Yeah, for saying pikachu is not top end of discussion is so much better? What are you a ****ing ******? What kind of reason is that? Idiot, atleast give some reasons to why you disagree.
-
Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!
You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!
Official Brawl Tier Discussion (OP Updated)
- Thread starter AlphaZealot
- Start date
- Status
Still, a good pikachu player will not loose to either of em.
SaxDude93
Smash Apprentice
Sonic's recovery is teh suxzors. 
Seriously, why is Sonic's recovery good again. I forgot.
Seriously, why is Sonic's recovery good again. I forgot.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
PIka's aerial game is average.
Down smash isn't broken you're just stupid.
Pikachu's camping game is average and is outdone by several other characters.
Your reasoning fails GG.
rehab
Smash Journeyman
Sonic can go under the stage for just about as long as he pleases and come back up with no problems. That's not what I call a bad recovery.
Nigerian Star Storm
Smash Ace
Well a Good G&W/Marth/MK could beat a good pikachu.
Seriously, your logic is ****, you're going to have to provide much better reasoning than the crap you're putting out now to convince any of us. Pikachu is not better than either Snake or Metaknight in Tournament Placings, Matchups, or straight up raw character potential. Using the you haven't played a good one card is one of the dumbest reasonings I've heard so far.
Average lol? Second or third is hardly average.
Care to eleborate?
Marth will get outcamped to hell. Unless you show me a match were a good pika player looses to a good marth player I refuse to belive that. Oh and snake? Hello chaingrab.
Blistering Speed
Smash Champion
Pit, Falco, Wolf, Marth (omgwtfnoprojctllulz),Tink (possibly), Lucas, ROB and Snake are all better campers then Pikachu. Pikachu's projectile is there to annoy and stop approaches, not to camp.
Oh want to know a secret? Thats called camping.
Nigerian Star Storm
Smash Ace
"A straight forward match. Pikachu has some good tools honestly, but you have a sword. You can jab Thunder Jolts all day. QAC is annoying, but not deadly since tit only goes into aerials, and Pika's aerials are outranged and outprioritized by you. D-smash has tons of priority, but your spacing game means you won't be getting hit by it much. If you get hit by it just repeatedly Smash DI up and you can get out fairly easily. If you don't Smash DI out in time DI to the left or the right, so Pika can't hit you with Thunder after the D-smash. Your F-smash is equal to his in range, but his sweetspot is in the middle of the thunder shock, while yours is at the tip of the blade so Marth wins out here. His recovery is good, while his edgeguarding is decnt, but not spectacular, so generally the both of you won't be edgeguarding each other too effectively, although you can edgehug him easily when you know he has to go for the ledge. If he is edgeguarding he will usually do a jumping Thunder Jolt that you will have to contend with. Just fair it if you can or airdodge if you aren't too low. If you are edgeguarding him and he just used skull bash then you can run out and hit him if you space well or counter it"-Emblem Lord concerning Pikachu's matchup with Marth
Also, you seemed to ignore G&W/MK for some reason. What's the matter? Scared?
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
Toon Link, Rob, Link, Snake, Olimar.
second or third indeed.
Its an average camping game.
thunder jolt has a good amount of cool down time while characters such as ROB, TL, Link, Snake, and Olimar have either less cooldown time, better range, better speed to their projectile.
In short Pikachu's camping game isn't spectacular.
Marth is known for being able to approach well.
Read EL's posts.
until you show me a good pika beating a good Marth I refuse to believe you.
Hello grenades, nikita, mortar, tilts, U tilt.
you may be able to CG, but its a ***** to get to Snak for a CG.
Sh1n0b1
Smash Journeyman
Except maybe snake none of those are harder to approach than pika, making him a better camper.
Admit I was wrong here.
Pika dosnt have to, snake will come to Pika.
Deathcarter
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2007
- Messages
- 1,358
There is NO F-ING way Snake, the most defensive character next to Olimar, will EVER go on the approach in this matchup. The grenades and the mortar are much more versatile projectiles than Thunder Jolt and Nikita can beat several Thunder Jolts. Snake is not going to need to approach Pika.
Grunt
Smash Master
Pikachu has a very limited camping game, and can be outdone by multiple characters. not to mention Jolt is weak and can be canceled by many basic, fast attacks. Pretty much everything everyone else has said is true.
Your only argument is that he can chain grab (OMGWTFHAX!?!?! like 1/2 the roster can>.>) he has a hax DSmash (because DI is so hard.) and that we have obviously never played a good pikachu before.
Get real. The ENTIRE SMASH COMMUNITY has NEVER played a good pikachu?
Blistering Speed
Smash Champion
Yep so take one part of my post and ignore the list of people I named who camp better then Pikachu. Alright I'll do it again
Nigerian Star Storm
Smash Ace
Also Grunt, why aren't you posing in the SFR? Didn't you get accepted?
Grunt
Smash Master
i keep forgetting it exists.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
no just no.
Snake has a much stronger camping game. Nikita, grenades, C4 and mines.
For approach he has DAC, crazy tilts.
Cmon think for a moment
Otherway around.
ANyways its obvious you knowlittle about snake so yeah GG
Jawsh!
Smash Cadet
Grunt
Smash Master
Learn what tiers are, then think about what you are going to say, THEN say it.
Oh, my bad. Thought I had a maybe in there. Oh wait I did.
Rockets wont save him, dont have time for that with constant jolts. Even if he does the rocket is easily avoided. Grenades? yeah sure like that will make pika approach. Pika wont take any damage, while snake will. And in the best case scenario none will take damage and its all about who can stand still more.
rehab
Smash Journeyman
Zelda in Middle? Poppycock! She should be at least 3.14 spots higher!
