes from KH)no chance
PK trainersrolly will be Generation 2 PK trainer, but Alt Costumes for a female would be nice
Ridley:Maybe. Some want him. Some dont. Im neutral as I've never played a metroid game(besides the DS one)
Bowser Jr.:Almost certain he'll be in the next one. Hes the only real candidate you chose

I HAVE SPOKEN

 

[majora_787]

Sora:No Chance
Knuckles:No Chance
Dark Samus:Better for an Alt Costume
Louie:IF he made it(no chance,btw), hed be a clone of Olimar
Porkey:No chance
Rikuim guessing hes from KH)no chance
PK trainersrolly will be Generation 2 PK trainer, but Alt Costumes for a female would be nice
Ridley:Maybe. Some want him. Some dont. Im neutral as I've never played a metroid game(besides the DS one)
Bowser Jr.:Almost certain he'll be in the next one. Hes the only real candidate you chose

I HAVE SPOKEN

Ridley is a major villain in Metroid. It depends on whether you think Mother Brain or Ridley is more important. But Ridley is much more popular.

I refuse to accept Hunters as a Metroid game. (kidding, but seriously.)

I think you're wrong though... Ridley is a real candidate among those as well. Bowser Jr. is pretty likely, I'd say, though. As well as a 2nd gen trainer.

Also, Palutena, K. Rool, Medusa, Mewtwo, and Roy. Just getting that out there.

Just briefly, I wanna see if you guys agree... Do you know what I miss?

SUPAAAAAHHH SMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASH BROOOTHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRSSS!!!!!

 

[Rychu]

I miss it too

 

[BirthNote]

These are my character ideas, Final Smashes, and probabilty's.....

New Characters: Dark Samus, Ridley, Sora, Riku, Knuckles, Bowser Jr., Wolf Link, Louie, Porky, Male Pokemon Trainer(Platinum), Female Pokemon Trainer(Heartgold).

Dark Samus-Would have different moves than Samus so he/she/it won't be a clone.(50%)
FS-Dark Laser?
Ridley-Probably would have to be shrunken down. Depends on how much he's shrunk.(40%)
FS-Would turn into Meta Ridley, go into the background, and then shoot multiple fireballs.
Sora-Of course have his Keyblade with him. Tints should be based on his Drive Forms.(25%)
FS-Final Form.
Riku-He should have different movesets than Sora, which would be pretty easy to do.(20%)
FS-Dark Riku.
Knuckles-I think he should be in the next game, instead of Shadow. Shadow is pretty much a clone of Sonic, but just with slightly different movesets.(40%)
FS-Super Knuckles?
Bowser Jr.-He should have his trusty paintbrush with him.(60%)
FS-Create Shadow Forms of himself, so they could attack other players.
Wolf Link-Maybe he should be an alternate form. Like with Zelda.(30%)
FS-Turn huge, and then starts attacking people.
Louie-Not much to say...(15%)
FS-?
Porky-...(50%)
FS-That spider machine.
Male PK Trainer-Piplup, Grotle, and Infernape.(20%)
FS-Do I even have to say it?
Female PK Trainer-Chikorita, Quilava, and Feraligator.(30%)
FS-Do I REALLY have to say it?!?!

That Bowser Jr FS isn't a bad idea.

 

[IYM!]

what about Samurai Goroh????, he is very popular too

about Ridley, that will be awesome, but not with the side of brawl, better with the Melee intro side

 

[*Z*]

@BirthNote-Thanks. It was that, or him turning into GIGA BOWSER JR. (That'd be interesting though...)

 

[Soniccuz]

Knuckles-I think he should be in the next game, instead of Shadow. Shadow is pretty much a clone of Sonic, but just with slightly different movesets.(40%)
FS-Super Knuckles?

Shadow can been done as an incredibly different character from sonic. He could be more focused on chaos powers like in Sonic Battle. But if they really want to add another character from the same third party series I'm with you on Knuckles.

