I would assume that most people lack of confidence in PT and his pokemon lies in the fact that:
1. He hasn't proven himself at tournies. Most of the "good" things we see/hear about PT is theory-craft.
2. Ivysaur's stats aren't impressive when stacked versus his recovery. Olimar/ZSS have a lot of comboing ability and Olimar has ridiculous power and priority behind his attacks ALONG with comboing potential. Ivysaur's only good damage dealing ability lies in his Bullet Seed, which everyone has figured out how to DI out of it. Spacing can only take you so far.
3. Squirtle and Charizard look good on paper, but never seem to stack well against the competition either. Both seem to be far inferior to characters that do what they can do, much better. Sure, this makes PT well rounded, but its just makes him well rounded below averageness, which doesn't win tournaments.
4. PT doesn't main Mudkip. This would greatly boost him popularity and power. No one can withstand the awesomeness of Mudkip.
Firstly, I'm going to thank you for actually posting logical arguements to the query. People have tried before and have literally gotten something like "Well Bair spam is nothing unless you space it perfectly everytime." I don't understand how you can use that arguement when discussing a tier list.
When you say DI out of Bullet Seed, I'm assuming you're talking about the initial pop-up. It's very obvious that you should Smash DI once caught in the streams, yet, you will still take a large chunk of damage should you already be in the stream. (at least 20% if you get caught in the middle) However, that pop-up isn't the only way to put someone into Bullet Seed. Of especial note is the ability to hit an opponent with Nair and DI down to avoid hitting with the last hit, then Bullet Seeding afterwards. And as ridiculous as it sounds, there are extremely simple ways of landing Bullet Seed on a recovering opponent. Simply predict a jump up from the ledge and peg them from below. This obviously ignores the fact that you could simply mind game a Bullet Seed (Because honestly, who expects Ivysaur to make any sort of approach?)
Bullet Seed is, however, not Ivysaur's only way of racking up damage. Razor Leaf, Ftilt, Nair, and grabs all do moderate damage at least (Around 10%). Ftilt does 14% when it's fresh, which is amazing considering it's such a safe attack to use. While it may not be the crazy damage that comes from the use of things like G&W's aerials, most of Ivysaur's attacks are incredibly safe to use (Ftilt, Bair). You can even pseudo wave bounce with short-hop Razor Leaf.
I'll agree with most of the rest, but I can't forgive you saying that other characters can do what Charizard does. Charizard's grab range is large and quick, and his throws are setting him up for his excellent edge-guard game. He has multiple jumps, sweet-spotted Bair/Fair are great for gimps, and he can spike. It's even possible to chase at low percents, especially in fatigue, using his Fthrow and Bthrow. Not to mention that he also has fast long ranged tilts, a fast finishing smash (Usmash), and Rock Smash for general damage building.
I'm not arguing at all for ZOMG Top Tier. I'm not even sure where I would move them. However, amongst the ranks of Ike doesn't seem like the right place.
Mr.Victory07 said:
And you can not be ivysaur, and Ivysaur has the worst matchups and is most likely the worst one. So the other two are bottom of low, so thus ivy must be in bottom
This is the kind of senseless thing I don't like to see. You have no support for any of your claims in the slightest. Disregarded