Nigerian Star Storm
Smash Ace
Because the smart posters joined the SFR, and pretty much rarely post here now >_>.
Nice to see that your actually capeable of real answer.
Ofc I am sure alot of players here have played against good pikachu players. And while I agree he is not top tier above snake or MK and I put him there to provoke and to get some tips on how to beat him thrown at me. Not to mention bring some ****ing debate back in here. I am 100% sure he is high tier material and anyone who have played against a good pika will propably agree. If your still sceptical watch Anther beat some of the high and top chars played by other good players and you will see its definantly doable.
SaxDude93
Smash Apprentice
So you were just baiting/flaming us? That shows some nice maturity on your part. And if you wanted tips, go to the character specific forums/you could've asked.
Everyone loves drama and a discussions.
And I still standby all the things I said, and the arguments used to prove he isnt top tier can be used to justify him not being high either. Lets be honest if I had put him in top of high ( which I belive he is meant to be) I would have gotten the same responses, and I kinda regret now that I didnt.
Fogo
Smash Shinigami
Nigerian Star Storm
Smash Ace
Hey Fogo, don't you host Biweeklies in Dallas?
M.K
Level 55
Well, how about we start with defining what criteria a character has to meet before being placed in a specific tier:
Top: These characters can be untouchable with a good player. They can quickly rebound from damage, have good hitboxes/damage/knockback, and they can camp or approach successfully with relative ease.
High: These characters usually have one minor flaw that keeps them from being at the Top, like Olimar and his easily gimped recovery.
Middle: These characters can do well in tournaments if used by the right people, but still lack the required criteria to be considered especially good or especially bad.
Low: These characters, despite the player's skill level, rarely perform well in tournaments, and lack the neccesary criteria to become even adequate. Maybe the attack hitboxes are small or they have low priority on their moves.
Bottom: Yikes. These characters can either be very VERY hard to master/control, or just hopeless.
Can we agree on this? I might've made some mistakes or forgotten some key details, so if you want, go ahead and reply with your own ideas.
Top: These characters can be untouchable with a good player. They can quickly rebound from damage, have good hitboxes/damage/knockback, and they can camp or approach successfully with relative ease.
High: These characters usually have one minor flaw that keeps them from being at the Top, like Olimar and his easily gimped recovery.
Middle: These characters can do well in tournaments if used by the right people, but still lack the required criteria to be considered especially good or especially bad.
Low: These characters, despite the player's skill level, rarely perform well in tournaments, and lack the neccesary criteria to become even adequate. Maybe the attack hitboxes are small or they have low priority on their moves.
Bottom: Yikes. These characters can either be very VERY hard to master/control, or just hopeless.
Can we agree on this? I might've made some mistakes or forgotten some key details, so if you want, go ahead and reply with your own ideas.
Trespayne
Smash Apprentice
I haven't been to any major tournaments yet but I have played with many people outside of my normal crew, so this is my take on the tier list. Feel free to criticize and give suggestions on who should move up or down. I tend to be biased in some of my choices because of characters I've seen played well by crew members or characters that none of us can play at a competitive level.
TOP:
Metaknight
Snake
G&W
High:
R.O.B
Falco
Lucario
Marth
Pit
Pikachu
DDD
Fox
Olimar
Toon Link
Diddy
Wario
Wolf
Middle:
Zelda
Ice Climbers
Luigi
DK
Pokemon Trainer
Ike
Low:
Mario
Lucas
Kirby
Ness
Sonic
Shiek
ZSS
Bowser
Peach
Link
Bottom:
Ganondorf
Yoshi
Jigglypuff
Samus
Capt. Falcon
TOP:
Metaknight
Snake
G&W
High:
R.O.B
Falco
Lucario
Marth
Pit
Pikachu
DDD
Fox
Olimar
Toon Link
Diddy
Wario
Wolf
Middle:
Zelda
Ice Climbers
Luigi
DK
Pokemon Trainer
Ike
Low:
Mario
Lucas
Kirby
Ness
Sonic
Shiek
ZSS
Bowser
Peach
Link
Bottom:
Ganondorf
Yoshi
Jigglypuff
Samus
Capt. Falcon
JrdnS
Smash Ace
snake is first. MK is second.
Sh1n0b1
Smash Journeyman
I thought we were making horizontal styled tier lists...
Debate only determines what we think is true not what is true. I have seen players use every single character to a fair degree of success and the only definitive thing is the fact that if some one wants to use a character in tournaments they will become good.
I remember one of my friends wanting to pick up Wario soon after the game came out just because on one used him, and now there are a bunch of Wario users. (BTW he switched to sonic and does pretty well.)
You can choose to list characters as you want and I will not call you wrong, but just don't be surprised when you are beaten by one of those lowly characters that you deem "not worth the time".
I remember one of my friends wanting to pick up Wario soon after the game came out just because on one used him, and now there are a bunch of Wario users. (BTW he switched to sonic and does pretty well.)
You can choose to list characters as you want and I will not call you wrong, but just don't be surprised when you are beaten by one of those lowly characters that you deem "not worth the time".
Fogo
Smash Shinigami
Desire
Smash Journeyman
pikachu GO DOWN
Lucas GO UP.. i think
Lucas GO UP.. i think
Dpete
Carnifex
Kirby is too low; his tournament placings are better than both Toon Link and Zelda and he has favorable matchups with arguably half the cast, making him viable for at least mid tier.
- Status