As for a final smash I think of how in his first game he would use switches to manipulate the level and mess with Sonic and Tails. It's more original then simply going super and beacons back to the classic games. It might be a bit of a problem programing in different effects for each stage, but like how Pokemon Stadium 2 changes gravity/ conveyor belts, or the Devil assist carries the stage around. Knuckles would have a button to press for those kind of effects.

 

[Frost94]

this probably isnt gonna happen but i want leonardo from FE RDto be playable and silver + updated vanguard ike and Soren assist trophie he cud like send a blast of wind

 

[Jaklub]

SUPAAAAAHHH SMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASH BROOOTHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRSSS!!!!!

I miss that too

 

[Ct.O.B.]

SUPAAAAAHHH SMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASH BROOOTHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRSSS!!!!!

Melee's announcer was so much better than Brawl's. He had this referee feel that Brawl's doesn't have.

 

[majora_787]

Melee's announcer was so much better than Brawl's. He had this referee feel that Brawl's doesn't have.

He would have been better if he yelled the title. >_< Seriously, living with that for eleven years of smash, and then it just goes away. I understand it doesn't fit with the title theme and all, but I'm sure it could have worked somehow.

Hopefully it'll make a return. xP And hopefully it's a long name like SSB Armaggeddon. *Lol* Probably not that, but you know what I mean.

 

[Smash G 0 D]

Hey guys, what's the chance of Goku being in SSB4?

D:

 

[Lord Viper]

Hey guys, what's the chance of Goku being in SSB4?

D:

★ When Dragon Ball make a new series that's not a remake? ♛

 

[majora_787]

It's zero, he didn't debut in a video game. =\ I don't think he meets EITHER requirement for being a 3rd party character...

 

[Smash G 0 D]

Goku has several video games! D:

 

[Big-Cat]

You got to know when there's sarcasm. This thread, aside from typically falling into crap, is way too serious.

 

[Smash G 0 D]

How is this thread serious? xD

 

[majora_787]

I'm sure people would be much less serious about sarcasm if sarcasm weren't so hard to read over the internet. xD

I mean sheesh, there are so many people who say dumb stuff on the internet, I just assume they're always serious unless it's Common Sense Sarcasm.

Ichigo from bleach would be awesome.how come they asked for sonic and not ichigo they are both on SEGA

I found that quote on Cheatsguru forums. Sadly, he was NOT being sarcastic.

 

[Big-Cat]

How is this thread serious? xD

Wait til Chronobound, SmashChu, or Toise of Choice get here.

 

[majora_787]

Wait til Chronobound, SmashChu, or Toise of Choice get here.

I can see Toise being serious, but I don't think I've seen SmashChu be serious here.

And what is with you and Chronobound? xD Every time you talka bout something like "a bad idea" or "being overly serious" you mention Chronobound in the same breath.

 

[Big-Cat]

Have you seen the arguments I've put up with Chu and the same ones Toise gets in with him?

As for Chronobound, I feel like he's looking WAY too much into the placing of the roster screen (one of the few things I agree on with Chu), Japanese popularity, and a few other things. I find it strange that he either has or had some character inclusion essay in the works that's extremely long.

 

[majora_787]

Have you seen the arguments I've put up with Chu and the same ones Toise gets in with him?

As for Chronobound, I feel like he's looking WAY too much into the placing of the roster screen (one of the few things I agree on with Chu), Japanese popularity, and a few other things. I find it strange that he either has or had some character inclusion essay in the works that's extremely long.

I've seen potential arguments start, but there were so many posts in a row that were so long, I didn't see if it actually went on for more than a page.

Honestly though, I don't think japanese popularity matters much anymore myself-- I mean, if it's REALLY popular and japan-only, then it could get in... Isn't that what happened with Marth, and so they included Roy to advertise for the NEW Fire Emblem? Or, something like that?